Political Roundtable Part XXVIII

[Wizardspride]

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[dckingsfan]

You're leaving one out, stop federal funding of charter schools.

Why? In some areas they have worked very well...

Or maybe a different question - where schools are failing should we use charter schools or defund and reimagine them?

Or maybe a third question followed by this statement - do you believe that our schools are behind the times and need to be changed? If so, what process would you use?

Opinion: Like our PD our schools are failing. Like our PDs, I think we should defund and reimagine those schools (and districts) that are failing.

[Zonkerbl]

The general idea for schools is they all should get the same per capita funding or you create an incentive for wealthy people to create little wealthy enclaves where their kids get better education than everyone else, which preserves their social status and serves as a barrier to entry to poorer people, helping them maintain their monopoly power over access to education and finances.

Anything that serves to disrupt attempts to keep access to education equal is basically a tool for wealthy people to put up barriers to opportunity for the poors and as such should be discouraged. Magnet and charter schools and what have you suck resources out of the public school system, and generally it is the highly motivated relatively wealthy families that finagle their way into those options, leaving poor kids stuck in the schools that have had resources sucked away from them.

I feel bad writing this because I finagled the heck out of this system to make sure my kids were in magnet schools from middle school through high school. I'm glad the options were available but yeah - there were no black kids in those programs.

[pancakes3]

we lack the culture, political appetite, or funds to reshape the educational process. it's also tremendously complicated that has external factors influencing what can even be done (poverty, home life, learning styles, etc)

and "defund" is not the right term here. PD's should be defunded in favor of alternative programs such as social work. there is still a need for police to respond to legitimately dangerous criminals (bank robbers, spree shooters, etc.) but their roles as dispute mediators, parking ticket givers, and private security blankets for the Karens of the world to threaten people with are invalid and need to be reduced.

education is necessary. there's no alternative to education, so the solution isn't to defund it but to make it better - somehow.

[Zonkerbl]

I feel like our school system, last time it was redesigned, probably after WWII, was to help us compete with the Russians in launching nuclear missiles. Somehow I feel like that objective isn't as relevant as it once was.

[JWizmentality]

Why is it that Republicans keep getting caught for voter fraud? Things that make you go hmmm.

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[Wizardspride]

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[dckingsfan]

we lack the culture, political appetite, or funds to reshape the educational process. it's also tremendously complicated that has external factors influencing what can even be done (poverty, home life, learning styles, etc)

and "defund" is not the right term here. PD's should be defunded in favor of alternative programs such as social work. there is still a need for police to respond to legitimately dangerous criminals (bank robbers, spree shooters, etc.) but their roles as dispute mediators, parking ticket givers, and private security blankets for the Karens of the world to threaten people with are invalid and need to be reduced.

education is necessary. there's no alternative to education, so the solution isn't to defund it but to make it better - somehow.

Good points.

Although "defund" is a technical term when you move funding from one program to another or cut the program entirely. In the case of the PDs we don't want armed police officer responding to old capital crimes (a broken window) or to a non-violent domestic incident (for example). In the same vein we might have teachers aides and e-learning (although it could be on-site and monitored by a TA for example). In many cases that is not allowed in the current set-up in both examples.

So, yes I believe that defund and reimagine is the correct phrase. The key is that you aren't trying to get rid of the union - that has to be clear and up front. You are going to come up with new ways to teach and have new paradigms that fit our times.

Also on a personal note - I am for defunding and reimaging our complete penal system from PDs to prosecutors to prisons. What we need is cover for our politicians to work on better solutions.

And that goes double for the education system (opinion).

As to funding - Zonk makes a good case. But that is going to need to be done state by state (I believe) since each state and local is responsible for funding. But, there may be much better ideas out there that I am not aware of...

[Pointgod]

The general idea for schools is they all should get the same per capita funding or you create an incentive for wealthy people to create little wealthy enclaves where their kids get better education than everyone else, which preserves their social status and serves as a barrier to entry to poorer people, helping them maintain their monopoly power over access to education and finances.

Anything that serves to disrupt attempts to keep access to education equal is basically a tool for wealthy people to put up barriers to opportunity for the poors and as such should be discouraged. Magnet and charter schools and what have you suck resources out of the public school system, and generally it is the highly motivated relatively wealthy families that finagle their way into those options, leaving poor kids stuck in the schools that have had resources sucked away from them.

I feel bad writing this because I finagled the heck out of this system to make sure my kids were in magnet schools from middle school through high school. I'm glad the options were available but yeah - there were no black kids in those programs.

It absolutely boggles my mind that Americans are just fine with school funding being tied directly to property taxes and then have the audacity to look down at kids in underfunded districts. School funding needs to be completely removed from property taxes because it’s a system we know absolutely does not work. Wealthy districts can still raise additional funds through bake sales or whatever bull and they’ll continue to be fine.

[Wizardspride]

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[Ruzious]

How do we have so many morons in power in the US? https://www.washingtonpost.com/nation/2020/07/15/oklahoma-kevin-stitt-coronavirus/

Stitt seems like a nice guy, but wow - stupid as f.

[Ruzious]

This means a lot to my very left leaning nephew and his former classmates who just graduated from Wesleyan in Connecticut. https://www.blackenterprise.com/angela-davis-said-she-backs-biden-because-he-can-be-pressured-by-the-left/

[Zonkerbl]

This means a lot to my very left leaning nephew and his former classmates who just graduated from Wesleyan in Connecticut. https://www.blackenterprise.com/angela-davis-said-she-backs-biden-because-he-can-be-pressured-by-the-left/

From a "defund the police" perspective Biden is the worst of all the candidates to have been selected. But I didn't want Bernie to be selected either, he's just too polarizing - too many Democrats don't like him. I wish Warren had caught on.

Hopefully Biden will select a progressive VP and put her in charge of the "defund the police" stuff. I think it's smart to wait until August to announce the VP so if they make a good choice they can milk it through September and October - the attention span of the voters who really count is pretty short so sure. But he better make the right choice.

[dobrojim]

Why is it that Republicans keep getting caught for voter fraud? Things that make you go hmmm.

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The party of projection. What they complain about is quite often exactly what they are doing.

PS- It seems to me that it would be completely appropriate to treat this offender
more harshly than the black woman who got 5 years for casting a provisional ballot
while still on probation and technically ineligible. It seems obvious that the Rep
knew exactly what he was doing and probably knew it was illegal.

[dckingsfan]

This means a lot to my very left leaning nephew and his former classmates who just graduated from Wesleyan in Connecticut. https://www.blackenterprise.com/angela-davis-said-she-backs-biden-because-he-can-be-pressured-by-the-left/

From a "defund the police" perspective Biden is the worst of all the candidates to have been selected. But I didn't want Bernie to be selected either, he's just too polarizing - too many Democrats don't like him. I wish Warren had caught on.

Hopefully Biden will select a progressive VP and put her in charge of the "defund the police" stuff. I think it's smart to wait until August to announce the VP so if they make a good choice they can milk it through September and October - the attention span of the voters who really count is pretty short so sure. But he better make the right choice.

And knowing that Trump is going to run against the VP and not Biden (since their message isn't sticking to Teflon Joe), make sure it isn't a governor who can get stuck in the sticky mess that is the COVID response.

And I was a Warren supporter but I have flipped. Now I would rather have her running the senate - which won't happen. But a Warren/Pelosi duo would be solid - come up with the plan/count the votes.

[pancakes3]

Pelosi's fine but she's no hero. Warren's a hero because she has convictions. AOC too. they're issue-driven, and not re-election driven. Pelosi's loyalties definitely prioritize the party over the people.

but my opinion could be being colored by her acting very much the boomer re: the Squad.

[Zonkerbl]

Why won't running the senate happen? Trump's incompetence has put it very much in play.

[pancakes3]

Why won't running the senate happen? Trump's incompetence has put it very much in play.

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/politics/elections/2020/07/16/democrats-get-flood-money-senate-races-outraise-gop/5427988002/

[pancakes3]

glimpse into the life of a stable genius

https://www.thedailybeast.com/team-trump-frantically-plots-new-ways-to-make-him-feel-good-about-himself

[dckingsfan]

Pelosi's fine but she's no hero. Warren's a hero because she has convictions. AOC too. they're issue-driven, and not re-election driven. Pelosi's loyalties definitely prioritize the party over the people.

but my opinion could be being colored by her acting very much the boomer re: the Squad.

Pelosi is one of the best at counting votes and cajoling and actually getting legislation through... you know, making progress

You need someone like her to help someone like Warren move forward. It is about conviction AND making progress.

BTW, I think AOC is taking serious strides forward as a politician - and (without fact) I think Pelosi has had a hand in that.

If Zonk is right and we take the senate - we need someone like Warren to have a plan and someone like Pelosi to drive the votes. And then Biden just needs to give the two cover to get things done.

BTW, do we know if Warren is good with the nuclear option (that Sanders wasn't up for)?