Deep Dive into Masai's Presidency

[MixxSRC]

I used to think he was a fraud while he trotted out BC's team (Demar, Kyle, JV, Casey) for years. But when he finally started to put his own stamp on the team, I realized how great he is at his job. The dude has an incredible eye for talent.

imagine what he could do with a real lottery pick. the highest pick he've gotten is 9th and it was a solid big in Poetl. I really want to see what kind of players he could land us with a top 5 pick.

What can he do with Top pick most of the times the whole league knows who goes where. If he drafts some unknown you guys will tear him apart

[Raps in 4]

I used to think he was a fraud while he trotted out BC's team (Demar, Kyle, JV, Casey) for years. But when he finally started to put his own stamp on the team, I realized how great he is at his job. The dude has an incredible eye for talent.

imagine what he could do with a real lottery pick. the highest pick he've gotten is 9th and it was a solid big in Poetl. I really want to see what kind of players he could land us with a top 5 pick.

What can he do with Top pick most of the times the whole league knows who goes where. If he drafts some unknown you guys will tear him apart

Masai would have drafted Luka with the first overall pick in 2018.

[nabbs]

I used to think he was a fraud while he trotted out BC's team (Demar, Kyle, JV, Casey) for years. But when he finally started to put his own stamp on the team, I realized how great he is at his job. The dude has an incredible eye for talent.

imagine what he could do with a real lottery pick. the highest pick he've gotten is 9th and it was a solid big in Poetl. I really want to see what kind of players he could land us with a top 5 pick.

Yes, one lottery pick in all his time here. And how did he acquire that lottery pick (since we were always in the playoffs?

My biggest argument against Masai's lack of star acquisition through whatvever means is.... if you look at all the young up and coming stars.... all lottery picks outside of Giannis and Jokic. Literally two international anomalies.

Denver and Milwaukee have been bad at some point where their records enabled them to acquire a lotto pick. We have never tanked or received a lotto pick in the lottery system. The only lotto pick in Masai's Raps tenure was the NY pick we acquired in the Bargs trade which got us Jak.

So yeah, no wonder we don't have a "star" set up for the future

[libertyYYZ]

I preface this with saying Masai is a fine President, but that people need to stop looking at him as one of the elite of the elite President's in basketball.

Curious to know who you rank above Masai?

[Steelo Green]

How can I tangibly prove it?



Average franchise growth would be better, but this is a decent proxy. Pushing for the championship was good for the value of the franchise.

Hawks were successful too. What's wrong with saying the Hawks were well-managed in that time?

That's not tangibly proving anything. All the teams values have increased about the same. Since 2010 the value of an NBA team has increased by 575.5%. That's every NBA team.

And with regard to it being a feat, again, he has done well as a business man, sure, but this he is devoid of criticism for the on court product needs to end. He has yet to build a consistent contender, he had a one off year and built a team that is a round 2-3 team at best that is likely worse than that now without Kyle.

No one has an answer for prior to Kawhi, on thin ice, after Kawhi, great GM. This is a fact.

Not every team has increased that much. The Suns, for instance, didn't.

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Yeah winning the title did that, of course, I have given him credit for the title, but am just saying to look at the entire picture.

I even started the entire convo by saying he is good but people need to take the rose coloured glasses off.

[Steelo Green]

5 pages of rambling and no mention of which GM/Exec would be better than Masai

Riley, Buford, West, Myers, Ainge, Presti

I think Masai is somewhere in the Morey range.

Those other guys have won multiple titles, been sustained contenders, and have assets galore.

Buford now finally is in the rebuild so his time to fall has come after 2 decades of greatness.

Presti didn't win a title but he built a sustained contender and made a mistake with Harden and then KD left, but even now he's reset and they have assets galore.

Masai's one season cannot ignore everything around it. Lebronto did happen or were we not a laughing stock just two years ago?

Buford? Guy who traded Kawhi for Derozan and.......Jacob Poeltl? Cool story. and 2 decades of greatness coincidentally alight with....Tim Duncan...damn what a coincidence.

Presti didn't win....you forgot to mention he had 3 MVP on a team and didn't win

Buford who had 2 decades of greatness?

I mean, I have been talking about the entire picture with Masai, so like I said, all GMs make bad moves, but in Masai's case people tend to ignore? Are we really judging one of the all time great GMs off of one deal? Sounds like the same people saying Masai should have a statue for Kawhi. Duncan was also on his last legs and Kawhi, the 15th pick in the draft, took over. He built with Manu and Parker who are also HOFers in late first rounders and early second rounders.

[Steelo Green]

I preface this with saying Masai is a fine President, but that people need to stop looking at him as one of the elite of the elite President's in basketball.

Curious to know who you rank above Masai?

I listed them already but:

Buford, Riley, West, Myers.

I think Masai is somewhere in the Presti and Morey category.

[Steelo Green]

5 pages of rambling and no mention of which GM/Exec would be better than Masai

Riley, Buford, West, Myers, Ainge, Presti

I think Masai is somewhere in the Morey range.

Those other guys have won multiple titles, been sustained contenders, and have assets galore.

Buford now finally is in the rebuild so his time to fall has come after 2 decades of greatness.

Presti didn't win a title but he built a sustained contender and made a mistake with Harden and then KD left, but even now he's reset and they have assets galore.

Masai's one season cannot ignore everything around it. Lebronto did happen or were we not a laughing stock just two years ago?

Where to begin with this post. You say that Masai fluked his way into getting Kawhi, yet you list Buford as superior despite him actually fluking his way to Tim Duncan because Robinson got injured that season and they lucked into the #1 pick. Buford is a great GM and was able to surround Duncan with excellent players and coaching staff. But the fact remains that he drafted the consensus #1 pick and 4 year college player onto a team that needed an alpha dog to get them over the hump.

Jerry West won many titles as the GM of the Lakers, who acquire more star free agents in any given decade than most teams see in their entire existence. He is without a doubt one of the greatest basketball executives ever, but he has also had the advantage of working in the most glamorous, influential and well recognized basketball organization in the world. With that being said, what happened when he became the GM of a franchise that was not a major free agent destination, a franchise that was in a moribund state? Well he created a perennial playoff team in Memphis, that never won a championship. I'll leave it to you to decide which of the two situations he worked in mirrored Masai and the Raptors more.

All of the executives you listed are excellent, but to say that they are all above Masai is a bit ridiculous.

Buford lucked into TD, and yet TD was on his last legs and guess what, another superstar level talent is on their team they drafted at 15? Kawhi leaving sucked but they didn't just have TD. To think they actually segue'd from TD to Kawhi almost seamlessly shows how incredible he is. The leaving and all was just one of the those situations.

With regard to West, sure but the clout is there, and not only that, he actually did quite a bit. He was the key factor in getting Klay and Draymond and creating that deep team that won 73 games. Steph was there sure, but constructing a 73 win team is no small feat that one superstar can do alone. You're right, he probably was a key factor in luring KD, but that power still reigns true and it was a key factor in Kawhi going to LAC as well.

They are above Masai. They have done more, have more titles, and built consistent contenders.

One off title and then the team the year later being again a 2nd round fodder team shouldn't give all the credit and goodwill forever. He gets credit for the Kawhi trade but you have to look at it all and think that yeah, this team doesn't look like it will win like that again for a very long time.

Presti didn't win a title, but the team that he built is better than anything Masai built for longevity. I trust him with building a team and acquiring talent to build a contender honestly.

Winning a title in Masai's case was a great achievement was a bit of a fluke where the stars aligned where Kawhi wanted out and he came for one season.

Everyone can disagree but look at the state of talent on the team currently.

[Steelo Green]

Riley, Buford, West, Myers, Ainge, Presti

I think Masai is somewhere in the Morey range.

Those other guys have won multiple titles, been sustained contenders, and have assets galore.

Buford now finally is in the rebuild so his time to fall has come after 2 decades of greatness.

Presti didn't win a title but he built a sustained contender and made a mistake with Harden and then KD left, but even now he's reset and they have assets galore.

Masai's one season cannot ignore everything around it. Lebronto did happen or were we not a laughing stock just two years ago?

Buford? Guy who traded Kawhi for Derozan and.......Jacob Poeltl? Cool story. and 2 decades of greatness coincidentally alight with....Tim Duncan...damn what a coincidence.

Presti didn't win....you forgot to mention he had 3 MVP on a team and didn't win

yup, my man had 3 mvp plus a all defensive guy in ibaka, all in their primes and nothing lmao. now he had to blow it up.

heat fans were calling riley senile like a year ago, ppl i guess forgot the atrocious contracts he handed james johnson and dion waiters and olynk lol

all gms have bad moments, masai is easily top 5 and i feel most fans would agree. this is a tough situation tho, but i trust our team

He built it though. KD leaving was not really controllable, and even now look at them, they have assets up the wazoo.

Winning a title requires a lot of talent along with a lot of luck as well.

That team would have been a contender for a decade, and it breaking up sucks, but Presti still built an incredible team. Yeah agreed he should have kept Harden but still in terms of talent and team building, few are as good.

We talk about Fred but look at Dort.

[Steelo Green]

Riley, Buford, West, Myers, Ainge, Presti

I think Masai is somewhere in the Morey range.

.....

Presti didn't win a title but he built a sustained contender and made a mistake with Harden and then KD left, but even now he's reset and they have assets galore.

Presti didn't win....you forgot to mention he had 3 MVP on a team and didn't win

But any time you can sign Steven Adams to a 4 year / $100,000,000 contract, you have to do it.

Fun fact, Adams was drafted with the Raptors pick (BC traded it for Lowry). If Raptors had kept it, who would Masai have drafted? Hint, it wouldn't have been Steven f'n Adams. So ... Presti or Masai? We report, you decide.

Steven Adams at 25 mil isn't the greatest contract sure, but you're going to look at one blemish of his when I have listed a dozen of Masai's? Steven Adams at 25 mil is a lot better than Carroll at 15 or Serge at 25.

I do know about the Kyle deal, but why do you say it would not have been Adams? Adams is a very good player in the NBA.

This thought that he was going to get Giannis in hindsight is funny. Yes he wanted to get into the first round, but no one knows where in the first round. For all we know he thought Giannis would be a late first rounder so, hindsight and conjecture is 20-20.

[Steelo Green]

Like how you referenced your assertion that Fred/Pascal would struggle against Boston at the beginning of your post. As if that's someway reflective of special insight or clairvoyance, or proof that we should take you seriously. Everyone knew they would struggle against their length. That wasn't a bold prediction.

Anyways, I'm a simple man. I see a Steelo Green thread, my brain sends me this message :

Well the same people who were high-fiving and And+ing one another as though their hubris could not be held and they were verklemp with excitement from a G-league win all of a sudden became sour on those same two players after the series was over. Same people saying I am an idiot for saying Fred is overrated or Pascal has no distinct offensive skill. So yeah, I will mention that it's ironic that it's the same mob mentality here of not actually discussing facts and thinking posting memes and gifs and simply saying terrible take without actually reading, is continued again.

This is a forum discussing basketball, and Masai has had some real blunders that need to be brought to light. We are now with a dearth of talent and our best player not named Kawhi for almost the entire decade is about to be at the end of his days, so really where are we?

We never built a contender, we built a one off year.

No one knew they would struggle with their length, that's the hilarious part. Everyone was saying pay Fred 30, and that Pascal will just figure it out.

Switching narratives post facto has become the common theme and it has become discussed ad nauseam.

Critiquing someone rightly so being met with personal shots shows who actually has something to bring to a discussion.

As of now a few people have responded given me solid responses, but holistically it's the same jargon.

I was called BC's wife and for some reason that is +1 simply because I am criticizing Masai.

Cult like mentality here.

[Steelo Green]

imagine what he could do with a real lottery pick. the highest pick he've gotten is 9th and it was a solid big in Poetl. I really want to see what kind of players he could land us with a top 5 pick.

Yes, one lottery pick in all his time here. And how did he acquire that lottery pick (since we were always in the playoffs?

My biggest argument against Masai's lack of star acquisition through whatvever means is.... if you look at all the young up and coming stars.... all lottery picks outside of Giannis and Jokic. Literally two international anomalies.

Denver and Milwaukee have been bad at some point where their records enabled them to acquire a lotto pick. We have never tanked or received a lotto pick in the lottery system. The only lotto pick in Masai's Raps tenure was the NY pick we acquired in the Bargs trade which got us Jak.

So yeah, no wonder we don't have a "star" set up for the future

I am not saying Masai is bad, just trying to give some context.

Prior to Kawhi we were in pretty bad shape, Lebronto, everyone laughing at this squad, Demar who was figured out, Casey who had 5 years too many.

These are facts.

We won the title and now all of that is overlooked when we now are big time lacking on talent.

Demar and Casey let go earlier to get picks and start fresh would likely have been the best move. Demar for Kawhi was again, a one in a million trade that has never happened in NBA history. These players are never available.

You cannot go from GM whom has some serious flaws to unfathomable after one move, especially when you are now back to what we were pre-Kawhi.

There can be nuance and discussion about Masai.

[ruckus]

Riley, Buford, West, Myers, Ainge, Presti

I think Masai is somewhere in the Morey range.

Those other guys have won multiple titles, been sustained contenders, and have assets galore.

Buford now finally is in the rebuild so his time to fall has come after 2 decades of greatness.

Presti didn't win a title but he built a sustained contender and made a mistake with Harden and then KD left, but even now he's reset and they have assets galore.

Masai's one season cannot ignore everything around it. Lebronto did happen or were we not a laughing stock just two years ago?

Buford? Guy who traded Kawhi for Derozan and.......Jacob Poeltl? Cool story. and 2 decades of greatness coincidentally alight with....Tim Duncan...damn what a coincidence.

Presti didn't win....you forgot to mention he had 3 MVP on a team and didn't win

Buford who had 2 decades of greatness?

I mean, I have been talking about the entire picture with Masai, so like I said, all GMs make bad moves, but in Masai's case people tend to ignore? Are we really judging one of the all time great GMs off of one deal? Sounds like the same people saying Masai should have a statue for Kawhi. Duncan was also on his last legs and Kawhi, the 15th pick in the draft, took over. He built with Manu and Parker who are also HOFers in late first rounders and early second rounders.

I'm not too sure what your argument is. I think most reasonable people would acknowledge Masai's shortcomings. The Carroll contract was bad but I don't know how Pascal will pan out and Fred hasn't happened yet. We were able to flip TRoss for Serge which worked out for us. A lot of posters felt Demar was overpaid and unmovable until he was moved. Same with Norm who has played into his contract.

Again, considering what he had to work with, what about his tenure with the Raptors doesn't scream elite executive? He's made the right decisions at the right times and the mistakes he's made haven't impacted the W/L column all that much.

We've averaged 50-ish wins over the past 7 seasons. Yes, the majority of those teams aren't championship contenders but those sorts of teams rarely are without a top 10 talent.

Other than the small box you've created to identify what is an elite executive (consistent contendership), Masai ticks off the majority of the boxes. Drafting? Check. Trades? Check. Decision making? Check. No knee jerk reactions? Check. Culture building? Check. Wealth building for the people he reports to? Check. Championship? Check.

[ruckus]

Yes, one lottery pick in all his time here. And how did he acquire that lottery pick (since we were always in the playoffs?

My biggest argument against Masai's lack of star acquisition through whatvever means is.... if you look at all the young up and coming stars.... all lottery picks outside of Giannis and Jokic. Literally two international anomalies.

Denver and Milwaukee have been bad at some point where their records enabled them to acquire a lotto pick. We have never tanked or received a lotto pick in the lottery system. The only lotto pick in Masai's Raps tenure was the NY pick we acquired in the Bargs trade which got us Jak.

So yeah, no wonder we don't have a "star" set up for the future

I am not saying Masai is bad, just trying to give some context.

Prior to Kawhi we were in pretty bad shape, Lebronto, everyone laughing at this squad, Demar who was figured out, Casey who had 5 years too many.

These are facts.

We won the title and now all of that is overlooked when we now are big time lacking on talent.

Demar and Casey let go earlier to get picks and start fresh would likely have been the best move. Demar for Kawhi was again, a one in a million trade that has never happened in NBA history. These players are never available.

You cannot go from GM whom has some serious flaws to unfathomable after one move, especially when you are now back to what we were pre-Kawhi.

There can be nuance and discussion about Masai.

How is a move that most likely wouldn't have resulted in a championship better than the move that resulted in a championship?

In what world does that make sense?

Yes, after the last loss to Lebron, things didn't look great but its not like the team was handcuffed in any way.

Edit: just to add, those one in a million events are what make great executives. Myers would never have signed Durant if they had cap smoothing. Bosh and Lebron joining Wade was unprecedented at the time. Ainge trading his aging stars for a truckload of picks is a once in a lifetime kind of deal.

[Ramed Nazored]

Like how you referenced your assertion that Fred/Pascal would struggle against Boston at the beginning of your post. As if that's someway reflective of special insight or clairvoyance, or proof that we should take you seriously. Everyone knew they would struggle against their length. That wasn't a bold prediction.

Anyways, I'm a simple man. I see a Steelo Green thread, my brain sends me this message :

Well the same people who were high-fiving and And+ing one another as though their hubris could not be held and they were verklemp with excitement from a G-league win all of a sudden became sour on those same two players after the series was over. Same people saying I am an idiot for saying Fred is overrated or Pascal has no distinct offensive skill. So yeah, I will mention that it's ironic that it's the same mob mentality here of not actually discussing facts and thinking posting memes and gifs and simply saying terrible take without actually reading, is continued again.

This is a forum discussing basketball, and Masai has had some real blunders that need to be brought to light. We are now with a dearth of talent and our best player not named Kawhi for almost the entire decade is about to be at the end of his days, so really where are we?

We never built a contender, we built a one off year.

No one knew they would struggle with their length, that's the hilarious part. Everyone was saying pay Fred 30, and that Pascal will just figure it out.

Switching narratives post facto has become the common theme and it has become discussed ad nauseam.

Critiquing someone rightly so being met with personal shots shows who actually has something to bring to a discussion.

As of now a few people have responded given me solid responses, but holistically it's the same jargon.

I was called BC's wife and for some reason that is +1 simply because I am criticizing Masai.

Cult like mentality here.[/

Oh, there’s nothing personal here at all. I just don’t agree with your opinion. I think Masai’s the best in the league. His successful decisions far outstrip his failures, and he’s fielded one of the leagues most winningest teams (second behind GSW I think?) since 2013-2014. Not sure what else you want.

You think you’re a brave outlier for pointing out the mistakes he’s made, which are so few they can spelled out in about 100 minutes words? You’re being a contrarian because you’re bored.

[LascelleL]

You're blem if you think Masai is anything less than the best GM in the NBA.

Masai would have a superstar of he ever got his hands on a 1st overall pick.

Sent from my IN2020 using RealGM mobile app

[Ramed Nazored]

Like how you referenced your assertion that Fred/Pascal would struggle against Boston at the beginning of your post. As if that's someway reflective of special insight or clairvoyance, or proof that we should take you seriously. Everyone knew they would struggle against their length. That wasn't a bold prediction.

Anyways, I'm a simple man. I see a Steelo Green thread, my brain sends me this message :

Well the same people who were high-fiving and And+ing one another as though their hubris could not be held and they were verklemp with excitement from a G-league win all of a sudden became sour on those same two players after the series was over. Same people saying I am an idiot for saying Fred is overrated or Pascal has no distinct offensive skill. So yeah, I will mention that it's ironic that it's the same mob mentality here of not actually discussing facts and thinking posting memes and gifs and simply saying terrible take without actually reading, is continued again.

This is a forum discussing basketball, and Masai has had some real blunders that need to be brought to light. We are now with a dearth of talent and our best player not named Kawhi for almost the entire decade is about to be at the end of his days, so really where are we?

We never built a contender, we built a one off year.

No one knew they would struggle with their length, that's the hilarious part. Everyone was saying pay Fred 30, and that Pascal will just figure it out.

Switching narratives post facto has become the common theme and it has become discussed ad nauseam.

Critiquing someone rightly so being met with personal shots shows who actually has something to bring to a discussion.

As of now a few people have responded given me solid responses, but holistically it's the same jargon.

I was called BC's wife and for some reason that is +1 simply because I am criticizing Masai.

Cult like mentality here.

Oh, there’s nothing personal here at all. I just don’t agree with your opinion. I think Masai’s the best in the league. His successful decisions far outstrip his failures, and he’s fielded one of the leagues most winningest teams (second behind GSW I think?) since 2013-2014. Not sure what else you want.

You think you’re a brave outlier for pointing out the mistakes he’s made, which are so few they can spelled out in about 100 words? You’re being a contrarian because you’re bored.

[Duffman100]

For the love of god we won a title. Can't believe a title for the Raptors, of all franchises, is now going to be under appreciated.

[Johnny Bball]

Who the **** just wakes up today and realizes we only had one year of a real championship team and seems surprised by the revelation.

[tecumseh18]

For the love of god we won a title. Can't believe a title for the Raptors, of all franchises, is now going to be under appreciated.

And finishing 2nd overall in the league, three years in a row. And in all three of those years, Raps swept the top seed in the West during the regular season. All without the ability to attract free unless they're mediocre and we massively overpay them.

I've heard of the black tax, but this is ridiculous. What more could ANY executive in the history of the league have done with the cards Masai was dealt. I'd argue this thread is actually more racist than the African athletes one. Not to say it should be locked, but ... man!