2019-2020 College/Draft thread X [marks the spot] (Knicks own #8 pick, 11/18 DRAFT)

[god shammgod]

he's kp now ?!?!? jesus.

[DOT]

he's kp now ?!?!? jesus.

Yeah I mean, he hit like 3 jumpers in college

Basically has AD's face up game.

[thebuzzardman]

he's kp now ?!?!? jesus.

Yeah I mean, he hit like 3 jumpers in college

Basically has AD's face up game.

I like how Wiseman automatically gets KP, Embiid and AD comps.

Why can't he be Marvin Bagley III?

I mean, that guy had a decent amount of college tape, more than 3 games.

[3toheadmelo]

he's kp now ?!?!? jesus.

Yeah I mean, he hit like 3 jumpers in college

Basically has AD's face up game.

I like how Wiseman automatically gets KP, Embiid and AD comps.

Why can't he be Marvin Bagley III?

I mean, that guy had a decent amount of college tape, more than 3 games.

Cause Bagley plays nothing like him. Bagley is incredibly raw on offense while Wiseman has advanced footwork in the mid post, can hit step backs, and a much better handle. Bagley only has a face up jumper and can’t create for himself. Wiseman can create for himself

[thebuzzardman]

Sort of forgotten in the "Mitch Rim Runner" fest is that Mitch skipped college entirely.

Obviously this was of his own doing
If he didn't do this, conversely, he probably wouldn't have lasted to the 2nd round, whereby Knick fans could come to love him, and then, apparently, dislike him.

I wouldn't mind giving him another year or 2, with a real development staff, to see what his final product is.
He might still be "Rim Running Mitch"

But who knows. I might develop a one step drop step, a jump hook and a 12 foot jumper.
And that would be a pretty nice player.
All while being a contributor while he gets there. Or not.

Don't they have another year to sort all this out?
I know there was all this mess over his extension and an issue that he might go, but last I checked, the Knicks have some time.

[thebuzzardman]

Yeah I mean, he hit like 3 jumpers in college

Basically has AD's face up game.

I like how Wiseman automatically gets KP, Embiid and AD comps.

Why can't he be Marvin Bagley III?

I mean, that guy had a decent amount of college tape, more than 3 games.

Cause Bagley plays nothing like him. Bagley is incredibly raw on offense while Wiseman has advanced footwork in the mid post, can hit step backs, and a much better handle. Bagley only has a face up jumper and can’t create for himself. Wiseman can create for himself

Is this off a comparison of their HS mix tapes?

[DOT]

he's kp now ?!?!? jesus.

Yeah I mean, he hit like 3 jumpers in college

Basically has AD's face up game.

I like how Wiseman automatically gets KP, Embiid and AD comps.

Why can't he be Marvin Bagley III?

I mean, that guy had a decent amount of college tape, more than 3 games.

I comped him to Bagley a few pages ago

Someone predictably took offense at the comparison.

[3toheadmelo]

I like how Wiseman automatically gets KP, Embiid and AD comps.

Why can't he be Marvin Bagley III?

I mean, that guy had a decent amount of college tape, more than 3 games.

Cause Bagley plays nothing like him. Bagley is incredibly raw on offense while Wiseman has advanced footwork in the mid post, can hit step backs, and a much better handle. Bagley only has a face up jumper and can’t create for himself. Wiseman can create for himself

Is this off a comparison of their HS mix tapes?

High school games and college. Wiseman was even hitting fadeaways out the post in college like he did all of high school. Bagley never showed that type of footwork ever in college, high school or in the NBA.

[3toheadmelo]

Yeah I mean, he hit like 3 jumpers in college

Basically has AD's face up game.

I like how Wiseman automatically gets KP, Embiid and AD comps.

Why can't he be Marvin Bagley III?

I mean, that guy had a decent amount of college tape, more than 3 games.

I comped him to Bagley a few pages ago

Someone predictably took offense at the comparison.

Cause it’s like comparing Frank to Giannis. It makes no sense.

[thebuzzardman]

Top Wiseman comps:

[thebuzzardman]

he's kp now ?!?!? jesus.

C'mon. You know Wiseman is >>>> Jesus

[jvsimonetti0514]

Wiseman is clearly AD, KP, and Embiid all in one. I mean just look at this touch on this hook shot here.

Read on Twitter

[NoDopeOnSundays]

he's kp now ?!?!? jesus.

You've said Mitch can be used like Giannis, and take exception to the idea that Wiseman can develop into a faceup big?

[3toheadmelo]

Wiseman is clearly AD, KP, and Embiid all in one. I mean just look at this touch on this hook shot here.

Read on Twitter

Yeah he’s an awful player. He averaged 20/11/3. Just terrible. Should go undrafted

[jvsimonetti0514]

Wiseman is clearly AD, KP, and Embiid all in one. I mean just look at this touch on this hook shot here.

Read on Twitter

Yeah he’s an awful player. He averaged 20/11/3. Just terrible. Should go undrafted

I'm sure with competition like UIC and South Carolina state that's a real reflection of what he's stats would be if he played a full season

[finestrg]

Nothing has changed for me -- it's still about building a young foundation. I honestly think that's the right way to go here. All this Chris Paul and Russell Westbrook stuff is absolutely insane, the very definition of "starphuck," and the type of thing we've seen this organization do so many times in the past, to little or no success. Change the plan and build it up young -- lay the foundation and continue to accumulate assets.

FREE AGENCY:

Option 1 -- throw a max at Brandon Ingram on day 1 for FA. He's almost certainly going back to New Orleans, but I'd do it just to see. The guys a star, a clear cut #1 option and at 23-24 years old, he'll be a top player in this league for years to come. Gotta be in it to win it--I'm not expecting him to come here or for NO to be stupid enough to let a talent like that walk out the door, but I think we at least try.

Option 2 -- be prepared to switch gears immediately and offer Christian Wood a near max/max deal. One of the better young bigs in the league, definitely came into his own this season and at 25 years old, he's another guy I'd love to bring in here. Unlike Ingram, he's an UFA so if we show proper love and promise him a big role here, we have a chance. Definitely more realistic than Ingram at least.

Automatic option 3 -- resign Damyean Dotson.

Possible option 4 for additional PG depth if needed -- sign Bryce Cotton. He's a little older to really fit my time line of amassing a roster of guys around 25 or younger but not that old (I believe he's 28 now), but this dude, wherever he's been, has played at a really high level -- all 4 years at Providence, the G League, and recently in Australia in the NBL for the Perth Wildcats, where he's won multiple championships and MVP awards over the last several seasons. He reminds me of Patty Mills a lot, maybe better, but that type of game -- 6'1", very quick, quality shooter/scorer but can run the show too. Always thought this guy was a nice player that has more than enough talent to play in the NBA.

Possible option 5 for SG depth -- sign Issuf Sanon to a contract with a legit chance to make the team/crack the rotation. This dude's talented. Reminds me of John Starks the more tape I look at. At the very least, we need to invite him to summer league and actually play him to see what he can do (I beleive he's had two summer league runs with the Wizards before we acquired him in the Marcus Morris deal, but he barely played).

DRAFT:

#8 -- Saddiq Bey, SF
#27 -- Desmond Bane, SG
#38 -- Payton Pritchard or Grant Riller

Bey might be the best shooter in the draft, right there with Nesmith, Vassell, etc. and he plays both ends. i think this guy plays the right way and can be a big part of the winning team we're trying to build. Automatically he'd be an upgrade at the 3 over what we have there now (and that's assuming Barrett is still at the 2 -- personally, I'd slide Barrett over to 3 and go with a Barrett/Saddiq Bey platoon at SF. That position would be covered for years to come). Like Bey, Bane is undeniably one of the better shooters in this draft. Do I see a star here? Maybe not, but I see a strong, tough SG that will be a solid rotation player here for years to come. We let Trier go and may not bring back Dotson -- we're gonna need to shore up this position. Pritchard vs. Riller at 38 I'm torn about. Again, Pritchard is also one of the better shooters in this draft and is probably the better PG of the two. Riller, meanwhile, can flat out score the ball -- might be pound for pound one of if not the best pure scorers to come out of this draft when it's all said and done. At 38, that's incredible value. Question is can he orchestrate enough and play enough D? They cut Trier loose and Riller has a similar skill set so not sure they would want a player like this but man can he can put the ball in the basket!! You need go-to scorers on your team. I think that skill translates over to the NBA right away day 1 imo.

TRADE ASSETS:
(1) Randle -- if we can find a taker, bring back an expiring contract or two along with a solid young salary-controlled player and/or a pick(s), i think you pull the trigger. Just not for Chris Paul, come on now...
(2) DSJ -- hasn't panned out here at all but he's young and the talent is still there.
(3) Knox -- still very young, he has value. I'm just worried about what I see as a limited ceiling. Heck, Houston supposedly wants him in a package for Chris Paul, right? If we can get Saddiq Bey in this draft, I'm ok dealing Knox.
(4) Bullock -- he can shoot and he's got a very favorable contract, so I think there's value here.
(5) Rights to Louis Labeyrie -- limited value but could be a sweetener.
(6) Rights to Ognjen Jaramaz -- same deal.
(7) Iggy Brazdekis -- There's some talent here but in the end of the day, I think we can go out and find something better for the SF position (Saddiq Bey for instance, along with sliding Barrett over to 3). Iggy has some value though, maybe not as a centerpiece of a deal, but as a solid sweetener/throw in.
(8) Rights to Issuf Sanon -- this kid I really like, the more tape I watch. 6'4" combo guard that checks a lot of boxes. This guy I might actually want to finally bring over and add to the roster/rotation. One of our better trade pieces imo.
(9) Cash -- not sure what the number is to include in a trade, say $3-5mm.

With a combination of a couple of these assets, I'd love to deal ourselves in for a 4th pick in this draft, say in the 20-30 range. I'd love to get either C Daniel Oturu or PF Jalen Smith. I like both as a nice young front court addition, but I think Oturu would be the better option as he can play both 5 and 4 (Smith is strictly a PF). Oturu checks off so many boxes -- quality rebounder (one of this draft's best) that can score inside and out, and block shots. I love the budding shooting ability from distance he showed. Mitch at the 5 with Oturu backing him up or playing next to him at times could present many problems for teams on both ends.

WHAT THE ROTATION COULD LOOK LIKE:

5 - Robinson
4 - Christian Wood (FA) -- would be a QUALITY young front court addition. He'd be a factor on both ends for us. Robinson/Wood/Oturu/Randle would be a real formidable rotation of bigs.
3 - Barrett
2 - Dotson (Resigned FA) -- if you look back on games he's started when he was getting playing time, he had quite a few big first quarters/first halves. I like this kid -- young, quality shooter, plays D and there's no nonsense with him. He could be a solid Raja Bell-type for us. Nothing wrong with that!
1 - Ntilikina -- continue building off the strong finish to the season.
------------------------------------
5 - Daniel Oturu -- i think we have enough assets to acquire a pick in the 20-30 range to use on this guy.
4 - Randle
3 - Saddiq Bey
2 - Desmond Bane (Issuf Sanon?) -- If Sanon, who's developed nicely overseas the past couple of seasons, can be a rotation player for us, maybe I don't go after Bane and use pick 27 on a big like Jalen Smith.
1 - Payton Pritchard (Grant Riller?)
------------------------------------
11 - Bryce Cotton
12 - Taj Gibson

May not win a lot of games at first but at least a nice young foundation would be laid. i think that's got to be step 1 for us.

[NoDopeOnSundays]

Wiseman is clearly AD, KP, and Embiid all in one. I mean just look at this touch on this hook shot here.

Read on Twitter

Yeah he’s an awful player. He averaged 20/11/3. Just terrible. Should go undrafted

I'm sure with competition like UIC and South Carolina state that's a real reflection of what he's stats would be

DeAndre Ayton averaged the same type of numbers through his first 3 games in college against equally bad opponents, if he were in this draft would you be saying to pass on him?

Joel Embiid averaged 9/8 and 3 fouls per game in 18mpg through his first 3 games, you wouldn't even want him with the 27th pick if he were in this draft and was coming out after 3 games.

[Worst_to_First]

I was being sarcastic in my response to Worst to First. It seems like we're looking for the perfect center. Sometimes we should be satisfied with what we got and work with that. Tbh, I'm against all trades to move up.

I think ultimately it just boils down to Wiseman really being that ideal Center for me.

On three games? Melo’s been working on you.

I have been following Wiseman since his HS days even during the time we were discussing the 2019 draft.

It is probably debatable who between 3toheadmelo or me liked Wiseman first. Even 3toheadmelo will attest to this.

[DOT]

The "this player averaged this over three games" is meaningless in comparison cause we had a whole season outside those three games to watch them

We don't have that with Wiseman.

[Manhattan Project]

The "this player averaged this over three games" is meaningless in comparison cause we had a whole season outside those three games to watch them

We don't have that with Wiseman.

I mean... have you seen his Per36?
I don't even mind Wiseman, we have the 8th pick. Da hell is this nonsense, shame on all of you.