Ball Don't Lie: The LaMelo Ball Thread

[DY_nasty]

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[BigSlam]

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Regardless of how Monk feels I'm not sure how Batum would feel about that....

[wilson115]

Regardless of how Monk feels I'm not sure how Batum would feel about that....

How does Larry feel???

[DY_nasty]

Regardless of how Monk feels I'm not sure how Batum would feel about that....

Who?

[MugzZo]

:D Draft Picks?.... Well Lamelo is a first rounder and was picked 3rd for Houston ....Ball+ Batum + Zellar + Who Else (Monk?Bacon?Graham?Rosier?)= Russell Westbrook in Charlotte. Think about it? Why would they draft 2 big rebounders and another PG in 2nd round. They already have 2 good PGs and another good one under contract in GBoro. That = 4 PG Don't bee suprised if Rosier and Monk(#9 1st) are part of the trade package
Yes it is.... but MJ has done it before and he will overide others and do it again. Beelieve Me...Mitch/MJ are still working on this one.

Dude: Chill it with the “we are trading everything for Westbrook” posts in every thread.

Use the fake trade thread if you have ideas but stop blowing up every other thread.


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For real its bad vibes. All we really need to do is sign Christian Wood and call it an offseaon.

[Rich4114]

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This is the sort of thing I was worried about with Ball. The circus he brings (his family). Notice LaMelo didn't publicly ask Monk for it (because that'd be dumb) but his brother did via Twitter (which is even more dumb). Monk has already replied saying he can't do that. It's just annoying it was even put out there. Really worried these guys are used to getting what they want. Hopefully LaMelo can fall in line and work to earn his mins. Mitch said that right off the bat, which I agree with and was needed. Guy seems to have a ton of talent and can be a superstar for us, but it won't happen if he's not pushed to work hard and earn it.

[DY_nasty]

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This is the sort of thing I was worried about with Ball. The circus he brings (his family). Notice LaMelo didn't publicly ask Monk for it (because that'd be dumb) but his brother did via Twitter (which is even more dumb). Monk has already replied saying he can't do that. It's just annoying it was even put out there. Really worried these guys are used to getting what they want. Hopefully LaMelo can fall in line and work to earn his mins. Mitch said that right off the bat, which I agree with and was needed. Guy seems to have a ton of talent and can be a superstar for us, but it won't happen if he's not pushed to work hard and earn it.

I'm with you a little but its all jokes imo

and for whatever isn't..... anything that lights a fire under Malik Monk is positive.

[SWedd523]

I don't think you can really say "his shooting sucks" based purely on 80 3PA he took in 12 games. It's a bigger context when you factor in FT%, 3PA, and shooting touch.

Lets put those 80 shots in perspective:
- 4 of those 80 were on full court heaves
- If he had just made 5 more shots he would have shot 33% (25/76)
- 5 shots isn't really significant
- 80 shots is too small a sample size

You're making a ton of rose colored excuses here and losing me as a result. Weren't you one of the guys who spent the majority of the pre-draft doing just that (drawing conclusions) based on Wiseman's 3 games in college?

Yet a 12 game example isn't significant enough for true conclusion drawing?

I get that you were super high on him, but this is bordering on Love Dome territory now.

[Hornet Mania]

what does ball shot from FT? thats normally a good indicator of long term success shooting the ball

72% with Illawarra, not particularly great for a guard.

If you factor in SPIRE, NBL, and Lithuania then he shot 337/424 or .794. It's also worth noting that while shots in different leagues would effect FG% that FT% would be unaffected by competition.

79% is not elite but it's still a solid number.



Also, it's totally possible he doesn't shoot at the next level. I want to be clear where I land. I'm optimistic but would say it's more likely he doesn't become an above average NBA shooter than he does become one.

Yeah, I'm definitely rooting for him. For me personally it's one of those deals where I didn't believe in the pick but he's ours now so he's my guy and I wish him well. Hope he makes every doubter eat crow, I'll gladly sidle up to the table myself if he develops into a great player.

It's an insane year so I'm hoping fans of other teams can eventually count the most unlikely team (Hornets) drafting the most unlikely generational superstar (Lamelo) as part of the madness.

[SWedd523]

He is not a good shooter right now, but guess what. You can learn to shoot. You can't teach his height.

Now you just wait a damn minute

*scrolls up, checks thread title*

Okay my bad, I thought I stumbled into the MKG thread.


He's BOTH a poor shooter and a low IQ shot taker. That is a potentially alarming combination if he isn't humble/intelligent enough to correct at least one of those issues.

[JMAC3]

He is not a good shooter right now, but guess what. You can learn to shoot. You can't teach his height.

Now you just wait a damn minute

*scrolls up, checks thread title*

Okay my bad, I thought I stumbled into the MKG thread.


He's BOTH a poor shooter and a low IQ shot taker. That is a potentially alarming combination if he isn't humble/intelligent enough to correct at least one of those issues.

You can say this about anyone, to be a good shooter in NBA you have to put the work in. Nobody just was a good shooter in college and then never has to work on it. It is a constant skill that you have to work on to keep sharp or develop.

If you don't think our coaching staff can help him improve his shooting then we need to fire all of them.

[James Gatz]

I don't think you can really say "his shooting sucks" based purely on 80 3PA he took in 12 games. It's a bigger context when you factor in FT%, 3PA, and shooting touch.

Lets put those 80 shots in perspective:
- 4 of those 80 were on full court heaves
- If he had just made 5 more shots he would have shot 33% (25/76)
- 5 shots isn't really significant
- 80 shots is too small a sample size

You're making a ton of rose colored excuses here and losing me as a result. Weren't you one of the guys who spent the majority of the pre-draft doing just that (drawing conclusions) based on Wiseman's 3 games in college?

Yet a 12 game example isn't significant enough for true conclusion drawing?

I get that you were super high on him, but this is bordering on Love Dome territory now.

Let's be clear, I don't think he will be a good or even average shooter next year. I'd be surprised if he shoots above 32%. I'd expect it to be 28%-31% from range. I'm optimistic by year 3-4 he can be around 33-35%. Even then I think it's far from a guarantee.

My issue with Slam's argument was that 80 shooting attempts doesn't really tell you that much. You have to look at FT%, 3PGA, and eye test factors like touch, shot selection, etc in order to attempt to project his shooting. Looking at just 3PT% from 12 games is not enough.

I also said through out that Wiseman didn't have a large enough sample size to draw anything from his college stats. Note the term stats here. My issues with Wiseman were based largely on his lateral quickness, an area that doesn't really have the ability to improve in the same way shooting does, and upside, which can be determined from his projected role.

[James Gatz]

He is not a good shooter right now, but guess what. You can learn to shoot. You can't teach his height.

Now you just wait a damn minute

*scrolls up, checks thread title*

Okay my bad, I thought I stumbled into the MKG thread.


He's BOTH a poor shooter and a low IQ shot taker. That is a potentially alarming combination if he isn't humble/intelligent enough to correct at least one of those issues.

That's the whole bet with Lamelo dude. If he can correct his shooting and shot selection enough to be average then he's an all-star level guy. For me, that upside is worth a top pick.

If he continues to have poor shot selection and low shooting percentages then he tops out a flashy low end starter.

[MasterIchiro]

I'm all for a new Love Dome™ now that the MKG Love Dome™ has ruptured and busted with gunk. LaMelo Ball has 8 years to prove himself. Themz the rulz.

[DY_nasty]

the FT% stuff is really only applicable if the shot itself doesn't need reworking or if there are no fundamental issues

and in the case of his brother, reworking his shot made the guy shoot *worse* from the line in the pros compared to college lol.

but meh. as long as people keep their expectations reasonable for the kid and stop trying to frame stuff like we need to drop everything we've been doing in this good rebuild to build around him specifically, i'm whatever...

[DY_nasty]

He is not a good shooter right now, but guess what. You can learn to shoot. You can't teach his height.

Now you just wait a damn minute

*scrolls up, checks thread title*

Okay my bad, I thought I stumbled into the MKG thread.


He's BOTH a poor shooter and a low IQ shot taker. That is a potentially alarming combination if he isn't humble/intelligent enough to correct at least one of those issues.

That's the whole bet with Lamelo dude. If he can correct his shooting and shot selection enough to be average then he's an all-star level guy. For me, that upside is worth a top pick.

If he continues to have poor shot selection and low shooting percentages then he tops out a flashy low end starter.

whoa there

we still gotta see if he can even finish at the rim, if his ball handling translates at all, and if he's some kind of genius passer as advertised too

[SWedd523]

He is not a good shooter right now, but guess what. You can learn to shoot. You can't teach his height.

Now you just wait a damn minute

*scrolls up, checks thread title*

Okay my bad, I thought I stumbled into the MKG thread.


He's BOTH a poor shooter and a low IQ shot taker. That is a potentially alarming combination if he isn't humble/intelligent enough to correct at least one of those issues.

You can say this about anyone, to be a good shooter in NBA you have to put the work in. Nobody just was a good shooter in college and then never has to work on it. It is a constant skill that you have to work on to keep sharp or develop.

If you don't think our coaching staff can help him improve his shooting then we need to fire all of them.

Not really.

Most bad shooters realize that and don't jack up random 30 footers or one legged floaters from one step inside the three point line.

Hell, most GOOD shooters don't do that.

The league has been chasing super efficiency ever since Steph exploded onto the scene. Ball needs to realize that his jumper is trash and he needs to fill a Simmons role until he (hopefully) develops a more functional shot.

[SWedd523]

I also said through out that Wiseman didn't have a large enough sample size to draw anything from his college stats. Note the term stats here. My issues with Wiseman were based largely on his lateral quickness, an area that doesn't really have the ability to improve in the same way shooting does, and upside, which can be determined from his projected role.

That's a fair enough argument, so I won't belabor that point.

My only argument here is perspective and the.... temperance? of expectations.

I view Ball as an uber confident player who may have issues recognizing his faults and fear he may not be talented enough to impose his will on defenses. That's backed up by him personally stating he doesn't believe his jumper is broken and/or needs to be rebuilt. That tells me he doesn't really realize he takes dumb shots and shoots poorly.

We really only need one season (or less) to see if he has the mental strength and humility to realize he needs massive improvement.

If he improves his shot IQ, his trajectory goes way up in my opinion. If not, then I'm going to be super down on him.


EDIT: just saw the following

That's the whole bet with Lamelo dude. If he can correct his shooting and shot selection enough to be average then he's an all-star level guy. For me, that upside is worth a top pick.

If he continues to have poor shot selection and low shooting percentages then he tops out a flashy low end starter.

It appears we're sitting on the same plane but in different rows. Pre-draft I didn't think his personality would allow him to do it. I still don't. But he's a Hornet so I want to beelieve

[yosemiteben]

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Damn right

[Hornet Mania]

Man, I miss Cookout so much.