Obi Toppin to the Knicks @ #8

[moocow007]

We picked a 3 quarter player that needs to be surrounded by the likes of Frank and Mitch

We already tried that..... Enes Kanter, Julius Randle, Amare Stoudemire, Bargnani, literally too many to name

This organization never learns and it never will

And who were the 4 quarter players that were available at 8?

[DaGawd]

Can’t be that excited about this selection since the USA Today rated the Knicks as losers of the draft.

One of few places to say that.. ignore em

[GONYK]

Those were meaningless games though, think about what that offense would look like in the playoffs. If our ultimate goal is to contend then both of them are going to need to be able to shoot.

Obi could be the melo role and Mitch at 5.

That was a different time though, look at what happened to Bam, and he's surrounded by shooters.

The issue is that Obi is not a PF/C, he's really a PF through and through, and almost all of the real PFs now play with a guy that can space.

Millsap & Jokic
Giannis & Lopez
Siakam & Gasol / Ibaka



If Obi could play the smallball 5 I wouldn't care as much, but we'd be giving up too much on defense playing him there. The Lakers best lineups had AD at the 5, so even there you have shooting at almost every position so he can attack.

Obi would have to put up 5-7 threes a game at ~38% clip to be effective in the Melo role.

I think that is a fundamental shifting of his game.

[3toheadmelo]

Mike Miller only played Julius and Mitch 12 MPG together and they were a net negative pairing.

I don't think pointing out the fit is being negative. It's something we're going to have to figure out if we are trying to get the most out of our young talent and construct a functional roster.

As of right now, it is a tough sell.

Last time I checked under Miller, Randle and Mitch were a positive 5.7 net rating together

Where are you checking?

I'm looking at NBA.com stats

EDIT: Ah, I see. Advanced lineup stats. Still though, the lineup wasn't great offensively. It was pretty decent defensively though.

Then why do you think Miller barely played them together?

I think the lineup was better when we traded Morris imo. Randle-RJ-Mitch under Miller were a positive net rating too.

Mitch was getting in foul trouble so much I think that’s why Miller didn’t play him that much next to Randle. Maybe I’m wrong though

[moocow007]

FVF
Bullock
RJ
Obi
Mitch

35 win season coming right up.

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What about

Russ
Joe Harris
RJ
Obi
Mitch?

You know it's coming...deal with it.

[DOT]

FVF
Bullock
RJ
Obi
Mitch

35 win season coming right up.

Sent from my SM-G965U using RealGM mobile app

As long as we build some continuity, I like this. The pieces fit IMO

I don't see how they do

You have 2 floor spacers and 3 guys who are at their best attacking the rim

Best case scenario on offense, Obi/Mitch is a worse version of Blake/DJ, and they had an all time great at PG and couldn't make it work. We'd have Fred Van Felton and RJ, so I don't see how we'd be better than them

It'd be better than last year cause FVF is better than Payton, Obi should be better than Randle, and RJ and Mitch should just get better, but that's not a good foundation.

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[3toheadmelo]

Those were meaningless games though, think about what that offense would look like in the playoffs. If our ultimate goal is to contend then both of them are going to need to be able to shoot.

Obi could be the melo role and Mitch at 5.

That was a different time though, look at what happened to Bam, and he's surrounded by shooters.

The issue is that Obi is not a PF/C, he's really a PF through and through, and almost all of the real PFs now play with a guy that can space.

Millsap & Jokic
Giannis & Lopez
Siakam & Gasol / Ibaka



If Obi could play the smallball 5 I wouldn't care as much, but we'd be giving up too much on defense playing him there. The Lakers best lineups had AD at the 5, so even there you have shooting at almost every position so he can attack.

So Mitch is the problem

[Mecca]

Of course we won the last game of the season against Detroit at the night of the pandemic and let them jump us in lotto odds. Killian would’ve been ripe for the picking at 7.

My heart is crushed that Kira was passed on for Obi. They still don’t get it man.

This is a CAA, box seats and partnership deals front office. Obi is the fun player, but this FO can’t build a team.

[GONYK]

FVF
Bullock
RJ
Obi
Mitch

35 win season coming right up.

Sent from my SM-G965U using RealGM mobile app

As long as we build some continuity, I like this. The pieces fit IMO

I don't see how they do

You have 2 floor spacers and 3 guys who are at their best attacking the rim

Best case scenario on offense, Obi/Mitch is a worse version of Blake/DJ, and they had an all time great at PG and couldn't make it work. We'd have Fred Van Felton and RJ, so I don't see how we'd be better than them

It'd be better than last year cause FVF is better than Payton, Obi should be better than Randle, and RJ and Mitch should just get better, but that's not a good foundation.

Sent from my SM-G965U using RealGM mobile app

And that is the ultimate problem. Obi isn't a bad player in a vacuum. He's just not a player that fits with our other foundational pieces, since they can't shoot.

Obi thrived as the C in a 4 out offense. RJ and Mitch prevent us from recreating that situation for him.

[NoDopeOnSundays]

Obi could be the melo role and Mitch at 5.

That was a different time though, look at what happened to Bam, and he's surrounded by shooters.

The issue is that Obi is not a PF/C, he's really a PF through and through, and almost all of the real PFs now play with a guy that can space.

Millsap & Jokic
Giannis & Lopez
Siakam & Gasol / Ibaka



If Obi could play the smallball 5 I wouldn't care as much, but we'd be giving up too much on defense playing him there. The Lakers best lineups had AD at the 5, so even there you have shooting at almost every position so he can attack.

So Mitch is the problem

He better learn to shoot, no if and's or buts, cause he's going to directly impact Obi's game for better or worse.


And if he can't shoot, there's gonna be a lot of slow singing, flower bringing if that trade machine starts ringing

[GONYK]

That was a different time though, look at what happened to Bam, and he's surrounded by shooters.

The issue is that Obi is not a PF/C, he's really a PF through and through, and almost all of the real PFs now play with a guy that can space.

Millsap & Jokic
Giannis & Lopez
Siakam & Gasol / Ibaka



If Obi could play the smallball 5 I wouldn't care as much, but we'd be giving up too much on defense playing him there. The Lakers best lineups had AD at the 5, so even there you have shooting at almost every position so he can attack.

So Mitch is the problem

He better learn to shoot, no if and's or buts, cause he's going to directly impact Obi's game for better or worse.


And if he can't shoot, there's gonna be a lot of slow singing, flower bringing if that trade machine starts ringing

RJ is a problem too, if we're being honest

[BugginOut]

Maybe the plan is to keep Randle and have Obi come off the bench. Since Thibs is a defensive guy, maybe he wants Obi to earn his minutes by playing defense. Either way the roster needs a lot more work before it is done

[HEZI]

FVF
Bullock
RJ
Obi
Mitch

35 win season coming right up.

Sent from my SM-G965U using RealGM mobile app

As long as we build some continuity, I like this. The pieces fit IMO

I don't see how they do

You have 2 floor spacers and 3 guys who are at their best attacking the rim

Best case scenario on offense, Obi/Mitch is a worse version of Blake/DJ, and they had an all time great at PG and couldn't make it work. We'd have Fred Van Felton and RJ, so I don't see how we'd be better than them

It'd be better than last year cause FVF is better than Payton, Obi should be better than Randle, and RJ and Mitch should just get better, but that's not a good foundation.

Sent from my SM-G965U using RealGM mobile app

I wouldn't say they couldn't make it work. That team was winning 50 games a year in the West and couldn't stay healthy throughout the playoffs. What ultimately caused them to split was their personalities and egos. Were they a title contender? No but were they a good team? Yes. Legit playoff team year in and year out? Yes

Constructing a consistent 50 win team would be an excellent turnaround for this franchise

No there is no CP3 on the squad and I'm aware of that but there are enough pieces to the puzzle that are starting to come together where you should be able to construct something that gets you at least back in the playoff picture if the players we hope to pan out eventually do, we make wise use of free agency and can make a good trade or few to compliment those pieces in place.

[GONYK]

Maybe the plan is to keep Randle and have Obi come off the bench. Since Thibs is a defensive guy, maybe he wants Obi to earn his minutes by playing defense. Either way the roster needs a lot more work before it is done

[NoDopeOnSundays]

So Mitch is the problem

He better learn to shoot, no if and's or buts, cause he's going to directly impact Obi's game for better or worse.


And if he can't shoot, there's gonna be a lot of slow singing, flower bringing if that trade machine starts ringing

RJ is a problem too, if we're being honest

I have faith in RJ becoming a better shooter, plus you could play them in a PnR together.

[GONYK]

He better learn to shoot, no if and's or buts, cause he's going to directly impact Obi's game for better or worse.


And if he can't shoot, there's gonna be a lot of slow singing, flower bringing if that trade machine starts ringing

RJ is a problem too, if we're being honest

I have faith in RJ becoming a better shooter, plus you could play them in a PnR together.

Their PnR effectiveness is directly proportional to how effective RJ becomes as a shooter. Otherwise, the defense will just pack the paint.

[Strick]

I will say there will be some fun moments on offense this year. Could have some games and moments where it looks like Lob City-lite

[SelbyCobra]

Not going to lie - as much as I was opposed to his contract, I got a little wistful this morning thinking about CP3 throwing lobs to Obi & Mitch, developing them to their max potential.

But I snapped out of it and am ok now.

[thebuzzardman]

I feel like we saw how far teams can go with offensively versatile all star bigs with a weak defensive reputation in the playoffs with Jokic. Obi doesn't need to turn into Bam Adebayo, he just needs to be smart enough to make his rotation. He could probably make the adjustment in that regard particularly with Thibs preparing him with deep scouting reports and gameplans. Will he ever have his Kevin Love moment? Guarding a guy like Curry in isolation at the three point line to win the championship? He could, and that's good enough for now.

His fit on offense is a no-brainer. He can literally play everyone's role. When going up against a good defense, we might have a guy that can just give it to the other team any way they want it.

As for Randle and Mitch, there's space on the team for a 3-man rotation. Knox imo is the odd one out.

While this point is valid, I think it's a mistake to think in terms of the playoffs. Knicks should collect assets, try to make it fit. They'll be a lot of moves and if Obi is decent but not great, could be good enough to move in a few years.

It's going to take a bit to contend, no matter who was drafted

[NoDopeOnSundays]

RJ is a problem too, if we're being honest

I have faith in RJ becoming a better shooter, plus you could play them in a PnR together.

Their PnR effectiveness is directly proportional to how effective RJ becomes as a shooter. Otherwise, the defense will just pack the paint.

We're on the same page, I just think RJ will develop into a passable shooter, he wasn't that bad of a three point shooter as a rookie, not when you go through a list of all-star wings and see what they shot from three as rookies.

I will be concerned though if RJ doesn't improve this season, because he will never get this much time off again to work on his game.