[Woj] DET/ATL - Dedmon for Snell + Khyri Thomas

[HartfordWhalers]

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Who needs a center? Or looking to trade one on a longer term deal?

got a slightly broken Dwight Powell.

Philly has a 58th pick backing up Embiid. And an undersized pf one too. Scott/Zhaire/Ferguson works and Detroit and Scott seem a perfect match while they get 2 youths to try.

[HartfordWhalers]

With increased reporting of no draft picks involved, added the poll.

{I still think Detroit gets some cash right? Clicking Atlanta win.}

[giberish]

Feels like a very good deal for Atlanta. Ogongwu should at least be getting backup C minutes, and there are tons of 3rd string C options around for min salaries.

Snell is a good depth wing guy for them. Ideally they fill out their rotation with enough guys that at full health he's a DNP-CD, but then when guys are out he can give 15-25 mpg and not be a problem.

More questionable for Detroit. Though so much of their roster is in flux I don't really know where they need minutes.

[Billl]

ATL wins. They get some depth where they need it and save a bit on next season. It's a pretty marginal move though.

From Det? I've seen stuff saying there is a followup, so I guess we'll have to wait. It makes no sense on paper right now though.

[Kilo]

Hollinger explained why Detroit did this - stretch provision. Dedmon, and McGruder from other trade, both have $1M guarantees next year meaning their stretched contracts would be over five years. Dedmon's 14M owed over five years would be 3M/season meaning Detroit could open up 11M this year or could trade him to a team to then stretch him and cut 11M from their cap/tax this year.

[Texas Chuck]

Hollinger explained why Detroit did this - stretch provision. Dedmon, and McGruder from other trade, both have $1M guarantees next year meaning their stretched contracts would be over five years. Dedmon's 14M owed over five years would be 3M/season meaning Detroit could open up 11M this year or could trade him to a team to then stretch him and cut 11M from their cap/tax this year.

I hate this deal even more for Detroit if their plan is to stretch him. Just awful. If you needed cap space to sign a player you want, take back less bad salary in dumps.

Trading him to another team as rumored who wants to stretch him--that I get the advantage of and why Detroit would swap Snell for him to suit that other team.

But surely Detroit doesn't stretch him. That would be incredibly dumb.

[Kilo]

Hollinger explained why Detroit did this - stretch provision. Dedmon, and McGruder from other trade, both have $1M guarantees next year meaning their stretched contracts would be over five years. Dedmon's 14M owed over five years would be 3M/season meaning Detroit could open up 11M this year or could trade him to a team to then stretch him and cut 11M from their cap/tax this year.

I hate this deal even more for Detroit if their plan is to stretch him. Just awful. If you needed cap space to sign a player you want, take back less bad salary in dumps.

Trading him to another team as rumored who wants to stretch him--that I get the advantage of and why Detroit would swap Snell for him to suit that other team.

But surely Detroit doesn't stretch him. That would be incredibly dumb.

Only sin eating they did was Ariza for #16. Ariza replaces Snell on the roster and Detroit trades Snell for Dedmon to stretch him and you end up with $4M cap hit (over next four years) and #16 for future heavily protected FRP. This would free up Detroit to have $21M in cap space this off-season.

[HartfordWhalers]

Hollinger explained why Detroit did this - stretch provision. Dedmon, and McGruder from other trade, both have $1M guarantees next year meaning their stretched contracts would be over five years. Dedmon's 14M owed over five years would be 3M/season meaning Detroit could open up 11M this year or could trade him to a team to then stretch him and cut 11M from their cap/tax this year.

I hate this deal even more for Detroit if their plan is to stretch him. Just awful. If you needed cap space to sign a player you want, take back less bad salary in dumps.

Trading him to another team as rumored who wants to stretch him--that I get the advantage of and why Detroit would swap Snell for him to suit that other team.

But surely Detroit doesn't stretch him. That would be incredibly dumb.

Clogging future years -- when the team might be good -- to get money off from this year when the team is bad -- is awful long term strategy.

[jayu70]

Hollinger explained why Detroit did this - stretch provision. Dedmon, and McGruder from other trade, both have $1M guarantees next year meaning their stretched contracts would be over five years. Dedmon's 14M owed over five years would be 3M/season meaning Detroit could open up 11M this year or could trade him to a team to then stretch him and cut 11M from their cap/tax this year.

That's sounds an awful route to go. Didn't Detroit just stop paying Josh Smith?

[HartfordWhalers]

Hollinger explained why Detroit did this - stretch provision. Dedmon, and McGruder from other trade, both have $1M guarantees next year meaning their stretched contracts would be over five years. Dedmon's 14M owed over five years would be 3M/season meaning Detroit could open up 11M this year or could trade him to a team to then stretch him and cut 11M from their cap/tax this year.

That's sounds an awful route to go. Didn't Detroit just stop paying Josh Smith?

And Reggie Jackson. And Markieff Morris. All 3 off the books tomorrow.

Also, there has been enough talk of a follow up Dedmon move, I'm hoping it was just Hollinger speculating a potential angle, and not a real plan.

[BullyKing]

Hollinger explained why Detroit did this - stretch provision. Dedmon, and McGruder from other trade, both have $1M guarantees next year meaning their stretched contracts would be over five years. Dedmon's 14M owed over five years would be 3M/season meaning Detroit could open up 11M this year or could trade him to a team to then stretch him and cut 11M from their cap/tax this year.

Well now I'm really confused because why wouldn't you just waive and stretch Snell's smaller contract if that was the plan.

[HartfordWhalers]

Hollinger explained why Detroit did this - stretch provision. Dedmon, and McGruder from other trade, both have $1M guarantees next year meaning their stretched contracts would be over five years. Dedmon's 14M owed over five years would be 3M/season meaning Detroit could open up 11M this year or could trade him to a team to then stretch him and cut 11M from their cap/tax this year.

Well now I'm really confused because why wouldn't you just waive and stretch Snell's smaller contract if that was the plan.

I'm skipping the complete math but:

Snell: 12m 1 year = 4m a year for 3 years
Dedmon 13m + 1 2 years = 2.8m a year for 5 years

It saves 1.2m a year right for 3 years .... At the cost of 2.8m a year for another 2 years.

Basically it takes the stretching direction and stretches it further. So, exactly opposite of what I would do.

[loserX]

Hollinger explained why Detroit did this - stretch provision. Dedmon, and McGruder from other trade, both have $1M guarantees next year meaning their stretched contracts would be over five years. Dedmon's 14M owed over five years would be 3M/season meaning Detroit could open up 11M this year or could trade him to a team to then stretch him and cut 11M from their cap/tax this year.

Well now I'm really confused because why wouldn't you just waive and stretch Snell's smaller contract if that was the plan.

Because of the stretch period reducing the annual cost. Snell's contract would have been $4M a year for 3 years, Dedmon's would be about $2.9M a year for 5 years.

Note: I am agreeing with those who say this is an awful idea for Detroit. It may be a better idea as a flip to a team that REALLY needs to reduce their annual outlay, but who knows if that team exists.

[Kilo]

Hollinger explained why Detroit did this - stretch provision. Dedmon, and McGruder from other trade, both have $1M guarantees next year meaning their stretched contracts would be over five years. Dedmon's 14M owed over five years would be 3M/season meaning Detroit could open up 11M this year or could trade him to a team to then stretch him and cut 11M from their cap/tax this year.

Well now I'm really confused because why wouldn't you just waive and stretch Snell's smaller contract if that was the plan.

2 yrs vs 4 yrs. Snell's 12M stretched over 2 years would be 6M in savings. Stretching Dedmon's $14 over 4yrs is 10M.

If Detroit can take on another bad contract and get a FRP for doing so with the space opened up by stretching Dedmon than I fail to see how it was a bad deal.

Of course I hope Dedmon is being rerouted to another team who could be looking to cut $10M off their cap number/tax number so Detroit doesn't have it on the books the next four years.

The possibility of a longer stretch explains why Detroit did it and why local beat writers were talking about how he wouldn't be here long. He's more valuable stretched for $10M in created cap space for FA bidding/sin eating.

I'll agree to disagree on this I guess.

[HartfordWhalers]

Hollinger explained why Detroit did this - stretch provision. Dedmon, and McGruder from other trade, both have $1M guarantees next year meaning their stretched contracts would be over five years. Dedmon's 14M owed over five years would be 3M/season meaning Detroit could open up 11M this year or could trade him to a team to then stretch him and cut 11M from their cap/tax this year.

Well now I'm really confused because why wouldn't you just waive and stretch Snell's smaller contract if that was the plan.

2 yrs vs 4 yrs. Snell's 12M stretched over 2 years would be 6M in savings. Stretching Dedmon's $14 over 4yrs is 10M.

If Detroit can take on another bad contract and get a FRP for doing so with the space opened up by stretching Dedmon than I fail to see how it was a bad deal.

Of course I hope Dedmon is being rerouted to another team who could be looking to cut $10M off their cap number/tax number so Detroit doesn't have it on the books the next four years.

The possibility of a longer stretch explains why Detroit did it and why local beat writers were talking about how he wouldn't be here long. He's more valuable stretched for $10M in created cap space for FA bidding/sin eating.

I'll agree to disagree on this I guess.

3 and 5 btw. And while it opens room now, it takes it away later. So, you need to feel really comfortable that cap space right now is >> cap space over the next 5 years.

[BullyKing]

Hollinger explained why Detroit did this - stretch provision. Dedmon, and McGruder from other trade, both have $1M guarantees next year meaning their stretched contracts would be over five years. Dedmon's 14M owed over five years would be 3M/season meaning Detroit could open up 11M this year or could trade him to a team to then stretch him and cut 11M from their cap/tax this year.

Well now I'm really confused because why wouldn't you just waive and stretch Snell's smaller contract if that was the plan.

I'm skipping the complete math but:

Snell: 12m 1 year = 4m a year for 3 years
Dedmon 13m + 1 2 years = 2.8m a year for 5 years

It saves 1.2m a year right for 3 years .... At the cost of 2.8m a year for another 2 years.

Basically it takes the stretching direction and stretches it further. So, exactly opposite of what I would do.

Thanks, yeah I forgot about Dedmon's partial guarantee extended the stretch period. But agree - its taking a bad idea and making it worse.

[chrbal]

I’m of the hope that we just run with dedmon for the time being. Waive/stretching him is odd at this point. Its not like he’s injured, we need the open roster spot, or his contract goes on forever.

We had rumors we were swapping him again yesterday and now this, it just kind of sounds like guessing weaver’s hand.

I’m not convinced we’re done flipping guys around, and dewayne kind of fits with all the inexperienced players we have. Free agency will help clear this up.

I feel like both teams did ok, just might change for Detroit with what they do with dewayne