2020 NBA Draft Thread, Part 2 -- (8PM, Wed, Nov. 18, ESPN)

[GoGreen]

Sorry yall. Could someone direct me to where the Cs have been linked to Haliburton? Seeing a lot of chatter on him. Looked on twitter, googled. Haven't found anything linking him to Boston.

[31to6]

Can I just remind us that there’s such a thing as smokescreens leading up to the draft? Maybe we’re really into Halliburton and Tillman or Ball. Maybe we just want other teams to think that we are. Maybe we’re not actually expressing any hints of interest in them and it’s just message board chum.

[celticfan42487]

I think I'd rather have 3 shots at this draft than trading up for 1.

With no personal workouts and a limited amount of tape to study I don't think anyone can have much more than a guess based on tape than they could before.

The Celtics have a habit of grading some players higher than the norm but I think that's due to our private workouts highlighting different things than other teams...

It just seem in a year with no information you're more likely to have a lot of "uh oh he should have been drafted a lot higher than he was" this year than any other.

This is a good draft to have 3 rolls of the dice. The current roster can't support 3 more rookies though

Why?

Are Semi, Poirer, Green, Waters, Fall, Edwards all essential?

[themoneyteam2]

Halliburton would definitely be a change in philosophy for point guards under Brad but I think a necessary one since the need for a guy like Kemba next to JT and JB isn’t that big.

Need a PG who won’t get targeted on defense and also don’t need a score first guard with those two wings. That’s where Halliburton makes the most sense but I’m just not that high on him, mostly due to his mechanics on his shot.

His percentages are great but he’ll need to tweak those shot mechanics

[JHTruth]

Well I don't think there's any signs at all pointing towards us moving up to take Haliburton or we would have heard of them.

That said, if Ainge sees a player he is certain could be a starter for us and wants to trade up to get him, that also works in my take the long view hopes.

We have to build for a team with the future of Tatum and Brown as the stars. They are both perhaps the best 3 and D guys in the league and Tatum can do a lot on the ball too.

But basically Tatum and Brown both thrive off ball, if you find a stud PG than that's perfect for them.

Lots of smoke in the first draft thread. Were coming out with Hali and Bane

Awesome!

Sorry I missed it.

I'm not sure if I love Hali because again that's someone playing with a bit of a disadvantage athletically, but I do truly think Tatum and Brown are some of the best 3 and D guards in the entire NBA and Smart is your classic 3 and D guard on a championship contender.

If you can give me someone who can do enough to be a threat on all 3 levels and set the table up for them... like again all of our core young pieces go into superstar mode playing off the ball.

Basically with Haliburton if he can develop into a 6'5" 190 lb Gordon Dragic so we can switch on defense with him... that would be amazing and I'd be fully down for that and it fits in perfectly with our 3 young guys of talent on the roster.

As for Bane, no one can knock his roleplaying potential. We need shooting in the lineup, and we may end up finding we have more shooting than we know what to do with if again a player like Haliburton is legit and gets Brown, Tatum, Smart consistent open 3s.

I wonder if Ainge is looking at it and says okay with Tatum I got the scoring I usually get from Kemba or an IT so I can afford to get a more defensive switchy PG that just sets the table up.

Hali.is also the premier PnR passer in college basketball in some time. Imagine him with a roll man with the finishing ability of Time lord. Opens up everything in our offense..

[playa-hater]

https://nbadraftroom.com/p/2020-nba-mock-draft/

New mock by draftroom.

#14: R.J Hampton
#26: Zeke Nnaji
#30: Elijah Hughes

Ainge probably loving this mock draft. Another combo guard as your top pick. A guard who looks Westbrook light without the defense. If he fixes his shot he could be a solid NBA player, not a fan of his defensive game. If not for his defensive issues, i would've said that this guy is hands down the biggest sleeper in the draft.

for the record, I want my wing forwards at 14 for a multitude of reasons, BUT I would be OK in drafting RJ.. reasons being his is a very athletic tall PG who can probably switch seamlessly. I hate little PGs and small lineups, so if I can not get my all important wing, than give me a tall athletic PG who won't dominate the ball (I hope) with some really nice upside.

[playa-hater]

would like to add that if Boston does trade up, I hope it's pick 26+30 and/or 2nd to get another teen area draft pick..

[playa-hater]

Who of these 2nd tier PGs would you want Boston to take if available.

Kira Lewis - 6'3 said to be the fastest, with good on ball defense, creating and shooting..

Cole Anthony - 6'3 - perhaps the best scorer and former Top talent who had a underwhelming year of college.

3 - R J Hampton - 6'5 known for his height speed combination. Is said to be good at everything but not special at anything.

4 Tyler Terry - 6'2 - is or should be considered the best shooting PG in the class. Probably the weakest of this 4 on defense.

rank them if you want.

[mdemers938]

I think Obi Toppin could be the best player in this draft.

[celticfan42487]

Very important weakness of those prospects to consider and it's why this draft is consider poor.

- Well RJ Hampton has a major weakness of shooting so let's not undersell that. He was also horrible last year playing in a professional league.

- Lewis is 165lbs with a frame that can't add much more weight so that's a concern for his defense. (Trae Young is 15 lbs heavier than him for reference, Cole Anthony is 25 lbs heavier than him)

- And you double down with Tyler Terry being 160 lbs. Who as a small PG Carsen Edwards is 40 lbs heavier than.

- Cole Anthony will never overwhelm you with his defense, but he plays hard and smart and has the weight to hang in switches. That's why on his profile for The Ringer they have off ball and on ball defense as a plus for him.

But yeah I think it's important for people to consider when they're ranking those players Tyler Terry, and Kira Lewis are popcorn chicken for even someone like Jaylen Brown on a switch and ISO. And Cole Anthony may be too but that's uncertain. Of them only RJ Hampton has the body and athleticism to maybe not be picked on in the playoffs...but he showed no awareness of how to play last year in a professional league and we can look at Rob Williams being subbed off for Grant Williams for defensive purposes to see just how much not knowing how to play defense can negate a better body. RJ Hampton could continue to be absolute **** on defense like he showed last year for the rest of his career but he theoretically has the body and athleticism to be good there.

In the end... mass matters. And ideally you don't want a player less than 190 on the court if you want them to be able to defend in switches. On a team full of Ainge draft picks there's only one player in the rotation less than 190 lbs and his name is Kemba Walker who is 185 lbs. You need the mass to not be pushed around in today's endless pick and roll game and if you're in a situatio with a guy that will always be like Tatum and free pushing you at an angel... you just need to be able to take hits to at least guide your man to the help defense or it's endless free layups.

Because of things like this and my belief of you need to be able to score on all 3 levels to playmake in the NBA or the defense can just play you into your weakness no matter how much skill or genetic gifts you have (hi half court Ben Simmons). Killian Hayes is the only PG in this draft I'd ever consider trading up for. But if you're a LaMelo Ball believer and think he can develop his 3 level scoring ability then go for it, I'm certain he won't and at best is another Lonzo who has been forced to not play PG because he can't score on all 3 levels ( 3 point shot, stop and pop mid range shot, drive to the hoop with ease level).

[Duke4life831]

Who of these 2nd tier PGs would you want Boston to take if available.

Kira Lewis - 6'3 said to be the fastest, with good on ball defense, creating and shooting..

Cole Anthony - 6'3 - perhaps the best scorer and former Top talent who had a underwhelming year of college.

3 - R J Hampton - 6'5 known for his height speed combination. Is said to be good at everything but not special at anything.

4 Tyler Terry - 6'2 - is or should be considered the best shooting PG in the class. Probably the weakest of this 4 on defense.

rank them if you want.

1. Terry:

Pros: He is a guy that ideally if everything pans out, you can plug him alongside Tatum and Brown and he will be money. Truly is a sharpshooter. Might take a year or 2 to get to the level of a sharpshooter on the NBA level, will need some small tweaks to consistently get his shot off against NBA defenders. Underrated amount of wiggle with the ball in his hands. Not necessarily a guy that can get to the basket at will, but can create space on the perimeter pretty damn well.

Cons: Is pretty damn small and not an A+ athlete. Not the best facilitator and wasnt a great defender on the college level. Could see him getting abused defensively and if that shot doesnt fall consistently, could just be another tiny 6 foot shooter who does nothing else (G League is filled with those guys).

2. Lewis:
Pros: Extremely quick. Solid shooting numbers, solid form on his jumper, solid facilitator. Should have good potential as a 1-2 defender.

Cons: Skinny as can be and doubt he ever becomes a versatile defender because of this and solid size but not great size. Solid for on his jumper but very inconsistent with it. More of a combo guard than PG at the moment. So not the ideal fit to go alongside Tatum/Brown

3. RJ:
Pros: High potential combo guard. Has all the tools you want in the combo guard. The shooting numbers arent there yet but has solid form with his jumper, nothing broken about it. Good size as well.

Cons: I think is a horrible fit alongside Tatum/Brown. Is a pretty ball dominant player, while he is a solid passer, he is a score first kind of guy. He looked really bad in Australia last year, really didnt do much well except look athletic. He has a ways to go and no guarantee he gets there.

4. Cole:
Pros: If youre looking for a guy that might be the next Jamal Murray Cole is your guy (in a smaller body). Cole's shooting was very inconsistent, but I think that has more to do with just adjusting to the size and speed of college. He will need an adjustment time in the NBA as well, but the dude was a lights out shooter in high school and can see that returning. When he is on, boy is he on. Can light you up wherever on the court.

Cons: He is a small 6'2 score first combo guard. If his shot isnt falling, what does he bring to the table? Very poor fit alongside Tatum/Brown. Was a very poor finisher at the rim in college, can be a solid passer but is far from a natural facilitator and turns it over a lot. How long will it take for him to adjust his jumper to the NBA level and will it ever be consistent?

[Floody100]

Who of these 2nd tier PGs would you want Boston to take if available.

Kira Lewis - 6'3 said to be the fastest, with good on ball defense, creating and shooting..

Cole Anthony - 6'3 - perhaps the best scorer and former Top talent who had a underwhelming year of college.

3 - R J Hampton - 6'5 known for his height speed combination. Is said to be good at everything but not special at anything.

4 Tyler Terry - 6'2 - is or should be considered the best shooting PG in the class. Probably the weakest of this 4 on defense.

rank them if you want.

1. Terry:

Pros: He is a guy that ideally if everything pans out, you can plug him alongside Tatum and Brown and he will be money. Truly is a sharpshooter. Might take a year or 2 to get to the level of a sharpshooter on the NBA level, will need some small tweaks to consistently get his shot off against NBA defenders. Underrated amount of wiggle with the ball in his hands. Not necessarily a guy that can get to the basket at will, but can create space on the perimeter pretty damn well.

Cons: Is pretty damn small and not an A+ athlete. Not the best facilitator and wasnt a great defender on the college level. Could see him getting abused defensively and if that shot doesnt fall consistently, could just be another tiny 6 foot shooter who does nothing else (G League is filled with those guys).

2. Lewis:
Pros: Extremely quick. Solid shooting numbers, solid form on his jumper, solid facilitator. Should have good potential as a 1-2 defender.

Cons: Skinny as can be and doubt he ever becomes a versatile defender because of this and solid size but not great size. Solid for on his jumper but very inconsistent with it. More of a combo guard than PG at the moment. So not the ideal fit to go alongside Tatum/Brown

3. RJ:
Pros: High potential combo guard. Has all the tools you want in the combo guard. The shooting numbers arent there yet but has solid form with his jumper, nothing broken about it. Good size as well.

Cons: I think is a horrible fit alongside Tatum/Brown. Is a pretty ball dominant player, while he is a solid passer, he is a score first kind of guy. He looked really bad in Australia last year, really didnt do much well except look athletic. He has a ways to go and no guarantee he gets there.

4. Cole:
Pros: If youre looking for a guy that might be the next Jamal Murray Cole is your guy (in a smaller body). Cole's shooting was very inconsistent, but I think that has more to do with just adjusting to the size and speed of college. He will need an adjustment time in the NBA as well, but the dude was a lights out shooter in high school and can see that returning. When he is on, boy is he on. Can light you up wherever on the court.

Cons: He is a small 6'2 score first combo guard. If his shot isnt falling, what does he bring to the table? Very poor fit alongside Tatum/Brown. Was a very poor finisher at the rim in college, can be a solid passer but is far from a natural facilitator and turns it over a lot. How long will it take for him to adjust his jumper to the NBA level and will it ever be consistent?

This is why we should be drafting Tre Jones.
Instead of taking one of these guys at 14 we can probably get him with the 30th pick.

[threrf23]

Who of these 2nd tier PGs would you want Boston to take if available.

Kira Lewis - 6'3 said to be the fastest, with good on ball defense, creating and shooting..

Cole Anthony - 6'3 - perhaps the best scorer and former Top talent who had a underwhelming year of college.

3 - R J Hampton - 6'5 known for his height speed combination. Is said to be good at everything but not special at anything.

4 Tyler Terry - 6'2 - is or should be considered the best shooting PG in the class. Probably the weakest of this 4 on defense.

rank them if you want.

I'm taking Markus Howard over any of these guys if I can, b/c from an analytical perspective, he seems almost a lock to become one of the greatest three point shooters in NBA history. To me, that in and of itself gives him a high floor as far as his value is concerned.

I'm not really for or against the guys above. Terry sounds to me like the best PG of the bunch, but given his age and build and the fact that PGs often take time to develop, I'm not sure if he contributes much on his rookie deal. If I had to rank them, I think I'd go RJ Hampton first based on his apparent upside, Cole Anthony last b/c I think he kinda fits the profile of a bust, toss up between Lewis and Terry.

[Duke4life831]

Who of these 2nd tier PGs would you want Boston to take if available.

Kira Lewis - 6'3 said to be the fastest, with good on ball defense, creating and shooting..

Cole Anthony - 6'3 - perhaps the best scorer and former Top talent who had a underwhelming year of college.

3 - R J Hampton - 6'5 known for his height speed combination. Is said to be good at everything but not special at anything.

4 Tyler Terry - 6'2 - is or should be considered the best shooting PG in the class. Probably the weakest of this 4 on defense.

rank them if you want.

1. Terry:

Pros: He is a guy that ideally if everything pans out, you can plug him alongside Tatum and Brown and he will be money. Truly is a sharpshooter. Might take a year or 2 to get to the level of a sharpshooter on the NBA level, will need some small tweaks to consistently get his shot off against NBA defenders. Underrated amount of wiggle with the ball in his hands. Not necessarily a guy that can get to the basket at will, but can create space on the perimeter pretty damn well.

Cons: Is pretty damn small and not an A+ athlete. Not the best facilitator and wasnt a great defender on the college level. Could see him getting abused defensively and if that shot doesnt fall consistently, could just be another tiny 6 foot shooter who does nothing else (G League is filled with those guys).

2. Lewis:
Pros: Extremely quick. Solid shooting numbers, solid form on his jumper, solid facilitator. Should have good potential as a 1-2 defender.

Cons: Skinny as can be and doubt he ever becomes a versatile defender because of this and solid size but not great size. Solid for on his jumper but very inconsistent with it. More of a combo guard than PG at the moment. So not the ideal fit to go alongside Tatum/Brown

3. RJ:
Pros: High potential combo guard. Has all the tools you want in the combo guard. The shooting numbers arent there yet but has solid form with his jumper, nothing broken about it. Good size as well.

Cons: I think is a horrible fit alongside Tatum/Brown. Is a pretty ball dominant player, while he is a solid passer, he is a score first kind of guy. He looked really bad in Australia last year, really didnt do much well except look athletic. He has a ways to go and no guarantee he gets there.

4. Cole:
Pros: If youre looking for a guy that might be the next Jamal Murray Cole is your guy (in a smaller body). Cole's shooting was very inconsistent, but I think that has more to do with just adjusting to the size and speed of college. He will need an adjustment time in the NBA as well, but the dude was a lights out shooter in high school and can see that returning. When he is on, boy is he on. Can light you up wherever on the court.

Cons: He is a small 6'2 score first combo guard. If his shot isnt falling, what does he bring to the table? Very poor fit alongside Tatum/Brown. Was a very poor finisher at the rim in college, can be a solid passer but is far from a natural facilitator and turns it over a lot. How long will it take for him to adjust his jumper to the NBA level and will it ever be consistent?

This is why we should be drafting Tre Jones.
Instead of taking one of these guys at 14 we can probably get him with the 30th pick.

I agree. Im definitely biased towards Tre, but I do think he is a good fit long term if he can get that shot to fall. Ive said many times in this thread the 14th pick I would be looking to grab a wing, then with one of the later picks I would use to grab a PG. Whether that be Tre or Nico. Two pass first PGs, Nico the more ready scoring wise, while Tre the more ready defensive guy. I think worst case scenario Tre becomes Tyus. Tyus shot has been inconsistent in the NBA (was good this year), but even with an inconsistent jumper, Tyus is one of the best backup PGs in the NBA. And if Tyus can keep his 3pt % around that 38% mark like he did this year, he would be an ideal PG to pair alongside Tatum/Brown.

Tre's shot is further behind Tyus coming out of Duke, but Tre's defense is far ahead of Tyus at the same time. I think worst case scenario with Tre, you get a damn good backup PG. If that jumper ever comes around, youre looking at the perfect starting PG to go alongside Tatum/Brown. Basically just look at Duke's offense 2 years ago, when Tre was running the show alongside Barrett and Zion. Tre didnt need to dominate the ball to run that offense perfectly. I do think Tre if he gets on the court enough, can be an all defense caliber defender. He maybe limited to 1s and 2s because of his size, but his on ball defense is freaking insane.

[Duke4life831]

Who of these 2nd tier PGs would you want Boston to take if available.

Kira Lewis - 6'3 said to be the fastest, with good on ball defense, creating and shooting..

Cole Anthony - 6'3 - perhaps the best scorer and former Top talent who had a underwhelming year of college.

3 - R J Hampton - 6'5 known for his height speed combination. Is said to be good at everything but not special at anything.

4 Tyler Terry - 6'2 - is or should be considered the best shooting PG in the class. Probably the weakest of this 4 on defense.

rank them if you want.

I'm taking Markus Howard over any of these guys if I can, b/c from an analytical perspective, he seems almost a lock to become one of the greatest three point shooters in NBA history. To me, that in and of itself gives him a high floor as far as his value is concerned.

I'm not really for or against the guys above. Terry sounds to me like the best PG of the bunch, but given his age and build and the fact that PGs often take time to develop, I'm not sure if he contributes much on his rookie deal. If I had to rank them, I think I'd go RJ Hampton first based on his apparent upside, Cole Anthony last b/c I think he kinda fits the profile of a bust, toss up between Lewis and Terry.

Im a huge Markus Howard fan. Most likely can get Howard late 2nd in this draft or wouldnt even be shocked if he goes undrafted. He is just so small and doesnt do anything else either than score. I actually like Howard more in the NBA than Carsen Edwards. Edwards is the stronger and more athletic guy, but Howard is an elite shooter. Id take his smaller size but elite shooting over Edwards strength and athleticism.

[threrf23]

Im a huge Markus Howard fan. Most likely can get Howard late 2nd in this draft or wouldnt even be shocked if he goes undrafted. He is just so small and doesnt do anything else either than score. I actually like Howard more in the NBA than Carsen Edwards. Edwards is the stronger and more athletic guy, but Howard is an elite shooter. Id take his smaller size but elite shooting over Edwards strength and athleticism.

Yeah - Edwards was a streaky shooter in college much more than an elite shooter (or scorer), and he had benefitted from his strength and athleticism.

Howard, as a skinny 17 y/o freshman playing for Marquette, shot 82/150 from three, that represented 55% on nearly 9 attempts per 40.

Three straight seasons thereafter - he was above 40% and above 10 attempts per 40 each season - as a skinny kid serving as a primary scoring option in a good conference. Through four years of college, he averaged 21.6 points per game and 28.7 pts per 40.

And this was all before he turned 21 in March. Four year senior, but is younger than several sophomores.

[Duke4life831]

Im a huge Markus Howard fan. Most likely can get Howard late 2nd in this draft or wouldnt even be shocked if he goes undrafted. He is just so small and doesnt do anything else either than score. I actually like Howard more in the NBA than Carsen Edwards. Edwards is the stronger and more athletic guy, but Howard is an elite shooter. Id take his smaller size but elite shooting over Edwards strength and athleticism.

Yeah - Edwards was a streaky shooter in college much more than an elite shooter (or scorer), and he had benefitted from his strength and athleticism.

Howard, as a skinny 17 y/o freshman playing for Marquette, shot 82/150 from three, that represented 55% on nearly 9 attempts per 40.

Three straight seasons thereafter - he was above 40% and above 10 attempts per 40 each season - as a skinny kid serving as a primary scoring option in a good conference. Through four years of college, he averaged 21.6 points per game and 28.7 pts per 40.

And this was all before he turned 21 in March. Four year senior, but is younger than several sophomores.

Ya and the vast majority of those 3s were off the dribble. I believe Synergy had him as the 2nd best spot up shooter in all of college ball last year. His jumper is also elite off the dribble as well. He is also a career 88% FT shooter with 3 seasons at or above 89% and one at 94%. He runs into problems with his shot selection and complete lack of facilitating, that mixed with his 5'11 frame, not a good mix.

But ya screw all that, Id take him in a heartbeat with any 2nd round pick this year, with the hope that my coach can get him to buy into being an elite catch and shoot shooter. Then once he gets his footing doing that, then down the road implement his handle to be able to attack guys running out on him.

[Floody100]

Im a huge Markus Howard fan. Most likely can get Howard late 2nd in this draft or wouldnt even be shocked if he goes undrafted. He is just so small and doesnt do anything else either than score. I actually like Howard more in the NBA than Carsen Edwards. Edwards is the stronger and more athletic guy, but Howard is an elite shooter. Id take his smaller size but elite shooting over Edwards strength and athleticism.

Yeah - Edwards was a streaky shooter in college much more than an elite shooter (or scorer), and he had benefitted from his strength and athleticism.

Howard, as a skinny 17 y/o freshman playing for Marquette, shot 82/150 from three, that represented 55% on nearly 9 attempts per 40.

Three straight seasons thereafter - he was above 40% and above 10 attempts per 40 each season - as a skinny kid serving as a primary scoring option in a good conference. Through four years of college, he averaged 21.6 points per game and 28.7 pts per 40.

And this was all before he turned 21 in March. Four year senior, but is younger than several sophomores.

Ya and the vast majority of those 3s were off the dribble. I believe Synergy had him as the 2nd best spot up shooter in all of college ball last year. His jumper is also elite off the dribble as well. He is also a career 88% FT shooter with 3 seasons at or above 89% and one at 94%. He runs into problems with his shot selection and complete lack of facilitating, that mixed with his 5'11 frame, not a good mix.

But ya screw all that, Id take him in a heartbeat with any 2nd round pick this year, with the hope that my coach can get him to buy into being an elite catch and shoot shooter. Then once he gets his footing doing that, then down the road implement his handle to be able to attack guys running out on him.

I’d happily take him with our #47 pick if he’s still there.

[flintsky21]

Since 2010, only 4 point guards were drafted in the late lottery or 10 to 14 range, and it's not a very good group.

Michael Carter-Williams
Kendall Marshall
Cameron Payne
Elfriid Payton

PGs are usually taken higher when they're projected to be starters immediately, while those projected to be backups are drafted in the 20s.

[100proof]

Who of these 2nd tier PGs would you want Boston to take if available.

Kira Lewis - 6'3 said to be the fastest, with good on ball defense, creating and shooting..

Cole Anthony - 6'3 - perhaps the best scorer and former Top talent who had a underwhelming year of college.

3 - R J Hampton - 6'5 known for his height speed combination. Is said to be good at everything but not special at anything.

4 Tyler Terry - 6'2 - is or should be considered the best shooting PG in the class. Probably the weakest of this 4 on defense.

rank them if you want.

I'm taking Markus Howard over any of these guys if I can, b/c from an analytical perspective, he seems almost a lock to become one of the greatest three point shooters in NBA history. To me, that in and of itself gives him a high floor as far as his value is concerned.

I'm not really for or against the guys above. Terry sounds to me like the best PG of the bunch, but given his age and build and the fact that PGs often take time to develop, I'm not sure if he contributes much on his rookie deal. If I had to rank them, I think I'd go RJ Hampton first based on his apparent upside, Cole Anthony last b/c I think he kinda fits the profile of a bust, toss up between Lewis and Terry.

Im a huge Markus Howard fan. Most likely can get Howard late 2nd in this draft or wouldnt even be shocked if he goes undrafted. He is just so small and doesnt do anything else either than score. I actually like Howard more in the NBA than Carsen Edwards. Edwards is the stronger and more athletic guy, but Howard is an elite shooter. Id take his smaller size but elite shooting over Edwards strength and athleticism.

If I am looking at shooting, I am looking at Isaiah Joe.