hugepatsfan wrote:We need SHOOTERS. Not just guys who can shoot, I'm talking real shooters. Guy who you say shooting is a strength for.
Brown, Smart, Theis, Wanamaker, Ojeleye, Grant all "can shoot" in the sense that they post respectable or even good percentages. But think from the perspective of if we were defending a team with all those players. They're the type of guys you know can and will knock down shots, but you accept that because you don't consider it something that will kill you. Then guys like Kanter or R Williams are just total non shooters. Even Kemba and Tatum, while good shooters, seem to prefer to shoot off the dribble vs spot up. Hayward is the only guy we have who I consider a really good catch & shoot guy. That's not enough.
I posted trades last night, but I strongly feel that Tony Snell in DET and Bjelica in SAC, as well as DJ Augustine as a MLE target, would have TREMENDOUS impact on this team. For one, it lengthens the rotation because it gives us more offensively passable players. That and Hayward coming back would allow us to better balance rotations. You can start Kemba/Brown/Hayward/Tatum and then sit two of them for Smart and one of the shooters (Augustine, Snell, Bjelica). You can line it up so that you always have 3 of our great perimeter players out there together (Smart/Kemba/Brown/Hayward/Tatum) and you don't have to play them all 40 minutes to do it. Miami didn't play a guy over 35 minutes last night. That helps teams continue to play hard for 48 minutes if they get sufficient rest.
Kanter + Poirier is enough salary to take back Tony Snell. DET adds about $7M of cap room once you factor in one less roster hold on top of the salary savings. I think they'd take that, especially if we sent some cash to waive Poirier since he's probably not roster worthy.
Carsen + Green + Semi + #26 is enough outgoing salary and value to land Bjelica. I think they'd go for it. Semi is playable, Carsen is a cheap flier, #26 is still a 1st rounder even if late and Green is worthy of a backend roster spot.
I think a 1 year MLE deal is fair value for Augustine. He's at the later stages of his career where you'd think he wants to be on good teams too. He has a history playing with Kemba too.
That would add not 1, not 2 but THREE real SHOOTERS to the rotation. It also adds flexibility to capitalize on mid season trades as an added bonus, since they're movable salaries. We'd still have Langford/R WIlliams/G Williams/#14 pick as pieces with value to use in deals should opportunities arise.
Kemba / Augustine Brown / Smart / Langford Hayward / Snell Tatum / G Williams Theis / Bjelica / R Williams
That team is still as good on defense as the current version for the most part (Bjelica is better than Kanter because everyone is lol, Snell is probably not as good as Semi but he's quality, Augustine is admittedly a downgrade from Wanamaker). We're seeing Kemba and Tatum be stifled by traps, doubles and strong help defense. The #1 way to reduce how much defenses can do that is by putting better shooters on the 3 point line. These moves here would MASSIVELY open the floor up.
Only read the 1st line and liked and quoted.
I think Bjelica can start against alot of teams in the league with his knock down shooting from deep. Would really open the floor for Kemba to collapse the defenses off of drives. Theis doesnt shoot from the outside so that allows defenders to sag off him.
I am not sure about Augustine. I think there are other/better options available for the MLE we will have (Burks, Bazemore, Connaughton, Bryn Forbes, Etwan Moore) Far superior offense and/or shooting to Augustine and can just move Smart to PG off the bench.
Off the bench Smart and Bjelica pick and roll all day with Snell in the corner.
But, ideally on a bench with Smart, Snell and Bjelica (all shooters) We would want a guy who can go Iso and break down the defense, Someone fast with the ball who can get into the middle. So for me a few names come to mind for that role.
Smith JR Delon Wright Alec Burks Etwan Moore Kent Bazemore
All these guys are averaging over 4 drives per game in limited minutes (less than 24)
That works for me. My thinking is more around playoff rotations though. With that lineup I put, I would always have at least two of Kemba/Brown/Hayward/Tatum out there with Smart. I'm lining up rotations so I never have less than 3 of Kemba/Brown/Hayward/Tatum/Smart out there together in the playoff rotation. So Snell and Augustine/one of those guys you brought up would just be filling 10-15 minutes each around the main guys.
Only way they're consistently touching it is C&S opportunities and as another PG I trust Augustine to make the best reads for swing passes and attacking close outs in those situations. That's why I preferred him. But same idea really applies the shooters you brought up. Not much of a Wright fan though because he doesn't shoot.
In the regular season where minutes aren't extended, can definitely see more of what you're saying be a factor. But I'm done really caring out our regular seasons at this point. I'm all about how the playoff rotation shakes out.
I'm torn on Bjelica. Love the idea sometimes, other times I'm wondering if we'd just be better off with a guy like Nesmith/Bey/Green/etc from the draft since they fit the D (to varying degrees). Kinda depends on Bjelica's D. I know the rep is bad, but I don't know how bad. Could he bang with the big centers like we use Kanter for? I'm pretty sure he'd be a disaster on switches. He'd have to be able to do at least one or the other.
If we hit on a 3&D guy in the draft, you can roll out the all wing lineup:
Smart, Jaylen, Tatum, Hayward, pick.
In your top 7 you still only have Theis that can't shoot. And if Grant develops any more, he's 7 and Theis is #8. Add DJ to that, you got a rotation where 8 of 9 can shoot.
And they're all cost-controlled other than DJ.
Snell, you know I trade for daily, but to me it's usually an effective way to disperse Hayward salary and get an expiring contributor. I'm not sure he's a target outright as opposed to just drafting. I don't think they go for just Kanter/Poirier - I think they want a low first or at least high 2nd for him. If they do go for it, amen, bring him on. He'd make it 9 of 10.
We're in the tax on these plans anyways, so I'd just waive/stretch Poirier instead of attaching even 47 to send him out. And Kanter's useful enough I don't need to pay to get rid of him either.
BK_2020 wrote:Why would you want a player that even Atlanta doesn't want? Smdh.
Atlanta MIGHT not want him because: 1) They are not winning with him and Trae 2) They may not want to pay him 3) Collins may not like being there. 4) Collins is best served as being a center, and Atlanta now has Dedmon and Capela there.
And you would want a player who gets blocked by Dedmon and Capela smmfh
BK_2020 wrote:Why would you want a player that even Atlanta doesn't want? Smdh.
Atlanta MIGHT not want him because: 1) They are not winning with him and Trae 2) They may not want to pay him 3) Collins may not like being there. 4) Collins is best served as being a center, and Atlanta now has Dedmon and Capela there.
And you would want a player who gets blocked by Dedmon and Capela smmfh
Uhhh, what?
Atlanta put him at pf thinking it would work, it hasnt and now they have alot of money tied up in cemters.
Atlanta MIGHT not want him because: 1) They are not winning with him and Trae 2) They may not want to pay him 3) Collins may not like being there. 4) Collins is best served as being a center, and Atlanta now has Dedmon and Capela there.
And you would want a player who gets blocked by Dedmon and Capela smmfh
Uhhh, what?
Atlanta put him at pf thinking it would work, it hasnt and now they have alot of money tied up in cemters.
You are both wrong on your thought process! John Collins is a PF. He was tasked with playing C because the Hawks had Alex Len and Damian Jones as the C rotation, so it was better to play a small lineup of Trae, Huerter, Reddish, Hunter and Collins. Capela and Dedmon were specifically brought in so that Collins wouldn't need to play Center (except small ball). With Collins' growing ability to step out and shoot the 3 (40% in 41 games), the hope is it works with Capela's inside game. Collins played 41 games this season, in those games the team was 16-25. He missed 25 games due to suspension, Hawks were 4-21 in those games, now you understand why the 'Trae and Collins aren't winning' doesn't hold water.
CelticsPride18 wrote:Hayward and the 3 picks for 2nd pick and Draymond Green.
Who says yes?
Not the Warriors.
Unless, the Cs agree to take Klay's contract off their hands. That would improve their response from convulsing on the floor with laughter, to a few minutes of serious thought before they say thanks, but no thanks.
Green is not only an elite big, but is the only legitimate big on their roster.
John Collins is exactly what Boston needs as a complete small ball center who can do everything inside out on offense and defense..
BUT he is at or near MAX level player and Boston still has to pay JT soon.. so no financial way to get him unless GH is traded.. which I just don't see happening..
2 things need to go.. my lack of spell check and Joe..
Trade up with WAS: 9 for 14, 26 & Poirier + cash to dump him
We can get a faller like Okongwu, Vassell, Okoro, Haliburton or other guys not at 14. Resign Hayward at Jaylen contract. Even if Kanter opts in, we're at 13 players, a little over $130M.
Fill 14 with 2nd, Waters, Semi, whatever, we can just squeeze under the tax. Or use the non-tax MLE and add someone really good and stay under the apron.
playa-hater wrote:John Collins is exactly what Boston needs as a complete small ball center who can do everything inside out on offense and defense..
BUT he is at or near MAX level player and Boston still has to pay JT soon.. so no financial way to get him unless GH is traded.. which I just don't see happening..
When is Collins owed the extension, this season or can it wait until next off-season?
playa-hater wrote:John Collins is exactly what Boston needs as a complete small ball center who can do everything inside out on offense and defense..
BUT he is at or near MAX level player and Boston still has to pay JT soon.. so no financial way to get him unless GH is traded.. which I just don't see happening..
When is Collins owed the extension, this season or can it wait until next off-season?
He's a third-year player like Tatum, so I presume they need to be paid at the same time.
Banned temporarily for, among other sins, being "Extremely Deviant".
If Boston doesn't win the title this year, I suspect they'll make a move to kick the inevitable luxury tax a year further down the road. It would not surprise me either if Ainge has his eyes on GSW"s #2 pick, and forming a young, Big 3 with Tatum and Brown.
This won't be popular, but can see Smart getting moved to GSW.
CelticFaninLBC wrote:If Boston doesn't win the title this year, I suspect they'll make a move to kick the inevitable luxury tax a year further down the road. It would not surprise me either if Ainge has his eyes on GSW"s #2 pick, and forming a young, Big 3 with Tatum and Brown.
This won't be popular, but can see Smart getting moved to GSW.
playa-hater wrote:John Collins is exactly what Boston needs as a complete small ball center who can do everything inside out on offense and defense..
BUT he is at or near MAX level player and Boston still has to pay JT soon.. so no financial way to get him unless GH is traded.. which I just don't see happening..
When is Collins owed the extension, this season or can it wait until next off-season?
He's a third-year player like Tatum, so I presume they need to be paid at the same time.
But we could pay tatum immediately and delay collins 1 year?
CelticFaninLBC wrote:If Boston doesn't win the title this year, I suspect they'll make a move to kick the inevitable luxury tax a year further down the road. It would not surprise me either if Ainge has his eyes on GSW"s #2 pick, and forming a young, Big 3 with Tatum and Brown.
This won't be popular, but can see Smart getting moved to GSW.
Smart, Poirier, #26 & #30 for GSW's TPE & #2 pick
No chance smart gets moved. Iko.
Hayward Kemba Theis Young guys.
In that order.
What do Kemba or Hayward bring back? Can't see either having lots of value given their contracts and health issues.
CelticFaninLBC wrote:If Boston doesn't win the title this year, I suspect they'll make a move to kick the inevitable luxury tax a year further down the road. It would not surprise me either if Ainge has his eyes on GSW"s #2 pick, and forming a young, Big 3 with Tatum and Brown.
This won't be popular, but can see Smart getting moved to GSW.
Smart, Poirier, #26 & #30 for GSW's TPE & #2 pick
No chance smart gets moved. Iko.
Hayward Kemba Theis Young guys.
In that order.
What do Kemba or Hayward bring back? Can't see either having lots of value given their contracts and health issues.
