What has Jordan achieved without Pippen?

[Jkam31]

Pippen was the backbone of their defense and main facilitator/playcaller on offense. You could probably win a similar number of rings if you replaced him with someone like Reggie Miller, but that speaks more to how damn stacked the Bulls were considering their first, second, third, and fourth options were always better than their opponents respective first, second, third and fourth options. They had guys who were overqualified for the roles they played, not overmatched guys like Tyler Herro or something

Herro wouldn’t be in that role if Dragic/Bam were playing bulls win 6 rings with Reggie Miller wtf probably even more cause he’d resign after the 98 season

[twyzted]

https://www.cbssports.com/nba/news/dennis-rodman-considered-scottie-pippen-best-player-in-the-world-during-michael-jordans-baseball-hiatus/

I think Dennis Rodman point of view is greater than any of us here.

Out of the players I mentioned, which ones was he better than

post 91 Magic For sure he aint 80s Magic.
Shaq was a Pup. He wasn't Lakers Shaq.

But I would Put Pippen in the same Breath as those guys.
When MJ Left, he was absolutely top 5 player in the league.
But for shi and giggles, let's say you're right and go with your top 10. If you want Top 15, but I bet you can't name 10 players or 15 players better than Pip during those times.

I thought MJ did it all by himself?
But he had top 10 Player with him the whole Ride? Well I'll be damned.

Post 91 magic you know he retired in the off season in 1991?

[TheGOATRises007]

These threads are embarrassing.

[LesGrossman]

Its the trademark argument of 15 y/o fanboy posters to believe they can use Scottie Pippen as something in an argument against MJ. Conveniently overlooking that MJ made Scottie. Scottie is an extention of Michael Jordan, because he was formed into the brilliant player he became by...MJ. Who has LeBron ever helped to become relevant? Delonte West?

Also, we not gonna mention that OP has registered 3 days ago and lost no time to create posts of this quality? To be totally honest i think this guy is a leBron hater who just set up this account to create threads that make Bron Fans look like idiots.

[jerok]

Out of the players I mentioned, which ones was he better than

post 91 Magic For sure he aint 80s Magic.
Shaq was a Pup. He wasn't Lakers Shaq.

But I would Put Pippen in the same Breath as those guys.
When MJ Left, he was absolutely top 5 player in the league.
But for shi and giggles, let's say you're right and go with your top 10. If you want Top 15, but I bet you can't name 10 players or 15 players better than Pip during those times.

I thought MJ did it all by himself?
But he had top 10 Player with him the whole Ride? Well I'll be damned.

Moving the goal post from MJ was playing with a top 5 player to Scottie was a top 5 player when MJ retired?

By the time MJ retired the first time, Shaq was already better than Pippen. He led the Magic to a Finals run during that time.

So I’ll ask again, who are the 5 players on that list that Pippen is better than? He’s not better than Shaq, D-Rob, Barkley, Malone, Hakeem or Ewing. Could even throw in Penny, Gary Payton and Grant Hill as comparable players in certain years.

When MJ retired, Pip showed what he can do. That's the guy MJ had the whole ride Pre and Post retirement.

He's better than all besides, D-Rob, Hakeem, Malone, MJ.

https://ca.nba.com/news/power-rankings-the-best-players-from-the-1990s/mu5pb494xop81wfdvi7yp5yrj
For some insight.

Obviously this is 1990s, Shaq is better if you include 2000s. Magic is better if you include 80's no question.

Like I said, Pros (Rodman), Experts/Media (Nba.com) thoughts/opinions weigh more than us average Joes.
If you can prove that the Other players you mentioned are better than Pippen, I'd like to see it. I'll wait.
But if you can't that is fine, it is your opinion, but I will side with Rodman on this one.

[jerok]

Out of the players I mentioned, which ones was he better than

post 91 Magic For sure he aint 80s Magic.
Shaq was a Pup. He wasn't Lakers Shaq.

But I would Put Pippen in the same Breath as those guys.
When MJ Left, he was absolutely top 5 player in the league.
But for shi and giggles, let's say you're right and go with your top 10. If you want Top 15, but I bet you can't name 10 players or 15 players better than Pip during those times.

I thought MJ did it all by himself?
But he had top 10 Player with him the whole Ride? Well I'll be damned.

Post 91 magic you know he retired in the off season in 1991?

Yeah and Pippen was better than him in 91, and when he came back briefly few years later.

[Shanghai Kid]

post 91 Magic For sure he aint 80s Magic.
Shaq was a Pup. He wasn't Lakers Shaq.

But I would Put Pippen in the same Breath as those guys.
When MJ Left, he was absolutely top 5 player in the league.
But for shi and giggles, let's say you're right and go with your top 10. If you want Top 15, but I bet you can't name 10 players or 15 players better than Pip during those times.

I thought MJ did it all by himself?
But he had top 10 Player with him the whole Ride? Well I'll be damned.

Post 91 magic you know he retired in the off season in 1991?

Yeah and Pippen was better than him in 91, and when he came back briefly few years later.

....Pippen was better than 91 Magic?

[bronxknicksfan1]

post 91 Magic For sure he aint 80s Magic.
Shaq was a Pup. He wasn't Lakers Shaq.

But I would Put Pippen in the same Breath as those guys.
When MJ Left, he was absolutely top 5 player in the league.
But for shi and giggles, let's say you're right and go with your top 10. If you want Top 15, but I bet you can't name 10 players or 15 players better than Pip during those times.

I thought MJ did it all by himself?
But he had top 10 Player with him the whole Ride? Well I'll be damned.

Moving the goal post from MJ was playing with a top 5 player to Scottie was a top 5 player when MJ retired?

By the time MJ retired the first time, Shaq was already better than Pippen. He led the Magic to a Finals run during that time.

So I’ll ask again, who are the 5 players on that list that Pippen is better than? He’s not better than Shaq, D-Rob, Barkley, Malone, Hakeem or Ewing. Could even throw in Penny, Gary Payton and Grant Hill as comparable players in certain years.

When MJ retired, Pip showed what he can do. That's the guy MJ had the whole ride Pre and Post retirement.

He's better than all besides, D-Rob, Hakeem, Malone, MJ.

https://ca.nba.com/news/power-rankings-the-best-players-from-the-1990s/mu5pb494xop81wfdvi7yp5yrj
For some insight.

Obviously this is 1990s, Shaq is better if you include 2000s. Magic is better if you include 80's no question.

Like I said, Pros (Rodman), Experts/Media (Nba.com) thoughts/opinions weigh more than us average Joes.
If you can prove that the Other players you mentioned are better than Pippen, I'd like to see it. I'll wait.
But if you can't that is fine, it is your opinion, but I will side with Rodman on this one.

You continue to point to articles and what person x says. Develop an opinion of your own.

Shaq, Ewing and Payton led their teams further than Pippen ever did on his own.

Pippen was outplayed by Shaq and Penny in that 95 series.

[jerok]

Moving the goal post from MJ was playing with a top 5 player to Scottie was a top 5 player when MJ retired?

By the time MJ retired the first time, Shaq was already better than Pippen. He led the Magic to a Finals run during that time.

So I’ll ask again, who are the 5 players on that list that Pippen is better than? He’s not better than Shaq, D-Rob, Barkley, Malone, Hakeem or Ewing. Could even throw in Penny, Gary Payton and Grant Hill as comparable players in certain years.

When MJ retired, Pip showed what he can do. That's the guy MJ had the whole ride Pre and Post retirement.

He's better than all besides, D-Rob, Hakeem, Malone, MJ.

https://ca.nba.com/news/power-rankings-the-best-players-from-the-1990s/mu5pb494xop81wfdvi7yp5yrj
For some insight.

Obviously this is 1990s, Shaq is better if you include 2000s. Magic is better if you include 80's no question.

Like I said, Pros (Rodman), Experts/Media (Nba.com) thoughts/opinions weigh more than us average Joes.
If you can prove that the Other players you mentioned are better than Pippen, I'd like to see it. I'll wait.
But if you can't that is fine, it is your opinion, but I will side with Rodman on this one.

You continue to point to articles and what person x says. Develop an opinion of your own.

Shaq, Ewing and Payton led their teams further than Pippen ever did on his own.

Pippen was outplayed by Shaq and Penny in that 95 series.

It's the basis of my opinion, he was top 5! That's what we started arguing with didn't we?
Sometimes you have to back it up, and I did.

You have your opinion, but can't really prove it. But I respect it.

I believe Pippen the most disrespected Star ever, he doesn't get any credit, it is always MJ.
But people forget how bad ass he was.

[bronxknicksfan1]

When MJ retired, Pip showed what he can do. That's the guy MJ had the whole ride Pre and Post retirement.

He's better than all besides, D-Rob, Hakeem, Malone, MJ.

https://ca.nba.com/news/power-rankings-the-best-players-from-the-1990s/mu5pb494xop81wfdvi7yp5yrj
For some insight.

Obviously this is 1990s, Shaq is better if you include 2000s. Magic is better if you include 80's no question.

Like I said, Pros (Rodman), Experts/Media (Nba.com) thoughts/opinions weigh more than us average Joes.
If you can prove that the Other players you mentioned are better than Pippen, I'd like to see it. I'll wait.
But if you can't that is fine, it is your opinion, but I will side with Rodman on this one.

You continue to point to articles and what person x says. Develop an opinion of your own.

Shaq, Ewing and Payton led their teams further than Pippen ever did on his own.

Pippen was outplayed by Shaq and Penny in that 95 series.

It's the basis of my opinion, he was top 5! That's what we started arguing with didn't we?
Sometimes you have to back it up, and I did.

You have your opinion, but can't really prove it. But I respect it.

I believe Pippen the most disrespected Star ever, he doesn't get any credit, it is always MJ.
But people forget how bad ass he was.

No, I’ve been proving my point. Haven’t even brought stats into it yet. You’re just saying Pippen is top 5 while ignoring the players that were clearly better.

And no one is saying Pippen wasn’t a star or wasn’t crucial for the 6 chips, but you’re propping him up to make it seem like MJ wasn’t the main reason the Bulls were as good as they were.

[jerok]

Post 91 magic you know he retired in the off season in 1991?

Yeah and Pippen was better than him in 91, and when he came back briefly few years later.

....Pippen was better than 91 Magic?

Remember when MJ was getting cooked by Magic's trip dub in game 1 Lakers win.
Then Pippen took over the rest of the way and full court press the hell out of Magic and Bulls won 4 straight.
Ya that Pippen.

[jerok]

You continue to point to articles and what person x says. Develop an opinion of your own.

Shaq, Ewing and Payton led their teams further than Pippen ever did on his own.

Pippen was outplayed by Shaq and Penny in that 95 series.

It's the basis of my opinion, he was top 5! That's what we started arguing with didn't we?
Sometimes you have to back it up, and I did.

You have your opinion, but can't really prove it. But I respect it.

I believe Pippen the most disrespected Star ever, he doesn't get any credit, it is always MJ.
But people forget how bad ass he was.

No, I’ve been proving my point. Haven’t even brought stats into it yet. You’re just saying Pippen is top 5 while ignoring the players that were clearly better.

And no one is saying Pippen wasn’t a star or wasn’t crucial for the 6 chips, but you’re propping him up to make it seem like MJ wasn’t the main reason the Bulls were as good as they were.

Don't need to bring up stats, just go to that link I sent you the experts did all the advanced stuff for you already.
Pippen is top 5.

I'm not propping him up, he was just that good man, stop disrespecting him and bringing him down.
MJ was obviously the best player. But this goes back to what the OP said,what has MJ done without Pippen?

[bronxknicksfan1]

It's the basis of my opinion, he was top 5! That's what we started arguing with didn't we?
Sometimes you have to back it up, and I did.

You have your opinion, but can't really prove it. But I respect it.

I believe Pippen the most disrespected Star ever, he doesn't get any credit, it is always MJ.
But people forget how bad ass he was.

No, I’ve been proving my point. Haven’t even brought stats into it yet. You’re just saying Pippen is top 5 while ignoring the players that were clearly better.

And no one is saying Pippen wasn’t a star or wasn’t crucial for the 6 chips, but you’re propping him up to make it seem like MJ wasn’t the main reason the Bulls were as good as they were.

Don't need to bring up stats, just go to that link I sent you the experts did all the advanced stuff for you already.
Pippen is top 5.

I'm not propping him up, he was just that good man, stop disrespecting him and bringing him down.
MJ was obviously the best player. But this goes back to what the OP said,what has MJ done without Pippen?

The “experts” didn’t do anything advanced or go deep into stats at all. If they did, Ewing, Barkley and Shaq are easily ranked above him.

But I’ll refrain from continuing this argument.

[themoneyteam2]

Yeah and Pippen was better than him in 91, and when he came back briefly few years later.

....Pippen was better than 91 Magic?

Remember when MJ was getting cooked by Magic's trip dub in game 1 Lakers win.
Then Pippen took over the rest of the way and full court press the hell out of Magic and Bulls won 4 straight.
Ya that Pippen.

Kind of like what’s happening this series with AD getting the Butler assignment in game 4 after Jimmy just put a 40 point triple double on 70% FG on LeBron’s head the prior game?

[MarcusBrody]

....Pippen was better than 91 Magic?

Remember when MJ was getting cooked by Magic's trip dub in game 1 Lakers win.
Then Pippen took over the rest of the way and full court press the hell out of Magic and Bulls won 4 straight.
Ya that Pippen.

Kind of like what’s happening this series with AD getting the Butler assignment in game 4 after Jimmy just put a 40 point triple double on 70% FG on LeBron’s head the prior game?

Nope not really at all similar. The change in defense on Butler was tactical, with the Lakers deciding to go way under the screens. Once they started that, both players played pretty successful defense on Butler, though Davis's end of the game defense was particularly good.

Edit:
I couldn't break it out by games, but according to NBA.com's player tracking software Lebron has guarded Jimmy for 61.1 partial possessions and given up 19 points. Davis has guarded him for 42.7 possessions and given up 17 points. Jimmy had 9 assists against Lebron vs. 6 coming when guarded by Davis. He had three turnovers against both. I don't at all contest that Davis's second half was the best defense Jimmy faced, but both the eye test and the stats back up that the problem previously was that Jimmy was getting Lebron/AD to switch off of him then attacking the other players. When the Lakers strategy changed there, he was much less effective.

[Jables]

Post 91 magic you know he retired in the off season in 1991?

Yeah and Pippen was better than him in 91, and when he came back briefly few years later.

....Pippen was better than 91 Magic?

I love Pippen, but I swear it's like he goes up in the GOAT ranking every year considering his nickname was named after a sidekick. Pretty soon he'll be better than Magic, MJ and LeBron combined.

[jerok]

....Pippen was better than 91 Magic?

Remember when MJ was getting cooked by Magic's trip dub in game 1 Lakers win.
Then Pippen took over the rest of the way and full court press the hell out of Magic and Bulls won 4 straight.
Ya that Pippen.

Kind of like what’s happening this series with AD getting the Butler assignment in game 4 after Jimmy just put a 40 point triple double on 70% FG on LeBron’s head the prior game?

Ya kinda like that.
LeBron got help. Like MJ got help.
But only LeBron gets crucified for it right?

[jerok]

No, I’ve been proving my point. Haven’t even brought stats into it yet. You’re just saying Pippen is top 5 while ignoring the players that were clearly better.

And no one is saying Pippen wasn’t a star or wasn’t crucial for the 6 chips, but you’re propping him up to make it seem like MJ wasn’t the main reason the Bulls were as good as they were.

Don't need to bring up stats, just go to that link I sent you the experts did all the advanced stuff for you already.
Pippen is top 5.

I'm not propping him up, he was just that good man, stop disrespecting him and bringing him down.
MJ was obviously the best player. But this goes back to what the OP said,what has MJ done without Pippen?

The “experts” didn’t do anything advanced or go deep into stats at all. If they did, Ewing, Barkley and Shaq are easily ranked above him.

But I’ll refrain from continuing this argument.

As you should, cause all you been spitting are your opinion.
Not really proving a damn thing. But respect, protect what you believe bro.

[The Rodzilla]

he retired specifically when the pippen contract was up and he was not going to be re-signed by the bulls

so even jordan knew he couldnt do anything without the pippen

[Ugalde]

Remember when MJ was getting cooked by Magic's trip dub in game 1 Lakers win.
Then Pippen took over the rest of the way and full court press the hell out of Magic and Bulls won 4 straight.
Ya that Pippen.

Kind of like what’s happening this series with AD getting the Butler assignment in game 4 after Jimmy just put a 40 point triple double on 70% FG on LeBron’s head the prior game?

Ya kinda like that.
LeBron got help. Like MJ got help.
But only LeBron gets crucified for it right?

mj built and created his help. lebron goes and joins it. if you respect it the same, fine. some people don’t.