2020 NBA Draft prospects

[Nick K]

For years I've complained about not having effective scoring guards and now we have plenty. We need a presence inside OO can be that guy.

We have two scoring guards....that's not plenty.

Well, we do have Culver and Nowell developing. We have next to nothing at PF. I do have hope for Jared Vanderbilt though.

Hernangomez isn't it by any means. Layman isn't an inside presence. I was somewhat happy with Saric who we moved for little.

If we don't add toughness and rebounding inside we won't win 30 games. The Covington experiment at PF was a failure.

Now if Edwards were there, that's another story.

[shangrila]

I don't see the Taj comp but even so he'd most likely still be better than anybody else in this poor draft.

They're very similar statistically coming out, but even then it's more of a role comparison.

It's nice to imagine that Onyeka will improve his shooting or passing but it's not a guarantee and so I floated the idea that he's just a solid starter (i.e. a Taj Gibson type) rather than some elite piece on a championship level team with the board's biggest OO fan, KG.

It wasn't meant as an insult to Onyeka. You're probably right that this kind of outcome might put him at the top of this class. Nor would I be upset if we took him (he and Deni are at the top of my board). But at the same time I think it's important to be realistic. Onyeka would help us but I get the vibe that people think he's going to transform the team or something.

So yeah, I was just curious what KG thought of that comp.

And my answer is that Taj 2.0 is his worst possible outcome. I'm a big Taj guy, but I think OO7 (hope he gets that #) is bigger, faster, stronger, quicker and more agile.

I know, I saw your original reply I just didn't respond. I was just explaining to Nick what I was doing.

But honestly, I think putting Taj as the floor is a bit ridiculous. Onyeka could easily wind up being like Biyombo instead, and there's probably more guys that fit his style and/or body type that didn't have the longevity or highs that Gibson had during his career. That doesn't get into whether a young Gibson would even get the same opportunities in today's league either.

As I've said, I like Onyeka. I just think the hype for him is getting a little out of control.

[shangrila]

I don't see the Taj comp but even so he'd most likely still be better than anybody else in this poor draft.

They're very similar statistically coming out, but even then it's more of a role comparison.

It's nice to imagine that Onyeka will improve his shooting or passing but it's not a guarantee and so I floated the idea that he's just a solid starter (i.e. a Taj Gibson type) rather than some elite piece on a championship level team with the board's biggest OO fan, KG.

It wasn't meant as an insult to Onyeka. You're probably right that this kind of outcome might put him at the top of this class. Nor would I be upset if we took him (he and Deni are at the top of my board). But at the same time I think it's important to be realistic. Onyeka would help us but I get the vibe that people think he's going to transform the team or something.

So yeah, I was just curious what KG thought of that comp.

I hear you. I liked Taj too. I just see us lacking rim protection, rebounding and toughness inside so a player like O.O. might be able to transform us in a good way. Look at how Rodman fit as the perfect piece for Detroit and Chicago. I'm not saying OO is Rodman but he brings what we need.

That makes sense and I'll agree that he should help in certain areas (he sure as hell can't hurt, anyway). But I've seen people talk like bringing him in will fix our defensive issues, like we can just turn the keys to our defence over to him and we'll be fine. I don't think he's got that potential and that's not a shot at him; you can probably count on one hand the number of players in league history that could single handily change a defence.

I might be wrong but in the film I've seen on OO he can defend the perimeter too.

I'm a little torn on that. I don't think I'd want him guarding full on perimeter players but he should be more than fine defending in space or switching.

In reality I'm not sure it matters for us. They seemed fine with Hernangomez starting at the 4 and he's strictly a big, not a wing like Cov is, so I don't see why Okongwu can't be a 4 for us.

For years I've complained about not having effective scoring guards and now we have plenty. We need a presence inside OO can be that guy.

Kind of.

I think what we need is defensive 3/4 guys that can hit 3s. That doesn't necessarily exclude Onyeka (I do buy stock in his shooting improving over time) but it's not where he's at right now either.

Although I suppose that doesn't really matter either. I doubt there's anyone in this draft that would be starting for us next season.

[Klomp]

I might be wrong but in the film I've seen on OO he can defend the perimeter too.

I'm a little torn on that. I don't think I'd want him guarding full on perimeter players but he should be more than fine defending in space or switching.

In reality I'm not sure it matters for us. They seemed fine with Hernangomez starting at the 4 and he's strictly a big, not a wing like Cov is, so I don't see why Okongwu can't be a 4 for us.

Again, if we were talking about defending on a few possessions per game, I wouldn't have a problem with Okongwu. But that's not the system Minnesota has run so far, and it's not the system Vanterpool ran in Portland either. They switch almost everything except at center, so whoever plays the 4 is basically guarding perimeter players every possession. Sometimes, you have to base things on reality and not the emotions of what we think they should do.

Spoiler:

Vanterpool has indeed designed a system — or, as he calls it, “our process” — to limit an opponent’s offensive production at the rim and from beyond the 3-point arc, while encouraging shots from the less-efficient midrange areas of the court.

Players on the Wolves roster who worked under Vanterpool with the Trail Blazers say that the fundamentals of the process are almost exactly the same as what he implemented in Portland. There is a lot more switching of coverages (the terminology used is “blacking”) than has happened with past Timberwolves teams, with the significant exception of the center position, which has an abiding responsibility for defending shots at the rim. (When describing what happens, players adhere to the typical basketball lingo of assigned numbers to positions according to ostensible height, so that the short point guards are a 1 and the centers are a 5, with shooting guards, small forwards and power forwards in-between.)

“We mostly black 1-through-4 as part of our basic package. But it’s all about who is on the floor for us and who is on the floor for them,” said swingman Jake Layman. “Sometimes we black 1-through-5, sometimes 2-through-4, sometimes just 3 and 4.” Added Noah Vonleh, “When I am a 5, I am pretty much a rim protector, and as a 4 I am switching much more.”

https://theathletic.com/1507563/2020/01/09/david-vanterpool-timberwolves-defense-process-andrew-wiggins/

Hernangomez certainly has more wing-ness than Okongwu from what I've seen. He regularly played SF in Denver. Watch this draft workout, he's moving around the court doing things that I simply don't think Okongwu can do.

Watch on YouTube

Again, maybe I'm wrong. Maybe Okongwu can actually move around the court like OG Anunoby. But I've just seen nothing so far from college or high school highlights to give me confidence that he already has that capability.

[K4P]

Without even considering OO's possible fit issues in the Wolves scheme, drafting a big top 5 is usually a bad idea unless he's a generational talent with star upside, especially when there are guys like Christian Wood constantly flying under the radar that could be had for cheaper than a top 3-5 rookie scale deal.

[KGdaBom]

They're very similar statistically coming out, but even then it's more of a role comparison.

It's nice to imagine that Onyeka will improve his shooting or passing but it's not a guarantee and so I floated the idea that he's just a solid starter (i.e. a Taj Gibson type) rather than some elite piece on a championship level team with the board's biggest OO fan, KG.

It wasn't meant as an insult to Onyeka. You're probably right that this kind of outcome might put him at the top of this class. Nor would I be upset if we took him (he and Deni are at the top of my board). But at the same time I think it's important to be realistic. Onyeka would help us but I get the vibe that people think he's going to transform the team or something.

So yeah, I was just curious what KG thought of that comp.

And my answer is that Taj 2.0 is his worst possible outcome. I'm a big Taj guy, but I think OO7 (hope he gets that #) is bigger, faster, stronger, quicker and more agile.

I know, I saw your original reply I just didn't respond. I was just explaining to Nick what I was doing.

But honestly, I think putting Taj as the floor is a bit ridiculous. Onyeka could easily wind up being like Biyombo instead, and there's probably more guys that fit his style and/or body type that didn't have the longevity or highs that Gibson had during his career. That doesn't get into whether a young Gibson would even get the same opportunities in today's league either.

As I've said, I like Onyeka. I just think the hype for him is getting a little out of control.

I think the hype against Okongwu is getting out of control. Fit bullsheet. Talent first. Gibson floor. Zo Ceiling. Go Wolves.

[KGdaBom]

They're very similar statistically coming out, but even then it's more of a role comparison.

It's nice to imagine that Onyeka will improve his shooting or passing but it's not a guarantee and so I floated the idea that he's just a solid starter (i.e. a Taj Gibson type) rather than some elite piece on a championship level team with the board's biggest OO fan, KG.

It wasn't meant as an insult to Onyeka. You're probably right that this kind of outcome might put him at the top of this class. Nor would I be upset if we took him (he and Deni are at the top of my board). But at the same time I think it's important to be realistic. Onyeka would help us but I get the vibe that people think he's going to transform the team or something.

So yeah, I was just curious what KG thought of that comp.

I hear you. I liked Taj too. I just see us lacking rim protection, rebounding and toughness inside so a player like O.O. might be able to transform us in a good way. Look at how Rodman fit as the perfect piece for Detroit and Chicago. I'm not saying OO is Rodman but he brings what we need.

That makes sense and I'll agree that he should help in certain areas (he sure as hell can't hurt, anyway). But I've seen people talk like bringing him in will fix our defensive issues, like we can just turn the keys to our defence over to him and we'll be fine. I don't think he's got that potential and that's not a shot at him; you can probably count on one hand the number of players in league history that could single handily change a defence.

I might be wrong but in the film I've seen on OO he can defend the perimeter too.

I'm a little torn on that. I don't think I'd want him guarding full on perimeter players but he should be more than fine defending in space or switching.

In reality I'm not sure it matters for us. They seemed fine with Hernangomez starting at the 4 and he's strictly a big, not a wing like Cov is, so I don't see why Okongwu can't be a 4 for us.

For years I've complained about not having effective scoring guards and now we have plenty. We need a presence inside OO can be that guy.

Kind of.

I think what we need is defensive 3/4 guys that can hit 3s. That doesn't necessarily exclude Onyeka (I do buy stock in his shooting improving over time) but it's not where he's at right now either.

Although I suppose that doesn't really matter either. I doubt there's anyone in this draft that would be starting for us next season.

I think there are many guys in the draft who could start for us this year. OO7 is one of them.

[KGdaBom]

CBS Sports Mock
https://www.cbssports.com/nba/news/2020-nba-mock-draft-lamelo-ball-obi-toppin-and-anthony-edwards-in-top-three-of-final-pre-lottery-projection/?ftag=SNL-04-10aaa0b&ET_CID=133990&ET_RID=39590134
Ball and Toppin go 1-2 leaving us Edwards at 3.
Wiseman 4
OO7 5
Onyeka Okongwu C
SOUTHERN CALIFORNIA • FR • 6'9" / 245 LBS
PROJECTED TEAM
Detroit
PROSPECT RNK
6th
POSITION RNK
2nd
PPG
16.2
RPG
8.6
APG
1.1
3P%
25%
Onyeka Okongwu mostly operated off the national radar this past season because he played for an unranked team on the West Coast. But he was fantastic rather quickly -- averaging 16.2 points and 8.6 rebounds while shooting 61.6% from the field. He's the main reason USC won 16 of its first 20 games and would've been in the NCAA Tournament if the NCAA Tournament had been played. Is he an undersized big? Yes, probably. But he's an undersized big who can play multiple positions. And, either way, the NBA is now littered with undersized bigs. So even though Okongwu wasn't thought of this way coming out of high school, it's now reasonable to call him the second-best big prospect in the draft.

They have us taking the very intriguing Maledon at 17.
PROJECTED TEAM
Minnesota
PROSPECT RNK
16th
POSITION RNK
6th
Theo Maledon is a skilled athlete, one who previously became the youngest LNB All-Star in history. He missed time with an injury while playing professionally in France this past season and was mostly underwhelming — although, in fairness, he played better as things progressed. But the talent that made him an interesting prospect at a young age still exists and is attractive to NBA executives selecting in this range.

[gandlogo]

And my answer is that Taj 2.0 is his worst possible outcome. I'm a big Taj guy, but I think OO7 (hope he gets that #) is bigger, faster, stronger, quicker and more agile.

I know, I saw your original reply I just didn't respond. I was just explaining to Nick what I was doing.

But honestly, I think putting Taj as the floor is a bit ridiculous. Onyeka could easily wind up being like Biyombo instead, and there's probably more guys that fit his style and/or body type that didn't have the longevity or highs that Gibson had during his career. That doesn't get into whether a young Gibson would even get the same opportunities in today's league either.

As I've said, I like Onyeka. I just think the hype for him is getting a little out of control.

I think the hype against Okongwu is getting out of control. Fit bullsheet. Talent first. Gibson floor. Zo Ceiling. Go Wolves.

This doesn’t have to be mutually exclusive. OK could turn out to be a great player and he’s not likely a fit in the current Wolves system. Thus, making him not the player they need. If he shows them something in workouts - like the ability to consistently space the floor offensively and the ability to guard wings full-time - then he could be awesome. If he’s a guy that sits in the dunker’s box or clogs the lane setting screens at the elbow, he’s probably not the guy - regardless of the other things he could bring.

[gandlogo]

I might be wrong but in the film I've seen on OO he can defend the perimeter too.

I'm a little torn on that. I don't think I'd want him guarding full on perimeter players but he should be more than fine defending in space or switching.

In reality I'm not sure it matters for us. They seemed fine with Hernangomez starting at the 4 and he's strictly a big, not a wing like Cov is, so I don't see why Okongwu can't be a 4 for us.

Again, if we were talking about defending on a few possessions per game, I wouldn't have a problem with Okongwu. But that's not the system Minnesota has run so far, and it's not the system Vanterpool ran in Portland either. They switch almost everything except at center, so whoever plays the 4 is basically guarding perimeter players every possession. Sometimes, you have to base things on reality and not the emotions of what we think they should do.

Spoiler:

Vanterpool has indeed designed a system — or, as he calls it, “our process” — to limit an opponent’s offensive production at the rim and from beyond the 3-point arc, while encouraging shots from the less-efficient midrange areas of the court.

Players on the Wolves roster who worked under Vanterpool with the Trail Blazers say that the fundamentals of the process are almost exactly the same as what he implemented in Portland. There is a lot more switching of coverages (the terminology used is “blacking”) than has happened with past Timberwolves teams, with the significant exception of the center position, which has an abiding responsibility for defending shots at the rim. (When describing what happens, players adhere to the typical basketball lingo of assigned numbers to positions according to ostensible height, so that the short point guards are a 1 and the centers are a 5, with shooting guards, small forwards and power forwards in-between.)

“We mostly black 1-through-4 as part of our basic package. But it’s all about who is on the floor for us and who is on the floor for them,” said swingman Jake Layman. “Sometimes we black 1-through-5, sometimes 2-through-4, sometimes just 3 and 4.” Added Noah Vonleh, “When I am a 5, I am pretty much a rim protector, and as a 4 I am switching much more.”

https://theathletic.com/1507563/2020/01/09/david-vanterpool-timberwolves-defense-process-andrew-wiggins/

Hernangomez certainly has more wing-ness than Okongwu from what I've seen. He regularly played SF in Denver. Watch this draft workout, he's moving around the court doing things that I simply don't think Okongwu can do.

Watch on YouTube

That’s why I’m very intrigued with pairing Avdija and Hernangomez at “forwards.” Physically very similar (Layman too). Enough size to body when needed. But still can switch a lot. Both should rebound well - especially defensively. Spacers, slashers, passers on offensive. Either can also share the floor with lesser offensive threats like Culver or Okogie because they are themselves threats.

[KGdaBom]

I'm a little torn on that. I don't think I'd want him guarding full on perimeter players but he should be more than fine defending in space or switching.

In reality I'm not sure it matters for us. They seemed fine with Hernangomez starting at the 4 and he's strictly a big, not a wing like Cov is, so I don't see why Okongwu can't be a 4 for us.

Again, if we were talking about defending on a few possessions per game, I wouldn't have a problem with Okongwu. But that's not the system Minnesota has run so far, and it's not the system Vanterpool ran in Portland either. They switch almost everything except at center, so whoever plays the 4 is basically guarding perimeter players every possession. Sometimes, you have to base things on reality and not the emotions of what we think they should do.

Spoiler:

Vanterpool has indeed designed a system — or, as he calls it, “our process” — to limit an opponent’s offensive production at the rim and from beyond the 3-point arc, while encouraging shots from the less-efficient midrange areas of the court.

Players on the Wolves roster who worked under Vanterpool with the Trail Blazers say that the fundamentals of the process are almost exactly the same as what he implemented in Portland. There is a lot more switching of coverages (the terminology used is “blacking”) than has happened with past Timberwolves teams, with the significant exception of the center position, which has an abiding responsibility for defending shots at the rim. (When describing what happens, players adhere to the typical basketball lingo of assigned numbers to positions according to ostensible height, so that the short point guards are a 1 and the centers are a 5, with shooting guards, small forwards and power forwards in-between.)

“We mostly black 1-through-4 as part of our basic package. But it’s all about who is on the floor for us and who is on the floor for them,” said swingman Jake Layman. “Sometimes we black 1-through-5, sometimes 2-through-4, sometimes just 3 and 4.” Added Noah Vonleh, “When I am a 5, I am pretty much a rim protector, and as a 4 I am switching much more.”

https://theathletic.com/1507563/2020/01/09/david-vanterpool-timberwolves-defense-process-andrew-wiggins/

Hernangomez certainly has more wing-ness than Okongwu from what I've seen. He regularly played SF in Denver. Watch this draft workout, he's moving around the court doing things that I simply don't think Okongwu can do.

Watch on YouTube

That’s why I’m very intrigued with pairing Avdija and Hernangomez at “forwards.” Physically very similar (Layman too). Enough size to body when needed. But still can switch a lot. Both should rebound well - especially defensively. Spacers, slashers, passers on offensive. Either can also share the floor with lesser offensive threats like Culver or Okogie because they are themselves threats.

I'm very impressed that he never misses a shot . Now if he can bring that to games even better. Are we going to sign him? If we do that will lessen the need to pick a PF in the draft a little.

[Klomp]

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[minimus]

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BPA is all we need to know

[Klomp]

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Seems like a perfect year for it to happen. 2020 man.....

[thinktank]

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BPA is all we need to know

It’s important to Rosas that all other teams perceive we have all options on the table.

[minimus]

Read on Twitter

BPA is all we need to know

It’s important to Rosas that all other teams perceive we have all options on the table.

Yes, I think one sign of Rosas management is that our FO is open, transparent, consistent for other FOs. I remember that during Thibs regime it was reported that Jimmy Butler trade negotiations were complicated because Thibs was "playing" with other GMs without giving much details.

[Norseman79]

I honestly don't think they would actually consider Wiseman. I really haven't allowed myself to even consider that possibility. Personally, I would love it...but, not sure it's right. Would they actually play that big?

Watching teams like Nugs, Portland, and LA do it gives me hope.

[Klomp]

I honestly don't think they would actually consider Wiseman. I really haven't allowed myself to even consider that possibility. Personally, I would love it...but, not sure it's right. Would they actually play that big?

Watching teams like Nugs, Portland, and LA do it gives me hope.

To me, actions speak louder than words. How many minutes did Towns play with another big last year?

I actually think I would like the Wiseman fit better than the Okongwu fit, but I'm not really huge on either unless one of them is Giannis 2.0....

[Rookie-Mistake]

I really need these ping pong balls to fall our way today.

Sent from my ONEPLUS A6003 using RealGM mobile app

[Norseman79]

I honestly don't think they would actually consider Wiseman. I really haven't allowed myself to even consider that possibility. Personally, I would love it...but, not sure it's right. Would they actually play that big?

Watching teams like Nugs, Portland, and LA do it gives me hope.

To me, actions speak louder than words. How many minutes did Towns play with another big last year?

Exactly, of course, how many legit bigs did we have to play next to him? The problem is what exactly is Wiseman? DeAndre Jordan 2.0? Dwight Howard with a jump shot?

I actually think I would like the Wiseman fit better than the Okongwu fit, but I'm not really huge on either unless one of them is Giannis 2.0....