Fool Me Twice: The Gordon Hayward Thread

[BigSlam]

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I think Mitch called Ainge's bluff. Doesn't make sense for BOS to let Hayward walk just like it doesn't make sense for us to stretch Batum.

This is like the Kemba situation in reverse.

Yup. It’s the moratorium so unless we had sent in paperwork to stretch Batum, there’s always time to make a deal. Good for Mitch calling Ainges bull.The stretch is the worst part honestly. Let’s see what we send back.

We don't have enough on the books to send back to get to Haywards $30 mil though?

Unless we are sending back Batum which would be a straight swap (maybe one of the teams throws in some 2nd round sweeteners - just not sure if it would be us, or them?)

Or Zeller and Terry combined - which doesn't make sense because Boston just signed Teague and Thompson.

The only other option would be if there was a 3rd team involved.....I think?

[Braggins]

Spoiler:

I think Mitch called Ainge's bluff. Doesn't make sense for BOS to let Hayward walk just like it doesn't make sense for us to stretch Batum.

This is like the Kemba situation in reverse.

Yup. It’s the moratorium so unless we had sent in paperwork to stretch Batum, there’s always time to make a deal. Good for Mitch calling Ainges bull.The stretch is the worst part honestly. Let’s see what we send back.

We don't have enough on the books to send back to get to Haywards $30 mil though?

Unless we are sending back Batum which would be a straight swap (maybe one of the teams throws in some 2nd round sweeteners - just not sure if it would be us, or them?)

Or Zeller and Terry combined - which doesn't make sense because Boston just signed Teague and Thompson.

The only other option would be if there was a 3rd team involved.....I think?

I might honestly prefer sending multiple 2nds with Batum to the alternative options.

[wilson115]

Spoiler:

Yup. It’s the moratorium so unless we had sent in paperwork to stretch Batum, there’s always time to make a deal. Good for Mitch calling Ainges bull.The stretch is the worst part honestly. Let’s see what we send back.

We don't have enough on the books to send back to get to Haywards $30 mil though?

Unless we are sending back Batum which would be a straight swap (maybe one of the teams throws in some 2nd round sweeteners - just not sure if it would be us, or them?)

Or Zeller and Terry combined - which doesn't make sense because Boston just signed Teague and Thompson.

The only other option would be if there was a 3rd team involved.....I think?

I might honestly prefer sending multiple 2nds with Batum to the alternative options.

Does Boston have enough space after signing Teague/Thompson? They get to waive Nic?

[Braggins]

Spoiler:

We don't have enough on the books to send back to get to Haywards $30 mil though?

Unless we are sending back Batum which would be a straight swap (maybe one of the teams throws in some 2nd round sweeteners - just not sure if it would be us, or them?)

Or Zeller and Terry combined - which doesn't make sense because Boston just signed Teague and Thompson.

The only other option would be if there was a 3rd team involved.....I think?

I might honestly prefer sending multiple 2nds with Batum to the alternative options.

Does Boston have enough space after signing Teague/Thompson? They get to waive Nic?

Not sure. I can't find any info on the Teague/Thompson deals. I'm guessing they are pretty cheap, but I don't know the cap rules well or what Boston's cap situation looks like.

[chabber]

I think Mitch called Ainge's bluff. Doesn't make sense for BOS to let Hayward walk just like it doesn't make sense for us to stretch Batum.

This is like the Kemba situation in reverse.

Yup. It’s the moratorium so unless we had sent in paperwork to stretch Batum, there’s always time to make a deal. Good for Mitch calling Ainges bull.The stretch is the worst part honestly. Let’s see what we send back.

We don't have enough on the books to send back to get to Haywards $30 mil though?

Unless we are sending back Batum which would be a straight swap (maybe one of the teams throws in some 2nd round sweeteners - just not sure if it would be us, or them?)

Or Zeller and Terry combined - which doesn't make sense because Boston just signed Teague and Thompson.

The only other option would be if there was a 3rd team involved.....I think?

I haven’t checked but maybe just some 2nd rounder that doesn’t convey and it creates a massive trade exception for Boston. I haven’t kept up with the cba in forever. Not sure how much salary we’d have to send back to get Hayward’s number to fit.

[JMAC3]

We would be giving them a trade exception. We don’t have to equal contracts. Rozier or Zeller can be dealt by themselves because we have cap space to absorb Hayward into.

[BigSlam]

d&k posted this in the offseason thread. Seems to make a lot of sense?

Is Mitch really that much of a bad ass to pull something like this off?

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?s=20

[chabber]

d&k posted this in the offseason thread. Seems to make a lot of sense?

Is Mitch really that much of a bad ass to pull something like this off?

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?s=20

He did force his former boss Jerry West to give him some picks for Shai. I’d say yes!

[James Gatz]

I'm not very knowledgeable about the CBA, but I don't think we could just send Rozier by himself for Hayward (at 30 mil), but maybe we could sign Tristan Thompson for Boston and send him with Rozier to match salaries? That would at least allows to keep our only decent center option. I'd probably rather send Batum and some 2nd rounders and keep Rozier and Zeller and use Rozier in separate trade, but I don't know if Boston would be down for that since Batum is basically useless. Maybe Kemba will do us a solid and vouch for Batum lol.

I actually believe we can do this trade as removing Rozier from our books puts us about 38 million under the cap and thus able to absorb all of Hayward's new salary. I believe this also creates a 11.1 mil TPE for Boston as well.

[JMAC3]

I think doing a sign and trade helps out Boston more than it helps us. They either get an asset like Rozier or a trade exception, either way both are better than getting nothing for Hayward.

[JMAC3]

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[James Gatz]

If we can get off Rozier's contract and not stretch Batum then I'm much more okay with Hayward deal. Despite his good statistical year last year I think he regresses and isn't worth what he's being paid next two years.

[BigSlam]

I think doing a sign and trade helps out Boston more than it helps us. They either get an asset like Rozier or a trade exception, either way both are better than getting nothing for Hayward.

Think of it this way:

Terry isn't a required player now with Tae, Ball and Hayward on the roster - not to mention Monk and Twin #1.

Trading Terry today frees up $18mil of cap room next season that we otherwise wouldn't have if Terry stays on the roster.

[BigSlam]

If we can get off Rozier's contract and not stretch Batum then I'm much more okay with Hayward deal. Despite his good statistical year last year I think he regresses and isn't worth what he's being paid next two years.

I'm with you JG. I'm still not stoked at the number or years, but if a S&T moves Terry's number off our books next year right away it makes the Hayward move much, much more palatable for me.

[James Gatz]

If we can get off Rozier's contract and not stretch Batum then I'm much more okay with Hayward deal. Despite his good statistical year last year I think he regresses and isn't worth what he's being paid next two years.

I'm with you JG. I'm still not stoked at the number or years, but if a S&T moves Terry's number off our books next year right away it makes the Hayward move much, much more palatable for me.

I think it's more likely that it just turns into us getting a 2nd and BOS creating a large TPE but that is still something of a positive from where we were a few hours ago.

[chabber]

I just realized. If this all works out, Bonnell did something useful for the team with the Batum stretch report.

Makes me wonder about those Okongwu injury reports he leaked even more.

[316Hornets]

I'm also a bigger fan of this deal if we don't stretch Batum. That was really the big negative out of this thing since we are so close to being done with that crap. We aren't really competing for a top seed this year so it doesn't make sense to stretch it. Although, I would stretch it if that's our only option just to have Hayward.

[James Gatz]

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[Braggins]

I think doing a sign and trade helps out Boston more than it helps us. They either get an asset like Rozier or a trade exception, either way both are better than getting nothing for Hayward.

Ya, I agree. Like, I think we definitely need to figure something out to avoid stretching Batum, but Rozier is a positive asset that I think we really need to use to find another piece that fits our roster better. If we ship Zeller that would be fine as long as we have a backup plan at center, but I really don't want that backup plan to be signing Whiteside. It would be nice to keep Cody as a backup for one last year if possible, so I think I'd rather just throw some 2nd rounders with Batum if Boston would do that, but I'm not sure if that is enough incentive for them.

[JMAC3]

If we can get off Rozier's contract and not stretch Batum then I'm much more okay with Hayward deal. Despite his good statistical year last year I think he regresses and isn't worth what he's being paid next two years.

I'm with you JG. I'm still not stoked at the number or years, but if a S&T moves Terry's number off our books next year right away it makes the Hayward move much, much more palatable for me.

I know we have a roster crunch but that doesn’t mean you just give up value.

Rozier is worth a first in the 14-24 range.

Assume Batum was under contract for the next three years at 9 million. Would you trade a first (Rozier value) to dump him?