OT: COVID-19 Ontario 2nd Wave Thread

[Coach Smiley]

seems to line up with Thanksgiving weekend, hopefully things come back down this week

[13th Man]

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978 today

Maaaan... this is getting crazy. I was hoping things would start turning around slowly and we can reopen things after the 28 day period.

I'm living such a pathetic lifestyle right now. I need the gym for my long term sanity.

We were never going to re-open until there was a vaccine. Too many irresponsible people in society.

This is no feasible. There will not be a working tried and tested vaccine until at least next summer.

[13th Man]

I think we’re looking at 1000 cases a day for a while. And that arbitrary 28 days was just to save face. It was always going to be longer, numbers don’t just magically go down like that. It’s going to be a repeated cycle of open, shut down, open, shut down. Better to find a way forward while keeping things open imo.

Agreed. All of this opening and closing really sucks for the local economy as well as our taxes for the next 10-20 years. More small businesses are going to go under while the big stores and online giants get richer. The filthy rich are making bank off of this pandemic while the middle and lower class get poorer.

More people are going to spiral into depression with job losses, mental and physical erosion from a lack of community activity. Remember that the cure cannot be worse than the problem. These Covid numbers are going to remain constant until the weather start to get warm again, which wouldn't be until next June imo.....what are we going to do, shut down restaurants and gyms until then? If you haven't noticed, the numbers have been going up all over the world in recent weeks, not just in Ontario. The weather does have a profound effect on the virus' ability to spread as we've witnessed at the beginning and end of summer.

I'm saying this as someone that is protected for the most part. Personally, I could be shut down for another year and be good as I comfy Gov't job and working from home. I also have my own basement gym with a squat rack, Olympics weights, spin bike, Concept 2 rower etc. but this is not about me.

I care more about the long term health of the people and of our economy. I think we should go back to stage 3 at the end of these 28 days. Nobody is forcing the people to go to restaurants or gyms anyway. If you don't feel comfortable, then don't go but let the people decide at their own risk and discretion.

[13th Man]

COVID-19 has caused more harm for the measures taken to "stop the spread" than the virus itself.

Lives ruined, economies hurt, and death rates low, yet there is constant fear mongering in the media, 24/7 from every outlet.

Draconian measures implemented and those who oppose are censored or discredited, for reasons unknown.

The only thing dumber than this post are the people who gave it an and1.

It’s always the same cabal. Wolverine and company. 13th man, bballinsight has Recently joined the fray. Alchemist too. I’ll give torraps some credit he doesn’t spam bs on here as much as those other guys. I’m surprised we haven’t seen dr negativity come running in here like the ultimate warrior. He’s their Hulk Hogan of this anti lockdown NWO like stable. Wolverine is like their Paul Bearer. Doesn’t say much but when he does open his mouth he just makes weird noises. They should have a name we can easily address them by. I propose ‘The Spirit Squad’. From now on these guys will be addressed with proper respect and we shall call them The Spirit Squad.

Lol

[13th Man]

seems to line up with Thanksgiving weekend, hopefully things come back down this week

My guess that it will not. The biggest factor in the rise of Covid numbers is due to the weather imo. Not masks, not people being defiant. Numbers are going up all over the world, not just in pockets of Ontario.

These numbers will remain constant throughout the winter, might even get worse as the weather gets colder. But continue to shut everything down and destroy people's livelihoods as well as the economy.

[NinjaBro]

If you haven't noticed, the numbers have been going up all over the world in recent weeks, not just in Ontario. The weather does have a profound effect on the virus' ability to spread as we've witnessed at the beginning and end of summer.

The number of cases are going up all over the world all at the same time. However just because it's getting colder here in Ontario doesn't mean it's winter in Australia. Therefore your theory don't compute.

[Basketball_Jones]

I think we’re looking at 1000 cases a day for a while. And that arbitrary 28 days was just to save face. It was always going to be longer, numbers don’t just magically go down like that. It’s going to be a repeated cycle of open, shut down, open, shut down. Better to find a way forward while keeping things open imo.

Agreed. All of this opening and closing really sucks for the local economy as well as our taxes for the next 10-20 years. More small businesses are going to go under while the big stores and online giants get richer. The filthy rich are making bank off of this pandemic while the middle and lower class get poorer.

More people are going to spiral into depression with job losses, mental and physical erosion from a lack of community activity. Remember that the cure cannot be worse than the problem. These Covid numbers are going to remain constant until the weather start to get warm again, which wouldn't be until next June imo.....what are we going to do, shut down restaurants and gyms until then? If you haven't noticed, the numbers have been going up all over the world in recent weeks, not just in Ontario. The weather does have a profound effect on the virus' ability to spread as we've witnessed at the beginning and end of summer.

I'm saying this as someone that is protected for the most part. Personally, I could be shut down for another year and be good as I comfy Gov't job and working from home. I also have my own basement gym with a squat rack, Olympics weights, spin bike, Concept 2 rower etc. but this is not about me.

I care more about the long term health of the people and of our economy. I think we should go back to stage 3 at the end of these 28 days. Nobody is forcing the people to go to restaurants or gyms anyway. If you don't feel comfortable, then don't go but let the people decide at their own risk and discretion.

We sound similar! I’m also in the public sector and we’re mandated to work from home right to 2021 and see what happens then.

From what I saw, the allowances before this second wave was far too open. 100 people allowed for outdoor events? What the hell is that? And 6 people allowed at dining tables? Why would anybody be socializing up close with that many people outside of their home during this? It should have been more like 4 max.

I think we saw too many rule breakers (king st. restaurants) that just pushed the envelope and not much was done for punishing them. As much as we all are to blame, I say the government was far too lax as well and deserves some blame.

[13th Man]

I think we’re looking at 1000 cases a day for a while. And that arbitrary 28 days was just to save face. It was always going to be longer, numbers don’t just magically go down like that. It’s going to be a repeated cycle of open, shut down, open, shut down. Better to find a way forward while keeping things open imo.

Agreed. All of this opening and closing really sucks for the local economy as well as our taxes for the next 10-20 years. More small businesses are going to go under while the big stores and online giants get richer. The filthy rich are making bank off of this pandemic while the middle and lower class get poorer.

More people are going to spiral into depression with job losses, mental and physical erosion from a lack of community activity. Remember that the cure cannot be worse than the problem. These Covid numbers are going to remain constant until the weather start to get warm again, which wouldn't be until next June imo.....what are we going to do, shut down restaurants and gyms until then? If you haven't noticed, the numbers have been going up all over the world in recent weeks, not just in Ontario. The weather does have a profound effect on the virus' ability to spread as we've witnessed at the beginning and end of summer.

I'm saying this as someone that is protected for the most part. Personally, I could be shut down for another year and be good as I comfy Gov't job and working from home. I also have my own basement gym with a squat rack, Olympics weights, spin bike, Concept 2 rower etc. but this is not about me.

I care more about the long term health of the people and of our economy. I think we should go back to stage 3 at the end of these 28 days. Nobody is forcing the people to go to restaurants or gyms anyway. If you don't feel comfortable, then don't go but let the people decide at their own risk and discretion.

We sound similar! I’m also in the public sector and we’re mandated to work from home right to 2021 and see what happens then.

From what I saw, the allowances before this second wave was far too open. 100 people allowed for outdoor events? What the hell is that? And 6 people allowed at dining tables? Why would anybody be socializing up close with that many people outside of their home during this? It should have been more like 4 max.

I think we saw too many rule breakers (king st. restaurants) that just pushed the envelope and not much was done for punishing them. As much as we all are to blame, I say the government was far too lax as well and deserves some blame.

Valid points. I'm all for re-opening up restaurants and gyms with tighter restrictions.

[13th Man]

If you haven't noticed, the numbers have been going up all over the world in recent weeks, not just in Ontario. The weather does have a profound effect on the virus' ability to spread as we've witnessed at the beginning and end of summer.

The number of cases are going up all over the world all at the same time. However just because it's getting colder here in Ontario doesn't mean it's winter in Australia. Therefore your theory don't compute.

I just mean in general. Obviously I can't assess every single region in the world to look out for anomalies.

[TorontoRapsFan]

One of the biggest reasons for why places are told to close down, even though to most it seems like fear mongering and overreactions by panzy liberals:
google review from a few days ago about a place I was going to go do some clothes shopping today:

"They have four employees who are confirmed cases of Covid-19 and the management is telling the employees not to inform the customers when they ask about it, instead just giving out the phone to winner PR department. Many of the staff are scared to work so there bringing people from other stores to fill the gaps which could help the disease spread. There also telling the staff to not tell anybody about it not even their parents or loved ones."

[Raps in 4]

Maaaan... this is getting crazy. I was hoping things would start turning around slowly and we can reopen things after the 28 day period.

I'm living such a pathetic lifestyle right now. I need the gym for my long term sanity.

We were never going to re-open until there was a vaccine. Too many irresponsible people in society.

This is no feasible. There will not be a working tried and tested vaccine until at least next summer.

Phase 3 testing is well underway for a lot of vaccines already. I wouldn't be shocked if the first ones are approved by the end of the year/early next year. Production will obviously take some time to ramp up after that, but a working vaccine isn't that far off.

[Local_NG_Idiot]

Agreed. All of this opening and closing really sucks for the local economy as well as our taxes for the next 10-20 years. More small businesses are going to go under while the big stores and online giants get richer. The filthy rich are making bank off of this pandemic while the middle and lower class get poorer.

More people are going to spiral into depression with job losses, mental and physical erosion from a lack of community activity. Remember that the cure cannot be worse than the problem. These Covid numbers are going to remain constant until the weather start to get warm again, which wouldn't be until next June imo.....what are we going to do, shut down restaurants and gyms until then? If you haven't noticed, the numbers have been going up all over the world in recent weeks, not just in Ontario. The weather does have a profound effect on the virus' ability to spread as we've witnessed at the beginning and end of summer.

I'm saying this as someone that is protected for the most part. Personally, I could be shut down for another year and be good as I comfy Gov't job and working from home. I also have my own basement gym with a squat rack, Olympics weights, spin bike, Concept 2 rower etc. but this is not about me.

I care more about the long term health of the people and of our economy. I think we should go back to stage 3 at the end of these 28 days. Nobody is forcing the people to go to restaurants or gyms anyway. If you don't feel comfortable, then don't go but let the people decide at their own risk and discretion.

We sound similar! I’m also in the public sector and we’re mandated to work from home right to 2021 and see what happens then.

From what I saw, the allowances before this second wave was far too open. 100 people allowed for outdoor events? What the hell is that? And 6 people allowed at dining tables? Why would anybody be socializing up close with that many people outside of their home during this? It should have been more like 4 max.

I think we saw too many rule breakers (king st. restaurants) that just pushed the envelope and not much was done for punishing them. As much as we all are to blame, I say the government was far too lax as well and deserves some blame.

Valid points. I'm all for re-opening up restaurants and gyms with tighter restrictions.

if you are in such a great position, why don't you order takeout from all those restaurants and tip 50%, as well as continue to pay for your gym membership even though they are closed if you are so worried about those businesses? To further that, why don't you promote them within your community and have others do the same.

[Vaclac]

If you haven't noticed, the numbers have been going up all over the world in recent weeks, not just in Ontario. The weather does have a profound effect on the virus' ability to spread as we've witnessed at the beginning and end of summer.

The number of cases are going up all over the world all at the same time. However just because it's getting colder here in Ontario doesn't mean it's winter in Australia. Therefore your theory don't compute.

Obviously he meant the Northern Hemisphere where most of the world population lives. You can look at Canada or the US or European nations like France, Spain, UK, Netherlands, Germany, Italy - they're all experiencing a huge spike after a mostly quiet summer. The exception to the quiet summer was in Southern states where likely the heat was so high that people were spending more time inside. In fact the Australia data actually do fit this seasonal pattern with their second wave occurring in their winter and now being calmer. I don't think there's any serious question anymore that there's a strong seasonal component to the spread of this virus.

[13th Man]

We sound similar! I’m also in the public sector and we’re mandated to work from home right to 2021 and see what happens then.

From what I saw, the allowances before this second wave was far too open. 100 people allowed for outdoor events? What the hell is that? And 6 people allowed at dining tables? Why would anybody be socializing up close with that many people outside of their home during this? It should have been more like 4 max.

I think we saw too many rule breakers (king st. restaurants) that just pushed the envelope and not much was done for punishing them. As much as we all are to blame, I say the government was far too lax as well and deserves some blame.

Valid points. I'm all for re-opening up restaurants and gyms with tighter restrictions.

if you are in such a great position, why don't you order takeout from all those restaurants and tip 50%, as well as continue to pay for your gym membership even though they are closed if you are so worried about those businesses? To further that, why don't you promote them within your community and have others do the same.

Being in a good position is relative. I am grateful for what I have and do what I can within my means to help out the small businesses that I interact with. This is on top of what we'll all be paying for in the long run, do you think all of these assistance programs and variations of CERB come out of thin air? Nope, we'll all be paying for it through taxes so brace yourselves for this over the next 10 to 20 years.

[Fairview4Life]

If you haven't noticed, the numbers have been going up all over the world in recent weeks, not just in Ontario. The weather does have a profound effect on the virus' ability to spread as we've witnessed at the beginning and end of summer.

The number of cases are going up all over the world all at the same time. However just because it's getting colder here in Ontario doesn't mean it's winter in Australia. Therefore your theory don't compute.

Obviously he meant the Northern Hemisphere where most of the world population lives. You can look at Canada or the US or European nations like France, Spain, UK, Netherlands, Germany, Italy - they're all experiencing a huge spike after a mostly quiet summer. The exception to the quiet summer was in Southern states where likely the heat was so high that people were spending more time inside. In fact the Australia data actually do fit this seasonal pattern with their second wave occurring in their winter and now being calmer. I don't think there's any serious question anymore that there's a strong seasonal component to the spread of this virus.

Seasonal isn't the thing really, it's groups of people indoors together. That happens in Canada when it gets colder, or we open up a bunch of bars in the fall, and in the southern US when it's hot as you mentioned, and everything is open.

[13th Man]

We were never going to re-open until there was a vaccine. Too many irresponsible people in society.

This is no feasible. There will not be a working tried and tested vaccine until at least next summer.

Phase 3 testing is well underway for a lot of vaccines already. I wouldn't be shocked if the first ones are approved by the end of the year/early next year. Production will obviously take some time to ramp up after that, but a working vaccine isn't that far off.

Depends what you mean by far off. Even with the best case scenario as above, we likely won't see it roll out to the public until at least the spring of 2021 imo. I say that we're still at least 6 months away, the point is that can we afford to stay locked down until then? I don't think so.

[13th Man]

The number of cases are going up all over the world all at the same time. However just because it's getting colder here in Ontario doesn't mean it's winter in Australia. Therefore your theory don't compute.

Obviously he meant the Northern Hemisphere where most of the world population lives. You can look at Canada or the US or European nations like France, Spain, UK, Netherlands, Germany, Italy - they're all experiencing a huge spike after a mostly quiet summer. The exception to the quiet summer was in Southern states where likely the heat was so high that people were spending more time inside. In fact the Australia data actually do fit this seasonal pattern with their second wave occurring in their winter and now being calmer. I don't think there's any serious question anymore that there's a strong seasonal component to the spread of this virus.

Seasonal isn't the thing really, it's groups of people indoors together. That happens in Canada when it gets colder, or we open up a bunch of bars in the fall, and in the southern US when it's hot as you mentioned, and everything is open.

It's not black and & white as to say let's open everything up including bars and go back to Stage 2. I think there will need to be additional tweaking and modifications; something in between a Stage 2 and Stage 2 modified. But instead, what are we hearing? Let's bring the entire province to Stage 2 modified and keep it there until the numbers subside.

Well, I have news for them; the numbers are not going to subside as they did in the summer months. We're not playing the same ball game anymore.

[GreatWhiteStiff]

debate a ridiculous strawman.

[13th Man]

Stage 2 modified has been in effect for 3 weeks now. Why aren't the numbers going down in those areas? Must be all those anti-maskers being openly defiant since we can no longer point the finger at restaurants or gyms.

[Caboclo]

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851 new cases today (but only 28k tests)