Around the NBA, Season 2019-2020

Post #241 » by **FJS** » Thu Aug 27, 2020 2:31 pm

I don't think cancelling games is helping their cause. I mean, they show their dissapoint yo the world, but who cares about nba are the main damaged, and probably racists are not watching and don't care about what lebron or another athlete has to say.

red4hf · Post #242 » by **red4hf** » Thu Aug 27, 2020 2:40 pm

I cancelled my League Pass subscription...... The NBA won't be getting any more of my money...... That's $200 more in my pocket...... There's plenty else to watch between the Premier League, Bundesliga, La Liga, Seria A, Euroleague, Champions League, Europa League...... I won't miss the NBA, and I'm sure they won't miss me.......

KqWIN · Post #243 » by **KqWIN** » Thu Aug 27, 2020 2:43 pm

I do agree that the players have their biggest impact when they are playing. If they didn't decide to restart, for example, they wouldn't be able to send the message they did by boycotting the games yesterday. I don't think their message is lessened or muted if they continue to play. Playing is what gives them their platform and their platform is what gives them influence...whether that's to improve the lives in their communities or sell home security systems.

Whatever they decide, I will support them, but I do think the players are leaders in this situation who have the most power when they are playing.

AingesBurner · Post #244 » by **AingesBurner** » Thu Aug 27, 2020 2:45 pm

Sports was the last unifier of every average American and that is now gone, I don’t want to watch millionaire athletes wax philosophical about politics, I watch them for entertainment and the reason they make that money is to entertain people, I paid $100 a month for Directv to watch the Jazz, I just cancelled Directv.

AingesBurner · Post #245 » by **AingesBurner** » Thu Aug 27, 2020 3:39 pm

It will be interesting when all these players on rookie contracts who went Woke with LeBron are getting their options of 20 million dollar max contracts because of lost viewership.

Post #246 » by **Inigo Montoya** » Thu Aug 27, 2020 4:12 pm

red4hf wrote:I cancelled my League Pass subscription...... The NBA won't be getting any more of my money...... That's $200 more in my pocket...... There's plenty else to watch between the Premier League, Bundesliga, La Liga, Seria A, Euroleague, Champions League, Europa League...... I won't miss the NBA, and I'm sure they won't miss me.......

But we'll miss you, so stick around. :party:

red4hf · Post #247 » by **red4hf** » Thu Aug 27, 2020 4:27 pm

Inigo Montoya wrote:
red4hf wrote:I cancelled my League Pass subscription...... The NBA won't be getting any more of my money...... That's $200 more in my pocket...... There's plenty else to watch between the Premier League, Bundesliga, La Liga, Seria A, Euroleague, Champions League, Europa League...... I won't miss the NBA, and I'm sure they won't miss me.......

But we'll miss you, so stick around.

Oh, I will still be around, I'll just be relying on everyone here to tell me what happens during the games......

And, what a surprise, the players have decided to keep playing.......

stitches · Post #248 » by **stitches** » Thu Aug 27, 2020 4:50 pm

What impact are players having while they play? They impact your entertainment level, they don't impact anything else. They went to that bubble thinking they can be catalysts for change and it doesn't seem like they feel like that was successful. In fact, from what I gather it seems like they are frustrated that it looks like what Kyrie was talking about is exactly what happened - they provide entertainment for the masses which takes away attention from the protests going on and at the same time police shootings continue and tensions escalate.

It seems like they want the owners to take more of a prominent and leading role in advocating and facilitating change and they are striking(btw, yes, this is a strike not a boycott) with the expectation this will happen.

The thing I want to know, though, is what exactly are their expectations and demands? I want to hear what they want the league and owners to do. I want specifics, not vagueries though.

I think it's delusional thinking police shootings will stop. As long as there is armed police and armed population that the police polices, there will be shootings and some small proportion of them will be bad accidents/corrupt cops/powertripping/racist cops/etc. There will never be zero police shootings. You can try minimzing them so... what's the steps towards that? I guess there needs to be at least some form of police reform and police oversight reform? So what do players expect from owners in that regard and in other way to support social justice? Again, I want specifics.

Post #249 » by **Inigo Montoya** » Thu Aug 27, 2020 5:43 pm

I don't know about impact, but more people will be exposed to what the players have to say when they are playing and there are cameras and TV crews looking to ask questions, than when they don't play. Most people will no go looking for George Hill's tweeter feed or whatever to hear what he has to say, but it will be right in their face when Doris Burke or someone will go on the court right after the game and ask him a question. There's also the pre-game interviews and post-game conferences where players sit and answer questions. I think the impact either way will be negligible, but at least they'll reach more people.

red4hf · Post #250 » by **red4hf** » Thu Aug 27, 2020 6:19 pm

I think there need to be reforms, serious reforms....... Qualified immunity is a big thing....... De-escalation training needs to be increased big time...... But none of that will happen because of anything the NBA does or doesn't do........

And none of those reforms are going to eliminate all violent interactions, because human beings are involved....... And people will still not care what the NBA has to say about it......

KqWIN · Post #251 » by **KqWIN** » Thu Aug 27, 2020 7:30 pm

stitches wrote:What impact are players having while they play? They impact your entertainment level, they don't impact anything else. They went to that bubble thinking they can be catalysts for change and it doesn't seem like they feel like that was successful. In fact, from what I gather it seems like they are frustrated that it looks like what Kyrie was talking about is exactly what happened - they provide entertainment for the masses which takes away attention from the protests going on and at the same time police shootings continue and tensions escalate.

It seems like they want the owners to take more of a prominent and leading role in advocating and facilitating change and they are striking(btw, yes, this is a strike not a boycott) with the expectation this will happen.

The thing I want to know, though, is what exactly are their expectations and demands? I want to hear what they want the league and owners to do. I want specifics, not vagueries though.

I think it's delusional thinking police shootings will stop. As long as there is armed police and armed population that the police polices, there will be shootings and some small proportion of them will be bad accidents/corrupt cops/powertripping/racist cops/etc. There will never be zero police shootings. You can try minimzing them so... what's the steps towards that? I guess there needs to be at least some form of police reform and police oversight reform? So what do players expect from owners in that regard and in other way to support social justice? Again, I want specifics.

My personal opinion, I don't think there necessarily needs to be specific action items. I actually think the league does a great job of letting the players voice their opinions and give them lots of support. Protesting/boycotting the games, even for a day or two, brings a ton of attention to the issues at hand. I don't believe that message is diluted in any way because they decided to start up again. I hear your point about the league being a distraction from the issues, but at the same time, the players are among the largest voices for these issues and their platform is largest when they are playing. If they hadn't started the season, for example, would they be able to put the spotlight on this issue the way they have by boycotting for a couple days? I'm not sure they can.

As for how do the actual shootings stop...again it's my personal opinion but the shootings are the manifestation of two deep, underlying issues we have in America. One is the militarized police culture, the other is the institutionalized racism we have in this country. If you want shootings and police brutality to stop and not disproportionately effect people of color, we have to address those issues.

babyjax13 · Post #252 » by **babyjax13** » Thu Aug 27, 2020 11:25 pm

All I have to say is that my boyfriend is black in America, and this is a scary place. I really respect players - at minimum - delaying games to amplify discussion around this issue, and I would have respected them ending the season to put their money and time into social justice even more. I'm glad I'll get to see more basketball, but I'd be a lot happier not to be afraid every time my boyfriend was in public.

Crunch 99 · Post #253 » by **Crunch 99** » Fri Aug 28, 2020 1:54 pm

Inigo Montoya wrote:The Pacers just fired McMillan. I think he's done a terrific job with that team, they are very well coached. I think they made a mistake by firing him. He's a good coach.

I've been a fan of McMillan all the way back to his playing days, where he was a bit of an unsung hero on the Gary Payton Sonic teams. Sloan was a big fan of Nate McMillan too.

The Pacers were overachievers under McMillan's leadership. Regarding the playoff sweep from Miami, I don't think management should have expected more given Oladipo wasn't back to normal and they were missing Sabonis. On the other side, Miami was well stocked with good players who are capable of competing for the EC Championship.

I thought McMillan did a good job coaching the Blazers as well, where he regularly got to the playoffs despite having to coach thru the sad Greg Oden and Brandon Roy injury era. His last partial season there, 2011-12, Aldridge was his only star player. McMillan was fired after a 20-23 start to that 2011-12 season.

stitches · Post #254 » by **stitches** » Fri Aug 28, 2020 3:54 pm

Well, here you go, something the Millers have agreed to do after the strike... might be small, but hopefully meaningful step:
https://www.nba.com/jazz/news/utah-jazz-announce-vivint-arena-select-megaplex-theatres-serve-polling-centers-election-day?cid=jazz_natsocial_IGSwipeup_pollingarena_20200828

Similar steps taken from the Rockets owner too.

stitches · Post #255 » by **stitches** » Fri Aug 28, 2020 5:51 pm

Read on Twitter

SoCalJazzFan · Post #256 » by **SoCalJazzFan** » Fri Aug 28, 2020 7:19 pm

While i support the cause of BLM through peaceful protests and dialog, as i do think that there is a bias and prejudice against those of color, i also would like to see everyone take a breath and wait for the full story of events to unfold before going off. You have to take the cops side of events, their training and ability to go home safely to their families into the equation as well. If you wonder why a cop would shoot someone in the back trying to get into their car during an arrest, search for videos of cops getting shot and killed in similar situations. If you doubt they are out there, I’ll post one. There are, though, inexcusable acts by police against blacks and other people of color that are also out there that deserve a strong response. Not all cop shootings are inexcusable, though.

red4hf · Post #257 » by **red4hf** » Fri Aug 28, 2020 7:30 pm

From Al Sharpton today, talking about cops:

"They have nothing on the line. Right away, the union comes in, no matter what they did, provides them with lawyers, provides them with PR people, provides them with everything and protects them. And if there's a lawsuit, the city pays."

"This law changes all of that," he said. "They've got to have some skin in the game."

https://toofab.com/2020/08/28/al-sharpton-jacob-blake-police-need-skin-in-the-game/

This is the type of stupidity that drives me insane...... Saying that cops who are shot at, have all sorts of things thrown at them, stabbed, hit with objects, and murdered have no skin in the "game." On average about 150 police officers are killed and 50,000 assaulted every year....... Sharpton is talking about money in that quote, but cops have something much more important on the line every single day, their actual well-being.......

Post #258 » by **Inigo Montoya** » Sat Aug 29, 2020 11:07 am

If the players decided to cancel the season over the latest incidents, then what will happen the next time something like that occurs? Will they cancel the season again? If something like that happens again on week two of the next season, will they cancel that season too? If not, then why not? Is one incident more important than the other? This is why canceling the season makes no sense.

red4hf · Post #259 » by **red4hf** » Sat Aug 29, 2020 11:34 am

Inigo Montoya wrote:If the players decided to cancel the season over the latest incidents, then what will happen the next time something like that occurs? Will they cancel the season again? If something like that happens again on week two of the next season, will they cancel that season too? If not, then why not? Is one incident more important than the other? This is why canceling the season makes no sense.

They should go on "strike" whenever something they don't like happens...... That way the season will literally be year-round......

Crunch 99 · Post #260 » by **Crunch 99** » Sat Sep 5, 2020 1:02 pm

Crunch 99 wrote:
Inigo Montoya wrote:The Pacers just fired McMillan. I think he's done a terrific job with that team, they are very well coached. I think they made a mistake by firing him. He's a good coach.

I've been a fan of McMillan all the way back to his playing days, where he was a bit of an unsung hero on the Gary Payton Sonic teams. Sloan was a big fan of Nate McMillan too.

The Pacers were overachievers under McMillan's leadership. Regarding the playoff sweep from Miami, I don't think management should have expected more given Oladipo wasn't back to normal and they were missing Sabonis. On the other side, Miami was well stocked with good players who are capable of competing for the EC Championship.

I thought McMillan did a good job coaching the Blazers as well, where he regularly got to the playoffs despite having to coach thru the sad Greg Oden and Brandon Roy injury era. His last partial season there, 2011-12, Aldridge was his only star player. McMillan was fired after a 20-23 start to that 2011-12 season.

So Miami has the number one seeded Bucks down 3-0. If the Heat sweep the Bucks like they did the Pacers, firing McMillan for getting swept when he is playing without All Star Sabonis and with a 60% Oladipo is going to look even dumber.