Miami Heat Speculation Thread - 2020 and beyond...

[Elnegron]

The problem with this trade is that 1- New Orleans will want young asset and draft pick and 2- if giannis wants to play in Miami but get a max deal via sign and trade, we would have lost all the draft picks in the jrue deal, not worth it. Jrue won't take up to a ring no matter how u slice it

[MadD23]

Jrue
Herro
Butler
Giannis
Bam

Make it happen Riley

[3ballbomber]

1 player mentioned for trade result in 4 pages of discussion. Gotta love the offseason where a piece of news creates so much excitement

I doubt we trade Herro for just anybody. It's Giannis type mega-talent or nothing. You don't just give away someone like Herro. His development is our priority.

What ever happens i have faith Riles will do what's right for the team. We're so close in building another Championship squad - They're not going to jeopardize that by making horrible decisions.

I'm excited & impatient at times to see us land that Whale but i'm partial to waiting until 2021 where we're able to keep both Herro & Duncan. Nunn, Crowder, DJJ etc. can go if need be....but we want our best 5 players together for that title run.

[RexBoyWonder]

Duncan
20th pick
FFR
Nunn
DJJ (sign and trade)
Olynyk

for

Jrue
Reddick

Its makes sense on some level, if you try to maximize next year and believe Jure will take us over the top.

But are you willing to kill the Giannis dream right now?
Because that move is killing it, no way to keep Jure and add Giannis. We're giving up a ton of cheap talent to add jure and a 36 YO shooter, if we don't win it all next year or 2 - we're ****.

Duncan, Nunn and FRP having such a low cap holds is what's allowing us to ADD Giannis into cap space.

[HeatingUp3]

Its amazed me Heat fans are willin to part ways with Herro or Duncan and 1st round picks for Jrue Holiday. He is NOT goin to take us over the top. Damn .

[AirP.]

Its amazed me Heat fans are willin to part ways with Herro or Duncan and 1st round picks for Jrue Holiday. He is NOT goin to take us over the top. Damn .

It's about getting better, I don't move Herro but I would move Duncan and a 1st for Jrue if you have an agreement in place that he opts out and agrees to a long term agreement. The reason you move Robinson is because he's up for a new contract in 2021, yes his cap hold will be small but it only takes one team willing to overpay for him to make it difficult to retain him in the current financial climate. Also, take in consideration that Herro will become a starter in the next year or 2, I'm not sure you want Herro and Robinson starting and ensuring 40% of your starting/ending defense being bad thus giving the other team 2 players to search for on defense.

Regular season having more great 3pt shooters works pretty well, in the playoffs the further you go, the better competition you'll play which equates to needing better defense.

Once again, Jrue probably isn't even an option unless he agrees to opt out of his player's option and agree to a predetermined longer contract. I don't think Miami will have the assets to outbid the Nets who would love to have Jrue's defense with Kyrie and KD offense.

[twix2500]

Its amazed me Heat fans are willin to part ways with Herro or Duncan and 1st round picks for Jrue Holiday. He is NOT goin to take us over the top. Damn .

It's about getting better, I don't move Herro but I would move Duncan and a 1st for Jrue if you have an agreement in place that he opts out and agrees to a long term agreement. The reason you move Robinson is because he's up for a new contract in 2021, yes his cap hold will be small but it only takes one team willing to overpay for him to make it difficult to retain him in the current financial climate. Also, take in consideration that Herro will become a starter in the next year or 2, I'm not sure you want Herro and Robinson starting and ensuring 40% of your starting/ending defense being bad thus giving the other team 2 players to search for on defense.

Regular season having more great 3pt shooters works pretty well, in the playoffs the further you go, the better competition you'll play which equates to needing better defense.

Once again, Jrue probably isn't even an option unless he agrees to opt out of his player's option and agree to a predetermined longer contract. I don't think Miami will have the assets to outbid the Nets who would love to have Jrue's defense with Kyrie and KD offense.

If the rumors are true that the Heat are pursuing Holiday, then they are serious about his ability. AirP, you gotta understand a lot have gain some emotional connection to some of the young players (not named Nunn lol) like they did with rook 1 and rook 2. They complained about going after Jimmy Butler just the same as Holiday. They said he wasnt that dude to break up the young core, he is not that good, too old, injured prone etc. Just after one year, now every one loves him and is now a Heat legend.

Back to Holiday, look I do believe the Heat are serious about him. However, I do not believe they will give up the kitchen and the sink for Holiday just as they didnt for Butler. But I do believe that the Heat sees him as a core player that they can win a chip with. Holiday - Butler and Bam is a hellava a trio. And yes, build around them right they can win a chip or two as the main core. And yes if they feel they can win a chip next year, yes they will be willing to use up free capspace to sign Giannis outright if he decides to play for the Heat. Because I think they will keep flexibility to make it happen regardless.

The interest to Holiday now makes sense why rumors about Matthews, and Millsap were coming out. And the that the Heat are interested in Joe Harris. The interest in swing shooters baffled me when they have an overload in swing shooters. Unless they are looking at some moves that will likely trade some of those swing shooters. Not saying they are going to trade Herro or Duncan but looking how they will filled the void of swing shooters if one or both are involved. Just looking how free agency can fill those voids.

PG: Holiday - Dragic
SG: Harris - Matthews
SF: Butler
PF: Gallinari - Milsap
Ce: Adebayo

[RexBoyWonder]

simply put - I rather gamble on us having :

Herro
Duncan
Jimmy
Bam
Giannis

And Dragic + KZ off the bench

If we just stay put, that can happen after this season.


If we trade for Jure now, not only are we losing cheap young players - we'll end up with the reality that's it's EITHER we keep Jrue after this year, OR we're Giannis. IT CAN'T BE BOTH.

So are you willing to lose Duncan + picks for a 1 year Jure rental?
Or are you willing to just keep Jure and tell Giannis we don't have cap space for him?

[Bishop45]

Yimmy/Giannas/Bam would have to play in a lot of staggered rotations with shooters, especially considering Giannis's usage. Not sure those three start together in a finals series even

If we could trade for Yanni and get Middleton as well, that would prolly be optimal-- fit wise

[Beenie]

Its amazed me Heat fans are willin to part ways with Herro or Duncan and 1st round picks for Jrue Holiday. He is NOT goin to take us over the top. Damn .

The distinction should be made that it's primarily Duncan, not Herro who is getting mentioned in a possible trade for Jrue.

In my mock proposal, Mia also acquires Reddick who compensates for much of the lost 3-point shooting.

Consider it's not guaranteed that Mia can afford Duncan after next season, particularly if they pursue Giannis and then have to max out Bam. Reddick is older and might be more inclined to take a discounted offer.

And I don't know how you can be so sure that Jrue wouldn't put Mia in the driver's seat. They were 2 wins away from a chip. Rondo, at times, terrorized the Heat defense by dribbling to the rim at will. That's not happening if Jrue is in the lineup.

[Seabass777]

Its amazed me Heat fans are willin to part ways with Herro or Duncan and 1st round picks for Jrue Holiday. He is NOT goin to take us over the top. Damn .

The distinction should be made that it's primarily Duncan, not Herro who is getting mentioned in a possible trade for Jrue.

In my mock proposal, Mia also acquires Reddick who compensates for much of the lost 3-point shooting.

Consider it's not guaranteed that Mia can afford Duncan after next season, particularly if they pursue Giannis and then have to max out Bam. Reddick is older and might be more inclined to take a discounted offer.

And I don't know how you can be so sure that Jrue wouldn't put Mia in the driver's seat. They were 2 wins away from a chip. Rondo, at times, terrorized the Heat defense by dribbling to the rim at will. That's not happening if Jrue is in the lineup.

We have Duncan's bird rights I believe, so we can go over the salary cap to resign him, retaining him would be a non-issue

[Miami590]

What if Giannis sign an extension this off-season. Do we give up on our 2021 cap space and go all out this year instead

[Beenie]

Its amazed me Heat fans are willin to part ways with Herro or Duncan and 1st round picks for Jrue Holiday. He is NOT goin to take us over the top. Damn .

The distinction should be made that it's primarily Duncan, not Herro who is getting mentioned in a possible trade for Jrue.

In my mock proposal, Mia also acquires Reddick who compensates for much of the lost 3-point shooting.

Consider it's not guaranteed that Mia can afford Duncan after next season, particularly if they pursue Giannis and then have to max out Bam. Reddick is older and might be more inclined to take a discounted offer.

And I don't know how you can be so sure that Jrue wouldn't put Mia in the driver's seat. They were 2 wins away from a chip. Rondo, at times, terrorized the Heat defense by dribbling to the rim at will. That's not happening if Jrue is in the lineup.

We have Duncan's bird rights I believe, so we can go over the salary cap to resign him, retaining him would be a non-issue

At what price?

That's gonna matter. If he gets 20 mil per year offers (not out of the realm possibilities) does Mia want to match and be a highly luxury taxed team in these uncertain economic times?

[twix2500]

Its amazed me Heat fans are willin to part ways with Herro or Duncan and 1st round picks for Jrue Holiday. He is NOT goin to take us over the top. Damn .

The distinction should be made that it's primarily Duncan, not Herro who is getting mentioned in a possible trade for Jrue.

In my mock proposal, Mia also acquires Reddick who compensates for much of the lost 3-point shooting.

Consider it's not guaranteed that Mia can afford Duncan after next season, particularly if they pursue Giannis and then have to max out Bam. Reddick is older and might be more inclined to take a discounted offer.

And I don't know how you can be so sure that Jrue wouldn't put Mia in the driver's seat. They were 2 wins away from a chip. Rondo, at times, terrorized the Heat defense by dribbling to the rim at will. That's not happening if Jrue is in the lineup.

We have Duncan's bird rights I believe, so we can go over the salary cap to resign him, retaining him would be a non-issue

It would be, if Duncan can get an extremely high offer somewhere else. 3 max contracts and then Duncan who might get 20 plus mill per. Is that feasible especially he will be playing a lesser role with Giannis added to the roster? Its may cause a problem like Philly. Paying Horford all that money when Embiid is taking his usage a away.

Sent from my SM-G965U using Tapatalk

[HeatingUp3]

Its amazed me Heat fans are willin to part ways with Herro or Duncan and 1st round picks for Jrue Holiday. He is NOT goin to take us over the top. Damn .

The distinction should be made that it's primarily Duncan, not Herro who is getting mentioned in a possible trade for Jrue.

In my mock proposal, Mia also acquires Reddick who compensates for much of the lost 3-point shooting.

Consider it's not guaranteed that Mia can afford Duncan after next season, particularly if they pursue Giannis and then have to max out Bam. Reddick is older and might be more inclined to take a discounted offer.

And I don't know how you can be so sure that Jrue wouldn't put Mia in the driver's seat. They were 2 wins away from a chip. Rondo, at times, terrorized the Heat defense by dribbling to the rim at will. That's not happening if Jrue is in the lineup.

I respact your opinion bro. I Just doesn't value Holiday's game as you i guess. I don't think that having Jrue would have won the finals for us. To me it was the inside defense,rebounding,etc.. lack of size and star big that can play with Bam and stop Davis from dominate us on the glass.
Duncan is a big part of this team success and i would try to keep him unless its a trade for a Giannis/Beal type deal.
We can offer him the money next off season. We can go into the cap we have the rights.

[Beenie]

The distinction should be made that it's primarily Duncan, not Herro who is getting mentioned in a possible trade for Jrue.

In my mock proposal, Mia also acquires Reddick who compensates for much of the lost 3-point shooting.

Consider it's not guaranteed that Mia can afford Duncan after next season, particularly if they pursue Giannis and then have to max out Bam. Reddick is older and might be more inclined to take a discounted offer.

And I don't know how you can be so sure that Jrue wouldn't put Mia in the driver's seat. They were 2 wins away from a chip. Rondo, at times, terrorized the Heat defense by dribbling to the rim at will. That's not happening if Jrue is in the lineup.

We have Duncan's bird rights I believe, so we can go over the salary cap to resign him, retaining him would be a non-issue

It would be, if Duncan can get an extremely high offer somewhere else. 3 max contracts and then Duncan who might get 20 plus mill per. Is that feasible especially he will be playing a lesser role with Giannis added to the roster? Its may cause a problem like Philly. Paying Horford all that money when Embiid is taking his usage a away.

Sent from my SM-G965U using Tapatalk

It's feasible but it's also not guaranteed that Mia will want to pony up that amount of money for a shooting specialist especially with the loss of revenue due to the absence of live fans which may continue through the next season. If they can replace Duncan with a cheaper option I think they probably will explore doing so. It's gonna take some creativity with the cap and managing the cumulative player salaries to avoid getting killed on the luxury tax which is a threshold that pretty much every team will not want to cross the next couple of seasons.

[MartyCONLONNN]

The homer blindness is impressive on here. You’re talking about trading a one dimensional shooter who’s miserable on the defensive end & was a non factor in both the ECF & Finals for a 2 way all star calibre player who is considered the best wing defender in the league and can drop 30 on any given night.

You can scheme shooters who cant create for themselves out of a series but you can’t do anything about an elite defensive force and dynamic playmaker/scorer

[RexBoyWonder]

The homer blindness is impressive on here. You’re talking about trading a one dimensional shooter who’s miserable on the defensive end & was a non factor in both the ECF & Finals for a 2 way all star calibre player who is considered the best wing defender in the league and can drop 30 on any given night.

You can scheme shooters who cant create for themselves out of a series but you can’t do anything about an elite defensive force and dynamic playmaker/scorer

If they were the same age, and more importantly made the same salary, no one would question that Jure > Duncan.

But the younger player will have a cap hold of ~2Mil in a year, while the other will have a cap hold of around 27Mil, which will kill the chance to add a third player who is much better then both of them.

We need to think big picture here, Giannis looks to be attainable, he's 26 YO, he's the MVP. You've got to give yourself the best chance to get him in a year.

Opportunity cost (also referred to as Alternative cost) is defined by New Oxford American Dictionary as "the loss of potential gain from other alternatives when one alternative is chosen". [1

[Beenie]

The homer blindness is impressive on here. You’re talking about trading a one dimensional shooter who’s miserable on the defensive end & was a non factor in both the ECF & Finals for a 2 way all star calibre player who is considered the best wing defender in the league and can drop 30 on any given night.

You can scheme shooters who cant create for themselves out of a series but you can’t do anything about an elite defensive force and dynamic playmaker/scorer

If they were the same age, and more importantly made the same salary, no one would question that Jure > Duncan.

But the younger player will have a cap hold of ~2Mil in a year, while the other will have a cap hold of around 27Mil, which will kill the chance to add a third player who is much better then both of them.

We need to think big picture here, Giannis looks to be attainable, he's 26 YO, he's the MVP. You've got to give yourself the best chance to get him in a year.

Opportunity cost (also referred to as Alternative cost) is defined by New Oxford American Dictionary as "the loss of potential gain from other alternatives when one alternative is chosen". [1

This is assuming that Jrue wouldn't opt-out and want to resign. I'm assuming in the opposite direction that he would because I give Riley the benefit of the doubt that he would only make the deal under those conditions. We already have the Galo example to look towards as a precedent.

[RexBoyWonder]

What if Giannis sign an extension this off-season. Do we give up on our 2021 cap space and go all out this year instead

It depends on what you consider "all out".

I wouldn't move Bam/Herro/Jimmy for the likes of Jrue/Dipo/Beal at this stage.

There isn't anyone we can sign in free agency that would be worth losing Dragic + Crowder IMO (and losing both is the only way to get enough cap space for a meaningful player) unless You really believe Christian Wood is a great fit and that he's about to become an Allstar level player. (And you'll need to also believe that you can replace Dragic's production at least to some degree)