The Chicago Bulls select forward Patrick Williams #4 overall.

[IliketheBullsNBearstoo]

We need a poll, is he a wing, a 4, or the rare combo f?

Have to admit I like the pick less if he's a 4.

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He’ll guard big wings and help side in the paint. Takes up the slack from Lauri and Zach. Which is as far as the declination of positions goes these days. Defined on defense. He’s got work to do finding his role on offense.

Williams
Lauri
WCJ
White
Zach

Lineup needs playmaker help. Too early in his career for that. But as a rim runner, garbage man open 3 guy, he might be able to handle that off the bench right now.

I hope Lauri actually worked on his agility. Stop with the power lifting. He needs to drop the mass.

Unless he plans on playing center. I don't like him as a PF personally.

[Clint Eastwood]

After a night to think about it . . . still not impressed. His upside seems to be a role player and his downside is bust. The tape on him really isn't impressive at all.

I'm looking for pro's here. I struggle to find many. He plays like a 4 and as such, is actually undersized. His shooting form is really slow. He is going to have to get a ton of room to shoot. His handle is mediocre. He isn't particularly quick on the floor. His best asset is as a help defender. He looks like a shorter Wendell Carter from where I am sitting.

If anyone taken behind PW does well, AK is going to get a lot of grief here.

The only sliver of hope is that this is a Jimmy Butler type situation where the guy works his ass off to become a completely different player in a few years.

AK seems to be putting a ton on the idea that he can develop players better than other teams. If so, that's fantastic. He will have to walk the walk though.

You and I are watching different tape. I feel the opposite. He won’t be undersized against anyone. Also, his thickness and ease of movement masks how quick he is. He can close out on one side and get to the corner to prevent a skip pass on the on there side. And he is a quick twitch explosive leaper and just turned 19. I see a unicorn beast in the making. Hope my eye is better than yours.

[Clint Eastwood]

So Patrick Williams is interesting in that you have a real difference between the stats, the "overall eye test," and then "the flashes" and maybe "the pedigree."

The stats from college are unimpressive. He didn't have a frosh impact - guys like Stanley Johnson, Justise Winslow, MKG, Pascal Siakam, Tobias Harris, Maurice Harkless all averaged 12 or more points per contest. Very good FT shooter, though, which distinguishes him from those guys, and his frosh stats are comparable to Oubre, RHJ, Nassir Little, so there have been recent high draft picks with similar stat profiles.

But the biggest difference is between the "overall eye test" (which matches the draft profile from the Stepian) and the "flashes." If you just go watch FSU youtubes (I watched a lot because of Vassell) - Williams comes across as a small, "energy" (6'7/6'8) 4. His play lacks the short area quickness, change-of-direction, and "bend" that you want from a modern wing . While Vassell played like a wing - Williams played like a forward - but without big rebounding numbers (Vassell and Williams had nearly identical per36 rebounding). Obviously, Vassell was a sophomore vs. Williams a frosh, and Vassell wasn't as good as Williams as a frosh.

But when you look at the highlights of just Patrick Williams, you start to see flashes of something more. Flashes of (inconsistent) ball handling and passing ability. Flashes of shooting ability both and off-the-catch and the bounce. Flashes of bend and short area quickness on both ends. Flashes of a guy who could play the 3 in the NBA.

It's unusual to have this kind level of difference between the "guy you usually see" and the "flashes." Most of the time, you see a guy who looks like the same player, but just better - the better pass, the shot that goes in, the better handle (think Tony Snell on those occasions where his shot was going in and he was playing with confidence). With Williams, it's almost like two different players . Here's hoping the "flashes" are the flower that's just about to bloom.

Great observation. And I think the disconnect comes from him being so young coming off the bench for a top team in the country for a defensive minded coach who doesnt highlight his stars. Top player on this contending team averaged like 13pts per game. He also obviously was asked to play a certain role. I suspect if he stayed for his soph year, he would have been the leader and leading scorer on the team.

[greenl]

AK seems to be putting a ton on the idea that he can develop players better than other teams. If so, that's fantastic. He will have to walk the walk though.

This is where I'm at as well. This is clearly a gamble on the Bulls belief that they can develop him. Given Denver's history with pick development- it's understandable why AK has this philosophy. I hold out some hope- given Williams h.s. experience as a point guard- that he can become more than a defensive tweener with an inconsistent shot.

[Red8911]

After a night to think about it . . . still not impressed. His upside seems to be a role player and his downside is bust. The tape on him really isn't impressive at all.

I'm looking for pro's here. I struggle to find many. He plays like a 4 and as such, is actually undersized. His shooting form is really slow. He is going to have to get a ton of room to shoot. His handle is mediocre. He isn't particularly quick on the floor. His best asset is as a help defender. He looks like a shorter Wendell Carter from where I am sitting.

If anyone taken behind PW does well, AK is going to get a lot of grief here.

The only sliver of hope is that this is a Jimmy Butler type situation where the guy works his ass off to become a completely different player in a few years.

AK seems to be putting a ton on the idea that he can develop players better than other teams. If so, that's fantastic. He will have to walk the walk though.

You don’t even know much about him how do you know what his upside or downside is ? AK was the one who did heavy scouting on these players and he/bulls staff felt like Patrick Williams was the best player available with the highest potential at 4. Just because the media and some “experts” had him going at 10 or later doesn’t mean anything. The fans or the media do not make the pick. On AKs list Williams was high , that’s all that matters.

This draft class was terrible and now was the time to go for potential. You think the other 3 teams that chose before the bulls have drafted well? I don’t think so, first Charlotte is going to regret drafting Ball and Wiseman doesn’t look like anything special. I don’t know if Williams will be good or not but again AK knows more than we do and the only time we can criticize this pick is if he actually turns out to suck. Until then though we have to take the to be determined approach.

[cjbulls]

I appreciate people staying positive, but it’s hard to sugarcoat this. I will certainly keep an open mind, but he feels like a 15th pick.

Like some others here, I don’t see a high ceiling as he doesn’t move all that well to the point he looks more like a long-term 4. So we took an average ceiling guy that’s raw and needs time to develop at #4.

This draft will be long remembered here because the Bulls had so many options and definitely chose the path less traveled. Will be funny to look back as each year goes by.

[coldfish]

After a night to think about it . . . still not impressed. His upside seems to be a role player and his downside is bust. The tape on him really isn't impressive at all.

I'm looking for pro's here. I struggle to find many. He plays like a 4 and as such, is actually undersized. His shooting form is really slow. He is going to have to get a ton of room to shoot. His handle is mediocre. He isn't particularly quick on the floor. His best asset is as a help defender. He looks like a shorter Wendell Carter from where I am sitting.

If anyone taken behind PW does well, AK is going to get a lot of grief here.

The only sliver of hope is that this is a Jimmy Butler type situation where the guy works his ass off to become a completely different player in a few years.

AK seems to be putting a ton on the idea that he can develop players better than other teams. If so, that's fantastic. He will have to walk the walk though.

You and I are watching different tape. I feel the opposite. He won’t be undersized against anyone. Also, his thickness and ease of movement masks how quick he is. He can close out on one side and get to the corner to prevent a skip pass on the on there side. And he is a quick twitch explosive leaper and just turned 19. I see a unicorn beast in the making. Hope my eye is better than yours.

Hope you are right and I am wrong. I'm not the type to root for negativity just to prove myself right. I hope this guy destroys the NBA and I'll happily eat crow.

[sco]

Presser sounded like a sell job. Sounded like they went with a guy with a combo of athleticism and skills but limited demonstrated performance. Also sounds like they plan on bringing him off the bench this season and will let his demonstrated play determine his role/position this year. While not too exciting, AK was clear he wanted to focus on high potential vs. high floor guys. Guess we'll have to wait and see.

IMO this feels like what the future will hold for the NBA after the one and done rule goes away.

I felt the opposite. To me, AK is no-nonsense and trusts his team and himself. I think he could give two **** if the fans love or hate the pick on first blush and doesn't care to sell it to us. Let the results speak for themselves. He spoke honestly about why he took the guy.

meh...potato tomato

[coldfish]

After a night to think about it . . . still not impressed. His upside seems to be a role player and his downside is bust. The tape on him really isn't impressive at all.

I'm looking for pro's here. I struggle to find many. He plays like a 4 and as such, is actually undersized. His shooting form is really slow. He is going to have to get a ton of room to shoot. His handle is mediocre. He isn't particularly quick on the floor. His best asset is as a help defender. He looks like a shorter Wendell Carter from where I am sitting.

If anyone taken behind PW does well, AK is going to get a lot of grief here.

The only sliver of hope is that this is a Jimmy Butler type situation where the guy works his ass off to become a completely different player in a few years.

AK seems to be putting a ton on the idea that he can develop players better than other teams. If so, that's fantastic. He will have to walk the walk though.

You don’t even know much about him how do you know what his upside or downside is ? AK was the one who did heavy scouting on these players and he/bulls staff felt like Patrick Williams was the best player available with the highest potential at 4. Just because the media and some “experts” had him going at 10 or later doesn’t mean anything. The fans or the media do not make the pick. On AKs list Williams was high , that’s all that matters.

This draft class was terrible and now was the time to go for potential. You think the other 3 teams that chose before the bulls have drafted well? I don’t think so, first Charlotte is going to regret drafting Ball and Wiseman doesn’t look like anything special. I don’t know if Williams will be good or not but again AK knows more than we do and the only time we can criticize this pick is if he actually turns out to suck. Until then though we have to take the to be determined approach.

I'm certainly not one who believes that coaching and management is infallible. If we believe that they are always above reproach, there isn't much point in having a discussion board, right?

What I see on tape isn't particularly impressive. I'm a Bulls fan so I hope I am spectacularly wrong.

[Betta Bulleavit]

I was very critical of this pick last night. I’m still not 100% sold on it after sleeping on it. But what I will say is that if there was ever a draft to take a swing up pure upside, this was likely the draft to do it. I don’t see ANY sure fire superstars here. So taking a chance on a guy like Williams does make some sense on the surface.

The fact that he didn’t start at FSU doesn’t concern me as much as it does some people. It’s just the way that system worked to be quite honest. But all of the information out there seems to indicate that there were at least a handful of teams that were excited about his upside and saw real potential there. I think that’s really about the best you can do in a draft like this to be honest. You could say that we should have traded back. Which is what I felt initially. But it seems like he might not have been there at whatever spot we could have traded back to. And if AK really liked him, then it really is what it is.

[Kurt Heimlich]

I'm sure there are plenty of negative examples of "draft risers" but Williams workout ascent the last few weeks is reminiscent of paul george, kawhi, giannis, Mitchell in recent years. Teams with the 4th pick in those drafts can only wish they had "reached" for those guys now.

When taken in context of how big a crap shoot this entire class looks I dont understand how people can be so vehemently negative. People are seeing very different projections from the same tape so perhaps theres a bit of confirmation bias on all sides there.

Pre draft favorites Deni and haliburton both fell well below where Williams was "projected" to go at 7. Implying their mock draft hype that we saw didnt exactly match reality. Okongwu was my favorite tape in the draft and he went 6, but he doesnt have the ball handling/shooting projectability of Williams.

Taken in the prism of this draft class I'm struggling to find the outrage here.

[fleet]

After a night to think about it . . . still not impressed. His upside seems to be a role player and his downside is bust. The tape on him really isn't impressive at all.

I'm looking for pro's here. I struggle to find many. He plays like a 4 and as such, is actually undersized. His shooting form is really slow. He is going to have to get a ton of room to shoot. His handle is mediocre. He isn't particularly quick on the floor. His best asset is as a help defender. He looks like a shorter Wendell Carter from where I am sitting.

If anyone taken behind PW does well, AK is going to get a lot of grief here.

The only sliver of hope is that this is a Jimmy Butler type situation where the guy works his ass off to become a completely different player in a few years.

AK seems to be putting a ton on the idea that he can develop players better than other teams. If so, that's fantastic. He will have to walk the walk though.

Its no secret the Bulls are now a player development franchise model. Billy Donovan is all about it. And they have built out a major player development staff. It is clear they want the talent, not necessarily the honed skills for acquisitions.

Haha shorter Wendell Carter. I don’t see that at all but to each his own. But I do think AK isn’t going into this blindly. It is not too generous to assume that the basic skills they think they can develop in him are present and most likely demonstrated in the workout they had with him.


“His ball-handling is something that’s very underrated, and people didn’t see it in college,” Karnisovas said. “Where for three years in high school, he played point guard. I was very impressed”

[ChettheJet]

In normal times I would be saying that it was a reach to take Williams because so many mock drafts put him at 7, 9 or 18. But this year I think the teams saw more of these guy than any internet expert, actually interviewed them and had a much better idea of who they were drafting and who was the better choice.

I don't fall for this BS about him being able to guard or play 1-5, 2,3,4 I'll fall for and one of those is where he could really shine.

I think it's a great situation for Williams, there's no pressure on him to come in an start, he'll get minutes off the bench and be able to get an understanding of the pace of the NBA and have his minutes increase through the season. Next year if he gest stronger, works on his shot and whatever else needs work he can get into the starting lineup and if Markkanen comes back, Carter is healthy and gets his game going Williams still doesn't have the pressure as the 5th guy out othere

[VolumePoster]

After a night to think about it . . . still not impressed. His upside seems to be a role player and his downside is bust. The tape on him really isn't impressive at all.

I'm looking for pro's here. I struggle to find many. He plays like a 4 and as such, is actually undersized. His shooting form is really slow. He is going to have to get a ton of room to shoot. His handle is mediocre. He isn't particularly quick on the floor. His best asset is as a help defender. He looks like a shorter Wendell Carter from where I am sitting.

If anyone taken behind PW does well, AK is going to get a lot of grief here.

The only sliver of hope is that this is a Jimmy Butler type situation where the guy works his ass off to become a completely different player in a few years.

AK seems to be putting a ton on the idea that he can develop players better than other teams. If so, that's fantastic. He will have to walk the walk though.

You and I are watching different tape. I feel the opposite. He won’t be undersized against anyone. Also, his thickness and ease of movement masks how quick he is. He can close out on one side and get to the corner to prevent a skip pass on the on there side. And he is a quick twitch explosive leaper and just turned 19. I see a unicorn beast in the making. Hope my eye is better than yours.

This might be because the tape on PW differs significantly between early and late season. And we can imagine significant strides since given his age and purported ethic.

[MrSparkle]

So Patrick Williams is interesting in that you have a real difference between the stats, the "overall eye test," and then "the flashes" and maybe "the pedigree."

The stats from college are unimpressive. He didn't have a frosh impact - guys like Stanley Johnson, Justise Winslow, MKG, Pascal Siakam, Tobias Harris, Maurice Harkless all averaged 12 or more points per contest. Very good FT shooter, though, which distinguishes him from those guys, and his frosh stats are comparable to Oubre, RHJ, Nassir Little, so there have been recent high draft picks with similar stat profiles.

But the biggest difference is between the "overall eye test" (which matches the draft profile from the Stepian) and the "flashes." If you just go watch FSU youtubes (I watched a lot because of Vassell) - Williams comes across as a small, "energy" (6'7/6'8) 4. His play lacks the short area quickness, change-of-direction, and "bend" that you want from a modern wing . While Vassell played like a wing - Williams played like a forward - but without big rebounding numbers (Vassell and Williams had nearly identical per36 rebounding). Obviously, Vassell was a sophomore vs. Williams a frosh, and Vassell wasn't as good as Williams as a frosh.

But when you look at the highlights of just Patrick Williams, you start to see flashes of something more. Flashes of (inconsistent) ball handling and passing ability. Flashes of shooting ability both and off-the-catch and the bounce. Flashes of bend and short area quickness on both ends. Flashes of a guy who could play the 3 in the NBA.

It's unusual to have this kind level of difference between the "guy you usually see" and the "flashes." Most of the time, you see a guy who looks like the same player, but just better - the better pass, the shot that goes in, the better handle (think Tony Snell on those occasions where his shot was going in and he was playing with confidence). With Williams, it's almost like two different players . Here's hoping the "flashes" are the flower that's just about to bloom.

It’ll be interesting to see this whole draft pan out. I spent less time checking out PW than every other guy in the lottery. My quick impression is:

- He’ll play steady minutes right away, off the bench.
- He has no flaws/red flags.
- He has excellent size and athleticism, should be a multi-position NBA defender.

So honestly, this was probably a smart pick beyond the alarming college role and stats. Because literally every other guy I deep scanned in this draft had atleast one major red flag, and it’s been all we talked about the last 6 months - how flawed this draft is at the top.

Williams can very well become a jack-of-all-trades bench guy. I’m not nervous about him totally busting and being a locker-room drama though. I see legit chances of the top-3 becoming huge headaches if they don’t get the minutes they’d like, or shoot terrible 3P% and get asked to dial down shot selection.

And Hayes, Okongwu, Okoro and Deni also seemed like luke-warm role-player projects. All are questionable shooters. If Hayes does pan out, he’ll be the best I think. But he was also a tough call, favoring one hand, rather lame first-step and foot-speed, a funky “showcase” situation at his club, and pretty mediocre 3P shooting. He’ll be glad to have Rose as a locker-room mentor.

[fleet]

After a night to think about it . . . still not impressed. His upside seems to be a role player and his downside is bust. The tape on him really isn't impressive at all.

I'm looking for pro's here. I struggle to find many. He plays like a 4 and as such, is actually undersized. His shooting form is really slow. He is going to have to get a ton of room to shoot. His handle is mediocre. He isn't particularly quick on the floor. His best asset is as a help defender. He looks like a shorter Wendell Carter from where I am sitting.

If anyone taken behind PW does well, AK is going to get a lot of grief here.

The only sliver of hope is that this is a Jimmy Butler type situation where the guy works his ass off to become a completely different player in a few years.

AK seems to be putting a ton on the idea that he can develop players better than other teams. If so, that's fantastic. He will have to walk the walk though.

You don’t even know much about him how do you know what his upside or downside is ? AK was the one who did heavy scouting on these players and he/bulls staff felt like Patrick Williams was the best player available with the highest potential at 4. Just because the media and some “experts” had him going at 10 or later doesn’t mean anything. The fans or the media do not make the pick. On AKs list Williams was high , that’s all that matters.

This draft class was terrible and now was the time to go for potential. You think the other 3 teams that chose before the bulls have drafted well? I don’t think so, first Charlotte is going to regret drafting Ball and Wiseman doesn’t look like anything special. I don’t know if Williams will be good or not but again AK knows more than we do and the only time we can criticize this pick is if he actually turns out to suck. Until then though we have to take the to be determined approach.

The people outraged at taking him at 4 have to be able to reasonably show the superiority of the guys taken after Williams. And they can’t do that. There are no obviously better picks. So acting as if there were better picks so as to justify the outrage is a case missing convincing evidence.

[DJhitek]

I still don’t buy the upside play here, I don’t think he has this massive ceiling like they think he does. I swear the Bulls, no matter who it is, are allergic to trading down.

But on the flip side, we didn’t draft Halliburton or Toppin at four so for me, that’s a win. With Williams, I see an undersized PF that can hit a pull-up jumper once in a while. Now defensively, he looks like he has some chops, but what good is that at his size if he can’t contribute on the offensive end?

[DJhitek]

And to be clear, I’m neither for or totally against this pick. I’m not playing hindsight here, I basically hated this entire draft and would have rather traded back to pick up some players that can shoot.

My issue isn’t with the pick per say, it’s with the decision not to trade back.

[weneeda2guard]

Maybe the thinking is that we needed something a bit more solidified at the pg and if we can't get ball then address the pg position in free agency or trade or hand the keys over to coby. And maybe they saw those options all better than drafting hali or hayes or Lewis.

But I'm sorry this pick feels like a guy who should have went in the teens being talked into being deserving of the 4th pick. It feels like AK convinced himself to look for the next kawhi and giannis but take them 4th then in 3 years look back and laugh as he got the early drop. That could or could not work.

Another message I got last night is that this rebuilding through AK and eversly is going to be a slow methodical process and not necessarily a quick turn around. So I'm lowering my expectations for next season. I'm now becoming content with a 2-3 year building where it may be a lot of moving parts then we can think playoffs

[weneeda2guard]

I still don’t buy the upside play here, I don’t think he has this massive ceiling like they think he does. I swear the Bulls, no matter who it is, are allergic to trading down.

But on the flip side, we didn’t draft Halliburton or Toppin at four so for me, that’s a win. With Williams, I see an undersized PF that can hit a pull-up jumper once in a while. Now defensively, he looks like he has some chops, but what good is that at his size if he can’t contribute on the offensive end?

The thing i fear the most with Williams is the nba is going to be too fast for him and as a result the bit of shot he has is going to vanish similar to what happened to Dunn. This franchise really needed a piece that can add to this core and I just dont see that with Williams. I really want to be wrong. I watched Hutchison highlights and he popped out the screen to me more than Patrick.

So I hope the evil genius that is AK shocks us all. But as I been saying if this falls apart especially if obi is all over the highlight reels on sportscenter or okongwu or hali or even deni become stars especially deni because we were tied to him from the moment we got 4th then this will be a trubisky situation all over again and not a good way to kick off the new regime.