BaF Season 4- Opening Night 12/1- (Announcement page 57)

[Smash3]

that doesn't solve the issue that non bird right teams could be good faith bidding on a player...lose out on that said player and then can't pivot to another FA because he is out of bids. In that scenario you would agree both the teams rightuflly wanted that player. One good faith team lost and then can't pivot just because of a rule?

This scenario of bad faith bidding is way overblown. You think there are a ton of GM's that are just waiting until 5 hours and 59 minutes to screw people on a 6 hour bid? I think most people wants bids to end sooner so they can move onto other targets.

You've never participated in FA, you would be surprised at the amount of times some GM's were raising the bid last minute. That happened to me at least 4-5 times.

and yet you still walked away with an amazing offseason with Lowry being an absolute steal. I'm not saying it doesn't happen. It does happen agreed, but does it happen enough to warrant hurting teams that actually are legit bidding. How do you decide a bad faith and good faith bid?

Now you're bugging MP, obviously if a team bids on the player I am bidding on it is a bad faith move.

[mpharris36]

In two years everyone will have bird rights on their own guys, that's not applicable for that year. It's going to be absolute madness, no way around it if we keep the current system. If Bish is already saying that this free agency was tough for him, you know some changes need to be implemented.

Not everyone is going to keep their players. We’ve just seen a lot players with bird rights go to new teams in this free agency.

Absolutely, there are going to be players that get let go. It's no secret that I plan on letting Love and Hayward go to have that money to play in free agency. My point was that most teams are going to attempt to keep their "core" intact. You're not going to let Bam/Tatum walk, you'll fight for them all day long. I don't think we'll see a frugal offseason because everyone will have money and that'll be a chance to really make moves. It'll be everyone's chance to get a franchise player if they don't have one.

and if we put caps on bids there with so many star FA's there is going to be nightmare scenarios where people with bird rights are in a huge advantage to keep there guys at ridiculously low costs because they have the power to unlimited bid there own guys.

I am not a fan of max min bids per day at all especially the effect that it will have on the 2022 FA class which is ultimately why were are having this convo.

[bringbackhoffa]

Not everyone is going to keep their players. We’ve just seen a lot players with bird rights go to new teams in this free agency.

Absolutely, there are going to be players that get let go. It's no secret that I plan on letting Love and Hayward go to have that money to play in free agency. My point was that most teams are going to attempt to keep their "core" intact. You're not going to let Bam/Tatum walk, you'll fight for them all day long. I don't think we'll see a frugal offseason because everyone will have money and that'll be a chance to really make moves. It'll be everyone's chance to get a franchise player if they don't have one.

and if we put caps on bids there with so many star FA's there is going to be nightmare scenarios where people with bird rights are in a huge advantage to keep there guys at ridiculously low costs because they have the power to unlimited bid there own guys.

I am not a fan of max min bids per day at all especially the effect that it will have on the 2022 FA class which is ultimately why were are having this convo.

max bids could be manipulated, most GMs here dont have patience, could just wait till the end of the day while everyone else has used up there bids and come in and clean up

[mpharris36]

You've never participated in FA, you would be surprised at the amount of times some GM's were raising the bid last minute. That happened to me at least 4-5 times.

and yet you still walked away with an amazing offseason with Lowry being an absolute steal. I'm not saying it doesn't happen. It does happen agreed, but does it happen enough to warrant hurting teams that actually are legit bidding. How do you decide a bad faith and good faith bid?

Now you're bugging MP, obviously if a team bids on the player I am bidding on it is a bad faith move.

[NewEra]

Couple of things I'll address here while I have a few minutes.

First off, as to the Free Agent desirability list. Overall, the first three seasons I think that this has been a fairly accurate and fair list. Teams that have won a lot like Dallas, Portland and Chicago have always been at the top while teams that started BaF building through youth and therefore losing more (Cleveland, Charlotte, Houston etc.) have been towards the bottom. This year was the first year we saw a few teams move a bit. New Orleans, Cleveland and Charlotte moved up the list some and rightfully so IMO as their build is further along then teams like Houston, San Antonio or the Lakers. Of course there are kinks in this system. Detroit still had a decent FA rating (in comparison to the other rebuilding teams) because they have a decent three year record (from Greenie's run as GM) and also because of the youth/future that Context has built. Conversely, Golden State had a poor rating this year. Obviously if I was being subjective and putting my own thoughts into these ratings, GS should be near the top of the list. But the numbers didn't lie and I wasn't going to manipulate them because of what I thought they should be (as much as I like NewEra and respect what he puts into BaF). Everyone knew what that list was based on before the offseason began and no one should be surprised when a team with no draft picks, no star player and basically an empty roster ended up being down the list. The list isn't designed to prohibit teams lower on it from getting a FA or make it extra easy or cheap for the good teams to sign who they want.
It just provides a little weight so teams bidding on the same player have different odds of getting that player. The list is not perfect obviously but I think overall, it's fair.

Second, the idea of tiered releases, maximum bids per day or public bids seem to be the most popular thoughts at this time. My thoughts on these: Tiered releases and maximum bids placed per day are both somethings I've thought about as well. Maybe releasing 30 players a day or only allowing teams to place x number of bids per day would make things easier. But as others have mentioned, there will be issues with both of these systems that hurt the fairness and competitiveness of the league. Making all bids public is not something I've thought much about. Honestly, I don't know how it would work. Considering offers deal with different amount of money and years and also factoring in the FA list that weights offers, I'm not sure how making the leading offer public would translate to the rest of the league?

For example, assume the leading bid on player x is $100/4 from Oklahoma City (using them because they are middle of the road on the FA list). Each team still has a different number that they could offer to take that leading bid.

My overall idea was that FA was always the part of the game that concerned me the most. Keeping it fair while also somewhat realistic was always the challenge. For the most part, I think three offseasons in, we have done that. I am not looking for major changes to the system unless there is an overwhelming amount of support for something. I just think it needs to be tweaked a bit in order to lessen what will undoubtedly be a crazy year two seasons from now.

I’m willing to let it go because I’ll always find a way to remain competitive, but I still don’t think I should’ve been that low.

My main concern is your workload. I don’t know how you managed to do what you did with your real life responsibilities. Hopefully we can figure something out. I’ve said thank you a million times, but Again, thank you.

[Depalma2002]

Biggest issue seems to be there is just too many pm's for bish and it creates a backlog and delay.

Kinda to take something from NewEra's proposal....could possibly release free agents by rating or something like this:

Day 1: 5 Star
Day 3: 4 Star
Day 5: 3 Star
Day 7: 2 star
Day 9: 1 star and undrafted free agents

I agree with this one

[mpharris36]

Absolutely, there are going to be players that get let go. It's no secret that I plan on letting Love and Hayward go to have that money to play in free agency. My point was that most teams are going to attempt to keep their "core" intact. You're not going to let Bam/Tatum walk, you'll fight for them all day long. I don't think we'll see a frugal offseason because everyone will have money and that'll be a chance to really make moves. It'll be everyone's chance to get a franchise player if they don't have one.

and if we put caps on bids there with so many star FA's there is going to be nightmare scenarios where people with bird rights are in a huge advantage to keep there guys at ridiculously low costs because they have the power to unlimited bid there own guys.

I am not a fan of max min bids per day at all especially the effect that it will have on the 2022 FA class which is ultimately why were are having this convo.

max bids could be manipulated, most GMs here dont have patience, could just wait till the end of the day while everyone else has used up there bids and come in and clean up

it creates that nightmare scenario where a team can have money and want a player but simply cant bid on a player because of a rule. I think that would be pretty damning.

If you have the cap space and want a player nothing should limit you on making a bid on any player no matter if its early in the day or later in the day.

[3toheadmelo]

Not everyone is going to keep their players. We’ve just seen a lot players with bird rights go to new teams in this free agency.

Absolutely, there are going to be players that get let go. It's no secret that I plan on letting Love and Hayward go to have that money to play in free agency. My point was that most teams are going to attempt to keep their "core" intact. You're not going to let Bam/Tatum walk, you'll fight for them all day long. I don't think we'll see a frugal offseason because everyone will have money and that'll be a chance to really make moves. It'll be everyone's chance to get a franchise player if they don't have one.

and if we put caps on bids there with so many star FA's there is going to be nightmare scenarios where people with bird rights are in a huge advantage to keep there guys at ridiculously low costs because they have the power to unlimited bid there own guys.

I am not a fan of max min bids per day at all especially the effect that it will have on the 2022 FA class which is ultimately why were are having this convo.

If a team is serious about getting a player with bird rights then they should make a serious offer. You want them to try and low ball all day wasting time.

Minimum bids only reduces bish’s workload and reduces bad faith bids. And it allows steals to continue to be a prominent feature of this game which ultimately adds competitiveness into the league. Your proposal is allowing bad faith bids to be the norm in this game, making the game less competitive with little to none steals.

[Depalma2002]

I think we all/majority agree:

No tiered release - all players released on same day

Public bidding/Sub-forum/Google Doc is looking to be a consensus. It looks to be the most feasible way to reduce Bish's workload without overhauling FA as much. I think the public bidding will reduce some of those "bad faith bids" that people mention and will help everyone see in realtime where players and their $$ stand

What am I missing. I don't see how tiered release or any other type of release where not everyone is released at once, kills bird advantage.

I do see releasing all at once gives tremendous advantage to teams with a lot of cap and a lot of open roster spots. A team with just enough money for 1 free agent or just one roster spot can only bid on one guy at a time, while others get to scatter bids around. Some teams have plan A/B/C/D available to them. Others have to wait for the result of their first attempt and by the time that is determined their next 10 choices are off the board.

[Slicin N Dicin]

and if we put caps on bids there with so many star FA's there is going to be nightmare scenarios where people with bird rights are in a huge advantage to keep there guys at ridiculously low costs because they have the power to unlimited bid there own guys.

I am not a fan of max min bids per day at all especially the effect that it will have on the 2022 FA class which is ultimately why were are having this convo.

max bids could be manipulated, most GMs here dont have patience, could just wait till the end of the day while everyone else has used up there bids and come in and clean up

it creates that nightmare scenario where a team can have money and want a player but simply cant bid on a player because of a rule. I think that would be pretty damning.

If you have the cap space and want a player nothing should limit you on making a bid on any player no matter if its early in the day or later in the day.

This, 100 times over. we can't punish teams who have cap space and want to bid on players.

FA is always going to be tough. I missed out on Dinwiddie because of personal obligations I had and I missed a day and a half of free agency...now if i were to come back the next day and try to get in as many bids as i can with the cap space i have to make up for what i missed, I would get punished? Just because people are mad that players get bid up?

I've been involved in free agency, yeah it sucks when bids go up on a player, but we all have busy lives, not everything is a run up last minute on a player...sometimes they just get announced late when bish gets to it or sometimes people don't have a chance to hop on until a certain time. We shouldn't punish people because we're tight over what we perceive are last minute or bad faith bids.

[bishnykfan]

My main concern is your workload. I don’t know how you managed to do what you did with your real life responsibilities. Hopefully we can figure something out.

I agree with you. Subjectively you shouldn't have been that low. You had a 5 star rating for your past performance but the other three categories were basically a zero for you this year. With the four categories being weighed equally, there really wasn't anything that could be done about that once you went in the direction you went. If you want to say that past performance should get weighed more than the other three categories, you can make that argument.

[bishnykfan]

Just wanted to post this here. A proposal I got from someone via PM. Obviously took a lot of thought and time coming up with it so it deserves to be looked at and discussed.

Hi Bish,
Free Agency Proposal
My approach would be a bit different. Free agency would last a bit longer and run in 2 stages.
Stage 1, you would go through each team and pick out their best players that are free agents, you can
make this choice by perhaps going with the SIM Rating. (Or you can choose top 30 players overall and
ignore going 1 per team)
On day 1 of free agency, 1 player from each team would be put on the free agent list and be up for
bidding. Each team will be allowed to send ONLY 1 message on day 1. In that message they would have
the bid for its bird rights player (should they want to bid on them) and in preference any other bids they
want to make staying under the cap after taking into account its bird right player bid. If at the end of day
1 the team with bird rights has the best offer for their player, they would automatically re-sign at the
end of day 1. Should there be an offer higher than what the bird right team put forth then in day 2 the
bird right team and the team with the highest offer would battle it out. I see this playing out as a series
of 3 rounds of bids between the 2 teams. If the team with bird rights did not submit an offer the top 2
teams with the highest offers would move onto day 2 with 3 rounds of bidding.
During the 3 rounds of bidding on day 2, if the team with bird rights has the highest bid after any round,
they would re-sign its player. This would be done so the non-bird right team does not play games with
the first 2 rounds of bids and then comes out with a much different offer in round 3. Both teams should
be putting forth competitive bids each round (with the team with bird rights incentivized to have the
highest bid at the conclusion of each round of bids). At no point can an offer be less than what they had
bid the prior round, offer must be equal to or be greater than the previous offer it made. At any time,
the team with bird rights can bow out and indicate it cannot beat the offer and the non-bird right team
would win the player. The bird right team can do this at the end of day 1 or at the conclusion of any of
the rounds of bids on day 2. If the battle is between 2 non bird right teams the team with the highest
offer at the conclusion of round 3 or has the highest offer in back to back rounds wins the player.
Ties on day 1 and day 2 between non bird right teams would go to the team with the higher free agency
ranking.
Ties on day 1 and 2 between non bird right teams and bird rights team would go to the team with bird
rights (you can change this to the team with higher free agency ranking)
I see the above removing the long drawn out process of teams nickel and diming its players, all teams
putting forth its best offers, and make it a bit more realistic with a player choosing between 2 teams as
opposed to 30.
Lets take the below 30 players as being the day 1 list
Patrick McCaw Steph Curry Clint Capela
Joel Embiid Brandon Ingram Kyrie Irving
Rudy Gobert James Harden Avery Bradley
John Collins Andrew Wiggins Buddy Hield
Lebron James Fred Vanvleet Kemba Walker
Kawhi Leonard Kristaps Porzingis Giannis Antetokounmpo

Jason Tatum Otto Porter De’Aaron Fox
Brandon Goodwin Ben Simmons Klay Thompson
Karl Antony Towns Kevin Durant Antony Davis
Jimmy Butler Bradley Beal Frank Ntilikina
Example 1 (cap space listed are estimates)
Boston- Player with Bird Rights Patrick McCaw, Cap Space: $975
Brooklyn- Player with Bird Rights Joel Embiid, Cap Space: $985
Cleveland: Player with Bird Rights Jason Tatum, Cap Space: $895

Suppose you are Boston you may not want to offer McCaw a contract so it could list its preference of
offers like:
1. Giannis Antetokounmpo $500/4
2. Kevin Durant $500/4
3. Lebron James $500/4
4. Jason Tatum $350/4
5. Kawhi Leonard $500/4
6. Brandon Ingram $350/4
7. Bradley Beal $350/4
8. Steph Curry $500/4
9. Joel Embiid $350/4
10. Karl Antony Towns $200/4
11. Fred Vanvleet $125/4
12. Buddy Hield $100/4
13. John Collins $350/4
Lets say Dallas or another team offered $520/4 to Giannis so Boston would not have a higher offer. Let
us say Boston offered the best contract to Durant including Portland. Boston would than go into day 2 to
face off with Portland in up to 3 rounds of bidding if Portland submitted an offer, lets say for this
example Portland did submit an offer to Durant. Boston’s offer to Lebron now would be void as it would
not have enough cap space as it was low on Durant. Boston’s offer to Tatum would be valid but lets say
it did not have the highest offer. Kawhi offer would be void since it would put it over the cap. Offers to
Ingram or Beal would be valid but let us say it did not have the highest offer. Offer to Curry would be
void as it would put it over the cap. Offers to Embiid and Karl Antony Towns would be valid but let us say
they were not high. Now let us say Boston did have the highest offer to Fred VanVleet and Buddy Hield,
and since it does have the necessary cap space both offers would be valid and it would now also go into
a head to head battle for those 2 players as well. Offer to John Collins would be void as it no longer has
sufficient cap space after being low on Durant, Fred VanVleet, and Buddy Hield.

Boston’s total remaining cap space for the duration of its 3 battles would be $975-500-125-100= $250.
For this example, let us say the Washington Wizards decided at the end of day 1 after being informed
that the high offer on VanVleet was $125/4 that it no longer was interested in re-signing him. At this
point in the beginning of day 2 Boston would be notified that it secured Fred VanVleet and it would only
now have 2 battles, Durant and Hield.
Lets say in round 1 of Day 2 Boston upped its offer to Durant to $550/4, that would mean it would only
have $200 additional to use on an offer on Hield and any subsequent offers on Durant in rounds 2 or 3 if
necessary. Let us say its offer to Hield was bumped up to $150/4 in round 1 vs Phoenix. Reducing total
cap space to $150. At the end of Round 1 lets say Portland bid $505/5 for Durant and Phoenix bid
$101/5 for Hield. Portland would be informed that the low bid for Durant is $550/4 and its next bid
would need to be $XXX/X to continue bidding. Phoenix would be informed that its next bid would need
to be $XXX/X to continue bidding. Let us say after being informed of what the 2 nd round bid required to
stay in the running for Hield, Phoenix bows out, Boston would be awarded Hield after 1 round of bidding
on day 2. For its second bid to Durant lets say Boston offered $560/4, leaving it with $140 in cap space,
and Portland offered $550/5. Portland being the team with bird rights and offering the better offer in
round 2 would automatically be awarded Durant. Boston would be left with a total of $700 in cap space
and awarded both Fred Vanvleet and Buddy Hield after day 1 and 2 of bidding.
Example 2
Suppose you are Brooklyn and you want to use your bird rights to re-sign Embiid, your list may look like
this then:
1. Joel Embiid $525/5
No offers can be higher than $460 as that is its remaining cap space after bird right offer ($985-525)
2. Kevin Durant $400/4
3. Bradley Beal $400/4
4. Giannis Antetokounmpo $450/4
5. Lebron James $400/4
6. Kyrie Irving $250/4
7. Kawhi Leonard $400/4
Let us say Brooklyn offered the highest contract to Embiid on day 1, Embiid automatically re-signs at the
conclusion of day 1 with the Nets. Brooklyn would be left with $985-525= $460 in cap space. Lets say
offers to Beal, Giannis, Lebron were all not low. Lets say offer to Irving was the highest and LAC also
extended a offer to Irving, Brooklyn and LAC would face off in day 2 in up to 3 rounds of bidding.
Brooklyn’s offer would be void on Kawhi as it no longer has sufficient cap space. In its day 2 battle for
Irving, Brooklyn would have an additional $210 to increase its offers ($985-525-250=$210) should they
want.

Example 3
Lets say you are the Cleveland Cavaliers who have numerous bird right free agents that they would like
to retain, and only 1 appears on day 1 list. It may just decide to only bid on Jason Tatum and not list any
other free agents so it does not tie up any additional cap space it may deem necessary for future bids.
***I could see a team like Cleveland having an issue with 1 player being selected to be on the initial
list. Given Cleveland has many top young players in this free agency class that it likely wants to re-sign
it may prefer a list of the top 30 players so just in case it cannot sign one of its players it can quickly
move on rather than missing out on numerous top end players. The counter argument would be that
it can still go over the cap to sign its other bird right players that appear on subsequent lists. The issue
with going over the cap is something that requires further thought when reviewing preference lists***

Structure
You could structure it that so all bids on day 1 have to be in by 9:00am so you would get the whole day
uninterrupted to go through the 30 messages as it could take some time to review and cross reference
offers on the same player. Given the different time zones you could maybe even allow for teams to
submit bids the day prior (and give yourself more time by getting a head start)
You could structure that bid 1 on day 2 has to be submitted between 6:00am-10:00am, bid 2 has to be
in between 1:00pm-5:00pm (giving you 3 hours to get back to the teams on what the new high bid is),
and bid 3 has to be in between 8:00pm-12:00am (giving you 3 hours to get back to the teams on what
the new high bid is)
You would then repeat the above day 1 on day 3 with the teams second best player from each team
added on the free agency list (or the top 31-60 players)
Day 4 would run similar to day 2 with the 3 rounds of bidding.
You could even stretch out free agency and have days 1 and 2 run on one Saturday & Sunday and then
have days 3 and 4 run on the following Saturday and Sunday (just so work is not getting in the way)
Day 5 we would revert to what we currently do with all the remaining free agents on the board. Days 1-4
would help remove 60 top tier players from the board and hopefully reduce the number of PMs and
aggravation all parties may have at having to constantly be at their computer. If you want you could
also amend this process and run lists for the remaining free agents and have days 5 and 6 etc.. run
similar to days 1 and 2 (probably better for you as reduces number of PMs).

This proposal would accomplish a few things. One a lot less PM’s for you. 2 nd eliminate numerous back
and forth offers that are frivolous in nature. 3 rd provide an incentive to teams with bird rights. 4 th if we go
with the method whereby the best players are going to be on the initial lists it would allow teams to
quickly pivot should they miss out on their player. 5 th it would lead to mid-tier players not getting way
below market value as teams maybe preoccupied in battles for top end talent, just like in real life the
mid-tier and lower tier players would sign once the bigger names are off the board.

If you believe 30 players on a list could be too time consuming to review, could always knock it down to
15 players. I do believe if this proposal were to move forward, that it be used in next year’s free agency
as well, as that would allow for the necessary tweaks should they be required for the all important year
5 free agency.
Appreciate you taking the time to review, let me know if you have any questions.

[Slicin N Dicin]

Another thought I had was with signing Bird Rights players - you're allowed to go over the cap to sign them, but if you sign them before a non-bird right player....you already used up your cap space on them and can't sign non-bird FA's (might not be explaining this exactly how I want but hopefully y'all get the point, but i ran into this situation when I was placing bids this year)

I think Bird Right players can have an agreement to sign with the team, but should not be "actually signed" or hit the cap until you've had a chance to sign non-bird FA's.

Hopefully you understand what i meant, if not forget it lol

[3toheadmelo]

and if we put caps on bids there with so many star FA's there is going to be nightmare scenarios where people with bird rights are in a huge advantage to keep there guys at ridiculously low costs because they have the power to unlimited bid there own guys.

I am not a fan of max min bids per day at all especially the effect that it will have on the 2022 FA class which is ultimately why were are having this convo.

max bids could be manipulated, most GMs here dont have patience, could just wait till the end of the day while everyone else has used up there bids and come in and clean up

it creates that nightmare scenario where a team can have money and want a player but simply cant bid on a player because of a rule. I think that would be pretty damning.

If you have the cap space and want a player nothing should limit you on making a bid on any player no matter if its early in the day or later in the day.

Like I said before. Make a serious offer. You just want guys to low ball offers all day long. It’s a waste of everybody’s time.

[3toheadmelo]

I just don’t see how allowing bird rights players to exceed their amount of minimum bids is a huge disadvantage to others. If you’re serious about getting that player then make a serious offer that’s good enough to steal the player. Otherwise you’re wasting time.

[Depalma2002]

Another thought I had was with signing Bird Rights players - you're allowed to go over the cap to sign them, but if you sign them before a non-bird right player....you already used up your cap space on them and can't sign non-bird FA's (might not be explaining this exactly how I want but hopefully y'all get the point, but i ran into this situation when I was placing bids this year)

I think Bird Right players can have an agreement to sign with the team, but should not be "actually signed" or hit the cap until you've had a chance to sign non-bird FA's.

Hopefully you understand what i meant, if not forget it lol

I second this.

I also like the PM'd proposal that Bish just put out there as a good base.

[Slicin N Dicin]

max bids could be manipulated, most GMs here dont have patience, could just wait till the end of the day while everyone else has used up there bids and come in and clean up

it creates that nightmare scenario where a team can have money and want a player but simply cant bid on a player because of a rule. I think that would be pretty damning.

If you have the cap space and want a player nothing should limit you on making a bid on any player no matter if its early in the day or later in the day.

Like I said before. Make a serious offer. You just want guys to low ball offers all day long. It’s a waste of everybody’s time.

You can still make a serious offer and be stuck in that situation. There's too much of a concern being made on hypothetical bad faith bids or low ball offers, but realistically if the bid is $100/4 and you only need to offer $101/4 to beat it, common sense would say why would you spend any more than that $101 and try to allocate the other dollars somewhere else.

I've never made a bid on a player i didn't want or a bid on a player just so they wouldn't get signed for cheap....but I damn sure don't want to get punished and be unable to make a bid on a player because there's a cap on the number of bids i can make since people are upset that their bids are getting beat. I've gotten beat on bids last minute too, but you say fack, and either place a higher bid or move on...again we shouldn't punish the group because some are upset with the actions of few (or one)

[mpharris36]

max bids could be manipulated, most GMs here dont have patience, could just wait till the end of the day while everyone else has used up there bids and come in and clean up

it creates that nightmare scenario where a team can have money and want a player but simply cant bid on a player because of a rule. I think that would be pretty damning.

If you have the cap space and want a player nothing should limit you on making a bid on any player no matter if its early in the day or later in the day.

Like I said before. Make a serious offer. You just want guys to low ball offers all day long. It’s a waste of everybody’s time.

Define a serious offer. What you think a player is worth or what someone else does?

At least we don't have to wait for bish to update a non serious offer if he is busy. For example if you say submit 5 years $200 for Tatum right off the bat. And someone within 5 minutes submits 4 years $215. Is that not a serious offer? The good thing is you don't have to wait to pish to update you can go right back and submit 5 years $220 and then now we can have say maybe even 15 bids in a hour. Instead of 2 bids in 6 hours if Bish isn't around.

There can be serious offers as well as strategic offers. No one bids the same way. This is part of the game we don't want FA to end in 1 or 2 days either because it kills time in the offseason.

If you say gave everyone 10 bids a day what is the fun if people started bidding $400 to $500 right off the bat. Its fun to negotiate and if the bids at least were updating real time you would know when you would be beat. Also you could also want a player but don't want to go up at $50 intervals either. That isn't bad faith to send a $1 to $5 increase that just means you are trying to get the player at the most respectable cost possible. Nothing wrong with that.

Basically it seems like you are suggesting unless you overpay as a non bird right team and don't want to waste bids you wont get a player because bird right teams can fend off 15 teams if they want...but a legit team can't really get into a bidding war on a player if he isn't there and still have room to bid on other players at the same time.

[bishnykfan]

minimum bids with 75% or more of the league being FA is going to be a disaster. You going to tell me Melo who has every right to keep Tatum and Bam if he has the money potentially could lose out on day 1 of one of them because he potentially used up all his bids?

You can't worry about bad faith bids especially if bids are public and update real time. That will eliminate a team being put in a position to wait for Bish to update which basically eliminates the negative impact of bad faith bids because in the past if bish didn't update you are losing why another player you might way ended you wouldn't have to worry about that with real time public bidding.

2010’s proposal was that bird rights holders get to exceed the minimum bids amount

In two years everyone will have bird rights on their own guys, that's not applicable for that year. It's going to be absolute madness, no way around it if we keep the current system. If Bish is already saying that this free agency was tough for him, you know some changes need to be implemented.

I'll say this about this past FA process.

I knew that FA this year was going to be more challenging then the past couple of offseasons due to the number of quality FA's and also because of the number of teams with cap space. I scheduled FA to start on a Sunday this year because I generally have Sunday-Monday off from work and I knew I would need to be around my computer more than usual. Saying that, I literally never left my laptop for more that ten minutes that first Sunday from 12PM-1AM. Monday was not much different. I received 369 PM's those first two days. For the most part, each PM received means I'm sending out two PM's (one as a reply to the sender and one to the GM who held the previous high bid telling them their bid was beat). As soon as 12PM hit I was flooded with 25+ PM's. Like I said, I was online for basically 13 hours straight and constantly clearing offers/PMs. But each time I cleared one, two more were waiting for me, lol. It got to the point pretty quickly that I was answering PM's sent two hours earlier. So, I will say that there were not any last minute bids that I can think of off the top of my head. It just got flooded with offers that I was two hours behind on.

I only bring it up because if that was the case this year, two years from now will be that much worse if we don't tweak things. I really don't think it needs to be anything major. Maybe just something as simple as putting a break in the middle of the day. Like bids are allowed from 12-5 and then from 7-12. The clock would stop during the two hour freeze which would allow me to catch up and keep everything on track. Or just make the day go from 6AM-10PM instead of midnight. FA was basically wrapped up after day three this year. Maybe something that drags it out a little more is all that is needed rather than radical changes that are being discussed. Public bids, max bids per day, etc...all things that will drastically change the system that for the most part, has worked pretty well IMO.

[Slicin N Dicin]

2010’s proposal was that bird rights holders get to exceed the minimum bids amount

In two years everyone will have bird rights on their own guys, that's not applicable for that year. It's going to be absolute madness, no way around it if we keep the current system. If Bish is already saying that this free agency was tough for him, you know some changes need to be implemented.

I'll say this about this past FA process.

I knew that FA this year was going to be more challenging then the past couple of offseasons due to the number of quality FA's and also because of the number of teams with cap space. I scheduled FA to start on a Sunday this year because I generally have Sunday-Monday off from work and I knew I would need to be around my computer more than usual. Saying that, I literally never left my laptop for more that ten minutes that first Sunday from 12PM-1AM. Monday was not much different. I received 369 PM's those first two days. For the most part, each PM received means I'm sending out two PM's (one as a reply to the sender and one to the GM who held the previous high bid telling them their bid was beat). As soon as 12PM hit I was flooded with 25+ PM's. Like I said, I was online for basically 13 hours straight and constantly clearing offers/PMs. But each time I cleared one, two more were waiting for me, lol. It got to the point pretty quickly that I was answering PM's sent two hours earlier. So, I will say that there were not any last minute bids that I can think of off the top of my head. It just got flooded with offers that I was two hours behind on.

I only bring it up because if that was the case this year, two years from now will be that much worse if we don't tweak things. I really don't think it needs to be anything major. Maybe just something as simple as putting a break in the middle of the day. Like bids are allowed from 12-5 and then from 7-12. The clock would stop during the two hour freeze which would allow me to catch up and keep everything on track. Or just make the day go from 6AM-10PM instead of midnight. FA was basically wrapped up after day three this year. Maybe something that drags it out a little more is all that is needed rather than radical changes that are being discussed. Public bids, max bids per day, etc...all things that will drastically change the system that for the most part, has worked pretty well IMO.

I think we all want it to be as easy as possible on you without changing the dynamic too much.

This might be the "fairest" option to do it since as you mentioned it doesn't alter the way things are and it gives you some breathing room.