The Lebron '20 Thread (Pt. 6)

[zimpy27]

I think the main takeaway is that the NBA should have a Conn Smythe Trophy or Ballon d'Or. In this era, it's becoming more and more common for players to focus on the playoffs over the regular season. I'm not even making a judgement on it - maybe it's a bad strategy or maybe it's a good strategy - but it feels strange that the playoffs are almost completely ignored as far as awards are concerned.

I tend to agree, it'd be good if there were awards that focussed on the entire NBA year, regular season and playoffs combined. Maybe they do voting after conference finals and release the winners during the finals series.

That would actually make having a separate finals MVP make sense.

From LeBron's perspective, not having those awards definitely impacts his public perception. There are many people who, perhaps rightfully so, realize that LeBron has only won 4 MVPs, and wonder how he can be in the GOAT conversation when there are guys ahead or even with him. The problem is that the NBA awards categories were decided upon 50 years ago by some random dudes in a boardroom, and for some reason have not evolved since then.

To be clear, I'm not saying that the NBA should alter its awards to make LeBron look good. I'm just saying that there are sensible awards that the NBA does not hand out, and it probably does impact LeBron's legacy in a way, as well as other players too. Bill Russell is actually the most victimized - If the NBA handed out DPOTY and FMVP when he was playing, there would be absolutely no resume-based argument for anyone besides him as the GOAT.

I agree. I don't think LeBron needs to look good. I also think the awards need to be improved generally.

[Joey Wheeler]

Giannis winning 2 MVPs is the final nail in the coffin of the MVP award, never taking it even remotely seriously again or even bothering discussing it during the season. If Giannis is the MVP of the league, then being the MVP of the league means absolutely nothing.

[MisterHibachi]

Paul Millsap is 0-8 in the playoffs against LeBron.

[MisterHibachi]

Read on Twitter

?s=09

[Heej]

What I wanna know is how these people know that's the name of the playcall and not like split tornado hulk smash or something. I get the split part because it's a split action but where do they come up with the rest of it.

[Mazter]

With .746 shs he just became the all time leader in MVP shares:
1. LeBron James 8.813
2. Michael Jordan 8.115
3. Kareem Abdul-Jabbar 6.105
4. Larry Bird 5.612
5. Magic Johnson 5.104
Other active players:
12. James Harden 3.655
14. Kevin Durant 3.209
24. Stephen Curry 2.207
26. Giannis Antetokounmpo 1.965

[TheGOATRises007]

The NBA version of a Ballon D'Or would be interesting.

Albeit, the Ballon D'Or also had some suspicious winners(Modric in 2018). Van Dijk almost won in 2019 over Messi.

[SeniorWalker]

Giannis winning 2 MVPs is the final nail in the coffin of the MVP award, never taking it even remotely seriously again or even bothering discussing it during the season. If Giannis is the MVP of the league, then being the MVP of the league means absolutely nothing.

This is a bull take, tbh.

LeBron has 4 MVPs, well deserved. In those years he pushed his team all year, got the best record and deserved it. His teams were among the most consistent in the regular season and he was the best player in the reg. season. Two of those years he went back to back but didn't make the finals. Still deserved it.

The other years of his career, we had to deal with inconsistency from both he and his teammates all year, locker room drama, underwhelming records, etc. He did not deserve it in these years compared to other players, especially those that played with less talent than he. In the majority of his post-cleveland (1st stint) career his teams were either the most or second most talented in the NBA and yet they underperformed often. That is not an MVP. If you want to say MVP should include playoffs, LeBron still wouldn't be MVP this year because he's arguably not been the best player on his own team, though he has been great to be sure.

Honestly, the fact that the Bucks were so easily crippled by the weakness of a single player shows just how singularly reliant they are on him. Building the wall against Giannis and the opposing team easily won because no one else could consistently step up, shows that Giannis was definitely the MVP (and that the Bucks are not a championship level team because they don't have more than one real option, and are easy to counter). Not to mention defensively as well. LeBron can have a bad game here and there playing with Davis because Davis is just about as good as he is and can carry the scoring and defensive load.

MVP has never been a best player in the league award. It just so happens that players who are considered among the best are most often in contention, but they are not the same thing and rightfully so.

[LikeABosh]

Paul Millsap is 0-8 in the playoffs against LeBron.

That poor Hawks team.

I believe Horford is 1-16 against him

[Homer38]

Paul Millsap is 0-8 in the playoffs against LeBron.

That poor Hawks team.

I believe Horford is 1-16 against him

He was after 2017 but he won 3 games in 2018 with the celtics against the cavs.

[nbhadja]

Been 7 years since LeBron won an MVP. Imagine dominating a sport for a 7-year stretch and not getting an MVP. Has this happened to any other player?

I can't imagine it has. Though I think that Lebron will win the MVP next year.

[freethedevil]

This guy oaktown has this shtick of posting the worst stats to prove an insane point. Notice how none of the advanced impact metrics that paint LeBron as the best in the league were mentioned.

In regards to mvp it's clear now that this is becoming more than a regular season award. One of my friends put it best in that the NBA season is like Dragonball Z, you get 20 episodes of filler until you get 1 with a main fight. The whole point of the MVP is to capture who is the best player in the league that year that gives you the best chance to win a championship. If that wasn't the spirit of the award you wouldn't get threads mocking Harden and Giannis every season or people saying Jordan and LeBron should've won mvp every year.

TBF, even going by impact metrics lebron's always been 2-4th post 2014 in the regular season.

Really? I thought there was a stretch with Draymond-Curry where he was displaced then back on top by 2017 in some of the metrics. I do remember that being a thing on the boards for some years but hey I might just be misremembering

maybe for a bit, but by the end, westbrook had him beat, and curry was leading the league by a landslide. Don't remember how he compared to harden.

And yeah, draymond's the GOAT

[nbhadja]

Been 7 years since LeBron won an MVP. Imagine dominating a sport for a 7-year stretch and not getting an MVP. Has this happened to any other player?

So dominant. Let's see all the areas he has lead the league in over the last 7 years:


PER: 0 of 7 years
WS: 0 of 7 years
WS/48: 0 of 7 years
VORP: 1 of 7 years
BPM: 0 of 7 years
Wins: 0 of 7 years
OWS: 0 of 7 years
DWS: 0 of 7 years
OBPM: 0 of 7 years
DBPM: 0 of 7 years
PPG: 0 of 7 years
APG: 1 of 7 years
SPG: 0 of 7 years
BPG: 0 of 7 years
RPG: 0 of 7 years
FG%: 0 of 7 years
FT%: 0 of 7 years
3P%: 0 of 7 years
2P%: 0 of 7 years
TS%: 0 of 7 years
eFG: 0 of 7 years

He has been a dominant presence for 7 years, but he has not dominated the league in any single season.

When was the last time someone won an MVP without being statistically dominant? Never.

No offense, but this is a terrible post. Lebron has been statistically dominant every season in the past 7 years. Focusing only on number one in each stat category is stupid. That is like saying that the 2nd most dominant scorer, rebounder, assister is garbage and the same as last place. That is also like saying that the 2nd tallest man on earth is short. That is a terrible way to measure things. Lebron has been the best player in the NBA over the past 7 years easily and he has the best statistics over the past 7 years easily also.

[nbhadja]

He's been the best player in the league for 6 of 7 years. Don't try to deny it.

Plenty win without statistical dominance btw.

Who? Who won MVP without leading the league in multiple categories?

You say plenty. Back that **** up or STFU

Why are you even in this thread if you get offended by some LeBron hype?

He is just mad that Lebron is a far superior player than Curry and KD ever were/are/will be.

[xb3at band1tx]

Paul Millsap is 0-8 in the playoffs against LeBron.

I love Millsap but he really is one of those classic LeBron jobbers.

[Heej]

Paul Millsap is 0-8 in the playoffs against LeBron.

I love Millsap but he really is one of those classic LeBron jobbers.

LMFAO I hate that you coined this. F***in A this is hilarious lol. Now I'm gonna start thinking of half these players as LeBron jobbers for the rest of their careers smh

[LikeABosh]

Paul Millsap is 0-8 in the playoffs against LeBron.

That poor Hawks team.

I believe Horford is 1-16 against him

He was after 2017 but he won 3 games in 2018 with the celtics against the cavs.

Oh, yeah. I remember thinking he was finally gonna win a series against LeBron

[PistolPeteJR]

Giannis winning 2 MVPs is the final nail in the coffin of the MVP award, never taking it even remotely seriously again or even bothering discussing it during the season. If Giannis is the MVP of the league, then being the MVP of the league means absolutely nothing.

This is a bull take, tbh.

LeBron has 4 MVPs, well deserved. In those years he pushed his team all year, got the best record and deserved it. His teams were among the most consistent in the regular season and he was the best player in the reg. season. Two of those years he went back to back but didn't make the finals. Still deserved it.

The other years of his career, we had to deal with inconsistency from both he and his teammates all year, locker room drama, underwhelming records, etc. He did not deserve it in these years compared to other players, especially those that played with less talent than he. In the majority of his post-cleveland (1st stint) career his teams were either the most or second most talented in the NBA and yet they underperformed often. That is not an MVP. If you want to say MVP should include playoffs, LeBron still wouldn't be MVP this year because he's arguably not been the best player on his own team, though he has been great to be sure.

Honestly, the fact that the Bucks were so easily crippled by the weakness of a single player shows just how singularly reliant they are on him. Building the wall against Giannis and the opposing team easily won because no one else could consistently step up, shows that Giannis was definitely the MVP (and that the Bucks are not a championship level team because they don't have more than one real option, and are easy to counter). Not to mention defensively as well. LeBron can have a bad game here and there playing with Davis because Davis is just about as good as he is and can carry the scoring and defensive load.

MVP has never been a best player in the league award. It just so happens that players who are considered among the best are most often in contention, but they are not the same thing and rightfully so.

“Singularly reliant”, yet the one game they won vs the Heat was the Giannis-less game. Lol.

[Homer38]

Not a good news for the lakers

Read on Twitter

[freethedevil]

Not a good news for the lakers

Read on Twitter

chuck is both the realist and most fraudlent member of that panel