Official 2020 NBA Draft Thread

[tiderulz]

I think there might be legs in AG to GSW for their pick.

My preferred structure is a three team trade involving Phoenix where we net GSW's pick and Oubre for AG and #15.

Orl out: AG, #15
Orl in: GSW pick, Oubre

Pho out: Oubre
Pho in: GSW TPE, #15

GSW out: GSW pick, TPE
GSW in: AG

Depending on where GSW's pick lands, Edwards, Hayes or Ball + Oubre is a good haul for us IMO.

no chance in heck GSW trades their top-5ish pick for AG

[tiderulz]

Minnesota fans really want AG and they have James Johnson and a high pick.

I wouldn't mind Schroder either.

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are we dying for 33 yr old Johnson and a mid round pick?

[Xatticus]

I think there might be legs in AG to GSW for their pick.

My preferred structure is a three team trade involving Phoenix where we net GSW's pick and Oubre for AG and #15.

Orl out: AG, #15
Orl in: GSW pick, Oubre

Pho out: Oubre
Pho in: GSW TPE, #15

GSW out: GSW pick, TPE
GSW in: AG

Depending on where GSW's pick lands, Edwards, Hayes or Ball + Oubre is a good haul for us IMO.

oubre? you do know he's coming off knee surgery right?

And? its not as if the guy we drafted at #16 overall last year wasnt coming off a knee injury

Not sure why so many hate on Oubre, but the guy he has literally improve his Pts\reb\ass\stl\blk every single year and this past year was a 19\6\2 player as the 3rd option on a bubble team in the west (only 4 games behind our record) while shooting good %, and to top it off, hes only 24. Not sure what people are expecting in our 1st rounder, but if you look at the 16-30 draft picks lately...

2017
Justin Patton
D. J. Wilson
T. J. Leaf
John Collins
Harry Giles
Terrance Ferguson
Jarrett Allen
OG Anunoby
Tyler Lydon
Anžejs Pasečņiks
Caleb Swanigan
Kyle Kuzma
Tony Bradley
Derrick White
Josh Hart
Omari Spellman

2018
Zhaire Smith
Donte DiVincenzo
Lonnie Walker
Kevin Huerter
Josh Okogie
Grayson Allen
Chandler Hutchison
Aaron Holiday
Anfernee Simons
Moritz Wagner
Landry Shamet
Robert Williams
Jacob Evans
Džanan Musa
Omari Spellman

2019
Chuma Okeke
Nickeil Alexander-Walker
Goga Bitadze
Luka Šamanić
Matisse Thybulle
Brandon Clarke
Grant Williams
Darius Bazley
Ty Jerome
Nassir Little
Dylan Windler#
Mfiondu Kabengele
Jordan Poole
Keldon Johnson
Kevin Porter Jr.

I mean looking at that, theres maybe a handful of guys on those lists id take over Oubre

Because he just isn't that good and you are going to have to pay him. His numbers have risen as a function of his playing time. He has a really low AST%. He hasn't made the Suns better when he has been on the floor. The only thing you can really point to as evidence of improvement is his TS%, but it's really not high enough that it matters. His next contract is probably going to provide the worst value for his career making it the very worst time to acquire him.

I think he is probably a slightly negative asset and I wouldn't give anything of real value to get him. I wouldn't even consider trading Gordon for him unless we got more in return and I'd rather use this year's pick on a rookie-scale player.

[KillMonger]

Minnesota fans really want AG and they have James Johnson and a high pick.

I wouldn't mind Schroder either.

Sent from my SM-G950U using RealGM mobile app

are we dying for 33 yr old Johnson and a mid round pick?

minny has a top 5 don't they?

[basketballRob]

Minnesota fans really want AG and they have James Johnson and a high pick.

I wouldn't mind Schroder either.

Sent from my SM-G950U using RealGM mobile app

are we dying for 33 yr old Johnson and a mid round pick?

They may have a top 5 pick.

Sent from my SM-G950U using RealGM mobile app

[The Effect]

minny has a top 5 don't they?

They may have a top 5 pick.

Pretty sure they will have 2 1st rounders, a top 5 and a pick right around ours (currently 1 pick ahead of us)

You can bet that they arent trading a top 5 pick for gordon, so likely the offer would be salary dump vet and the 15th pick

[KillMonger]

minny has a top 5 don't they?

They may have a top 5 pick.

Pretty sure they will have 2 1st rounders, a top 5 and a pick right around ours (currently 1 pick ahead of us)

You can bet that they arent trading a top 5 pick for gordon, so likely the offer would be salary dump vet and the 15th pick

well the rumor with golden state involve them giving up their 1st rounder for AG so if Minny isn't coming with that to the table then......



that deal ain't getting it done

[Skin]

oubre? you do know he's coming off knee surgery right?

And? its not as if the guy we drafted at #16 overall last year wasnt coming off a knee injury

Not sure why so many hate on Oubre, but the guy he has literally improve his Pts\reb\ass\stl\blk every single year and this past year was a 19\6\2 player as the 3rd option on a bubble team in the west (only 4 games behind our record) while shooting good %, and to top it off, hes only 24. Not sure what people are expecting in our 1st rounder, but if you look at the 16-30 draft picks lately...

2017
Justin Patton
D. J. Wilson
T. J. Leaf
John Collins
Harry Giles
Terrance Ferguson
Jarrett Allen
OG Anunoby
Tyler Lydon
Anžejs Pasečņiks
Caleb Swanigan
Kyle Kuzma
Tony Bradley
Derrick White
Josh Hart
Omari Spellman

2018
Zhaire Smith
Donte DiVincenzo
Lonnie Walker
Kevin Huerter
Josh Okogie
Grayson Allen
Chandler Hutchison
Aaron Holiday
Anfernee Simons
Moritz Wagner
Landry Shamet
Robert Williams
Jacob Evans
Džanan Musa
Omari Spellman

2019
Chuma Okeke
Nickeil Alexander-Walker
Goga Bitadze
Luka Šamanić
Matisse Thybulle
Brandon Clarke
Grant Williams
Darius Bazley
Ty Jerome
Nassir Little
Dylan Windler#
Mfiondu Kabengele
Jordan Poole
Keldon Johnson
Kevin Porter Jr.

I mean looking at that, theres maybe a handful of guys on those lists id take over Oubre

Because he just isn't that good and you are going to have to pay him. His numbers have risen as a function of his playing time. He has a really low AST%. He hasn't made the Suns better when he has been on the floor. The only thing you can really point to as evidence of improvement is his TS%, but it's really not high enough that it matters. His next contract is probably going to provide the worst value for his career making it the very worst time to acquire him.

I think he is probably a slightly negative asset and I wouldn't give anything of real value to get him. I wouldn't even consider trading Gordon for him unless we got more in return and I'd rather use this year's pick on a rookie-scale player.

Might be bias since I've been such a long time proponent for bringing here and being a fan of his since the draft.

But I think he's getting a bad wrap here. Suns have not been winning but I can't really fault him for that. Does Booker get the same criticism? He's been there longer.

Actually thought Oubre brought some intangibles to the team that brought them closer. He actually thinks highly of his teammates and sacrificed for them... plus with his labeling them as Valley Boyz that brought them closer.

He's had to pay out of position a lot (PF) just to allow more PT for others. His Ast% could be affected by his role, not sure. But he does make hustle plays on D and brings an intensity to the court. I thought the Suns did him dirty in FA, but he was a RFA so that's part of their right I guess.

He has a lot of characteristics that WeHam seems to like so maybe in a system that takes advantage of him properly will get more out of him.

I would trade Gordon for him straight up based on fit and better balance with our roster. I think he could even play SG at times giving us crazy length with his 7'3 wingspan.

[Knightro]

Gordon is a better basketball player than Oubre for my money, so I wouldn’t do that deal straight up.

I could be talked in to something like Gordon and 16 for Oubre and 10 if a guy I really liked fell unexpectedly to 10 on draft night.

Or if Phoenix ends up getting a top 4 pick in the lottery and I can take a swing on one of the higher upside guys, then sure.

Otherwise, I’d just keep Gordon around for a different trade possibility or to have on the roster.

[The Effect]

minny has a top 5 don't they?

They may have a top 5 pick.

Pretty sure they will have 2 1st rounders, a top 5 and a pick right around ours (currently 1 pick ahead of us)

You can bet that they arent trading a top 5 pick for gordon, so likely the offer would be salary dump vet and the 15th pick

well the rumor with golden state involve them giving up their 1st rounder for AG so if Minny isn't coming with that to the table then......



that deal ain't getting it done

Those are rumors started by fans, not by credible sources. Theres no way the warriors are trading a top 4 pick for Gordon no matter what fansided writers think

[Skin]

Gordon is a better basketball player than Oubre for my money, so I wouldn’t do that deal straight up.

I could be talked in to something like Gordon and 16 for Oubre and 10 if a guy I really liked fell unexpectedly to 10 on draft night.

Or if Phoenix ends up getting a top 4 pick in the lottery and I can take a swing on one of the higher upside guys, then sure.

Otherwise, I’d just keep Gordon around for a different trade possibility or to have on the roster.

Obviously would take more if I could get more but I won't be so picky that I miss out on the guy I want.

I think getting a lottery pick for him is unrealistic and a top 4 pick is just laughable. Why do Magic fans fall for this type of trade value for our players? I see it on the T/T forum all the time. We overrate our players so badly.

Who would your top 3 targets be if you were trading AG? I'd like to hear more than "save him for another trade". I think we should stay under the age of 25 to ensure the player can grow with our young core. Who ya got?

[Xatticus]

Gordon is a better basketball player than Oubre for my money, so I wouldn’t do that deal straight up.

I could be talked in to something like Gordon and 16 for Oubre and 10 if a guy I really liked fell unexpectedly to 10 on draft night.

Or if Phoenix ends up getting a top 4 pick in the lottery and I can take a swing on one of the higher upside guys, then sure.

Otherwise, I’d just keep Gordon around for a different trade possibility or to have on the roster.

Obviously would take more if I could get more but I won't be so picky that I miss out on the guy I want.

I think getting a lottery pick for him is unrealistic and a top 4 pick is just laughable. Why do Magic fans fall for this type of trade value for our players? I see it on the T/T forum all the time. We overrate our players so badly.

Who would your top 3 targets be if you were trading AG? I'd like to hear more than "save him for another trade". I think we should stay under the age of 25 to ensure the player can grow with our young core. Who ya got?

I don't know why everyone is so dismissive of this. I don't know that GS would be interested in such a swap, but I could certainly see why they would be. I'd actually be a bit surprised if they held onto that pick. This is not a strong draft and GS needs to retool if they are going to make another run at a title next year. Their championship window is closing and they'd probably be DOA if they just drafted Anthony Edwards. Gordon can give them someone to throw at LeBron, Kawhi, George, etc... and he is still young enough that he can be part of the post-Curry future. Gordon's perceived value almost certainly rises when everyone sees him as a functional piece of a contender in the Western Conference. I think the potential stumbling block would be that GS just might not be willing to use that trade exception to take on more salary. They are in luxury tax hell and revenue is uncertain right now.

[The Effect]

Gordon is a better basketball player than Oubre for my money, so I wouldn’t do that deal straight up.

I could be talked in to something like Gordon and 16 for Oubre and 10 if a guy I really liked fell unexpectedly to 10 on draft night.

Or if Phoenix ends up getting a top 4 pick in the lottery and I can take a swing on one of the higher upside guys, then sure.

Otherwise, I’d just keep Gordon around for a different trade possibility or to have on the roster.

Obviously would take more if I could get more but I won't be so picky that I miss out on the guy I want.

I think getting a lottery pick for him is unrealistic and a top 4 pick is just laughable. Why do Magic fans fall for this type of trade value for our players? I see it on the T/T forum all the time. We overrate our players so badly.

Who would your top 3 targets be if you were trading AG? I'd like to hear more than "save him for another trade". I think we should stay under the age of 25 to ensure the player can grow with our young core. Who ya got?

Exactly, people seem to think we trade AG for Luka or something when in reality if we are trading with the Warriors in a AG trade, its sadly something like AG+Aminu for Wiggins and maybe a FUTURE 1st (def not this years top 4 pick)

I actually think Oubre is kind of a best case scenario for what we should be expecting in a AG trade. A young, high potential, improving wing on a similar contract to replace Evan. If not Oubre, we are probably looking at guys like Buddy Heild, Spencer Dinwiddie (or levert?) or Gary Harris (although with Millsap, MPj and Bol, they probably have no use for gordon), but of all those i think Oubre has the best combo of WeHam characteristics.
Good defender, Crazy Wingspan (7'3), good 3pt shooter, young

Is he perfect, no of course not, but compared to what people want to think AG is worth........He much more likely

[The Effect]

Gordon is a better basketball player than Oubre for my money, so I wouldn’t do that deal straight up.

I could be talked in to something like Gordon and 16 for Oubre and 10 if a guy I really liked fell unexpectedly to 10 on draft night.

Or if Phoenix ends up getting a top 4 pick in the lottery and I can take a swing on one of the higher upside guys, then sure.

Otherwise, I’d just keep Gordon around for a different trade possibility or to have on the roster.

Obviously would take more if I could get more but I won't be so picky that I miss out on the guy I want.

I think getting a lottery pick for him is unrealistic and a top 4 pick is just laughable. Why do Magic fans fall for this type of trade value for our players? I see it on the T/T forum all the time. We overrate our players so badly.

Who would your top 3 targets be if you were trading AG? I'd like to hear more than "save him for another trade". I think we should stay under the age of 25 to ensure the player can grow with our young core. Who ya got?

I don't know why everyone is so dismissive of this. I don't know that GS would be interested in such a swap, but I could certainly see why they would be. I'd actually be a bit surprised if they held onto that pick. This is not a strong draft and GS needs to retool if they are going to make another run at a title next year. Their championship window is closing and they'd probably be DOA if they just drafted Anthony Edwards. Gordon can give them someone to throw at LeBron, Kawhi, George, etc... and he is still young enough that he can be part of the post-Curry future. Gordon's perceived value almost certainly rises when everyone sees him as a functional piece of a contender in the Western Conference. I think the potential stumbling block would be that GS just might not be willing to use that trade exception to take on more salary. They are in luxury tax hell and revenue is uncertain right now.

Im sorry, but there isnt a GM in the NBA that would take a 16-18m a year 24 year old GOrdon, over a rookie contract top 5 pick. You can think its a week draft, but i dont see it that way, especially at the top. There is everything they could want at the top of the draft. If they want a PG of the future, they can get Ball, who would be a great eventual replacement for Curry. A SG? Edwards is sitting there. a Hybrid G? Hayes. a High flying 4? Toppin, or an elite center? Wiseman. They arent trading any of those guys for AG

As for a post curry future, im sure they looked at how Gordon fared in our rebuild and will take their chances with a younger player

Again, if Gordon ends up in GS, its gonna be for Wiggins, not a top 5 pick

[Skin]

Gordon is a better basketball player than Oubre for my money, so I wouldn’t do that deal straight up.

I could be talked in to something like Gordon and 16 for Oubre and 10 if a guy I really liked fell unexpectedly to 10 on draft night.

Or if Phoenix ends up getting a top 4 pick in the lottery and I can take a swing on one of the higher upside guys, then sure.

Otherwise, I’d just keep Gordon around for a different trade possibility or to have on the roster.

Obviously would take more if I could get more but I won't be so picky that I miss out on the guy I want.

I think getting a lottery pick for him is unrealistic and a top 4 pick is just laughable. Why do Magic fans fall for this type of trade value for our players? I see it on the T/T forum all the time. We overrate our players so badly.

Who would your top 3 targets be if you were trading AG? I'd like to hear more than "save him for another trade". I think we should stay under the age of 25 to ensure the player can grow with our young core. Who ya got?

I don't know why everyone is so dismissive of this. I don't know that GS would be interested in such a swap, but I could certainly see why they would be. I'd actually be a bit surprised if they held onto that pick. This is not a strong draft and GS needs to retool if they are going to make another run at a title next year. Their championship window is closing and they'd probably be DOA if they just drafted Anthony Edwards. Gordon can give them someone to throw at LeBron, Kawhi, George, etc... and he is still young enough that he can be part of the post-Curry future. Gordon's perceived value almost certainly rises when everyone sees him as a functional piece of a contender in the Western Conference. I think the potential stumbling block would be that GS just might not be willing to use that trade exception to take on more salary. They are in luxury tax hell and revenue is uncertain right now.

Because it's way too good to be true. If GS is really dangling their unprotected pick around the NBA, they're bound to get a better offer than AG. If we offered AG, they'd probably counter with wanting Isaac.

[Xatticus]

Obviously would take more if I could get more but I won't be so picky that I miss out on the guy I want.

I think getting a lottery pick for him is unrealistic and a top 4 pick is just laughable. Why do Magic fans fall for this type of trade value for our players? I see it on the T/T forum all the time. We overrate our players so badly.

Who would your top 3 targets be if you were trading AG? I'd like to hear more than "save him for another trade". I think we should stay under the age of 25 to ensure the player can grow with our young core. Who ya got?

I don't know why everyone is so dismissive of this. I don't know that GS would be interested in such a swap, but I could certainly see why they would be. I'd actually be a bit surprised if they held onto that pick. This is not a strong draft and GS needs to retool if they are going to make another run at a title next year. Their championship window is closing and they'd probably be DOA if they just drafted Anthony Edwards. Gordon can give them someone to throw at LeBron, Kawhi, George, etc... and he is still young enough that he can be part of the post-Curry future. Gordon's perceived value almost certainly rises when everyone sees him as a functional piece of a contender in the Western Conference. I think the potential stumbling block would be that GS just might not be willing to use that trade exception to take on more salary. They are in luxury tax hell and revenue is uncertain right now.

Im sorry, but there isnt a GM in the NBA that would take a 16-18m a year 24 year old GOrdon, over a rookie contract top 5 pick. You can think its a week draft, but i dont see it that way, especially at the top. There is everything they could want at the top of the draft. If they want a PG of the future, they can get Ball, who would be a great eventual replacement for Curry. A SG? Edwards is sitting there. a Hybrid G? Hayes. a High flying 4? Toppin, or an elite center? Wiseman. They arent trading any of those guys for AG

As for a post curry future, im sure they looked at how Gordon fared in our rebuild and will take their chances with a younger player

Again, if Gordon ends up in GS, its gonna be for Wiggins, not a top 5 pick

Pretty much everyone looks more appealing before they are drafted. Gordon was every bit the prospect at the time of his drafting that these guys are right now. The difference is that he has six years of development under his belt. Do you remember how hyped RJ Barrett was one year ago? He probably would've gone first in this draft.

Edwards makes any team in the league worse the moment he steps onto the floor. You are drafting his body and hoping you can teach him to basketball. Hayes and Ball are going to require a lot of development time. Ball has plus vision and what else? He couldn't handle the Australian league. Hayes' team finished dead last in the EuroCup (1-9), which is the tier below the EuroLeague. Toppin is 18 months younger than Gordon. Gordon was averaging 18 ppg and 8 rpg in the NBA when he was Toppin's age now. Toppin can't defend. Is he better than Hachimura? Wiseman is the big wild card. He will pile up stats. How much he contributes to winning remains to be seen.

Steph Curry will be approaching 33 years of age when next season begins. Their window is now. None of these players projected to go in the top 5 of this year's draft are going to help the Warriors win a title while Curry is still an elite player in the NBA.

Understand that I am not a proponent of trading Gordon to get into the top 5 this year. The talent just isn't there.

[Knightro]

I just can't see a scenario where the Magic trade Gordon to Golden State and get W's first round pick back that doesn't involve them taking on Wiggins' salary as well.

The Warriors could be facing a historically large luxury tax bill if the salary cap and luxury tax drop significantly for next season. They are already at $142.1M in salary on 8 players. They could literally be on the hook for hundreds of millions of dollars in tax if things drop dramatically and the NBA doesn't do a smoothing process.

Dumping Wiggins and their pick for a cheaper and better player than Wiggins seems like something GS could potentially be interested in.

Something like Gordon, Birch and 16 for Wiggins and their top 5 pick.

The question then becomes, with the aforementioned impending cap drop, would the Magic be willing to add that much salary which would inevitably push them into the luxury tax as well?

Probably not.

[Bensational]

Understand that I am not a proponent of trading Gordon to get into the top 5 this year. The talent just isn't there.

Which is why I think it's possible GSW or Minnesota consider trading their picks for Gordon, if he were made available. This draft is less valuable than others since there are no clear and obvious stars. Like the Oladipo draft, teams know this will be one where the real impact guys fall randomly through the draft like McCollum, Giannis and Gobert did.

If GSW were able to trade a top 5 pick for Gordon + #16, they could come away with a ready now player to help their contending hopes, and another prospect for the future who could be as good or better than who we get in the top 5.

Frankly I'd love to see what Gordon looked like on a team like that, or the Raptors, or Celtics, or Spurs. If he's not going to be here, I'd like to see him on a good team at least.

I'm excited to see how he handles the playoffs this year. His growth there will say a lot about him as a prospect. I think we can safely expect a collapse from Vuc and Fournier, so hopefully Gordon can bring some new life to the lineup.

[Knightro]

I would trade Aaron Gordon for a top 5 pick.

I am willing to roll the dice on one of Ball, Edwards, Haliburton or *gulp* Hayes becoming an all-star guard.

Okeke and Aminu can soak up the outgoing forward minutes that would be lost by moving Gordon.

If it doesn't work out, the Magic aren't really in a worse position than they are right now because they're a upper 30s win team anyway. It's not like have a bright future to screw up.

[Bensational]

I just can't see a scenario where the Magic trade Gordon to Golden State and get W's first round pick back that doesn't involve them taking on Wiggins' salary as well.

The Warriors could be facing a historically large luxury tax bill if the salary cap and luxury tax drop significantly for next season. They are already at $142.1M in salary on 8 players. They could literally be on the hook for hundreds of millions of dollars in tax if things drop dramatically and the NBA doesn't do a smoothing process.

Dumping Wiggins and their pick for a cheaper and better player than Wiggins seems like something GS could potentially be interested in.

Something like Gordon, Birch and 16 for Wiggins and their top 5 pick.

The question then becomes, with the aforementioned impending cap drop, would the Magic be willing to add that much salary which would inevitably push them into the luxury tax as well?

Probably not.

I don't think the Warriors think of Wiggins as a salary dump guy. They just traded D'Lo for him, and better offers surely would've been around for him. They also have deep pockets and are on a championship run. But I'm sure they'd also like a cheaper alternative. I don't see a Gordon for Wiggins swap being worth a 10+ jump in draft position. I think the Warriors will want more value than that.

What about Fournier (opted in) + Gordon + #16 for Wiggins + Looney + #5?

They take on more salary, but with two starting calibre players to fill out their depth. Adding the #16 is probably overkill on our part, but WeHam won't want anymore youth on the team.

We get a wing scorer to try alongside Fultz for a bit in Wiggins, and whoever we draft. Or we flip Wiggins on to another team. Wiggins + #16 for CJ? Wiggins for DeRozan? Wiggins for Heild? Wiggins for Oubre Jr?

Whoever we draft is likely 2-3 seasons away from opportunity and substantial minutes in this current system, as we've seen with Isaac, Fultz and Bamba so far. So drafting a prospect doesn't excite me in the short term, knowing we won't see anything of them. You just have to look at the experience of Bamba for the past two seasons and think - do I want to go through that again just to discover Ball/Edwards/Hayes is Hezonja 2.0? Not really. Especially not compared to the version of Gordon we were seeing just before covid lockdowns.

To me, someone like Wiggins or Oubre Jr have as much chance of becoming all stars as most of the guys in the top 5, but they've done the bulk of their development already. They just need the system, opportunity and mindset to take it to the next level.