Updated best young cores

Jadoogar · Post #1 » by **Jadoogar** » Wed Sep 16, 2020 7:29 pm

In light of these playoffs, i wanted to rexamine the best young cores list. I'm going to define young as 25 years or younger

1. Mavericks - Luka (potential MVP), Porzingis (potential allstar)
2. Celtics - Tatum (all nba), Brown (potential allstar), Robert Williams (likely role player), Grant Williams (likely role player)
3. Nuggets - Jokic (all nba), Murray (potential allstar), Michael Porter Jr (potential allstar)
4. Suns - Booker (potential all nba), Ayton (potential all star), Bridges (potential starter)
5. Pelicans - Zion (potential allstar maybe more), Ingram (allstar), Josh Hart (potential starter), Lonzo Ball (potential role player)
6. Hawks - Trae Young (potential all nba), John Collins (likely allstar), Hunter/Reddish (potential role players)
7. Timberwolves - KAT (all nba), D'angelo (allstar kinda), #1 pick
8. Heat - Bam (potential all nba), Herro (likely starter), Nunn (likely starter)
9. OKC - mostly relying on picks but SGA is potential allstar
10. Bulls - Lavine (potential allstar), Carter jr (potential allstar), Markkanen (likely starter), Coby White (potential starter)

Cavs, Knicks, Hornets, Magic haven't shown much/i don't watch these teams.
Jazz and Philly have 1 core player under 25, i'm unsure how we would rank them.

Cavsfansince84 · Post #2 » by **Cavsfansince84** » Wed Sep 16, 2020 7:34 pm

Nuggets young core is a lot better than the Celtics. They have a core that as is can contend for titles. The Celtics core is one top 15 player, one top 30ish type player and nothing. Not that the Celtics are bad but if you don't include Kemba(which you shouldn't) then the core isn't that great. The Nuggets are a fully formed core already. I would even say they might be #1 ahead of the Mavs as of right now.

HoopsterJones · Post #3 » by **HoopsterJones** » Wed Sep 16, 2020 7:36 pm

Jadoogar wrote:In light of these playoffs, i wanted to rexamine the best young cores list. I'm going to define young as 25 years or younger

1. Mavericks - Luka (potential MVP), Porzingis (potential allstar)
2. Celtics - Tatum (all nba), Brown (potential allstar), Robert Williams (likely role player), Grant Williams (likely role player)
3. Nuggets - Jokic (all nba), Murray (potential allstar), Michael Porter Jr (potential allstar)
4. Suns - Booker (potential all nba), Ayton (potential all star), Bridges (potential starter)
5. Pelicans - Zion (potential allstar maybe more), Ingram (allstar), Josh Hart (potential starter), Lonzo Ball (potential role player)
6. Hawks - Trae Young (potential all nba), John Collins (likely allstar), Hunter/Reddish (potential role players)
7. Timberwolves - KAT (all nba), D'angelo (allstar kinda), #1 pick
8. Heat - Bam (potential all nba), Herro (likely starter), Nunn (likely starter)
9. OKC - mostly relying on picks but SGA is potential allstar
10. Bulls - Lavine (potential allstar), Carter jr (potential allstar), Markkanen (likely starter), Coby White (potential starter)

Cavs, Knicks, Hornets, Magic haven't shown much/i don't watch these teams.
Jazz and Philly have 1 core player under 25, i'm unsure how we would rank them.

You have a glaring omission in the Memphis Grizzlies.

Ja Morant, JJJ, Brandon Clarke, and maybe Brooks.

NY 567 · Post #4 » by **NY 567** » Wed Sep 16, 2020 7:36 pm

Mavs
Nuggets
Celtics
Suns
Pelicans

Jadoogar · Post #5 » by **Jadoogar** » Wed Sep 16, 2020 7:37 pm

HoopsterJones wrote:
Jadoogar wrote:In light of these playoffs, i wanted to rexamine the best young cores list. I'm going to define young as 25 years or younger

1. Mavericks - Luka (potential MVP), Porzingis (potential allstar)
2. Celtics - Tatum (all nba), Brown (potential allstar), Robert Williams (likely role player), Grant Williams (likely role player)
3. Nuggets - Jokic (all nba), Murray (potential allstar), Michael Porter Jr (potential allstar)
4. Suns - Booker (potential all nba), Ayton (potential all star), Bridges (potential starter)
5. Pelicans - Zion (potential allstar maybe more), Ingram (allstar), Josh Hart (potential starter), Lonzo Ball (potential role player)
6. Hawks - Trae Young (potential all nba), John Collins (likely allstar), Hunter/Reddish (potential role players)
7. Timberwolves - KAT (all nba), D'angelo (allstar kinda), #1 pick
8. Heat - Bam (potential all nba), Herro (likely starter), Nunn (likely starter)
9. OKC - mostly relying on picks but SGA is potential allstar
10. Bulls - Lavine (potential allstar), Carter jr (potential allstar), Markkanen (likely starter), Coby White (potential starter)

Cavs, Knicks, Hornets, Magic haven't shown much/i don't watch these teams.
Jazz and Philly have 1 core player under 25, i'm unsure how we would rank them.

You have a glaring omission in the Memphis Grizzlies.

Ja Morant, JJJ, Brandon Clarke, and maybe Brooks.

I knew i was missing someone. i would put them in the 5-6 range and kick out the Bulls.

goodboy · Post #6 » by **goodboy** » Wed Sep 16, 2020 7:37 pm

Take out Nunn from the starting rotation. Bam/Herro/Duncan

HoopsterJones · Post #7 » by **HoopsterJones** » Wed Sep 16, 2020 7:38 pm

Jadoogar wrote:
HoopsterJones wrote:
Jadoogar wrote:In light of these playoffs, i wanted to rexamine the best young cores list. I'm going to define young as 25 years or younger

1. Mavericks - Luka (potential MVP), Porzingis (potential allstar)
2. Celtics - Tatum (all nba), Brown (potential allstar), Robert Williams (likely role player), Grant Williams (likely role player)
3. Nuggets - Jokic (all nba), Murray (potential allstar), Michael Porter Jr (potential allstar)
4. Suns - Booker (potential all nba), Ayton (potential all star), Bridges (potential starter)
5. Pelicans - Zion (potential allstar maybe more), Ingram (allstar), Josh Hart (potential starter), Lonzo Ball (potential role player)
6. Hawks - Trae Young (potential all nba), John Collins (likely allstar), Hunter/Reddish (potential role players)
7. Timberwolves - KAT (all nba), D'angelo (allstar kinda), #1 pick
8. Heat - Bam (potential all nba), Herro (likely starter), Nunn (likely starter)
9. OKC - mostly relying on picks but SGA is potential allstar
10. Bulls - Lavine (potential allstar), Carter jr (potential allstar), Markkanen (likely starter), Coby White (potential starter)

Cavs, Knicks, Hornets, Magic haven't shown much/i don't watch these teams.
Jazz and Philly have 1 core player under 25, i'm unsure how we would rank them.

You have a glaring omission in the Memphis Grizzlies.

Ja Morant, JJJ, Brandon Clarke, and maybe Brooks.

I knew i was missing someone. i would put them in the 5-6 range and kick out the Bulls.

As a Bulls fan, sadly I kind of agree.

Post #8 » by **Harry Garris** » Wed Sep 16, 2020 7:40 pm

1. Nuggets - Jokic is already a superstar and just 25. Murray is trending towards one of the best #2 options in the NBA. MPJ just needs reps to figure out how to play team defense and fit into the flow of the game, he's got all star talent.
2. Celtics - Tatum is a superstar like Jokic but not as consistent. I see Brown on about the same level as Murray.
3. Mavericks - On Luka alone. Porzingis is good when healthy but he's had so many injuries already.
4. Pelicans - Zion has the talent to be an all NBA guy like Jokic and Tatum. Ingram's a solid all star.
5. Heat - Bam is already one of the best defenders in the league and improving so quickly on offense, Herro has so much skill and confidence he could be a 20+ppg guy for a long time.
6. Grizzlies - they have 3 guys in Morant, JJJ, and Clarke and a bunch of other solid young role players.
7. Suns - Booker & Ayton are both potential all stars
8. OKC - No star yet but the assets to trade for one and a brilliant GM. SGA, Dort, and Bazley are all good young pieces.
9. Timberwolves - KAT has to improve on defense. Same for Russell. #1 pick this year is worth something.
10. Hawks - Trae Young and Collins are talented but I don't know how this team gets good enough on defense to win.

Rapaz · Post #9 » by **Rapaz** » Wed Sep 16, 2020 7:41 pm

One glaring omission:

Bucks - Giannis (25) and Donte (23)

mcmurphy · Post #10 » by **mcmurphy** » Wed Sep 16, 2020 7:42 pm

Potentially a Nuggets starting lineup Murray-Harris-MPJ-Grant-Jokic already used into PO has an average age of 23.4.

timO · Post #11 » by **timO** » Wed Sep 16, 2020 7:43 pm

Harry Garris wrote:1. Nuggets - Jokic is already a superstar and not yet 25. Murray is trending towards one of the best #2 options in the NBA. MPJ just needs reps to figure out how to play team defense and fit into the flow of the game, he's got all star talent.
2. Celtics - Tatum is a superstar like Jokic but not as consistent. I see Brown on about the same level as Murray.
3. Mavericks - On Luka alone. Porzingis is good when healthy but he's had so many injuries already.
4. Pelicans - Zion has the talent to be an all NBA guy like Jokic and Tatum. Ingram's a solid all star.
5. Heat - Bam is already one of the best defenders in the league and improving so quickly on offense, Herro has so much skill and confidence he could be a 20+ppg guy for a long time.
6. Grizzlies - they have 3 guys in Morant, JJJ, and Clarke and a bunch of other solid young role players.
7. Suns - Booker & Ayton are both potential all stars
8. OKC - No star yet but the assets to trade for one and a brilliant GM. SGA, Dort, and Bazley are all good young pieces.
9. Timberwolves - KAT has to improve on defense. Same for Russell. #1 pick this year is worth something.
10. Hawks - Trae Young and Collins are talented but I don't know how this team gets good enough on defense to win.

Jokic has 25, 26 in 5 months

2/19/1995

celticfan42487 · Post #12 » by **celticfan42487** » Wed Sep 16, 2020 7:43 pm

Cavsfansince84 wrote:Nuggets young core is a lot better than the Celtics. They have a core that as is can contend for titles. The Celtics core is one top 15 player, one top 30ish type player and nothing. Not that the Celtics are bad but if you don't include Kemba(which you shouldn't) then the core isn't that great. The Nuggets are a fully formed core already. I would even say they might be #1 ahead of the Mavs as of right now.

Agreed.

I think whatever potential Jaylen Brown does have doesn't put him in the same conversation as what Jamal Murray is showing for realized potential.

NBA fans love to ignore it because it's not fun. but young players just as often stay about the same or can regress as they do to get better.

And we're in really next season this bubble not last season. Jamal Murray has showed he's taken the leap in that off season and putting up...

27 ppg 5 rpg 6.5 aspg 1 steal on 50% fg and 49% 3 point shooter during his 14 playoff games when it matters most.

Now if that ends up being about his norm that's a potential MVP guy. But even with regression to the mean... don't think it's the mean from last year before the bubble.

We don't know what the mean is yet for him. And a 23 year old player breaking out isn't something that has never happened before.

There's a good chance next year he is at least a 24 ppg 4 rpg 5 aspg guy on 45% fg and 38% from 3

That's an all-star at the very least not a "potential" all star.

Post #13 » by **Harry Garris** » Wed Sep 16, 2020 7:44 pm

Cavsfansince84 wrote:Nuggets young core is a lot better than the Celtics. They have a core that as is can contend for titles. The Celtics core is one top 15 player, one top 30ish type player and nothing. Not that the Celtics are bad but if you don't include Kemba(which you shouldn't) then the core isn't that great. The Nuggets are a fully formed core already. I would even say they might be #1 ahead of the Mavs as of right now.

That's where I have them mostly because of Porzingis's knee issues. If we had a guarentee that Porzingis would be healthy for the next 5 years it would be Mavs and then Nuggets.

Post #14 » by **Harry Garris** » Wed Sep 16, 2020 7:45 pm

timO wrote:
Harry Garris wrote:1. Nuggets - Jokic is already a superstar and not yet 25. Murray is trending towards one of the best #2 options in the NBA. MPJ just needs reps to figure out how to play team defense and fit into the flow of the game, he's got all star talent.
2. Celtics - Tatum is a superstar like Jokic but not as consistent. I see Brown on about the same level as Murray.
3. Mavericks - On Luka alone. Porzingis is good when healthy but he's had so many injuries already.
4. Pelicans - Zion has the talent to be an all NBA guy like Jokic and Tatum. Ingram's a solid all star.
5. Heat - Bam is already one of the best defenders in the league and improving so quickly on offense, Herro has so much skill and confidence he could be a 20+ppg guy for a long time.
6. Grizzlies - they have 3 guys in Morant, JJJ, and Clarke and a bunch of other solid young role players.
7. Suns - Booker & Ayton are both potential all stars
8. OKC - No star yet but the assets to trade for one and a brilliant GM. SGA, Dort, and Bazley are all good young pieces.
9. Timberwolves - KAT has to improve on defense. Same for Russell. #1 pick this year is worth something.
10. Hawks - Trae Young and Collins are talented but I don't know how this team gets good enough on defense to win.

Jokic has 25, 26 in 5 months

2/19/1995

My bad, the podcast that I was listening to as I was writing this post just said that he was 24.

Mickey8 · Post #15 » by **Mickey8** » Wed Sep 16, 2020 7:46 pm

Why are the Mavericks on the list, Porzingis can't stay healthy full season , that disqualifies them right away, the other pieces are ok , but there is no potential all star type player on that roster beside Porzingis.

celticfan42487 · Post #16 » by **celticfan42487** » Wed Sep 16, 2020 7:46 pm

Harry Garris wrote:
Cavsfansince84 wrote:Nuggets young core is a lot better than the Celtics. They have a core that as is can contend for titles. The Celtics core is one top 15 player, one top 30ish type player and nothing. Not that the Celtics are bad but if you don't include Kemba(which you shouldn't) then the core isn't that great. The Nuggets are a fully formed core already. I would even say they might be #1 ahead of the Mavs as of right now.

That's where I have them mostly because of Porzingis's knee issues. If we had a guarentee that Porzingis would be healthy for the next 5 years it would be Mavs and then Nuggets.

Agreed. Same conversation with Zion. If you could promise me health and the ability to jump due to not being fat... then they hop into the conversation and you start thinking

Nugz v Mavz v Pelz here.

I think Ingram is really underrated for what he can bring to a team with his ball handling.

Post #17 » by **bisme37** » Wed Sep 16, 2020 7:46 pm

Assuming the point of basketball is winning and not just how good we think players are in our heads, the current list ought to be...

Celtics (2nd and 3rd conference finals for Tatum and Brown at ages 22 and 23)
Nuggets
Heat
Mavs

With the caveat that Doncic is awesome and might have more playoff success if KP didn't go down.

Cavsfansince84 · Post #18 » by **Cavsfansince84** » Wed Sep 16, 2020 7:47 pm

celticfan42487 wrote:Agreed.

I think whatever potential Jaylen Brown does have doesn't put him in the same conversation as what Jamal Murray is showing for realized potential.

NBA fans love to ignore it because it's not fun. but young players just as often stay about the same or can regress as they do to get better.

And we're in really next season this bubble not last season. Jamal Murray has showed he's taken the leap in that off season and putting up...

27 ppg 5 rpg 6.5 aspg 1 steal on 50% fg and 49% 3 point shooter during his 14 playoff games when it matters most.

Now if that ends up being about his norm that's a potential MVP guy. But even with regression to the mean... don't think it's the mean from last year before the bubble.

We don't know what the mean is yet for him. And a 23 year old player breaking out isn't something that has never happened before.

There's a good chance next year he is at least a 24 ppg 4 rpg 5 aspg guy on 45% fg and 38% from 3

That's an all-star at the very least not a "potential" all star.

Nice objective post. I mean Murray has probably been a top 5-7 player in these entire playoffs. Brown is a guy who can put up 25 pts and hit some 3's every now and then while playing good defense. All star is likely his ceiling.

celticfan42487 · Post #19 » by **celticfan42487** » Wed Sep 16, 2020 7:48 pm

Mickey8 wrote:Why are the Mavericks on the list, Porzingis can't stay healthy full season , that disqualifies them right away, the other pieces are ok , but there is no potential all star type player on that roster beside Porzingis.

The hard part is finding an MVP guy.

And Doncic is the only other guy along with Greek Freak who's the potential league MVP at such a young age.

Finding a KP isn't nearly as hard to do.

SeattleJazzFan · Post #20 » by **SeattleJazzFan** » Wed Sep 16, 2020 7:52 pm

Jadoogar wrote:In light of these playoffs, i wanted to rexamine the best young cores list. I'm going to define young as 25 years or younger

1. Mavericks - Luka (potential MVP), Porzingis (potential allstar)
2. Celtics - Tatum (all nba), Brown (potential allstar), Robert Williams (likely role player), Grant Williams (likely role player)
3. Nuggets - Jokic (all nba), Murray (potential allstar), Michael Porter Jr (potential allstar)
4. Suns - Booker (potential all nba), Ayton (potential all star), Bridges (potential starter)
5. Pelicans - Zion (potential allstar maybe more), Ingram (allstar), Josh Hart (potential starter), Lonzo Ball (potential role player)
6. Hawks - Trae Young (potential all nba), John Collins (likely allstar), Hunter/Reddish (potential role players)
7. Timberwolves - KAT (all nba), D'angelo (allstar kinda), #1 pick
8. Heat - Bam (potential all nba), Herro (likely starter), Nunn (likely starter)
9. OKC - mostly relying on picks but SGA is potential allstar
10. Bulls - Lavine (potential allstar), Carter jr (potential allstar), Markkanen (likely starter), Coby White (potential starter)

Cavs, Knicks, Hornets, Magic haven't shown much/i don't watch these teams.
Jazz and Philly have 1 core player under 25, i'm unsure how we would rank them.

it's a good list, but as you admitted you need Memphis in there at about 5. Mavericks are too high with just Doncic and Porizingis as a potential all-star. just two dudes (where all the others have 3-5 guys) with only one being a legit star already. Also, Bridges - potential starter - he is a starter already and plays huge minutes. he might have remote all-star potential as a top 3 and D guy in the entire league.

otherwise good thread and good post.