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2020 Season/Offseason (FA/Trade) Speculation - the Season Resumes

Moderators: bwgood77, lilfishi22, Qwigglez

If Suns get Chris Paul, who will be the 2nd leading scorer on the team?

Ayton
44
94%
Paul
3
6%
 
Total votes: 47

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Re: 2020 Season/Offseason (FA/Trade) Speculation - the Season Resumes 

Post#1161 » by RedIndian » Tue Aug 25, 2020 7:22 am

I really like FVV, but with Rubio here, that deal simply isn't happening. We're not paying 20+ million to our third guard.

The way to go in the offseason is this.

- Retain Saric, Carter and Payne. I would be ok giving Saric a multi year deal at 8 million per. That's fair value, and Saric is an impactful player off the bench. I don't see a huge market for Carter, so we shouldn't do anything more than a 1 + 1 year deal.

- Release Okobo, Frank, and Diallo

- Baynes can come back on a 1 year deal max. If he wants more than a year, let him walk. Keep the flexibility for 2021. If Baynes isn't interested, there are other veteran bigs in FA that can be had on a 1 year deal.

- At #10, draft the best of Hayes / Haliburton / Vassell / Saddiq / Jalen Smith. That's James Jones player profile, and you just know we're getting one of them. I'm open to the idea of Cole Anthony or Kira Lewis or Pokusevski, but I just don't think Jones will be interested in them.

- If you get Hayes / Haliburton in the draft, keep Oubre.

- If you get Vassell / Saddiq in the draft, then potentially trade Oubre for Dinwiddie or Kennard or even someone like Sexton.


The cap sheet for 2021 would basically be Ayton, Cam, Bridges, Booker, Rubio and Saric, #10 for roughly 75 million. That gives you room to pursue a supermax FA in 2021 before Ayton and Bridges become eligible for extension.
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Re: 2020 Season/Offseason (FA/Trade) Speculation - the Season Resumes 

Post#1162 » by Qwigglez » Tue Aug 25, 2020 7:49 am

bwgood77 wrote:
matt131 wrote:Why would FVV want to leave Toronto? Why would Toronto not offer him a reasonable contract? FVV is a terrific player, he's thrived under Nick Nurse, and Nurse has gotten more out of him than any other coach could have. I imagine Fred stays put.


Yeah, the guy is starting on the defending champions who have a very good shot imo of getting back to the finals, and maybe winning. This series against the Celtics is going to be crazy, but I still give them the edge and feel they can beat the Bucks too....I will say, though, that I think the Heat are going to be a tough out for anyone...the Bucks or the Raptors (or Celtics).

FVV would need to start.

But the main point is there is no way Toronto lets him go....he's too valuable...he's their future along with Pascal. I think they'd easily sooner part with Lowry.

Now if he is Unrestricted and someone offers him a monster contract and starting position that Toronto is hesitant to match, that's the only possibility but I still think Toronto will pay him and I think he might even stay for less money.


Isn't FVV an unrestricted free agent? He was a RFA two summers ago, so the Raptors have no say in letting him go and what not. He can simply decide where he wants to go.
I'm not really interested in FVV personally, but since he's being discussed might as well entertain the idea to some extent. I don't see why he would stay with the Raptors for less money either. He has only gotten roughly $20 million from his entire NBA career, I imagine he wants to maximize how much he gets paid, and this is the summer for him to do it. If I was Van Vleet I'd take the highest bid and play there, you've already won a championship.
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Re: 2020 Season/Offseason (FA/Trade) Speculation - the Season Resumes 

Post#1163 » by Revived » Tue Aug 25, 2020 10:14 am

Saberestar wrote:
Revived wrote:We would be pretty stupid to move on from Rubio. Especially after he shot a career high from 3 too.

He actually shot higher from 3 than Booker did.

No need to move on from Rubio, but I would love to add FVV to this team.

He would be a terrific addition.

There have been a lot of players who have struggled after leaving Toronto’s system and I do worry that FVV becomes one of them.

I like his game a lot but it’s something to be aware of.

Read an article that he is expected to receive $25-30M/yr type contract. I wouldn’t touch him with even half that. The most that’s realistically possible would be about $10M-11M/yr deal. Something similar to what Spencer Dinwiddie got because they are about the same caliber as players to me.
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Re: 2020 Season/Offseason (FA/Trade) Speculation - the Season Resumes 

Post#1164 » by Revived » Tue Aug 25, 2020 10:16 am

BobbieL wrote:
Revived wrote:We would be pretty stupid to move on from Rubio. Especially after he shot a career high from 3 too.

He actually shot higher from 3 than Booker did.


Plus -- I think he is more a pure PG - I like that!

if FVV wants to sign to be on the bench - granted that would mean no FA in 2021 and Saris probably gone

I think - sign Augustin or Dragic :)

Ha Dragic for a third time. Now that would be fun.

I’m all for it but I doubt it happens.
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Re: 2020 Season/Offseason (FA/Trade) Speculation - the Season Resumes 

Post#1165 » by Saberestar » Tue Aug 25, 2020 10:50 am

Revived wrote:
Saberestar wrote:
Revived wrote:We would be pretty stupid to move on from Rubio. Especially after he shot a career high from 3 too.

He actually shot higher from 3 than Booker did.

No need to move on from Rubio, but I would love to add FVV to this team.

He would be a terrific addition.

There have been a lot of players who have struggled after leaving Toronto’s system and I do worry that FVV becomes one of them.

I like his game a lot but it’s something to be aware of.

Read an article that he is expected to receive $25-30M/yr type contract. I wouldn’t touch him with even half that. The most that’s realistically possible would be about $10M-11M/yr deal. Something similar to what Spencer Dinwiddie got because they are about the same caliber as players to me.

$10M for FVV would be incredible, but he would need to fire his agent after that. Lou Williams signed a supercheap contract a few years ago too, another mistake IMO.

Dinwiddie took a huge discount to be part of a contender. He recruited Kyrie and Durant, he would get a lot more money in the open market.

FVV would be a dream come true. The guy can do it all and is TOUGH. He would be perfect as part as our core, but Masai will not lose a player like that. Not happening.
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Re: 2020 Season/Offseason (FA/Trade) Speculation - the Season Resumes 

Post#1166 » by Revived » Tue Aug 25, 2020 10:57 am

Saberestar wrote:
Revived wrote:
Saberestar wrote:No need to move on from Rubio, but I would love to add FVV to this team.

He would be a terrific addition.

There have been a lot of players who have struggled after leaving Toronto’s system and I do worry that FVV becomes one of them.

I like his game a lot but it’s something to be aware of.

Read an article that he is expected to receive $25-30M/yr type contract. I wouldn’t touch him with even half that. The most that’s realistically possible would be about $10M-11M/yr deal. Something similar to what Spencer Dinwiddie got because they are about the same caliber as players to me.

$10M for FVV would be incredible, but he would need to fire his agent after that. Lou Williams signed a supercheap contract a few years ago too, another mistake IMO.

Dinwiddie took a huge discount to be part of a contender. He recruited Kyrie and Durant, he would get a lot more money in the open market.

FVV would be a dream come true. The guy can do it all and is TOUGH. He would be perfect as part as our core, but Masai will not lose a player like that. Not happening.

The salary cap will be declining next few years because of the huge loss of revenue along with the increase in operating costs from this season. It’s gonna be a few years before the salary cap actually goes up and I wouldn’t be surprised to see it go down some as the economy takes a beating.

$10M-$12M for players of the likes of FVV won’t be all that far fetched imo.
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Re: 2020 Season/Offseason (FA/Trade) Speculation - the Season Resumes 

Post#1167 » by Saberestar » Tue Aug 25, 2020 11:09 am

Revived wrote:
Saberestar wrote:
Revived wrote:There have been a lot of players who have struggled after leaving Toronto’s system and I do worry that FVV becomes one of them.

I like his game a lot but it’s something to be aware of.

Read an article that he is expected to receive $25-30M/yr type contract. I wouldn’t touch him with even half that. The most that’s realistically possible would be about $10M-11M/yr deal. Something similar to what Spencer Dinwiddie got because they are about the same caliber as players to me.

$10M for FVV would be incredible, but he would need to fire his agent after that. Lou Williams signed a supercheap contract a few years ago too, another mistake IMO.

Dinwiddie took a huge discount to be part of a contender. He recruited Kyrie and Durant, he would get a lot more money in the open market.

FVV would be a dream come true. The guy can do it all and is TOUGH. He would be perfect as part as our core, but Masai will not lose a player like that. Not happening.

The salary cap will be declining next few years because of the huge loss of revenue along with the increase in operating costs from this season. It’s gonna be a few years before the salary cap actually goes up and I wouldn’t be surprised to see it go down some as the economy takes a beating.

$10M-$12M for players of the likes of FVV won’t be all that far fetched imo.

We disagree here. I think he deserves and he will get easily over $20M per year even with all the Covid thing. We will see.
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Re: 2020 Season/Offseason (FA/Trade) Speculation - the Season Resumes 

Post#1168 » by King4Day » Tue Aug 25, 2020 12:51 pm

Saberestar wrote:
Revived wrote:
Saberestar wrote:$10M for FVV would be incredible, but he would need to fire his agent after that. Lou Williams signed a supercheap contract a few years ago too, another mistake IMO.

Dinwiddie took a huge discount to be part of a contender. He recruited Kyrie and Durant, he would get a lot more money in the open market.

FVV would be a dream come true. The guy can do it all and is TOUGH. He would be perfect as part as our core, but Masai will not lose a player like that. Not happening.

The salary cap will be declining next few years because of the huge loss of revenue along with the increase in operating costs from this season. It’s gonna be a few years before the salary cap actually goes up and I wouldn’t be surprised to see it go down some as the economy takes a beating.

$10M-$12M for players of the likes of FVV won’t be all that far fetched imo.

We disagree here. I think he deserves and he will get easily over $20M per year even with all the Covid thing. We will see.


When teams like NY and Detroit are out there, who, like us, struggle to bring in free agents, it's times like these that they have to take advantage of. He's going to get paid. Prob not 25-30 mil, but he's going to get at least 20. If it's that low, I expect him to stay in Toronto.
If a team like NY offers 25, then he bolts. Get your pay, run your team. He's already got a ring anyway.
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Re: 2020 Season/Offseason (FA/Trade) Speculation - the Season Resumes 

Post#1169 » by BobbieL » Tue Aug 25, 2020 2:13 pm

RedIndian wrote:I really like FVV, but with Rubio here, that deal simply isn't happening. We're not paying 20+ million to our third guard.

The way to go in the offseason is this.

- Retain Saric, Carter and Payne. I would be ok giving Saric a multi year deal at 8 million per. That's fair value, and Saric is an impactful player off the bench. I don't see a huge market for Carter, so we shouldn't do anything more than a 1 + 1 year deal.

- Release Okobo, Frank, and Diallo

- Baynes can come back on a 1 year deal max. If he wants more than a year, let him walk. Keep the flexibility for 2021. If Baynes isn't interested, there are other veteran bigs in FA that can be had on a 1 year deal.

- At #10, draft the best of Hayes / Haliburton / Vassell / Saddiq / Jalen Smith. That's James Jones player profile, and you just know we're getting one of them. I'm open to the idea of Cole Anthony or Kira Lewis or Pokusevski, but I just don't think Jones will be interested in them.

- If you get Hayes / Haliburton in the draft, keep Oubre.

- If you get Vassell / Saddiq in the draft, then potentially trade Oubre for Dinwiddie or Kennard or even someone like Sexton.


The cap sheet for 2021 would basically be Ayton, Cam, Bridges, Booker, Rubio and Saric, #10 for roughly 75 million. That gives you room to pursue a supermax FA in 2021 before Ayton and Bridges become eligible for extension.


I like this thought process. Nicely done!
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Re: 2020 Season/Offseason (FA/Trade) Speculation - the Season Resumes 

Post#1170 » by WeekapaugGroove » Tue Aug 25, 2020 2:36 pm

Saberestar wrote:
Revived wrote:
Saberestar wrote:No need to move on from Rubio, but I would love to add FVV to this team.

He would be a terrific addition.

There have been a lot of players who have struggled after leaving Toronto’s system and I do worry that FVV becomes one of them.

I like his game a lot but it’s something to be aware of.

Read an article that he is expected to receive $25-30M/yr type contract. I wouldn’t touch him with even half that. The most that’s realistically possible would be about $10M-11M/yr deal. Something similar to what Spencer Dinwiddie got because they are about the same caliber as players to me.

$10M for FVV would be incredible, but he would need to fire his agent after that. Lou Williams signed a supercheap contract a few years ago too, another mistake IMO.

Dinwiddie took a huge discount to be part of a contender. He recruited Kyrie and Durant, he would get a lot more money in the open market.

FVV would be a dream come true. The guy can do it all and is TOUGH. He would be perfect as part as our core, but Masai will not lose a player like that. Not happening.


Saberestar wrote:
Revived wrote:
Saberestar wrote:No need to move on from Rubio, but I would love to add FVV to this team.

He would be a terrific addition.

There have been a lot of players who have struggled after leaving Toronto’s system and I do worry that FVV becomes one of them.

I like his game a lot but it’s something to be aware of.

Read an article that he is expected to receive $25-30M/yr type contract. I wouldn’t touch him with even half that. The most that’s realistically possible would be about $10M-11M/yr deal. Something similar to what Spencer Dinwiddie got because they are about the same caliber as players to me.

$10M for FVV would be incredible, but he would need to fire his agent after that. Lou Williams signed a supercheap contract a few years ago too, another mistake IMO.

Dinwiddie took a huge discount to be part of a contender. He recruited Kyrie and Durant, he would get a lot more money in the open market.

FVV would be a dream come true. The guy can do it all and is TOUGH. He would be perfect as part as our core, but Masai will not lose a player like that. Not happening.


Yeah that's a crazy low number for Van Vleet, he's getting PAID this off-season.

One minor correction Dinwiddie took that contract because it was the highest amount he could get under the CBA for an early extension which he signed during the season, he chose the financial security instead of trying to hit the market as a RFA later. I actually do think he might end up getting traded this summer.

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Re: 2020 Season/Offseason (FA/Trade) Speculation - the Season Resumes 

Post#1171 » by WeekapaugGroove » Tue Aug 25, 2020 2:36 pm

BobbieL wrote:
RedIndian wrote:I really like FVV, but with Rubio here, that deal simply isn't happening. We're not paying 20+ million to our third guard.

The way to go in the offseason is this.

- Retain Saric, Carter and Payne. I would be ok giving Saric a multi year deal at 8 million per. That's fair value, and Saric is an impactful player off the bench. I don't see a huge market for Carter, so we shouldn't do anything more than a 1 + 1 year deal.

- Release Okobo, Frank, and Diallo

- Baynes can come back on a 1 year deal max. If he wants more than a year, let him walk. Keep the flexibility for 2021. If Baynes isn't interested, there are other veteran bigs in FA that can be had on a 1 year deal.

- At #10, draft the best of Hayes / Haliburton / Vassell / Saddiq / Jalen Smith. That's James Jones player profile, and you just know we're getting one of them. I'm open to the idea of Cole Anthony or Kira Lewis or Pokusevski, but I just don't think Jones will be interested in them.

- If you get Hayes / Haliburton in the draft, keep Oubre.

- If you get Vassell / Saddiq in the draft, then potentially trade Oubre for Dinwiddie or Kennard or even someone like Sexton.


The cap sheet for 2021 would basically be Ayton, Cam, Bridges, Booker, Rubio and Saric, #10 for roughly 75 million. That gives you room to pursue a supermax FA in 2021 before Ayton and Bridges become eligible for extension.


I like this thought process. Nicely done!
Yeah I'd say what Red lays out is probably pretty close to how the off-season will go.

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Re: 2020 Season/Offseason (FA/Trade) Speculation - the Season Resumes 

Post#1172 » by Wilber85 » Tue Aug 25, 2020 2:45 pm

Sign Dennis Schroder
Draft Vassell
Keep Carter and Saric
Sign Baynes for 1 year.

Rubio, Shroder, Payne
Booker, Vassell, Carter
Oubre, Cam
Bridges, Saric
Ayton, Baynes

Let's go
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Re: 2020 Season/Offseason (FA/Trade) Speculation - the Season Resumes 

Post#1173 » by Barkley6 » Tue Aug 25, 2020 3:05 pm

Wilber85 wrote:Sign Dennis Schroder
Draft Vassell
Keep Carter and Saric
Sign Baynes for 1 year.

Rubio, Shroder, Payne
Booker, Vassell, Carter
Oubre, Cam
Bridges, Saric
Ayton, Baynes

Let's go


That's a REALLY guard heavy team. I know wings are the premier position in today's NBA, but any injuries to our 5 men, or Saric and we are suddenly in a bad place with front court depth. I'd rather draft someone at the 4 spot, Toppin, Okongwu, Patrick Williams, etc. and add a guard in FA.

Suns backcourt currently contains:
Rubio, Booker, Jerome, Payne, Carter, Okobo and Lecque

Fair to assume two of those guys won't be with the team next year (Okobo and Lecque are my guesses). That's 5 guards, and you want to add two more for 7 total guards.

Suns font court currently contains:
Ayton, Saric, Baynes, Kaminsky and Diallo

There is a possibility that FOUR of those five guys could leave. Two definitely will (Kaminsky and Diallo), but if the market for Saric and Baynes ends up pricing us out, we basically end up with Ayton as our sole front court player and limited resources to get help (~$19 million in cap space to sign two players).


Since the draft comes before Free Agency, the smart move would be to draft a big man (either a 4 or a 5) because it gives us negotiating flexibility with Saric and Baynes. We can reasonably let them walk (not that I want them to, but both will get offers) without having to feel forced into overpaying because we have an unbalanced roster.

To mimic your format:
Sign Goran Dragic
Draft Toppin
Keep Carter and Saric
Sign Baynes for 1 year.

Rubio, Payne
Booker, Dragic, Carter
Oubre, Cam
Bridges, Saric, Toppin
Ayton, Baynes

Let's go :D
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Re: 2020 Season/Offseason (FA/Trade) Speculation - the Season Resumes 

Post#1174 » by Wilber85 » Tue Aug 25, 2020 3:54 pm

Barkley6 wrote:
Wilber85 wrote:Sign Dennis Schroder
Draft Vassell
Keep Carter and Saric
Sign Baynes for 1 year.

Rubio, Shroder, Payne
Booker, Vassell, Carter
Oubre, Cam
Bridges, Saric
Ayton, Baynes

Let's go


That's a REALLY guard heavy team. I know wings are the premier position in today's NBA, but any injuries to our 5 men, or Saric and we are suddenly in a bad place with front court depth. I'd rather draft someone at the 4 spot, Toppin, Okongwu, Patrick Williams, etc. and add a guard in FA.

Suns backcourt currently contains:
Rubio, Booker, Jerome, Payne, Carter, Okobo and Lecque

Fair to assume two of those guys won't be with the team next year (Okobo and Lecque are my guesses). That's 5 guards, and you want to add two more for 7 total guards.

Suns font court currently contains:
Ayton, Saric, Baynes, Kaminsky and Diallo

There is a possibility that FOUR of those five guys could leave. Two definitely will (Kaminsky and Diallo), but if the market for Saric and Baynes ends up pricing us out, we basically end up with Ayton as our sole front court player and limited resources to get help (~$19 million in cap space to sign two players).


Since the draft comes before Free Agency, the smart move would be to draft a big man (either a 4 or a 5) because it gives us negotiating flexibility with Saric and Baynes. We can reasonably let them walk (not that I want them to, but both will get offers) without having to feel forced into overpaying because we have an unbalanced roster.

To mimic your format:
Sign Goran Dragic
Draft Toppin
Keep Carter and Saric
Sign Baynes for 1 year.

Rubio, Payne
Booker, Dragic, Carter
Oubre, Cam
Bridges, Saric, Toppin
Ayton, Baynes

Let's go :D


Guards

Schroeder , Rubio, Carter, Payne, Booker, Vassell (Can be 2,3)

WIngs

Oubre, Cam, Bridges, Vassell (Can be 2,3)

Bigs

Ayton Baynes Saric Diallo?
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Re: 2020 Season/Offseason (FA/Trade) Speculation - the Season Resumes 

Post#1175 » by Ghost of Kleine » Tue Aug 25, 2020 3:58 pm

BobbieL wrote:
RedIndian wrote:I really like FVV, but with Rubio here, that deal simply isn't happening. We're not paying 20+ million to our third guard.

The way to go in the offseason is this.

- Retain Saric, Carter and Payne. I would be ok giving Saric a multi year deal at 8 million per. That's fair value, and Saric is an impactful player off the bench. I don't see a huge market for Carter, so we shouldn't do anything more than a 1 + 1 year deal.

- Release Okobo, Frank, and Diallo

- Baynes can come back on a 1 year deal max. If he wants more than a year, let him walk. Keep the flexibility for 2021. If Baynes isn't interested, there are other veteran bigs in FA that can be had on a 1 year deal.

- At #10, draft the best of Hayes / Haliburton / Vassell / Saddiq / Jalen Smith. That's James Jones player profile, and you just know we're getting one of them. I'm open to the idea of Cole Anthony or Kira Lewis or Pokusevski, but I just don't think Jones will be interested in them.

- If you get Hayes / Haliburton in the draft, keep Oubre.

- If you get Vassell / Saddiq in the draft, then potentially trade Oubre for Dinwiddie or Kennard or even someone like Sexton.


The cap sheet for 2021 would basically be Ayton, Cam, Bridges, Booker, Rubio and Saric, #10 for roughly 75 million. That gives you room to pursue a supermax FA in 2021 before Ayton and Bridges become eligible for extension.


I like this thought process. Nicely done!


Yes! Agreed.
Very well done man! :nod: :clap:
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Re: 2020 Season/Offseason (FA/Trade) Speculation - the Season Resumes 

Post#1176 » by BobbieL » Tue Aug 25, 2020 4:27 pm

WeekapaugGroove wrote:
BobbieL wrote:
RedIndian wrote:I really like FVV, but with Rubio here, that deal simply isn't happening. We're not paying 20+ million to our third guard.

The way to go in the offseason is this.

- Retain Saric, Carter and Payne. I would be ok giving Saric a multi year deal at 8 million per. That's fair value, and Saric is an impactful player off the bench. I don't see a huge market for Carter, so we shouldn't do anything more than a 1 + 1 year deal.

- Release Okobo, Frank, and Diallo

- Baynes can come back on a 1 year deal max. If he wants more than a year, let him walk. Keep the flexibility for 2021. If Baynes isn't interested, there are other veteran bigs in FA that can be had on a 1 year deal.

- At #10, draft the best of Hayes / Haliburton / Vassell / Saddiq / Jalen Smith. That's James Jones player profile, and you just know we're getting one of them. I'm open to the idea of Cole Anthony or Kira Lewis or Pokusevski, but I just don't think Jones will be interested in them.

- If you get Hayes / Haliburton in the draft, keep Oubre.

- If you get Vassell / Saddiq in the draft, then potentially trade Oubre for Dinwiddie or Kennard or even someone like Sexton.


The cap sheet for 2021 would basically be Ayton, Cam, Bridges, Booker, Rubio and Saric, #10 for roughly 75 million. That gives you room to pursue a supermax FA in 2021 before Ayton and Bridges become eligible for extension.


I like this thought process. Nicely done!
Yeah I'd say what Red lays out is probably pretty close to how the off-season will go.

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From Reds post - I think if Baynes is not back and they have 8m or so to spend, I could see a shooting guard on a one year deal - but I guess that does depend on the draft.
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Re: 2020 Season/Offseason (FA/Trade) Speculation - the Season Resumes 

Post#1177 » by Barkley6 » Tue Aug 25, 2020 4:56 pm

Wilber85 wrote:
Barkley6 wrote:
Wilber85 wrote:Sign Dennis Schroder
Draft Vassell
Keep Carter and Saric
Sign Baynes for 1 year.

Rubio, Shroder, Payne
Booker, Vassell, Carter
Oubre, Cam
Bridges, Saric
Ayton, Baynes

Let's go


That's a REALLY guard heavy team. I know wings are the premier position in today's NBA, but any injuries to our 5 men, or Saric and we are suddenly in a bad place with front court depth. I'd rather draft someone at the 4 spot, Toppin, Okongwu, Patrick Williams, etc. and add a guard in FA.

Suns backcourt currently contains:
Rubio, Booker, Jerome, Payne, Carter, Okobo and Lecque

Fair to assume two of those guys won't be with the team next year (Okobo and Lecque are my guesses). That's 5 guards, and you want to add two more for 7 total guards.

Suns font court currently contains:
Ayton, Saric, Baynes, Kaminsky and Diallo

There is a possibility that FOUR of those five guys could leave. Two definitely will (Kaminsky and Diallo), but if the market for Saric and Baynes ends up pricing us out, we basically end up with Ayton as our sole front court player and limited resources to get help (~$19 million in cap space to sign two players).


Since the draft comes before Free Agency, the smart move would be to draft a big man (either a 4 or a 5) because it gives us negotiating flexibility with Saric and Baynes. We can reasonably let them walk (not that I want them to, but both will get offers) without having to feel forced into overpaying because we have an unbalanced roster.

To mimic your format:
Sign Goran Dragic
Draft Toppin
Keep Carter and Saric
Sign Baynes for 1 year.

Rubio, Payne
Booker, Dragic, Carter
Oubre, Cam
Bridges, Saric, Toppin
Ayton, Baynes

Let's go :D


Guards

Schroeder , Rubio, Carter, Payne, Booker, Vassell (Can be 2,3)

WIngs

Oubre, Cam, Bridges, Vassell (Can be 2,3)

Bigs

Ayton Baynes Saric Diallo?


Jerome and Lecque are still under contract. Jerome's is guaranteed, cant remember if Lecque is or not. So you're going to have minimum of 7 guards no matter what. Are you comfortable with Diallo playing big minutes? Because if Ayton or Baynes goes down with an injury, you're looking at 12-20 minutes of Diallo every night. That doesn't sit well with me. Also, what if Saric and Baynes get big FA offers? What if Baynes get an offer from a contender and bolts? What if Saric gets offered 3/$40m and the Suns don't want to match?

Too many question marks. Need to add one guard, and one big.
Wilber85
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Re: 2020 Season/Offseason (FA/Trade) Speculation - the Season Resumes 

Post#1178 » by Wilber85 » Tue Aug 25, 2020 5:39 pm

Barkley6 wrote:
Wilber85 wrote:
Barkley6 wrote:
That's a REALLY guard heavy team. I know wings are the premier position in today's NBA, but any injuries to our 5 men, or Saric and we are suddenly in a bad place with front court depth. I'd rather draft someone at the 4 spot, Toppin, Okongwu, Patrick Williams, etc. and add a guard in FA.

Suns backcourt currently contains:
Rubio, Booker, Jerome, Payne, Carter, Okobo and Lecque

Fair to assume two of those guys won't be with the team next year (Okobo and Lecque are my guesses). That's 5 guards, and you want to add two more for 7 total guards.

Suns font court currently contains:
Ayton, Saric, Baynes, Kaminsky and Diallo

There is a possibility that FOUR of those five guys could leave. Two definitely will (Kaminsky and Diallo), but if the market for Saric and Baynes ends up pricing us out, we basically end up with Ayton as our sole front court player and limited resources to get help (~$19 million in cap space to sign two players).


Since the draft comes before Free Agency, the smart move would be to draft a big man (either a 4 or a 5) because it gives us negotiating flexibility with Saric and Baynes. We can reasonably let them walk (not that I want them to, but both will get offers) without having to feel forced into overpaying because we have an unbalanced roster.

To mimic your format:
Sign Goran Dragic
Draft Toppin
Keep Carter and Saric
Sign Baynes for 1 year.

Rubio, Payne
Booker, Dragic, Carter
Oubre, Cam
Bridges, Saric, Toppin
Ayton, Baynes

Let's go :D


Guards

Schroeder , Rubio, Carter, Payne, Booker, Vassell (Can be 2,3)

WIngs

Oubre, Cam, Bridges, Vassell (Can be 2,3)

Bigs

Ayton Baynes Saric Diallo?


Jerome and Lecque are still under contract. Jerome's is guaranteed, cant remember if Lecque is or not. So you're going to have minimum of 7 guards no matter what. Are you comfortable with Diallo playing big minutes? Because if Ayton or Baynes goes down with an injury, you're looking at 12-20 minutes of Diallo every night. That doesn't sit well with me. Also, what if Saric and Baynes get big FA offers? What if Baynes get an offer from a contender and bolts? What if Saric gets offered 3/$40m and the Suns don't want to match?

Too many question marks. Need to add one guard, and one big.


Jerome and Lecque to G League. Sign a vet min big

Bobby Portis (What is his market going to be)?
Willie Cauley Stein
BobbieL
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Re: 2020 Season/Offseason (FA/Trade) Speculation - the Season Resumes 

Post#1179 » by BobbieL » Tue Aug 25, 2020 5:50 pm

Wilber85 wrote:
Barkley6 wrote:
Wilber85 wrote:
Guards

Schroeder , Rubio, Carter, Payne, Booker, Vassell (Can be 2,3)

WIngs

Oubre, Cam, Bridges, Vassell (Can be 2,3)

Bigs

Ayton Baynes Saric Diallo?


Jerome and Lecque are still under contract. Jerome's is guaranteed, cant remember if Lecque is or not. So you're going to have minimum of 7 guards no matter what. Are you comfortable with Diallo playing big minutes? Because if Ayton or Baynes goes down with an injury, you're looking at 12-20 minutes of Diallo every night. That doesn't sit well with me. Also, what if Saric and Baynes get big FA offers? What if Baynes get an offer from a contender and bolts? What if Saric gets offered 3/$40m and the Suns don't want to match?

Too many question marks. Need to add one guard, and one big.


Jerome and Lecque to G League. Sign a vet min big

Bobby Portis (What is his market going to be)?
Willie Cauley Stein


With the money being probably lower this year - there will be some bargains in Free Agency for the Vet Minimum as there just won't be the cash to spend. I would guess if the cap goes down, that probably means luxury tax threshholds and those are going down too. It could be an interesting offseason to have a bit of cap space.
Barkley6
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Re: 2020 Season/Offseason (FA/Trade) Speculation - the Season Resumes 

Post#1180 » by Barkley6 » Tue Aug 25, 2020 6:12 pm

Wilber85 wrote:
Barkley6 wrote:
Wilber85 wrote:
Guards

Schroeder , Rubio, Carter, Payne, Booker, Vassell (Can be 2,3)

WIngs

Oubre, Cam, Bridges, Vassell (Can be 2,3)

Bigs

Ayton Baynes Saric Diallo?


Jerome and Lecque are still under contract. Jerome's is guaranteed, cant remember if Lecque is or not. So you're going to have minimum of 7 guards no matter what. Are you comfortable with Diallo playing big minutes? Because if Ayton or Baynes goes down with an injury, you're looking at 12-20 minutes of Diallo every night. That doesn't sit well with me. Also, what if Saric and Baynes get big FA offers? What if Baynes get an offer from a contender and bolts? What if Saric gets offered 3/$40m and the Suns don't want to match?

Too many question marks. Need to add one guard, and one big.


Jerome and Lecque to G League. Sign a vet min big

Bobby Portis (What is his market going to be)?
Willie Cauley Stein


If you're sold on Vassel then by all means add an additional pick to get him. But I don't think putting all our ammunition into the guard spot is the best move for this team. Guard play is, in general, a strength whereas big man play has been a weakness. Of 15 roster spots, SEVEN are currently occupied by guards. We invested picks and money into Jerome and Lecque in hopes they will improve and become rotation players. I'm not saying don't upgrade, but essentially by drafting and signing a Free Agent guard you're giving up on both of them, which is fine, but I'd rather give up on both of them to strengthen a position of weakness, which is the 4 and 5 slots.

Portis will definitely get more than the vet min. WCS? No thank you. And again, there is no guarantee in free agency. What if, and this isn't THAT unlikely, we decline Frank and Diallo, then we enter negotiations to resign Saric and Baynes. WCS and Portis, along with other serviceable Free Agents, sign elsewhere while we are in talks, but then talks breakdown and Baynes leaves and joins a playoff team, and Saric joins Miami or someone who gives him a bigger offer.

We are left holding our....well, you get the idea. The point is, if we draft a big man, we can avoid the worst case scenario which is having to fill in the roster around Ayton with crap, and/or overpaying for Saric and/or Baynes and limiting what we can do in 2021.

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