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2020 Preseason Speculation - Lineup battles underway

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Re: 2020 Season/Offseason (FA/Trade) Speculation - CP3 added...who's next? 

Post#2881 » by ray ray » Sun Nov 22, 2020 2:38 am

Revived wrote:
Kerrsed wrote:Soooo....lets NOW revisit the trade. Which combo is better? Rubio/Oubre or CP3/Crowder ???? And for those of you sticking with Rubio/Oubre, honestly, does it look as bad now?

Depends on if CP3 stays healthy. If he doesn’t miss any games or misses like 5-7 games then easily CP3.

If CP3 misses a ton of games then the latter for sure.


Some suns fans act like Ricky Rubio was always healthy and never missed games. I will says this , Rubio played 65 games last year versus CP3 70 and those don’t include the playoffs.

CP3 does everything that Rubio did last year for us at a much higher level. He brings an element that Rubio had improved but still lacked consistency and that is shooting ability. CP3 is a much better shooter and the defense will not sag off him like they did with Rubio which will increase and open lanes for Booker to either score or create.

Kelly Oubre will be missed. There is no
Debate, Oubre is a much better athlete than Crowder. Oubre brought flashy plays, and brought energy to a game similar to what happens when Larry Fitzgerald catches a ball.
However, Crowder brings toughness, playoff type of defense, physicality similar to what PJ Tucker does. He can hit the open three and is a smart defender . There was a good chance that Oubre was going to leave us after this season so we replaced him with a PJ Tucker type of player. It’s not flashy like Oubre but does the same job.

Overall, I feel like we upgraded our roster. If we are going off what they did in the bubble . You upgraded with CP3 at the point and added a tough defender to the mix which we didn’t have.

If they are able to keep Saric , we have a nice 9 man rotation. Most importantly, we have a team that is very well rounded. A roster with shooting, defense and high IQ players. Great job James
Jones , great job!


CP3| Payne | Carter
Booker | Nadar | Ty-Shon
Bridges| Crowder | Cam
Crowder | Cam | Smith
Ayton | Saric | Smith
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Re: 2020 Season/Offseason (FA/Trade) Speculation - CP3 added...who's next? 

Post#2882 » by Book1Nation » Sun Nov 22, 2020 2:41 am

Ghost of Kleine wrote:At this point, What's really left? I have to say that currently, I'm somewhat disappointed so far ( with the exception of the Crowder signing) With the free agency results? I mean, Feel free to tell me if I'm wrong, But wasn't one of the major selling points on the Chris Paul trade that he'd draw big name/ higher caliber free agents to our team? And so far we've only been able to secure Crowder. And that's honestly by overpaying, with additional years. Otherwise he most likely would have just resigned with Miami ( If not for that extra year. What I guess I find most concerning, is that we still don't have any reasonable depth behind Paul in the event of injury though. So what's left for us in the vets' minimum range ? What should our remaining " realistic " tiers be at this point?


Guys I’m still interested in, but would have to be for the BAE or vet min. Counting on bringing back Saric + Carter.

Point guards - Yogi Ferrell, Quin Cook, Emmanuel Mudiay, Reggie Jackson, Shabazz Napier

Off guards/Wings - E'Twaun Moore, Langston Galloway, Marco Belinelli, Bryn Forbes, Solomon Hill, Glenn Robinson III, Shaquille Harrison, Torrey Craig, DeAndre' Bembry, Juancho Hernangomez

Bigs - Aron Baynes (why not?), Marc Gasol, Serge Ibaka, Noah Vonleh, Ian Mahinmi, Harry Giles, Alex Len
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Re: 2020 Season/Offseason (FA/Trade) Speculation - CP3 added...who's next? 

Post#2883 » by Revived » Sun Nov 22, 2020 2:42 am

I’m surprised many people here only learned about Chris Paul last season. He’s been in the NBA for like 12+ years lol. If people knew about him from before then they would surely know the injury risk he brings and one fluke season last year doesn’t change that.

This whole “Oh but but but last year he played more than Rubio” argument is pretty funny to me. Chris Paul’s been around a lot longer than last year guys. So has Rubio (10+ yrs for him too I think). Rubio isn’t some super durable guy either. But when comparing both guys injury history, the results are pretty obvious.

Hoping for the best and for 35 yr old Chris Paul to be an iron man like he was last season. Let’s see.
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Re: 2020 Season/Offseason (FA/Trade) Speculation - CP3 added...who's next? 

Post#2884 » by BobbieL » Sun Nov 22, 2020 2:46 am

I still think there are options at guard
Moore
McLaughlin

Who knows - George hill might get bought out

Baynes might not have many options left
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Re: 2020 Season/Offseason (FA/Trade) Speculation - CP3 added...who's next? 

Post#2885 » by BobbieL » Sun Nov 22, 2020 2:48 am

Revived wrote:
matt131 wrote:
Read on Twitter

Imagine if the Nets got him. They would Kevin Durant, Jeff Green, Serge Ibaka. If they trade for Harden then that’s 4 out of 5 from OKC’s starting lineup when they made finals long time ago.

And the market for Baynes gets smaller

One year 6m ?
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Re: 2020 Season/Offseason (FA/Trade) Speculation - CP3 added...who's next? 

Post#2886 » by KLEON » Sun Nov 22, 2020 2:50 am

Kerrsed wrote:
Read on Twitter

People are really sleeping on GSW because of Klay's injury. Steph will be Steph and Draymond will be Draymond. People are acting as if Wiggins is a scrub but I think he'll step up because he will be in a winning culture and Draymond will be in his ears. We all know Kelly will bring it(AVG. 19 pts last season), Wiseman gives them something they never had, a big that can post-up and he has mid range game and Eric Paschall who's like a Draymond with offensive game.They will be scary
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Re: 2020 Season/Offseason (FA/Trade) Speculation - CP3 added...who's next? 

Post#2887 » by DirtyDez » Sun Nov 22, 2020 2:58 am

KLEON wrote:
Kerrsed wrote:
Read on Twitter

People are really sleeping on GSW because of Klay's injury. Steph will be Steph and Draymond will be Draymond. People are acting as if Wiggins is a scrub but I think he'll step up because he will be in a winning culture and Draymond will be in his ears. We all know Kelly will bring it(AVG. 19 pts last season), Wiseman gives them something they never had, a big that can post-up and he has mid range game and Eric Paschall who's like a Draymond with offensive game.They will be scary


I like their frontcourt situation more than ours but without Klay their guards/wings are two tiers below us. After the big-3 I only have Portland and Dallas better on paper.
fromthetop321 wrote:I got Lebron number 1, he is also leading defensive player of the year. Curry's game still reminds me of Jeremy Lin to much.
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Re: 2020 Season/Offseason (FA/Trade) Speculation - CP3 added...who's next? 

Post#2888 » by WeekapaugGroove » Sun Nov 22, 2020 2:59 am

Some people didn't like the Paul trade from the beginning and nothing will change that. It's fine and we'll see how it works out. There's absolutely level of risk involved.

What I don't think is debatable is the ceiling of this team is raised with him here. All NBA talent wins.

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Re: 2020 Season/Offseason (FA/Trade) Speculation - CP3 added...who's next? 

Post#2889 » by bwgood77 » Sun Nov 22, 2020 3:03 am

ray ray wrote:
Revived wrote:
Kerrsed wrote:Soooo....lets NOW revisit the trade. Which combo is better? Rubio/Oubre or CP3/Crowder ???? And for those of you sticking with Rubio/Oubre, honestly, does it look as bad now?

Depends on if CP3 stays healthy. If he doesn’t miss any games or misses like 5-7 games then easily CP3.

If CP3 misses a ton of games then the latter for sure.


Some suns fans act like Ricky Rubio was always healthy and never missed games. I will says this , Rubio played 65 games last year versus CP3 70 and those don’t include the playoffs.

CP3 does everything that Rubio did last year for us at a much higher level. He brings an element that Rubio had improved but still lacked consistency and that is shooting ability. CP3 is a much better shooter and the defense will not sag off him like they did with Rubio which will increase and open lanes for Booker to either score or create.

Kelly Oubre will be missed. There is no
Debate, Oubre is a much better athlete than Crowder. Oubre brought flashy plays, and brought energy to a game similar to what happens when Larry Fitzgerald catches a ball.
However, Crowder brings toughness, playoff type of defense, physicality similar to what PJ Tucker does. He can hit the open three and is a smart defender . There was a good chance that Oubre was going to leave us after this season so we replaced him with a PJ Tucker type of player. It’s not flashy like Oubre but does the same job.

Overall, I feel like we upgraded our roster. If we are going off what they did in the bubble . You upgraded with CP3 at the point and added a tough defender to the mix which we didn’t have.

If they are able to keep Saric , we have a nice 9 man rotation. Most importantly, we have a team that is very well rounded. A roster with shooting, defense and high IQ players. Great job James
Jones , great job!


CP3| Payne | Carter
Booker | Nadar | Ty-Shon
Bridges| Crowder | Cam
Crowder | Cam | Smith
Ayton | Saric | Smith


Yeah, Paul finally did well being healthy last year after missing 69 games the previous 3 years to 26 for Rubio. And of course Rubio had to miss one while his baby was born during the season.

Hope he stays healthy. You are right that the team will be better with him, but Rubio was no slouch himself and made a big difference and still seems to be getting better.

And yeah, even though Rubio improved his 3 pt shot to 36.1%, Paul was better at 36.5%.
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Re: 2020 Season/Offseason (FA/Trade) Speculation - CP3 added...who's next? 

Post#2890 » by nevetsov » Sun Nov 22, 2020 3:05 am

Baynes might be playing for the Adelaide 36ers the way it's going.
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Re: 2020 Season/Offseason (FA/Trade) Speculation - CP3 added...who's next? 

Post#2891 » by bwgood77 » Sun Nov 22, 2020 3:08 am

BobbieL wrote:I still think there are options at guard
Moore
McLaughlin

Who knows - George hill might get bought out

Baynes might not have many options left


If Ibaka goes to Brooklyn, I feel like the Clips or Raptors, whoever doesn't sign Gasol, will sign Baynes.
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Re: 2020 Season/Offseason (FA/Trade) Speculation - CP3 added...who's next? 

Post#2892 » by bwgood77 » Sun Nov 22, 2020 3:11 am

DirtyDez wrote:
KLEON wrote:
Kerrsed wrote:
Read on Twitter

People are really sleeping on GSW because of Klay's injury. Steph will be Steph and Draymond will be Draymond. People are acting as if Wiggins is a scrub but I think he'll step up because he will be in a winning culture and Draymond will be in his ears. We all know Kelly will bring it(AVG. 19 pts last season), Wiseman gives them something they never had, a big that can post-up and he has mid range game and Eric Paschall who's like a Draymond with offensive game.They will be scary


I like their frontcourt situation more than ours but without Klay their guards/wings are two tiers below us. After the big-3 I only have Portland and Dallas better on paper.


Don't forget about Nico Mannion. They also signed Wanamaker. But yeah, you're right.
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Re: 2020 Season/Offseason (FA/Trade) Speculation - CP3 added...who's next? 

Post#2893 » by nevetsov » Sun Nov 22, 2020 3:11 am

I think it's more like:

1 Paul, Payne, TBA
2 Booker, Carter, Okobo
3 Bridges, Nader
4 Johnson, Crowder, Smith
5 Ayton, Saric

With Cam/ Crowder playing some 3 so Smith can get minutes. Wouldn't mind some injury insurance, though (and an Okobo upgrade).
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Re: 2020 Season/Offseason (FA/Trade) Speculation - CP3 added...who's next? 

Post#2894 » by DirtyDez » Sun Nov 22, 2020 3:15 am

bwgood77 wrote:
DirtyDez wrote:
KLEON wrote:People are really sleeping on GSW because of Klay's injury. Steph will be Steph and Draymond will be Draymond. People are acting as if Wiggins is a scrub but I think he'll step up because he will be in a winning culture and Draymond will be in his ears. We all know Kelly will bring it(AVG. 19 pts last season), Wiseman gives them something they never had, a big that can post-up and he has mid range game and Eric Paschall who's like a Draymond with offensive game.They will be scary


I like their frontcourt situation more than ours but without Klay their guards/wings are two tiers below us. After the big-3 I only have Portland and Dallas better on paper.


Don't forget about Nico Mannion. They also signed Wanamaker. But yeah, you're right.


Nico is the reason I’m never again getting hyped for a UA recruit. I think the twilight of Steph’s career will be fascinating. He’s on the back-9 now.
fromthetop321 wrote:I got Lebron number 1, he is also leading defensive player of the year. Curry's game still reminds me of Jeremy Lin to much.
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Re: 2020 Season/Offseason (FA/Trade) Speculation - CP3 added...who's next? 

Post#2895 » by Kerrsed » Sun Nov 22, 2020 3:18 am

bwgood77 wrote:
BobbieL wrote:I still think there are options at guard
Moore
McLaughlin

Who knows - George hill might get bought out

Baynes might not have many options left


If Ibaka goes to Brooklyn, I feel like the Clips or Raptors, whoever doesn't sign Gasol, will sign Baynes.


As i said earlier its going to be Toronto. All signs point to Ibaka in Brooklyn. Clippers really want Gasol. That leaves the Raptor with ZERO centers. At that point Baynes is the best FA C available. Only way i see it going otherwise is if Toronto decides that the loss of Ibaka and Gasol is too great and to start the rebuild (Or Retool). I could see the possibility of them looking to trade Lowry to upgrade other positions now that FVV is under contract.
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Re: 2020 Season/Offseason (FA/Trade) Speculation - CP3 added...who's next? 

Post#2896 » by Ghost of Kleine » Sun Nov 22, 2020 3:23 am

ray ray wrote:
Revived wrote:
Kerrsed wrote:Soooo....lets NOW revisit the trade. Which combo is better? Rubio/Oubre or CP3/Crowder ???? And for those of you sticking with Rubio/Oubre, honestly, does it look as bad now?

Depends on if CP3 stays healthy. If he doesn’t miss any games or misses like 5-7 games then easily CP3.

If CP3 misses a ton of games then the latter for sure.


Some suns fans act like Ricky Rubio was always healthy and never missed games. I will says this , Rubio played 65 games last year versus CP3 70 and those don’t include the playoffs.

CP3 does everything that Rubio did last year for us at a much higher level. He brings an element that Rubio had improved but still lacked consistency and that is shooting ability. CP3 is a much better shooter and the defense will not sag off him like they did with Rubio which will increase and open lanes for Booker to either score or create.

Kelly Oubre will be missed. There is no
Debate, Oubre is a much better athlete than Crowder. Oubre brought flashy plays, and brought energy to a game similar to what happens when Larry Fitzgerald catches a ball.
However, Crowder brings toughness, playoff type of defense, physicality similar to what PJ Tucker does. He can hit the open three and is a smart defender . There was a good chance that Oubre was going to leave us after this season so we replaced him with a PJ Tucker type of player. It’s not flashy like Oubre but does the same job.

Overall, I feel like we upgraded our roster. If we are going off what they did in the bubble . You upgraded with CP3 at the point and added a tough defender to the mix which we didn’t have.

If they are able to keep Saric , we have a nice 9 man rotation. Most importantly, we have a team that is very well rounded. A roster with shooting, defense and high IQ players. Great job James
Jones , great job!


CP3| Payne | Carter
Booker | Nadar | Ty-Shon
Bridges| Crowder | Cam
Crowder | Cam | Smith
Ayton | Saric | Smith


CP3| Payne | Carter
Booker | Nadar | Ty-Shon
Bridges| Crowder | Cam
Crowder | Cam | Smith
Ayton | Saric | Smith


I get that Paul is apparently a big upgrade to Rubio, And am thankful for that. But at 41 million? It remains to be seen. What my concern has been with respect to this trade, Is our overall depth. And obviously, it still is looking to be an issue at key areas? For example, I'm sure that everyone Hope's for and expects the best outcome, Aherein Paul maintains his durability from last season. But obviously if going off of the larger sample size or pattern over the past 4 yrs. 1 season in the last 4, With 3 of those 4 missing an average of over 20 games is not encouraging.

Again, One of the big selling points in this trade that was frequently mentioned was with respect to free agency. In that by adding Paul, He'd draw/ bring a higher caliber of free agents with him! Yet we've only been able to secure one mid tier quality free agent so far, And that's by overpaying with an additional year in order to persuade him not to resign. I understand that people are preaching patience, But whilst we're sitting around being patient, many other teams are improving their rosters and depth significantly. I mean honestly, Compare our depth against every other team in the league currently. Where do we come out against those other teams?

We still have a really big valid concern with our backup guard depth. What do we do IF ( worst case scenario) Paul does go down for periods of time due to heavy minutes in a heavily condensed season and brutal schedule? Who legitimately backs him up at that point? I mean I suppose we could have Booker play some games as " Point Book" perhaps? But let's be honest, Do we really want to be forced into potentially pushing heavy minutes on Booker, resulting in him wearing down faster and also subsequently increasing the risk of potential injury for him too?

Please anyone? Alay my fears and concerns with this? What's our contingency plan for potential injury here? Who at the veterans' minimum scale are we legitimately looking at (left with) that we feel confident can shoulder this potential burden? Shouldn't we honestly be concerned about our overall positional depth? Especially when considering the brutal format of this upcoming season? Also, with respect to the depth chart, I noticed that Smith is listed as BOTH our 3rd string 4 AND 5. But obviously he can't cover two positions simultaneously right? And we really can't Trot out 4 players either. So who do we target as our 3rd string 5, IF Smith is to be our 3rd string 4?

Anyways, I apologize for my rant and concerns. I'm just looking for potential answers to our depth issues. But do hope that this Paul experiment is successful! :)
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Re: 2020 Season/Offseason (FA/Trade) Speculation - CP3 added...who's next? 

Post#2897 » by nevetsov » Sun Nov 22, 2020 3:24 am

nevetsov wrote:I think it's more like:

1 Paul, Payne, TBA
2 Booker, Carter, Okobo
3 Bridges, Nader
4 Johnson, Crowder, Smith
5 Ayton, Saric

With Cam/ Crowder playing some 3 so Smith can get minutes. Wouldn't mind some injury insurance, though (and an Okobo upgrade).


Just looking at that, and assuming we get a game-ready upgrade over Okobo as 3rdSG (Forbes?) We can pretty much handle one injury at a time, with the exception of Ayton:

Paul out - Carter starts, 3SG gets minutes

Booker, Mikal, Johnson out - Crowder starts

Payne out - Carter back up CP3, 3SG gets minutes

Carter out - 3SG gets minutes

Nader out - Crowder/ Cam cover backup 3, more minutes for Smith at 4

Dario out - Smith plays backup C mins.

Ayton.. Smith starts???
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Re: 2020 Season/Offseason (FA/Trade) Speculation - CP3 added...who's next? 

Post#2898 » by King4Day » Sun Nov 22, 2020 3:26 am

Carter re-signs. 3 years. 11.5mi. Per woj
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Re: 2020 Season/Offseason (FA/Trade) Speculation - CP3 added...who's next? 

Post#2899 » by darealjuice » Sun Nov 22, 2020 3:28 am

Good deal on Jevon
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Re: 2020 Season/Offseason (FA/Trade) Speculation - CP3 added...who's next? 

Post#2900 » by matt131 » Sun Nov 22, 2020 3:28 am

Read on Twitter
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