2019-2020 College/Draft thread (Part 6) -LOTTO 8/20 DRAFT 10/16!

[robillionaire]

their upward trend (yeah Knick fans, this team is upward trending).

it's gonna all depend on how far mitch & rj progress next year and how good whoever we draft is. but yeah, it's not a given. marcus morris won a bunch of games we shouldn't have won last year. who's the go to player now at the end of games ? julius again ?

if they draft this guy it will be because he can't do nothing with the ball

Spoiler:

yes, i just wanted to post this pic again.

we were 6-9 (.400) after the morris trade and 15-36 (.294) before the morris trade, we will be ok

[god shammgod]

it's gonna all depend on how far mitch & rj progress next year and how good whoever we draft is. but yeah, it's not a given. marcus morris won a bunch of games we shouldn't have won last year. who's the go to player now at the end of games ? julius again ?

if they draft this guy it will be because he can't do nothing with the ball

Spoiler:

yes, i just wanted to post this pic again.

we were 6-9 (.400) after the morris trade and 15-36 (.294) before the morris trade, we will be ok

how many of those 6 wins were against teams smart enough to tank early

[god shammgod]

we should tank again to be honest. i'm not sure i want to trend upwards. 38 wins or something ? is that the hope ? nah. give me a solid 11. lol

[Deeeez Knicks]

As long as the young guys are leading the way can live with the results. If we win its cause they are doing well. If we lose then at least we will have a nice pick. Maybe the lottery gods will be in our favor. Most likely we will end up losing a lot anyway.

[HEZI]

He’s incredibly versatile defensively and can play next to Robinson and in his spot.

You don’t think he can build on his handles and shot? Sure he has some tunnel vision. Big question if he can clean it up for sure... Tillman just lumping around out there that is the definition of a bench player today I’m sorry.

He plays big and strong and has shown flashes of handle, shooting open jumpers, straight line drives, and even pull-up jumpers. How is this a guy we couldn’t build on? Cause he struggled in improvement areas as a freshman? Please man.

You think he's a starter? In the NBA? And next to Robinson?

No thanks. Also it's funny how he's got all this room for improvement but the dude that's less than a year older than him has none? And yeah Tillman is more of a bench player right now but he's way more experienced and polished and savvy for some NBA minutes than Hachiuwa. Won't be surprised one bit if the team that drafts him sends him to the GLeague for development, he sure needs it. We aint drafting him, that's almost certain.

He can 100% start in the NBA at some point in his career if he keeps developing, yes. What kind of questions was that lol.

Drafting Tillman would be alarming to me. The league is and has been moving away from that type of player. It’s obvious. We need athletes, we need speed, we need shooters, we need spacing... the Knicks LACK all of that. Tillman helps NONE of that.

At some point in his career if he keeps developing? I mean seriously that applies to like 95% of the dudes in the draft, you aren't saying much. I'm asking is he an NBA starter right now? He clearly isn't so lets not get ahead of ourselves here talking about this dude like he's all that when he's got a loooong way to go.

Tillman is only of one of our options, if we were looking to add some bench depth but he's not a must have player. There are plenty of dudes I like at that 27th spot, Tillman is just a better option to have at 27 than wasting a lotto pick on Hachuwa. There are always dudes with speed and athleticism to be had for cheap and that alone won't get you anywhere. I'd look to invest these picks into perimeter guys and then try to dump Randle in the offseason while trying to sign Christian Wood but absolutely not wasting a pick on Hachuwa.

[mpharris36]

As long as the young guys are leading the way can live with the results. If we win its cause they are doing well. If we lose then at least we will have a nice pick. Maybe the lottery gods will be in our favor. Most likely we will end up losing a lot anyway.

this is literally what we have been asking form the knicks the last 3-4 years. Just play the young guys. If it leads to wins then great our young guys will be coveted assets. If it doesn't we get rewarded with a high pick so that we can eventually find young players that will be good.

The plan last year was such a**

[knickstape4ever]

we should tank again to be honest. i'm not sure i want to trend upwards. 38 wins or something ? is that the hope ? nah. give me a solid 11. lol

right? I've seen Begley and Berman report that Leon Rose wants to end the playoff drought next season.

That's classic Knicks. Don't force it/skip steps, build organically. This FA class isn't good, let the young players play, have a few complimentary veterans to help them develop. the 2021 draft is already considered one of the best in recent years, so I wouldn't be mad at all if they decided to not be as good.

I wouldn't outwardly tank b/c IMO it creates bad habits w/ the team, but missing the playoffs and ending up w/ 30ish wins/mid-lottery isnt so bad w/ the lottery odds flattened

[robillionaire]

we should tank again to be honest. i'm not sure i want to trend upwards. 38 wins or something ? is that the hope ? nah. give me a solid 11. lol

right? I've seen Begley and Berman report that Leon Rose wants to end the playoff drought next season.

That's classic Knicks. Don't force it/skip steps, build organically. This FA class isn't good, let the young players play, have a few complimentary veterans to help them develop. the 2021 draft is already considered one of the best in recent years, so I wouldn't be mad at all if they decided to not be as good.

I wouldn't outwardly tank b/c IMO it creates bad habits w/ the team, but missing the playoffs and ending up w/ 30ish wins/mid-lottery isnt so bad w/ the lottery odds flattened

In fairness to rose and company it's not like it would take much effort to end the playoff drought in the eastern conference, all it would take would be like 1 or 2 players not being complete garbage. That doesn't necessarily mean they have to blow up the rebuild

I would rather tank again though.

[Deeeez Knicks]

As long as the young guys are leading the way can live with the results. If we win its cause they are doing well. If we lose then at least we will have a nice pick. Maybe the lottery gods will be in our favor. Most likely we will end up losing a lot anyway.

this is literally what we have been asking form the knicks the last 3-4 years. Just play the young guys. If it leads to wins then great our young guys will be coveted assets. If it doesn't we get rewarded with a high pick so that we can eventually find young players that will be good.

The plan last year was such a**

Yea, they were just so desperate for wins and to sell the fans/Dolan on fake stars like Randle, Timmy, etc. I can understand wanting to win more games, but even just executing that plan was horrible.

I hope Rose gets some leeway and can take a more patient approach, even if its just for the first year

[mpharris36]

we should tank again to be honest. i'm not sure i want to trend upwards. 38 wins or something ? is that the hope ? nah. give me a solid 11. lol

right? I've seen Begley and Berman report that Leon Rose wants to end the playoff drought next season.

That's classic Knicks. Don't force it/skip steps, build organically. This FA class isn't good, let the young players play, have a few complimentary veterans to help them develop. the 2021 draft is already considered one of the best in recent years, so I wouldn't be mad at all if they decided to not be as good.

I wouldn't outwardly tank b/c IMO it creates bad habits w/ the team, but missing the playoffs and ending up w/ 30ish wins/mid-lottery isnt so bad w/ the lottery odds flattened

In fairness to rose and company it's not like it would take much effort to end the playoff drought in the eastern conference, all it would take would be like 1 or 2 players not being complete garbage. That doesn't necessarily mean they have to blow up the rebuild

I would rather tank again though.

and there in lies the disconnect with the fan base and the ownership/front office for years and years. No true knicks fans cares about breaking a playoff drought. Who gives a flying f*ck about that. The goal should be building a sustainable winner. That is the only goal there should be. If that means another year or two of sucking so be it. No one cares about no damn "playoff draught" especially if it costs us long term success.

[knickstape4ever]

we should tank again to be honest. i'm not sure i want to trend upwards. 38 wins or something ? is that the hope ? nah. give me a solid 11. lol

right? I've seen Begley and Berman report that Leon Rose wants to end the playoff drought next season.

That's classic Knicks. Don't force it/skip steps, build organically. This FA class isn't good, let the young players play, have a few complimentary veterans to help them develop. the 2021 draft is already considered one of the best in recent years, so I wouldn't be mad at all if they decided to not be as good.

I wouldn't outwardly tank b/c IMO it creates bad habits w/ the team, but missing the playoffs and ending up w/ 30ish wins/mid-lottery isnt so bad w/ the lottery odds flattened

In fairness to rose and company it's not like it would take much effort to end the playoff drought in the eastern conference, all it would take would be like 1 or 2 players not being complete garbage. That doesn't necessarily mean they have to blow up the rebuild

I would rather tank again though.

idk, looking at next season, the Bucks, Raptors, Celtics, Heat, 76ers, Nets are essentially playoff locks, and I think Pacers can be included in that mix too, which would make 6-7 teams.

the 8 seed is technically attainable, but that still means being better than the Magic, Bulls, Wizards, Hornets all of whom had better records, as well as the Cavs who were improved after the Drummond trade/Beilein resignation

I'd like to see the Knicks load up on draft picks, sign 2-3 complimentary vets. use the cap space to acquire another pick why not? we praise the Celtics for their young talent and in the past 5 years they avg. 3.8 picks per year; the more picks, the better chance at finding talent. over the last 5 years, Knicks have averaged just 2 picks per draft, which is literally avg. since every team is allotted 2 picks

I wouldn't want to outwardly tank and end up a bottom 3 team (tho I wouldn't be mad b/c we'd get a good pick) b/c its about time to develop some winning habits, and constant losing can create losing habits; young players need to be shown how to win IMO

[god shammgod]

right? I've seen Begley and Berman report that Leon Rose wants to end the playoff drought next season.

That's classic Knicks. Don't force it/skip steps, build organically. This FA class isn't good, let the young players play, have a few complimentary veterans to help them develop. the 2021 draft is already considered one of the best in recent years, so I wouldn't be mad at all if they decided to not be as good.

I wouldn't outwardly tank b/c IMO it creates bad habits w/ the team, but missing the playoffs and ending up w/ 30ish wins/mid-lottery isnt so bad w/ the lottery odds flattened

In fairness to rose and company it's not like it would take much effort to end the playoff drought in the eastern conference, all it would take would be like 1 or 2 players not being complete garbage. That doesn't necessarily mean they have to blow up the rebuild

I would rather tank again though.

and there in lies the disconnect with the fan base and the ownership/front office for years and years. No true knicks fans cares about breaking a playoff drought. Who gives a flying f*ck about that. The goal should be building a sustainable winner. That is the only goal there should be. If that means another year or two of sucking so be it. No one cares about no damn "playoff draught" especially if it costs us long term success.

the problem is that really isn't true. there's probably a larger percentage of fans who worry about wins and losses than getting the best draft pick possible. only the super obsessed junkies like us on here are thinking about the team as if we are the actual gm of it.

[robillionaire]

right? I've seen Begley and Berman report that Leon Rose wants to end the playoff drought next season.

That's classic Knicks. Don't force it/skip steps, build organically. This FA class isn't good, let the young players play, have a few complimentary veterans to help them develop. the 2021 draft is already considered one of the best in recent years, so I wouldn't be mad at all if they decided to not be as good.

I wouldn't outwardly tank b/c IMO it creates bad habits w/ the team, but missing the playoffs and ending up w/ 30ish wins/mid-lottery isnt so bad w/ the lottery odds flattened

In fairness to rose and company it's not like it would take much effort to end the playoff drought in the eastern conference, all it would take would be like 1 or 2 players not being complete garbage. That doesn't necessarily mean they have to blow up the rebuild

I would rather tank again though.

and there in lies the disconnect with the fan base and the ownership/front office for years and years. No true knicks fans cares about breaking a playoff drought. Who gives a flying f*ck about that. The goal should be building a sustainable winner. That is the only goal there should be. If that means another year or two of sucking so be it. No one cares about no damn "playoff draught" especially if it costs us long term success.

Fans don't care about that but maybe players do

[robillionaire]

In fairness to rose and company it's not like it would take much effort to end the playoff drought in the eastern conference, all it would take would be like 1 or 2 players not being complete garbage. That doesn't necessarily mean they have to blow up the rebuild

I would rather tank again though.

and there in lies the disconnect with the fan base and the ownership/front office for years and years. No true knicks fans cares about breaking a playoff drought. Who gives a flying f*ck about that. The goal should be building a sustainable winner. That is the only goal there should be. If that means another year or two of sucking so be it. No one cares about no damn "playoff draught" especially if it costs us long term success.

the problem is that really isn't true. there's probably a larger percentage of fans who worry about wins and losses than getting the best draft pick possible. only the super obsessed junkies like us on here are thinking about the team as if we are the actual gm of it.

Yep.

[knickstape21]

You think he's a starter? In the NBA? And next to Robinson?

No thanks. Also it's funny how he's got all this room for improvement but the dude that's less than a year older than him has none? And yeah Tillman is more of a bench player right now but he's way more experienced and polished and savvy for some NBA minutes than Hachiuwa. Won't be surprised one bit if the team that drafts him sends him to the GLeague for development, he sure needs it. We aint drafting him, that's almost certain.

He can 100% start in the NBA at some point in his career if he keeps developing, yes. What kind of questions was that lol.

Drafting Tillman would be alarming to me. The league is and has been moving away from that type of player. It’s obvious. We need athletes, we need speed, we need shooters, we need spacing... the Knicks LACK all of that. Tillman helps NONE of that.

At some point in his career if he keeps developing? I mean seriously that applies to like 95% of the dudes in the draft, you aren't saying much. I'm asking is he an NBA starter right now? He clearly isn't so lets not get ahead of ourselves here talking about this dude like he's all that when he's got a loooong way to go.

Tillman is only of one of our options, if we were looking to add some bench depth but he's not a must have player. There are plenty of dudes I like at that 27th spot, Tillman is just a better option to have at 27 than wasting a lotto pick on Hachuwa. There are always dudes with speed and athleticism to be had for cheap and that alone won't get you anywhere. I'd look to invest these picks into perimeter guys and then try to dump Randle in the offseason while trying to sign Christian Wood but absolutely not wasting a pick on Hachuwa.

Oof signing Christian Wood......

Just gonna have to agree to disagree here. We ain’t ready to win yet. Take high reward guys not backup building blocks. Achiuwa’s potential is strong. Can’t believe you’re throwing the “can he start in the nba” at me right now lol. Really none of these guys can if you’re trying to win a championship next season.

I’m looking to grow, you’re looking to dig.

[god shammgod]

and there in lies the disconnect with the fan base and the ownership/front office for years and years. No true knicks fans cares about breaking a playoff drought. Who gives a flying f*ck about that. The goal should be building a sustainable winner. That is the only goal there should be. If that means another year or two of sucking so be it. No one cares about no damn "playoff draught" especially if it costs us long term success.

the problem is that really isn't true. there's probably a larger percentage of fans who worry about wins and losses than getting the best draft pick possible. only the super obsessed junkies like us on here are thinking about the team as if we are the actual gm of it.

Yep.

we can't even get half the people here to root for losses

[knickstape4ever]

In fairness to rose and company it's not like it would take much effort to end the playoff drought in the eastern conference, all it would take would be like 1 or 2 players not being complete garbage. That doesn't necessarily mean they have to blow up the rebuild

I would rather tank again though.

and there in lies the disconnect with the fan base and the ownership/front office for years and years. No true knicks fans cares about breaking a playoff drought. Who gives a flying f*ck about that. The goal should be building a sustainable winner. That is the only goal there should be. If that means another year or two of sucking so be it. No one cares about no damn "playoff draught" especially if it costs us long term success.

the problem is that really isn't true. there's probably a larger percentage of fans who worry about wins and losses than getting the best draft pick possible. only the super obsessed junkies like us on here are thinking about the team as if we are the actual gm of it.

Idk, I think I agree with mp on this one; it's the casual fans who want to end the playoff drought immediately; to me it seems that hardcore fans want to build properly

[mpharris36]

In fairness to rose and company it's not like it would take much effort to end the playoff drought in the eastern conference, all it would take would be like 1 or 2 players not being complete garbage. That doesn't necessarily mean they have to blow up the rebuild

I would rather tank again though.

and there in lies the disconnect with the fan base and the ownership/front office for years and years. No true knicks fans cares about breaking a playoff drought. Who gives a flying f*ck about that. The goal should be building a sustainable winner. That is the only goal there should be. If that means another year or two of sucking so be it. No one cares about no damn "playoff draught" especially if it costs us long term success.

the problem is that really isn't true. there's probably a larger percentage of fans who worry about wins and losses than getting the best draft pick possible. only the super obsessed junkies like us on here are thinking about the team as if we are the actual gm of it.

so you think there is a larger portion of knicks fans that would be ok with trading every 1st round pick we own and can trade for a guaranteed playoff spot?

[mpharris36]

the problem is that really isn't true. there's probably a larger percentage of fans who worry about wins and losses than getting the best draft pick possible. only the super obsessed junkies like us on here are thinking about the team as if we are the actual gm of it.

Yep.

we can't even get half the people here to root for losses

half I think its 75-80% would want to build properly. I can only think of a few posters who are worried about winning right now.

[robillionaire]

and there in lies the disconnect with the fan base and the ownership/front office for years and years. No true knicks fans cares about breaking a playoff drought. Who gives a flying f*ck about that. The goal should be building a sustainable winner. That is the only goal there should be. If that means another year or two of sucking so be it. No one cares about no damn "playoff draught" especially if it costs us long term success.

the problem is that really isn't true. there's probably a larger percentage of fans who worry about wins and losses than getting the best draft pick possible. only the super obsessed junkies like us on here are thinking about the team as if we are the actual gm of it.

Idk, I think I agree with mp on this one; it's the casual fans who want to end the playoff drought immediately; to me it seems that hardcore fans want to build properly

Yeah but that's the point. Casual fans make up the majority of the fanbase. Psychopaths like us who post here all summer analyzing everybody in the draft for no reason are the minority