Jimmy Butler

Post #81 » by **Klomp** » Tue Sep 22, 2020 4:17 pm

I'd put Towns third or fourth, behind Doncic and Booker and in a similar tier with Jayson Tatum.

Killboard · Post #82 » by **Killboard** » Tue Sep 22, 2020 4:59 pm

Fun fact: Butler and KAT won 63% when both played two season ago. Bam and Butler won 65% of their games when both played this season.

Now take into account conference record, coaching experience/success, and depth of both rosters.

Jedzz · Post #83 » by **Jedzz** » Tue Sep 22, 2020 5:28 pm

Killboard wrote:Fun fact: Butler and KAT won 63% when both played two season ago. Bam and Butler won 65% of their games when both played this season.

Now take into account conference record, coaching experience/success, and depth of both rosters.

If they could have removed Wiggins from the equation it probably would have went up 3 to 5% in 70% of the season's games.

Jedzz · Post #84 » by **Jedzz** » Tue Sep 22, 2020 5:35 pm

Klomp wrote:I'd put Towns third or fourth, behind Doncic and Booker and in a similar tier with Jayson Tatum.

The problem probably is that you are likely basing this on what you know Towns is capable of, where outsiders are basing it on how often Towns has allowed them to forget about him. Missing half of a shortened season and not getting your team even into the bubble might share a part in it. If the rest of his seasons are riddled with stretches not playing he's maybe no more influential on the league than say an often injured KP.

Would be really nice to see a season of Towns with no Wiggins around. One day sometime in the future when the Wolves play bball again.

urinesane · Post #85 » by **urinesane** » Tue Sep 22, 2020 10:01 pm

I get it, KAT is the man, so everything gets put on him... but last season until the massive trade our squad was basically KAT and a bunch of hot garbage.

Definitely should have made people around him better, but you can't shine a turd, amirite?

MN7725 · Post #86 » by **MN7725** » Tue Sep 22, 2020 10:59 pm

KAT being low is probably has to do with being a "C" more than anything

Zion/Bam are both "bigs", but are 1% athleticism

younggunsmn · Post #87 » by **younggunsmn** » Wed Sep 23, 2020 12:06 am

Well history has proven Butler right.
Free Agency is a big deal and for most the chance to pick your team/situation only comes around once when in their prime.

When you look at the 3 teams, MN/PHI/MIA, the one thing that really sticks out is the continuity of the front office/coaching in MIA versus the other 2. You've got a HOF level coach and executive in Pat Riley, and quietly one of the best coaches in the game in Spoelstra at the helm for 10+ years.

When a player has faith in the coach/front office, it matters when you are committing for the next 3-4 years that you feel the team will be on the rise.
You look at Miami at the time Jimmy was asking out, their roster was filled with alot of hot garbage on bad contracts, with a couple of young assets. It's amazing what they have done since.
All the maneuvering for the Butler S&T.
Getting memphis to eat all those bad contracts for Justice Winslow (Although throwing all that money at old man Iguodala baffles me).
Finding good rotation guys in the 2nd round and off the scrap heap (which Riley has always been great at, his problem has been overpaying those guys).
Now they have 2 elite 2-way players, and a max slot next summer.

Jimmy wasn't a fan of Rubio, so Thibs traded him. Signing Teague was an awful move, but Rubio was the only realistic alternative at the time (Lowry wasnt signing here).. At the time Rubio was coming off a down year after dealing with losing his mom. Could Rubio have won Jimmy over with his high BBIQ and defense or would all the missed 3's and layups driven him up a wall? We will never know.

If I were Jimmy I wouldn't have had faith in Thibs the GM either. Maxing Wiggins and adding throwing 33 mil at Taj/Teague.
We had peaked that summer. We had no room to add assets, we had cashed in all our chips.

It was interesting that he wanted out of a seemingly better Philly situation with Embiid and Simmons. Brand hasn't shown himself to be a good GM either, and although Brown is a good coach, that team probably needed a stronger hand guiding all those personalities.
Moving Butler inside the conference was a decision they already regret.

I don't think Bam+Richardson were ever on the table together. It was Bam+ bad contract+1st or Richardson + bad contract+1st.
If we were ever offered both together we should have taken the offer immediately.
I can see Thibs wanting Bam (he was a draft target), but we also needed a wing to replace Butler.
In hindsight Bam is the best asset we were offered, but you also have to give a tremendous amount of credit to Spoelstra for developing him.

KAT''s biggest problem is his inability to move on to the next play when things don't go his way. Guys can get under his skin and they know it, and that is a problem. Putting Embiid in a headlock is not a good thing. KAT has a great passion for the game, that much is clear, channeling that consistently into positive energy on the court is the challenge. When he is spending energy on BS like foul calls and reacting to trash talk, its energy he's not spending reading the defense, thinking about what the other team is doing offensively, or carrying out his assignments on the court.

He has mediocre lateral agility, and he can't afford to be consistently a half step late mentally, he certainly can't afford to be out of position. Teams are good at exploiting him by getting him to overcommit and then attacking.
We are going to have to find a way to make it work. A drop scheme is probably best.
It certainly doesn't help that he doesn't have an interior tag-team partner. Juancho isnt going to cut it.
It's part of the reason I'm so excited about adding Wiseman. Although if you add another 7 footer with the same limitations as KAT it is not a good thing. I am optimistic about Wiseman's lateral agility when looking at the tape, and he certainly has the length to effect shots and eat up space quickly.

southern wolf · Post #88 » by **southern wolf** » Wed Sep 23, 2020 12:35 am

Maybe Jimmy just couldn't cope with a young star stealing his limelight? First KAT then Simmons and Embiid in Philly. No doubt he's a superstar player as he's proving once again in Miami, but he's also an egomaniac who needs everything to be on his terms. We'll see how long he stays buddies with Bam.

Killboard · Post #89 » by **Killboard** » Wed Sep 23, 2020 2:24 am

younggunsmn wrote:Well history has proven Butler right.
Free Agency is a big deal and for most the chance to pick your team/situation only comes around once when in their prime.

When you look at the 3 teams, MN/PHI/MIA, the one thing that really sticks out is the continuity of the front office/coaching in MIA versus the other 2. You've got a HOF level coach and executive in Pat Riley, and quietly one of the best coaches in the game in Spoelstra at the helm for 10+ years.

When a player has faith in the coach/front office, it matters when you are committing for the next 3-4 years that you feel the team will be on the rise.
You look at Miami at the time Jimmy was asking out, their roster was filled with alot of hot garbage on bad contracts, with a couple of young assets. It's amazing what they have done since.
All the maneuvering for the Butler S&T.
Getting memphis to eat all those bad contracts for Justice Winslow (Although throwing all that money at old man Iguodala baffles me).
Finding good rotation guys in the 2nd round and off the scrap heap (which Riley has always been great at, his problem has been overpaying those guys).
Now they have 2 elite 2-way players, and a max slot next summer.

Jimmy wasn't a fan of Rubio, so Thibs traded him. Signing Teague was an awful move, but Rubio was the only realistic alternative at the time (Lowry wasnt signing here).. At the time Rubio was coming off a down year after dealing with losing his mom. Could Rubio have won Jimmy over with his high BBIQ and defense or would all the missed 3's and layups driven him up a wall? We will never know.

If I were Jimmy I wouldn't have had faith in Thibs the GM either. Maxing Wiggins and adding throwing 33 mil at Taj/Teague.
We had peaked that summer. We had no room to add assets, we had cashed in all our chips.

It was interesting that he wanted out of a seemingly better Philly situation with Embiid and Simmons. Brand hasn't shown himself to be a good GM either, and although Brown is a good coach, that team probably needed a stronger hand guiding all those personalities.
Moving Butler inside the conference was a decision they already regret.

I don't think Bam+Richardson were ever on the table together. It was Bam+ bad contract+1st or Richardson + bad contract+1st.
If we were ever offered both together we should have taken the offer immediately.
I can see Thibs wanting Bam (he was a draft target), but we also needed a wing to replace Butler.
In hindsight Bam is the best asset we were offered, but you also have to give a tremendous amount of credit to Spoelstra for developing him.

KAT''s biggest problem is his inability to move on to the next play when things don't go his way. Guys can get under his skin and they know it, and that is a problem. Putting Embiid in a headlock is not a good thing. KAT has a great passion for the game, that much is clear, channeling that consistently into positive energy on the court is the challenge. When he is spending energy on BS like foul calls and reacting to trash talk, its energy he's not spending reading the defense, thinking about what the other team is doing offensively, or carrying out his assignments on the court.

He has mediocre lateral agility, and he can't afford to be consistently a half step late mentally, he certainly can't afford to be out of position. Teams are good at exploiting him by getting him to overcommit and then attacking.
We are going to have to find a way to make it work. A drop scheme is probably best.
It certainly doesn't help that he doesn't have an interior tag-team partner. Juancho isnt going to cut it.
It's part of the reason I'm so excited about adding Wiseman. Although if you add another 7 footer with the same limitations as KAT it is not a good thing. I am optimistic about Wiseman's lateral agility when looking at the tape, and he certainly has the length to effect shots and eat up space quickly.

He didn't need to throw his teamates under the bus though. He was going to be a FA anyways. He overreacted and acted without honor IMO. Terrific player still.

AirP. · Post #90 » by **AirP.** » Thu Sep 24, 2020 3:58 am

southern wolf wrote:Maybe Jimmy just couldn't cope with a young star stealing his limelight? First KAT then Simmons and Embiid in Philly. No doubt he's a superstar player as he's proving once again in Miami, but he's also an egomaniac who needs everything to be on his terms. We'll see how long he stays buddies with Bam.

Tyler Herro summed it up tonight after his 37 point game in the ECF, something KAT didn't want to deal with.

He's taught me a lot of things, just continuing to get on me, whether it's something I want to hear or not

Read on Twitter

Jedzz · Post #91 » by **Jedzz** » Sat Sep 26, 2020 12:38 am

urinesane wrote:I get it, KAT is the man, so everything gets put on him... but last season until the massive trade our squad was basically KAT and a bunch of hot garbage.

Definitely should have made people around him better, but you can't shine a turd, amirite?

I'm going to petrify a dog dooty and then throw it in a rock polisher to find out. If it works out everyone get in line, it will be the next pet rock.

urinesane · Post #92 » by **urinesane** » Sat Sep 26, 2020 12:40 am

Jedzz wrote:
urinesane wrote:I get it, KAT is the man, so everything gets put on him... but last season until the massive trade our squad was basically KAT and a bunch of hot garbage.

Definitely should have made people around him better, but you can't shine a turd, amirite?

I'm going to petrify a dog dooty and then throw it in a rock polisher to find out. If it works out everyone get in line, it will be the next pet rock.

Spoiler:

Jedzz · Post #93 » by **Jedzz** » Mon Sep 28, 2020 12:28 am

It's Game six. Does Jimmy and Miami close the door tonight. Or do they falter again and the Butler haters come screaming in like a dam just broke?

UnFadeable21 · Post #94 » by **UnFadeable21** » Mon Sep 28, 2020 2:28 am

Jimmy Butler has made it to the NBA finals

KGdaBom · Post #95 » by **KGdaBom** » Mon Sep 28, 2020 3:42 am

I don't wish Jimmy any success. Not after the crap he pulled on us. It's a shame that good things are coming to him. It sets a bad example.

Jedzz · Post #96 » by **Jedzz** » Mon Sep 28, 2020 7:02 pm

Waaaa wrote:I don't wish Jimmy any success. Not after the crap he pulled on us. It's a shame that good things are coming to him. It sets a bad example.

KGdaBom · Post #97 » by **KGdaBom** » Mon Sep 28, 2020 8:05 pm

Jedzz wrote:
Waaaa wrote:I don't wish Jimmy any success. Not after the crap he pulled on us. It's a shame that good things are coming to him. It sets a bad example.

UnFadeable21 · Post #98 » by **UnFadeable21** » Mon Sep 28, 2020 8:10 pm

Read on Twitter

?s=21

Tyus sticking up for his boy

Battletrigger · Post #99 » by **Battletrigger** » Mon Sep 28, 2020 8:25 pm

Beat L. A. as you beated losers here

KGdaBom · Post #100 » by **KGdaBom** » Mon Sep 28, 2020 9:05 pm

Jedzz wrote:
Waaaa wrote:I don't wish Jimmy any success. Not after the crap he pulled on us. It's a shame that good things are coming to him. It sets a bad example.

That's the emoji I should have used.