Official Trade Thread -- Part XXXIX

[queridiculo]

On the other hand, Kevin O'Connor had the Wizards moving up to 6 in a draft night trade (TBJ, 9th, and 37th for the Hawks' 6th pick) so where there's smoke, there's fire?

The 37th pick alone should be enough to move up 3 spots, throwing in TBJ would be a ridiculous overpay.

I am not even sure I would be willing to give up our 2nd rounder, there are going to be some good players available 31-40, Washington would be wise to hold onto the pick.

[Ed Wood]

It does feel kind of like an inductive leap from "well if the point of the trade is to move up for Okongwu then the move marginalizes Bryant on the roster in itself sooo..." while sort of skating past a longer look at whether the actual trade parses especially well. Also, proceeding from that assumption Okongwu seems like far and away the player that the Hawks would most benefit from adding as well, and given that their roster is kind of similar to Washington's in that interior defense is an obvious issue they don't seem obviously more interested in Bryant than Washington. Really the two teams - their general strengths and their apparent needs - seem very similar, so a trade like this seems destined to be obviously better for one than the other.

I hope my speculation is in the neighborhood of the actual explanation for the proposed trade. Having spitballed to this point I kind of feel committed not to actually find out and trust I have a perfect read.

[doclinkin]

It does feel kind of like an inductive leap from "well if the point of the trade is to move up for Okongwu then the move marginalizes Bryant on the roster in itself sooo..." while sort of skating past a longer look at whether the actual trade parses especially well. Also, proceeding from that assumption Okongwu seems like far and away the player that the Hawks would most benefit from adding as well, and given that their roster is kind of similar to Washington's in that interior defense is an obvious issue they don't seem obviously more interested in Bryant than Washington. Really the two teams - their general strengths and their apparent needs - seem very similar, so a trade like this seems destined to be obviously better for one than the other.

I hope my speculation is in the neighborhood of the actual explanation for the proposed trade. Having spitballed to this point I kind of feel committed not to actually find out and trust I have a perfect read.

Would Okonwu be perceived as a significant upgrade over Clint Capela in the front court? He hasn't played a game for them after the 4 team trade, but they are committed to him for $72 million over the next few years. I suspect they feel they are largely set at the position of front court utility defender.

If I'm guessing they'd be looking for a perimeter player who can score off the ball but can also pick up playmaking duties when Trae is out of the game. If he is a decent perimeter defender then all the better. I'd think Halliburton would be a solid fit in that respect.

[Ed Wood]

I confess I did forget that Capela was on the roster; he does sort of obviate the need to draft for defensive presence in the middle (or at least doing so so soon after that trade would be sort of embarrassing looking).

e: to put a little more effort into the idea because obviously I didn't nail it off the bat - the Hawks do also have sort of an infinite number of young small forward-y players milling around as well. Washington's sort of over-saturated with players who aren't clearly NBA players yet but might eventually be (especially at forward), but I'm not exactly sure what else to look at if we're trying to calibrate the trade a little better for value exchanged.

[doclinkin]

I confess I did forget that Capela was on the roster; he does sort of obviate the need to draft for defensive presence in the middle (or at least doing so so soon after that trade would be sort of embarrassing looking).

Either way, I get the feeling Edwards may slip. But I can't see him sliding past Atlanta. If they had an ath-elite at the 2 they give Trae a weapon that he doesn't yet have. His decision making and shot selection issues are minimized if Trae gets to decide where and when he gets the ball. And in that case they'd be uninterested in swapping downward.

[Dark Faze]

I don't know that I like Okongwu significantly more than Achiuwa to the point where I'd trade up to get him.

[Ed Wood]

I think that's eminently reasonable with the caveat that if Okongwu is off the board at 9 I imagine it is going to be extremely likely that someone I'd rather draft than Achiuwa is going to be available instead.

There's no way to say this without sounding like a hater, but I'm very glad that we're almost definitely not going to be in a position to draft Edwards. Nothing I see about his year at Georgia particularly supports his being a transcendent talent and dude just has some powerful Corey Maggette energy.

[nate33]

I don't know that I like Okongwu significantly more than Achiuwa to the point where I'd trade up to get him.

I'm in general agreement.

I might package our #37 with the #9 to move up 2 or 3 spots, or maybe swap some combination of Robinson, Wagner and Ish for a contract expiring in 2022 as an incentive to move up, but I wouldn't give up any major asset. I definitely wouldn't give a future 1st or one of Brown, Bryant, Bonga or Rui.

[Ruzious]

Chase Hughes of NBC Sports changed his story. Now, it's multiple teams WITHOUT cap room are looking into sign and trade options re Bertans. https://hoopshype.com/rumor/teams-planning-sign-and-trade-offers-for-davis-bertans/

I heard the rumor on sports talk radio this AM, and they said 3 unnamed teams are interested - just saying 2 are in the West and 1 in the East.

Again, it never made sense that teams with cap room would do a sign and trade, because he's a UFA, and they could simply sign him without giving up anything, and he'd be their's.

[nate33]

I confess I did forget that Capela was on the roster; he does sort of obviate the need to draft for defensive presence in the middle (or at least doing so so soon after that trade would be sort of embarrassing looking).

Either way, I get the feeling Edwards may slip. But I can't see him sliding past Atlanta. If they had an ath-elite at the 2 they give Trae a weapon that he doesn't yet have. His decision making and shot selection issues are minimized if Trae gets to decide where and when he gets the ball. And in that case they'd be uninterested in swapping downward.

I don't think he'll slip at all. I think he goes top 3 - top 4 at the worst. While there are a lot of red flags, he is still one of the few guys in this draft that one can picture as a legit All-Star someday. The kid has talent.

[dckingsfan]

I don't know that I like Okongwu significantly more than Achiuwa to the point where I'd trade up to get him.

I'm in general agreement.

I might package our #37 with the #9 to move up 2 or 3 spots, or maybe swap some combination of Robinson, Wagner and Ish for a contract expiring in 2022 as an incentive to move up, but I wouldn't give up any major asset. I definitely wouldn't give a future 1st or one of Brown, Bryant, Bonga or Rui.

Especially this...

[Frichuela]

In the Pacers board there was an active discussion about a sign-and-trade of Bertans for Myles Turner...

Problem is they would like our #9 pick...The best (or least worst) proposal was as follows: Bertans (S&T), Bryant and #9 for Myles Turner (3-years left) and Mcdermott (1-year left).

Mcdermott shot over 40% last season, maybe he can somehow replace Bertan's role and Turner can also stretch the floor (while being one of the premier rim protectors in the NBA).

Would any of you do it?

I would still prefer to draft Okongwu at #9, but if he's not available and the Pacers would add a future lottery-protected first or 2 future second rounders, it could be tempting..

[nate33]

Chase Hughes of NBC Sports changed his story. Now, it's multiple teams WITHOUT cap room are looking into sign and trade options re Bertans. https://hoopshype.com/rumor/teams-planning-sign-and-trade-offers-for-davis-bertans/

I heard the rumor on sports talk radio this AM, and they said 3 unnamed teams are interested - just saying 2 are in the West and 1 in the East.

Again, it never made sense that teams with cap room would do a sign and trade, because he's a UFA, and they could simply sign him without giving up anything, and he'd be their's.

Yes, that makes a lot more sense. And it could also drive up the price we charge since they have no other way of absorbing Bertans' new salary. The one issue is that we would have to take back filler salary equal to roughly 80% of Bertans' new contract.

[nate33]

In the Pacers board there was an active discussion about a sign-and-trade of Bertans for Myles Turner...

Problem is they would like our #9 pick...The best (or least worst) proposal was as follows: Bertans (S&T), Bryant and #9 for Myles Turner (3-years left) and Mcdermott (1-year left).

Mcdermott shot over 40% last season, maybe he can somehow replace Bertan's role and Turner can also stretch the floor (while being one of the premier rim protectors in the NBA).

Would any of you do it?

I would still prefer to draft Okongwu at #9, but if he's not available and the Pacers would add a future lottery-protected first or 2 future second rounders, it could be tempting..

We can't trade our #9 pick as part of the transaction because the draft is before free agency. It would have to be a future pick, which makes a bit more sense under the premise that we are trying to win now.

Something like Bertans + lotto protected 1st for Turner is the framework of a good trade. (I don't see why they'd want Bryant given that they have Sabonis and Bitadze already.)

With our center needs taken care of, we can opt for best player available at #9. We have needs at every position except center and shooting guard. A defensive wing like Okoro, or a shooter like Nesmith to replace Bertans would be nice.

[Ruzious]

In the Pacers board there was an active discussion about a sign-and-trade of Bertans for Myles Turner...

Problem is they would like our #9 pick...The best (or least worst) proposal was as follows: Bertans (S&T), Bryant and #9 for Myles Turner (3-years left) and Mcdermott (1-year left).

Mcdermott shot over 40% last season, maybe he can somehow replace Bertan's role and Turner can also stretch the floor (while being one of the premier rim protectors in the NBA).

Would any of you do it?

I would still prefer to draft Okongwu at #9, but if he's not available and the Pacers would add a future lottery-protected first or 2 future second rounders, it could be tempting..

Wait what? I wouldn't consider trading any 2 of Bertans, Bryant, and 9 for Turner and McDermott. Frankly, I'd much prefer Bryant at 8.5 mil a year than Turner at 17.5 mil a year.

[Dat2U]

In the Pacers board there was an active discussion about a sign-and-trade of Bertans for Myles Turner...

Problem is they would like our #9 pick...The best (or least worst) proposal was as follows: Bertans (S&T), Bryant and #9 for Myles Turner (3-years left) and Mcdermott (1-year left).

Mcdermott shot over 40% last season, maybe he can somehow replace Bertan's role and Turner can also stretch the floor (while being one of the premier rim protectors in the NBA).

Would any of you do it?

I would still prefer to draft Okongwu at #9, but if he's not available and the Pacers would add a future lottery-protected first or 2 future second rounders, it could be tempting..

We can't trade our #9 pick as part of the transaction because the draft is before free agency. It would have to be a future pick, which makes a bit more sense under the premise that we are trying to win now.

Something like Bertans + lotto protected 1st for Turner is the framework of a good trade. (I don't see why they'd want Bryant given that they have Sabonis and Bitadze already.)

With our center needs taken care of, we can opt for best player available at #9. We have needs at every position except center and shooting guard. A defensive wing like Okoro, or a shooter like Nesmith to replace Bertans would be nice.

I don't love Turner. Definitely a 2nd tier big. He would improve the defense tho. I value Bertans spacing from the 4 alot. I'd consider a swap depending on how much $$$ Bertans would get but I'm not trading a first. They can have JRob or Wags tho lol.

[nate33]

Frankly, I'd much prefer Bryant at 8.5 mil a year than Turner at 17.5 mil a year.

I don't know if I'd go that far. I get the individual statistical argument, but Turner has great defensive advanced stats and has led his team to be among the best defensive teams in the league over the last two years (ranked 3rd in 2018 and 6th in 2019) despite having fairly ordinary defenders at other positions. He ranked 7th in DRPM this year and 2nd the year before.

I know Turner can be on the floor during crunch time of a playoff game. I don't know about Bryant, or Bertans for that matter. I also like that Turner's contract is flat, with no raises.

[doclinkin]

In the Pacers board there was an active discussion about a sign-and-trade of Bertans for Myles Turner...

Problem is they would like our #9 pick...The best (or least worst) proposal was as follows: Bertans (S&T), Bryant and #9 for Myles Turner (3-years left) and Mcdermott (1-year left).

Mcdermott shot over 40% last season, maybe he can somehow replace Bertan's role and Turner can also stretch the floor (while being one of the premier rim protectors in the NBA).

Would any of you do it?

I would still prefer to draft Okongwu at #9, but if he's not available and the Pacers would add a future lottery-protected first or 2 future second rounders, it could be tempting..

Flat no for me. And I like Myles Turner. Bryant is a young improving big with upside and good effort. Bertans opens the floor up for Wall and Beal. Defensive bigs can be found in this draft and others. And we are supposed to also give a pick (even in a future year)? For a hefty contract?

[queridiculo]

In the Pacers board there was an active discussion about a sign-and-trade of Bertans for Myles Turner...

Problem is they would like our #9 pick...The best (or least worst) proposal was as follows: Bertans (S&T), Bryant and #9 for Myles Turner (3-years left) and Mcdermott (1-year left).

Mcdermott shot over 40% last season, maybe he can somehow replace Bertan's role and Turner can also stretch the floor (while being one of the premier rim protectors in the NBA).

Would any of you do it?

I would still prefer to draft Okongwu at #9, but if he's not available and the Pacers would add a future lottery-protected first or 2 future second rounders, it could be tempting..

Wait what? I wouldn't consider trading any 2 of Bertans, Bryant, and 9 for Turner and McDermott. Frankly, I'd much prefer Bryant at 8.5 mil a year than Turner at 17.5 mil a year.

Yeah, that's absurd, there's not way I'd include a lottery pick to make this happen.

Perhaps I could talk myself into this years 2nd or future considerations, but that's about it.

Bertans has an elite skill we'd be hard pressed to add any time soon.

[nate33]

I don't love Turner. Definitely a 2nd tier big. He would improve the defense tho. I value Bertans spacing from the 4 alot. I'd consider a swap depending on how much $$$ Bertans would get but I'm not trading a first. They can have JRob or Wags tho lol.

Don't overlook the lotto protection on that first.

If we were in a long rebuild mode, I'd lean against this trade. But let's face it, there is a lot of pressure to get this team back to respectability or else Beal will depart. If we don't trade Beal, then I fully expect some other trade like this where we trade youth/picks for veteran talent. Better to trade for a guy who is only 24 years old than trade for some 30-year-old vet on the decline. It's also nice that Turner projects to be a very nice offensive fit for Wall and Beal because he can be effective outside of the paint.