Nets Going Forward: Planning for Next Season

[Prokorov]

I don't think it's delusional that one of LeVert or Dinwiddie with salary filler, 2 1st round picks and Claxton and/or Rodi is that unfathomable for Jrue.

no its not, but you are just swapping allen for dinwiddie which isnt too different value wise and is far more than just levert

True, but I don’t believe I or anyone on here has said nothing but LeVert for Jrue is possible.

We’ve said plus picks and a prospect(s).

Fair enough. but i view our picks and prospects as low level filler.

If you had to assign a value grade A through F id probably go with:

#19 pick: C-
2022 pick: D
Kurucs: D+
Musa: F
TLC: D+
Claxton: D+

Upgrade Kurucs grade if his legal situation clears up. but really those assets all amount to "hopefully they can consistently be in a 9 man rotation some day".

I think it will require 2 of Allen/Levert/Dinwiddie plus the 2 picks plus salary/cash help to make it work.

I just dont think any of levert/allen/dinwiddie excite a good or bad team. closest is probably a good team being excited by dinwiddie.

Allen is young with upside but in a league where centers have diminished value and lob/long centers can be had top 15-20 most years.

Leverts age/injury/taking 20% of the cap/issues as a non-primary option make him tough to give better than C+ value on. not good enough/young enough for a bad rebuilding team and not healthy/reliable enough for good team.

Spencer/Allen/#19/2022 heavily protected i think gets it done and id do that for sure

[Hello Brooklyn]

I just don't think they're going to want to spend that much on a backup center.

And Jordan will keep starting while KD & Kyrie are here.

33 is not even that old. Jordan looked good last year.

Allen isn't a back up center, he's a starter. and one with a higher ceiling and upside than Jordan who is in his 30s and nearing the end of the ride.

What Jordan did prior to the shut down is irrelevant. He is going to be 33 years old next season, 33 years old is the precipice of player decline in the NBA. What happens when Jordan is 34 or 35? Are you still starting him?

I'm starting jordan until he is 50 if he is the better player. right now, he seems like the better player although it is very very close and allen in an offseason may surpass him.

in either event, if you can move allen for a better player at G/W while still having someone as good/better then allen at C you do that 100 times out of 100.

I'm with you on this as well.

Jordan was a little better than Allen last year, although Allen is still improving.

In either case, most teams go small in crunch time and I'm not sure we will be closing with either of them.

[Hello Brooklyn]

Jrue played SG/SF all season. not PG. and excelled at it. he is one of the 5 or 6 best defenders in the league and sis a solid 3 point shooter, especially catch and shoot form the corner (43%)

You guys are overrating the **** out of Jrue. He is not one of the 5 or 6 defenders in the league. Not even close. He won't even make an all defensive team.

The Pelicans were one of the worst defensive teams in the entire NBA. He routinely got torched in the bubble.

He is never going to be the type of guy we can put on elite wing players like LeBron/Kawhi/Butler/Tatum/Giannis, the guys we might see in the playoffs. As of now we have no one to guard them except for KD returning from a torn achilles.

He has made a career shutting down the best players in the league. wings and guards. and yes, he is a top 5-6 defender in the league. he has ALREADY guarded the guys you mentioned on that list and done so at an elite level.

team defense is about TEAM. and you are only as strong as your weakest link. Jrue was outstanding on D this year. he should make the all-defensive team. you could also argue in 2018 he was DPOTY but the league typically is biased towards bigger players with that award

You really think Jrue Holiday is going to be able to guard Giannis, LeBron or Kawhi?

If that is our strategy we will get absolutely murdered in the playoffs.

Top defensive players don't lead their teams to one of the worst defenses in the league.

[Hello Brooklyn]

Let's say for the sake of argument that Musa, 2020 first, 2021 second, and either Caris or Spencer gets us Jrue.

Choosing between Caris and Spencer is not as easy as picking the more talented player.

LeVert's contract is a known quantity.

Paying more to Dinwiddie could mean that we give up the luxury of keeping both DJ and Allen at center.

It could also mean that we are forced to give up additional assets to unload Prince.

While it might come as a surprise Spencer could just decide to switch teams.

Recently he did ask the internet to pick his next team.

Depending on where we sit at the trade deadline perhaps Joe Harris goes instead.

I am glad we have Marks to figure this out because I am not sure myself.

Thoughts?

I don't see it as a hard decision.

Spencer is going to demand more money this off season and Levert is locked down on a good contract.

There is little chance we keep Spencer after this year. Trade him now if we get something worthwhile back.

[Prokorov]

You guys are overrating the **** out of Jrue. He is not one of the 5 or 6 defenders in the league. Not even close. He won't even make an all defensive team.

The Pelicans were one of the worst defensive teams in the entire NBA. He routinely got torched in the bubble.

He is never going to be the type of guy we can put on elite wing players like LeBron/Kawhi/Butler/Tatum/Giannis, the guys we might see in the playoffs. As of now we have no one to guard them except for KD returning from a torn achilles.

He has made a career shutting down the best players in the league. wings and guards. and yes, he is a top 5-6 defender in the league. he has ALREADY guarded the guys you mentioned on that list and done so at an elite level.

team defense is about TEAM. and you are only as strong as your weakest link. Jrue was outstanding on D this year. he should make the all-defensive team. you could also argue in 2018 he was DPOTY but the league typically is biased towards bigger players with that award

You really think Jrue Holiday is going to be able to guard Giannis, LeBron or Kawhi?

If that is our strategy we will get absolutely murdered in the playoffs.

Top defensive players don't lead their teams to one of the worst defenses in the league.

We have already seen Jrue guard those players (well) we dont need to hypothesize about it.

Also, you dont shut down elite players by throwing 1 guy on them and asking him to lock them down. you mix guys on them, you mix defenses. you switch at times, you double at times, you zone at times. the best defenders make them uncomfortable for long stretches. Jrue is one of the best at that.

and yeah, all-nba defenders are on poor defensive teams all the time.

I mean in 2018 the pelicans were the 7th worst defense and he was 1st team all-nba. they were 16th overall defensively when he made 2nd team the next season.

Again, if you drop a great defender alongside a team of poor ones it doesnt make them great overnight just like that.

[drchaos]

If you had to assign a value grade A through F id probably go with:

#19 pick: C-
2022 pick: D
Kurucs: D+
Musa: F
TLC: D+
Claxton: D+

I think I would value Kurucs, Claxton, and TLC over either draft pick (perhaps out trade partner would feel differently).

Admittedly I haven't done much research on the draft prospects but where we are picking (and will be in 2022) I would not want to give up on one of these three prospects to roll the dice so late in the draft.

I do agree that Musa is the least valuable of these assets.

[Paradise]

Nets have officially interviewed Vaughn.

Read on Twitter

[TheNetsFan]

DJ outplayed Fro this year. He may outplay him next year. He's been pretty durable for his whole career, but he's still a 32 year old big. It should surprise no one if he starts breaking down in a year or two. He could be a 12-15mpg player before the end of his contract. For that reason, I would hold on tight to Allen. He's cheap depth this year. At worst, you're paying him and Jordan big money at the same time for only two years.

[GTR11]

Nets have officially interviewed Vaughn.

Read on Twitter

He has my support. I prefer him over the likes of J.Kidd, Lue, Mark Jackson.

[MrDollarBills]

I just don't think they're going to want to spend that much on a backup center.

And Jordan will keep starting while KD & Kyrie are here.

33 is not even that old. Jordan looked good last year.

Allen isn't a back up center, he's a starter. and one with a higher ceiling and upside than Jordan who is in his 30s and nearing the end of the ride.

What Jordan did prior to the shut down is irrelevant. He is going to be 33 years old next season, 33 years old is the precipice of player decline in the NBA. What happens when Jordan is 34 or 35? Are you still starting him?

I'm starting jordan until he is 50 if he is the better player. right now, he seems like the better player although it is very very close and allen in an offseason may surpass him.

in either event, if you can move allen for a better player at G/W while still having someone as good/better then allen at C you do that 100 times out of 100.

If Allen looks even remotely like he did during the bubble games or even improved from there, there is no way you can sell me on a 33 year old DeAndre Jordan on the decline being better.

Now, if we have to move Allen because of a can't miss deal, that's one thing. But if not, I'm not keen on hitching our wagon to a center past his prime. People on here were calling DJ lazy af this season and it seems like all of a sudden now he's a keeper because of locker room politics and who his buddies are.

[GTR11]

Not saying we should go after either but Jrue weighs 205 Smart is 220.

We not getting Smart who even brought it up. Jrue is not happening either. Caris showed up and put entire league on notice. Only dumb azz will trade him now.

You put the league on notice by dominating for 80 games. not 8. you put the league on notice by winning in the playoffs, not being swept.

Levert didnt put anyone on notice. he does what he typically does. has a hot couple weeks to knee jerk homer fans into thinking he is a star before going back to being an inefficient 1-way player who cant succeed off the ball next to a true #1

LeVert absolutely raised eyebrows and put his name out there as an all star candidate whether you agree or not. Question is, can he stay healthy. This far the answer is no. However we've seen players been marked as injury prone to come back and have strong seasons. That guy Steph Curry been scrutinized a lot, not saying he'll ever be on Steph level.

[MrDollarBills]

Nets have officially interviewed Vaughn.

Read on Twitter

Vaughn did a tremendous job. However, it's going to come down to what KD and Kyrie want and how Vaughn manages egos. It's far easier to do what Vaughn did on a roster with guys trying to prove themselves than it will be next season with a loaded roster full of veterans and two superstar talents.

[DarkXaero]

Okay guy, I believe you, you totally don't drop random vocabulary words when trying to be condescending to me

What kind of stupid ass damage control is that about Beal? Beal has played in 40 playoffs games in his career, averaging 23 PPG. His numbers actually went up in the playoffs compared to his regular season averages, that's the opposite of Kevin Love who actually shrunk on the big stage.

"22 pts is nout "roughly" averaging 25 ppg."-I'm not getting into another dumb semantics argument with you. Your lack of reading comprehension isn't my problem.

"Beal is not a good defender, no matter how hard you try to pretend he was. He is not anything like Klay, and thus your comparison is dubious."-I think I've been pretty factual and honest about Beal's defense in his NBA career so far. Not my problem that you can't do your research, and then come at me with your stupid opinions instead of well researched arguments.

"Sorry. Try better next time."- Something a troll would write.

Just my view without trying to insult anyone.
To say Love wouldn't avg his regular wolves numbers sound crazy to me. Wall is not LBJ and rely on his teammates far more often. Love would've get his numbers and maybe more with Wall as his teammate. In addition Love actually proved he was as good if not better than Bosh.
Beal has more impact on a game simply because it's a guard dominant league ever since MJ. No chip caliber team has bum guards unless of course you got Kawhi, LBJ or Greek. Question is, can star due guards win rings? Even Steph and Klay lost to LBJ led Cavs.
We in unique situation guys. We got two elite scorers that happened to be great shooters as well. Can Beal fit better and have more impact on a team than Caris, Din and Allen? I believe the answer is yes. He won't put up crazy numbers most likely, but he's overall impact will be huge. Also he's very durable and still young.

To be fair the record wiz made the playoffs one year with 41 wins playing a majority of east teams. Love missed the playoffs with 41 wins playing a majority of west teams in a stacked west.

I think it is fair to say if love was on the wiz teams with wall he would put up a similar 24/12 and they make the playoffs.

Fair enough, Love was in a more difficult Western conference, and probably makes the playoffs in East. But Beal is currently at a level that I don't think Love ever reached. Love was also more of a negative on defense with the Wolves than Beal for most of his career. Beal has also played better in the playoffs than Love, who was often (deservedly) criticized for underperforming with Lebron led Cavs. If I have a choice between prime Beal, and prime Love, I'm taking prime Beal no question.

[DarkXaero]

Nets have officially interviewed Vaughn.

Read on Twitter

Vaughn did a tremendous job. However, it's going to come down to what KD and Kyrie want and how Vaughn manages egos. It's far easier to do what Vaughn did on a roster with guys trying to prove themselves than it will be next season with a loaded roster full of veterans and two superstar talents.

This is a key part of that Shams article:

"The Nets appear to want Vaughn back with the franchise in some capacity whether or not he gets the head coaching job — and the momentum around his candidacy has been consistent."

It tells me that we want him as an assistant coach (again), if not a head coach. Prior history suggests that Vaughn could be lead assistant to Pop, if he were to come here.

[TheNetsFan]

Buddy Hield and Spencer Dinwiddie are among the trade candidates that the Hawks might pursue to pair with Trae Young, Chris Kirschner of The Athletic opines. Kirschner and Peachtree Hoops’ Andrew Kelly take an in-depth look at what type of trades Atlanta might explore this offseason using the team’s cap room.

https://www.hoopsrumors.com/2020/08/southeast-notes-bamba-okeke-fultz-hield-howard.html

Hawks have some interesting young pieces or could be part of a larger 3 team deal. I don't have an Athletic subscription, so not sure what type of deals were discussed.

[Prokorov]

If you had to assign a value grade A through F id probably go with:

#19 pick: C-
2022 pick: D
Kurucs: D+
Musa: F
TLC: D+
Claxton: D+

I think I would value Kurucs, Claxton, and TLC over either draft pick (perhaps out trade partner would feel differently).

Admittedly I haven't done much research on the draft prospects but where we are picking (and will be in 2022) I would not want to give up on one of these three prospects to roll the dice so late in the draft.

I do agree that Musa is the least valuable of these assets.

I cant see anyone valuing those guys over #19. #19 is going to be younger and have more years on rookie scale. regardless of draft class you should expect similar to that kind of talent as well.

[Prokorov]

DJ outplayed Fro this year. He may outplay him next year. He's been pretty durable for his whole career, but he's still a 32 year old big. It should surprise no one if he starts breaking down in a year or two. He could be a 12-15mpg player before the end of his contract. For that reason, I would hold on tight to Allen. He's cheap depth this year. At worst, you're paying him and Jordan big money at the same time for only two years.

but the question isnt really should we dump allen to ride with Jordan... its do you pass on an upgrade to levert/dinwiddie because you want to keep allen.

Choose the name... Lavine, Porter, Beal, Jrue whomever.

I'm not letting allen stand in the way of adding a guy like that. I think you can find an Allen or 80% of him alot easier than an impact wing and DJ gives you great insurance for a couple years

[Prokorov]

Allen isn't a back up center, he's a starter. and one with a higher ceiling and upside than Jordan who is in his 30s and nearing the end of the ride.

What Jordan did prior to the shut down is irrelevant. He is going to be 33 years old next season, 33 years old is the precipice of player decline in the NBA. What happens when Jordan is 34 or 35? Are you still starting him?

I'm starting jordan until he is 50 if he is the better player. right now, he seems like the better player although it is very very close and allen in an offseason may surpass him.

in either event, if you can move allen for a better player at G/W while still having someone as good/better then allen at C you do that 100 times out of 100.

If Allen looks even remotely like he did during the bubble games or even improved from there, there is no way you can sell me on a 33 year old DeAndre Jordan on the decline being better.

Now, if we have to move Allen because of a can't miss deal, that's one thing. But if not, I'm not keen on hitching our wagon to a center past his prime. People on here were calling DJ lazy af this season and it seems like all of a sudden now he's a keeper because of locker room politics and who his buddies are.

The bubble is 8 games. we had 60 games to see allen vs DJ and DJ was outplaying him for the majority of it. Even if Allen is better or improves to be better you are not talking about a huge gap between the two.

Also, the bubble should not really be gauged as any kind of realistic measure. Those games were super high scoring. They were after a huge layoff. 75% of the games had no playoff implication as almost all the seeding was locked in prior to the restart. There was no travel. There were no fans. There was no pressure. Many top players didnt join, including beal which put us in a no pressure situation as wiz had no shot to close that gap with 3rd string guys.

I put alot more stock in games 1-60 then i do in the 12 bubble games. That isnt to say allen didnt look good, he did. But thats kind of a foot note. I dont see a scenario were if Jordan was in the bubble and allen wasnt that jordan doesnt post like 13/12/3 or something like that. Maybe even a few more points given how many more possessions bubble games had and how few scoring options we had.

[Prokorov]

We not getting Smart who even brought it up. Jrue is not happening either. Caris showed up and put entire league on notice. Only dumb azz will trade him now.

You put the league on notice by dominating for 80 games. not 8. you put the league on notice by winning in the playoffs, not being swept.

Levert didnt put anyone on notice. he does what he typically does. has a hot couple weeks to knee jerk homer fans into thinking he is a star before going back to being an inefficient 1-way player who cant succeed off the ball next to a true #1

LeVert absolutely raised eyebrows and put his name out there as an all star candidate whether you agree or not. Question is, can he stay healthy. This far the answer is no. However we've seen players been marked as injury prone to come back and have strong seasons. That guy Steph Curry been scrutinized a lot, not saying he'll ever be on Steph level.

1) The questions is less if levert can stay healthy and more if he can stay consistent and if he can do it without 30% utilization and being the #1 option. Levert has failed to show he can sustain fringe all-star play for more than 8-10 games. He also has failed to show fringe all-star impact if he isnt the primary ball handler with 30% utilization.

2) Steph curry didnt miss the large part of 3 years in college to injury. steph curry didnt miss an average of 30 games a season to injury his first 4 years. Curry played 72+ games in 3 of his first 4 seasons. Levert has never done that and top 70 games just once. the injury comparison between the 2 is not even remotely close.

[Prokorov]

Just my view without trying to insult anyone.
To say Love wouldn't avg his regular wolves numbers sound crazy to me. Wall is not LBJ and rely on his teammates far more often. Love would've get his numbers and maybe more with Wall as his teammate. In addition Love actually proved he was as good if not better than Bosh.
Beal has more impact on a game simply because it's a guard dominant league ever since MJ. No chip caliber team has bum guards unless of course you got Kawhi, LBJ or Greek. Question is, can star due guards win rings? Even Steph and Klay lost to LBJ led Cavs.
We in unique situation guys. We got two elite scorers that happened to be great shooters as well. Can Beal fit better and have more impact on a team than Caris, Din and Allen? I believe the answer is yes. He won't put up crazy numbers most likely, but he's overall impact will be huge. Also he's very durable and still young.

To be fair the record wiz made the playoffs one year with 41 wins playing a majority of east teams. Love missed the playoffs with 41 wins playing a majority of west teams in a stacked west.

I think it is fair to say if love was on the wiz teams with wall he would put up a similar 24/12 and they make the playoffs.

Fair enough, Love was in a more difficult Western conference, and probably makes the playoffs in East. But Beal is currently at a level that I don't think Love ever reached. Love was also more of a negative on defense with the Wolves than Beal for most of his career. Beal has also played better in the playoffs than Love, who was often (deservedly) criticized for underperforming with Lebron led Cavs. If I have a choice between prime Beal, and prime Love, I'm taking prime Beal no question.

They are very different players. Chosing Beal over love is not unheard of. but the gap is minimal if not non-exsistant. It is also an unfair criticism of love to say he played poorly in the playoffs. Year 1 he was injured. year 2 he had 1 poor series. beyond that he was the same guy in the playoffs and hit some big shots too. he shot 40% plus from three and was a 16/10 player. His numbers where not what they were in minnesota, but like bosh when your playing next to a pair of elite scorers, your numbers will dip...

Lebron/Kyrie were scoring by the truckloads. Love was there to rebound and space the floor. and Love played a ton of 5 in the playoffs, which create big matchup issues and space for lebron and kyrie.

If Beal was on cleveland he would be closer to an 18/4/4 player then a 22/5/5 player. and if love was on the wizards in those playoff runs he is probably closer to a 22/11 player then a 16/10 player