2020 Draft Rumors Thread

nolang1 · Post #41 » by **nolang1** » Tue Nov 3, 2020 4:19 pm

Boston is looking to use their picks to move up. How far does 14, 26, and 30 get them, and who do you think they'd be looking for? Okongwu is the first one who comes to mind for me, and they'd have to get to 8 or higher.

Post #42 » by **Ruzious** » Tue Nov 3, 2020 6:44 pm

nolang1 wrote:Boston is looking to use their picks to move up. How far does 14, 26, and 30 get them, and who do you think they'd be looking for? Okongwu is the first one who comes to mind for me, and they'd have to get to 8 or higher.

According to Kevin Pelton's chart http://nbasense.com/draft-pick-trade-value/2/kevin-pelton-2 , those 3 picks have the value of the 4th pick.

BadWolf · Post #43 » by **BadWolf** » Tue Nov 3, 2020 7:13 pm

Looking at that chart, he really overvalues lower picks. There should be a log function thrown in somewhere.

26, 27 and 60 gets you to 14... Which imo is at least 5 spots to high in typical draft.

He thinks 16 and 19 gets you to 5.in 2014 Bulls traded 16 and 19 for 11. The value of players selected today shouldn't really influence the evaluationhhere though, it was Gar Pax after all.

BlazersBroncos · Post #44 » by **BlazersBroncos** » Tue Nov 3, 2020 7:48 pm

Boston is looking to use their picks to move up. How far does 14, 26, and 30 get them, and who do you think they'd be looking for? Okongwu is the first one who comes to mind for me, and they'd have to get to 8 or higher.

I like Detroit at 7. That team needs bodies and unless you see a guy at 7 that can be a franchise cornerstone (Which, IMO, just isnt likely in this draft) taking the 3 picks and using them to improve young role playing depth across the board would be a good move.
They might even be able to still snag a high upside guy like Poku at 14 and the guard depth this year is enough to get a guy like Ramsey, who should be able to score at the next level right away IMO, at 26 or even 30.

MotownMadness · Post #45 » by **MotownMadness** » Tue Nov 3, 2020 8:13 pm

BlazersBroncos wrote:
Boston is looking to use their picks to move up. How far does 14, 26, and 30 get them, and who do you think they'd be looking for? Okongwu is the first one who comes to mind for me, and they'd have to get to 8 or higher.

I like Detroit at 7. That team needs bodies and unless you see a guy at 7 that can be a franchise cornerstone (Which, IMO, just isnt likely in this draft) taking the 3 picks and using them to improve young role playing depth across the board would be a good move.
They might even be able to still snag a high upside guy like Poku at 14 and the guard depth this year is enough to get a guy like Ramsey, who should be able to score at the next level right away IMO, at 26 or even 30.

I wouldn't do it until I see who is left over at 7. If Hayes is there than forget about it, I really like him.

BlazersBroncos · Post #46 » by **BlazersBroncos** » Tue Nov 3, 2020 8:24 pm

I wouldn't do it until I see who is left over at 7. If Hayes is there than forget about it, I really like him.

I totally get that, and generally most trades like this are for a player not a pick. If the board didnt fall in DET's favor, I think it makes sense.

doordoor123 · Post #47 » by **doordoor123** » Tue Nov 3, 2020 9:03 pm

Ruzious wrote:
nolang1 wrote:Boston is looking to use their picks to move up. How far does 14, 26, and 30 get them, and who do you think they'd be looking for? Okongwu is the first one who comes to mind for me, and they'd have to get to 8 or higher.

According to Kevin Pelton's chart http://nbasense.com/draft-pick-trade-value/2/kevin-pelton-2 , those 3 picks have the value of the 4th pick.

Unfortunately this year is so different in terms of value with revenue loss, weak top of the draft, corona, etc. Hard to say what the actual value is.

CP War Hawks · Post #48 » by **CP War Hawks** » Tue Nov 3, 2020 10:29 pm

14 and 26 should only get you a few spots up. Pick 30 is neutral so I don't understand the inflated value for Boston here. They mishandled the Memphis pick when it had so much potential value.

baldur · Post #49 » by **baldur** » Tue Nov 3, 2020 11:10 pm

15 and 20 can get you 10. so in boston's case I would say something 8th or 9th.

baldur · Post #50 » by **baldur** » Wed Nov 4, 2020 12:32 am

UcanUwill wrote:
getrichordie wrote:
baldur wrote:
I thought Chicago is looking for a playmaker, apparently haliburton or hayes at that range?

Avdija is a two-way playmaker.

Do not overdraft Euroleague bench warmers, recent history should have taught this lesson.

european teams are almost always in win-now modes. Why would they play him if he is not mature enough to contribute or make a difference? It is certain that he will go to the nba, so why would they invest him?
porzingis was a bench warmer too, even in a mediocre European team.

Coxy · Post #51 » by **Coxy** » Wed Nov 4, 2020 7:20 am

They could potentially get Golden State interested with Marcus Smart involved as well.

UcanUwill · Post #52 » by **UcanUwill** » Wed Nov 4, 2020 8:52 am

baldur wrote:
UcanUwill wrote:
getrichordie wrote:
Avdija is a two-way playmaker.

Do not overdraft Euroleague bench warmers, recent history should have taught this lesson.

european teams are almost always in win-now modes. Why would they play him if he is not mature enough to contribute or make a difference? It is certain that he will go to the nba, so why would they invest him?
porzingis was a bench warmer too, even in a mediocre European team.

Porzingis wasnt a bench warmer, he was role player with ridiculously good 3 point shooting percentage. Sure he wasnt utilized the way he was in NYK, but he was playing and showing potential of outgrowing the European competition and thats key.

WHy would Euros play Avdija, maybe because hes good? Most Euroleague contracts are 1-2 years long, no one is investing in players long term in Europe, if you good you just play. If Avdija isnt mature to contribute on Israeli team, how are people expect him to be good in the NBA? Even NBA teams do not invest into these prospect long term anymore, guys like Wade Baldwin or Dennis Smith Jr. were thrown out after a year, but lets draft a guy who is not good enough for Tel Aviv Maccabi and watch him play in the NBA...

arusinov · Post #53 » by **arusinov** » Wed Nov 4, 2020 9:22 am

UcanUwill wrote:
baldur wrote:
UcanUwill wrote:
Do not overdraft Euroleague bench warmers, recent history should have taught this lesson.

european teams are almost always in win-now modes. Why would they play him if he is not mature enough to contribute or make a difference? It is certain that he will go to the nba, so why would they invest him?
porzingis was a bench warmer too, even in a mediocre European team.

Porzingis wasnt a bench warmer, he was role player with ridiculously good 3 point shooting percentage. Sure he wasnt utilized the way he was in NYK, but he was playing and showing potential of outgrowing the European competition and thats key.

WHy would Euros play Avdija, maybe because hes good? Most Euroleague contracts are 1-2 years long, no one is investing in players long term in Europe, if you good you just play. If Avdija isnt mature to contribute on Israeli team, how are people expect him to be good in the NBA? Even NBA teams do not invest into these prospect long term anymore, guys like Wade Baldwin or Dennis Smith Jr. were thrown out after a year, but lets draft a guy who is not good enough for Tel Aviv Maccabi and watch him play in the NBA...

Porzingis half year younger than Deni this season was quite bench warmer. He averaged 6.7 pts / 2.8 rbd / 0.3 ast (with 0.6 stl, 0,9 blk)
Porzingis half year older than Deni this season was a good role player for one of worst ACB teams (finished ACB season 14 in field of 18, 12W / 22 L).
There was nothing "ridiculous" about Porzingis 3P% if you look at both competitions - he shot 46% in EuroCup but just 31% in ACB on same ~3.1 - 3.2 3PA per game (36% overall average)

Deni's role was quickly expanding as the season progressed precisely because "hes good"
From rotational guy at ~10 ppg first half of season to ~16 ppg leading scorer of the team second half in I-BSL
From fringe player on 10 min per game (and couple DNP-CD) 2.5 ppg at the start of the Euroleague season to 20 min per game 7 ppg and quite important player in the rotation close to time when the season was cancelled

UcanUwill · Post #54 » by **UcanUwill** » Wed Nov 4, 2020 9:34 am

arusinov wrote:
Porzingis half year younger than Deni this season was quite bench warmer. He averaged 6.7 pts / 2.8 rbd / 0.3 ast (with 0.6 stl, 0,9 blk)
Porzingis half year older than Deni this season was a good role player for one of worst ACB teams (finished ACB season 14 in field of 18, 12W / 22 L).
There was nothing "ridiculous" about Porzingis 3P% if you look at both competitions - he shot 46% in EuroCup but just 31% in ACB on same ~3.1 - 3.2 3PA per game (36% overall average)

Deni's role was quickly expanding as the season progressed precisely because "hes good"
From rotational guy at ~10 ppg first half of season to ~16 ppg leading scorer of the team second half in I-BSL
From fringe player on 10 min per game (and couple DNP-CD) 2.5 ppg at the start of the Euroleague season to 20 min per game 7 ppg and quite important player in the rotation close to time when the season was cancelled

Thats all fair, I just disappointed he is no longer plays for Maccabi, if he was playing in Euroleague this year and looked actually improved, then it would be great, but he quite before even proving he can be Euroleague player, I do not put a lot of stock on Israeli playoffs were completely washed up Amare ended up as MVP.

arusinov · Post #55 » by **arusinov** » Wed Nov 4, 2020 10:03 am

UcanUwill wrote:
arusinov wrote:
Porzingis half year younger than Deni this season was quite bench warmer. He averaged 6.7 pts / 2.8 rbd / 0.3 ast (with 0.6 stl, 0,9 blk)
Porzingis half year older than Deni this season was a good role player for one of worst ACB teams (finished ACB season 14 in field of 18, 12W / 22 L).
There was nothing "ridiculous" about Porzingis 3P% if you look at both competitions - he shot 46% in EuroCup but just 31% in ACB on same ~3.1 - 3.2 3PA per game (36% overall average)

Deni's role was quickly expanding as the season progressed precisely because "hes good"
From rotational guy at ~10 ppg first half of season to ~16 ppg leading scorer of the team second half in I-BSL
From fringe player on 10 min per game (and couple DNP-CD) 2.5 ppg at the start of the Euroleague season to 20 min per game 7 ppg and quite important player in the rotation close to time when the season was cancelled

Thats all fair, I just disappointed he is no longer plays for Maccabi, if he was playing in Euroleague this year and looked actually improved, then it would be great, but he quite before even proving he can be Euroleague player, I do not put a lot of stock on Israeli playoffs were completely washed up Amare ended up as MVP.

Amar'e was signed as backup big off the bench when Tarik Black got injured and it was hard to find anyone good in that time of season. And Amar'e was signed for one and only one reason - he is Israeli citizen and could be added to the roster as Israeli player and not foreigner. He was precisely what he was signed to be: backup big off the bench with 8.7 pts /4.4 rbs / 1.1 ast
But in the final game both stars of the team - proven Euroleague scorer Scottie WIlbekin and Deni didn't have a good game... so Amar's recalled old times and led the team with season high 18 pts. You know - it happens that a washed up great vet suddenly gives one good game.

Look. I agree that in other times Deni would stay in Maccabi and hopefully became their leader in Euroleague too, But it's the same as with one-and-done college players. Why someone like Isaac Okoro which had very close to Deni's I-BSL stats in NCAA (and level of I-BSL while not great still much much better than in any NCAA conference) leaves after one season and considered top-10 pick (and in previous seasons without Covid-19 interference it was same - players with ok-ish stats and best achievement like 1/16 in NCAA tournament did it) ?

You can't expect from Deni to stay in Maccabi when he's expected to be top-10 selection... Anything can happen (injury for example) in this season. In Euroleague ~$5.5 mln salary of Niko is considered ridiculous, and Maccabi is not rich as Barcelona, they are paying ~$1.5 mln to Wilbeken which is proven Euroleague star, how much would they give Deni? $1 mln at best?

doordoor123 · Post #56 » by **doordoor123** » Thu Nov 5, 2020 12:56 am

Coxy wrote:They could potentially get Golden State interested with Marcus Smart involved as well.

IMO Marcus Smart is their most valuable player. The Celtics arent the Celtics without Marcus Smart. He's the yin to the yang of the superstars on the team. He provides too much energy and effort. Its unmatched by any defender in the league. He's a modern day Tony Allen. I think he's going to be a Celtic for life.

Coxy · Post #57 » by **Coxy** » Thu Nov 5, 2020 1:01 am

doordoor123 wrote:
Coxy wrote:They could potentially get Golden State interested with Marcus Smart involved as well.

IMO Marcus Smart is their most valuable player. The Celtics arent the Celtics without Marcus Smart. He's the yin to the yang of the superstars on the team. He provides too much energy and effort. Its unmatched by any defender in the league. He's a modern day Tony Allen. I think he's going to be a Celtic for life.

Hence the reason I state they could get Golden State interested. That Marcus Smart you outlined, on the same court with Draymond Green? My defensive/hustle/winner wet dreams would come true. Add in that guy Stephen Curry, and the dude himself Klay, yes please.

doordoor123 · Post #58 » by **doordoor123** » Thu Nov 5, 2020 1:51 am

Coxy wrote:
doordoor123 wrote:
Coxy wrote:They could potentially get Golden State interested with Marcus Smart involved as well.

IMO Marcus Smart is their most valuable player. The Celtics arent the Celtics without Marcus Smart. He's the yin to the yang of the superstars on the team. He provides too much energy and effort. Its unmatched by any defender in the league. He's a modern day Tony Allen. I think he's going to be a Celtic for life.

Hence the reason I state they could get Golden State interested. That Marcus Smart you outlined, on the same court with Draymond Green? My defensive/hustle/winner wet dreams would come true. Add in that guy Stephen Curry, and the dude himself Klay, yes please.

I don't see the Celtics parting ways with him, just knowing the Celtics in general. They're too proud of their players. Otherwise they could have easily done the Anthony Davis trade.

Coxy · Post #59 » by **Coxy** » Thu Nov 5, 2020 1:53 am

doordoor123 wrote:
Coxy wrote:
doordoor123 wrote:
IMO Marcus Smart is their most valuable player. The Celtics arent the Celtics without Marcus Smart. He's the yin to the yang of the superstars on the team. He provides too much energy and effort. Its unmatched by any defender in the league. He's a modern day Tony Allen. I think he's going to be a Celtic for life.

Hence the reason I state they could get Golden State interested. That Marcus Smart you outlined, on the same court with Draymond Green? My defensive/hustle/winner wet dreams would come true. Add in that guy Stephen Curry, and the dude himself Klay, yes please.

I don't see the Celtics parting ways with him, just knowing the Celtics in general. They're too proud of their players. Otherwise they could have easily done the Anthony Davis trade.

You're probably right.

God Squad · Post #60 » by **God Squad** » Thu Nov 5, 2020 9:44 am

doordoor123 wrote:
Coxy wrote:They could potentially get Golden State interested with Marcus Smart involved as well.

IMO Marcus Smart is their most valuable player. The Celtics arent the Celtics without Marcus Smart. He's the yin to the yang of the superstars on the team. He provides too much energy and effort. Its unmatched by any defender in the league. He's a modern day Tony Allen. I think he's going to be a Celtic for life.

I totally agree. IMO he's like Lowry on the Raptors. It's clear as day he's the engine and best defender. Boston would take a big hit without Smart.