cjbulls wrote:fleet wrote:What?
You think Patirck Williams was #1 on their board?
Yes. AK all but said that in the presser if you read between the lines.
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cjbulls wrote:fleet wrote:What?
You think Patirck Williams was #1 on their board?
johnnyvann840 wrote:cjbulls wrote:fleet wrote:How is that a win if you dont get your guy?
Pat Williams wasn't their guy. They wanted to move up.
They didn't want to move up, they were only considering it in case Detroit moved up to #3. Then, moving up to #2 would have made sure they got Williams.
johnnyvann840 wrote:cjbulls wrote:fleet wrote:How is a promise a poor use of a pick? If he stopped working out for teams they are less likely to seek a trade up over the Bulls
If they trade up ahead of you, to 3, then you get Ball. That's a win.
How is that a win? Thank goodness that didn't happen. That's exactly what the Bulls didn't need is a PG who can't shoot at all. Ball's shot mechanics look exactly like my 9 year old niece's. I would much rather have Pat Will than LeMelo Ball.
Brad Biggs wrote:Fields was in the bottom third of the league in too many key statistical metrics for the Bears to commit to the idea of trading down from the first pick for a bundle of future assets and then building around him.
cjbulls wrote:I guess we will have to wait and see. This kid deserves time (at least 3 years) and of course the draft moves randomly so it’s a bit unfair to always judge after the fact.
But I’d like all the posters here who are saying things like AK had him #1 to remember that as we move forwards and evaluate AK’s drafting skills. Perhaps all your faith shouldn’t be in the FO.
PhilLeotardo wrote:Ugly Duckling wrote:All my opinions thus far have been preliminary, just gut feelings based on watching a few minutes of tape on this kid. Now that I've been able to study more film, I can more confidently say that I'm happy with this pick. Not very happy, because we spent the 4th overall pick to get him, but happy. This is not a pick GarPax would've made. They didn't have the balls to take a calculated risk like this. Reisndorf is starting to come back into my good graces. He can keep the team. For now.
Jerry Reinsdorf no longer runs the Bulls & is ancient, probably doesn’t know where he is half the time, & is nearing the end of his life. All of the changes took place *because* of these factors. He doesn’t even live in Chicago. This is all Michael
I can guarantee that the old man doesn’t even know who Marc Evs is, and had almost nothing whatsoever to do with hiring anyone, besides a “senior blessing” type deal
Also, when was Jerry f**** reinsbarf ever in anyone’s good graces? It’s been a 22 year nightmare lol. It took him aging out in order for the nightmare to end
I’m also pretty positive that the Reinsdorf family only owns like 40% of the franchise
coldfish wrote:cjbulls wrote:I guess we will have to wait and see. This kid deserves time (at least 3 years) and of course the draft moves randomly so it’s a bit unfair to always judge after the fact.
But I’d like all the posters here who are saying things like AK had him #1 to remember that as we move forwards and evaluate AK’s drafting skills. Perhaps all your faith shouldn’t be in the FO.
I very much hope that PW goes on to become a hybrid of Lebron and Jordan, leading the Bulls to 12 straight titles. When I'm negative about PW it doesn't mean I'm rooting against him.
That said, AK has done nothing to earn a level where he is above criticism. Anyone criticizing PW isn't crazy. The film on him is concerning at best. The dude averaged 9.2p 4.0r and 1.0a off the bench. People a little worried about using a #4 pick on him are justified.
I hope AK found a gem in the rough but I'm not going to guarantee it.
coldfish wrote:
That said, AK has done nothing to earn a level where he is above criticism.
Anyone criticizing PW isn't crazy. The film on him is concerning at best. The dude averaged 9.2p 4.0r and 1.0a off the bench. People a little worried about using a #4 pick on him are justified.
Brad Biggs wrote:Fields was in the bottom third of the league in too many key statistical metrics for the Bears to commit to the idea of trading down from the first pick for a bundle of future assets and then building around him.
Brad Biggs wrote:Fields was in the bottom third of the league in too many key statistical metrics for the Bears to commit to the idea of trading down from the first pick for a bundle of future assets and then building around him.
sco wrote:I'm using my analogy for this draft again. This draft was the proverbial 3am choices in the bar. There's a lot of discussion as to whether the one with one leg is hotter than the one with the missing tooth. That's what this draft seemed like to me, lots of flaws everywhere you look, but it was easy to ignore them because they were so pervasive and you gotta take someone. We decided to go for the one sitting in the dark corner. Is PWill missing a tooth or a leg or is he the hidden gem...we won't know til morning, but that's who we brought home.
Brad Biggs wrote:Fields was in the bottom third of the league in too many key statistical metrics for the Bears to commit to the idea of trading down from the first pick for a bundle of future assets and then building around him.
fleet wrote:coldfish wrote:
That said, AK has done nothing to earn a level where he is above criticism.
The trouble with that is that AK hasn’t even had a chance to put a team on the court yet. And all he has done so far was to hire a respectable coach, and then made a draft pick who hasn’t even worn a uniform in practice. He’s not above criticism, but we sort of need to see his work first. The kind of criticism he has been getting is that he already **** up. A little hard to swallow.Anyone criticizing PW isn't crazy. The film on him is concerning at best. The dude averaged 9.2p 4.0r and 1.0a off the bench. People a little worried about using a #4 pick on him are justified.
Paul George went like #10, and Giannis went #15. Both drafts kind of sucked as well. By the angst we have seen displayed in this thread and all over Chicago, both would have been reaches in the top 5, defined by fan outrage. I think it’s bananas. In fact, Pat Williams is less of a reach than those 2 would have been, because we have reporting that at least one other team wanted to trade up and take Williams at 3. Trade down not feasible.
coldfish wrote:fleet wrote:coldfish wrote:
That said, AK has done nothing to earn a level where he is above criticism.
The trouble with that is that AK hasn’t even had a chance to put a team on the court yet. And all he has done so far was to hire a respectable coach, and then made a draft pick who hasn’t even worn a uniform in practice. He’s not above criticism, but we sort of need to see his work first. The kind of criticism he has been getting is that he already **** up. A little hard to swallow.Anyone criticizing PW isn't crazy. The film on him is concerning at best. The dude averaged 9.2p 4.0r and 1.0a off the bench. People a little worried about using a #4 pick on him are justified.
Paul George went like #10, and Giannis went #15. Both drafts kind of sucked as well. By the angst we have seen displayed in this thread and all over Chicago, both would have been reaches in the top 5, defined by fan outrage. I think it’s bananas. In fact, Pat Williams is less of a reach than those 2 would have been, because we have reporting that at least one other team wanted to trade up and take Williams at 3. Trade down not feasible.
If you go over the history of high potential guys taken high in the draft, its not pretty. Here are some other names, just guys taken at 4:
- Josh Jackson
- Dragan Bender
- Dion Waiters
- Tyrus Thomas
If you expand it to other picks, the number of disappointments is legion. IMO, AK hasn't earned the ability to select players like this and not get criticized.
Hopefully AK is a genius and he is rightfully ignoring the noise but the noise is justified. Again, if you look at the college tape on the guy he doesn't really look like a pro prospect, let alone a high lottery pick.
You can do all that and its perfectly fine, it's just annoying that you keep coming up with the same arguments all over again. People are telling you it is fine that you have your opinion, and you just don't want to stop arguing. Just bookmark this page and if PW busts you can dig it up and tell everyone that you were right.cjbulls wrote:Leslie Forman wrote:cjbulls wrote:I'd rather read professional opinions, watch videos and use as much info as possible to evaluate. But you just want to listen to what AK says for the media. Yet I'm the sucker.
some guys on internet podcasts who have literally never worked in the NBA in any capacity = "professionals"
Arturas Karnisovas, A MAN LITERALLY GETTING PAID A LARGE SALARY BY AN NBA FRANCHISE = some amateur
yeah ok bud
You love to misrepresent things when they aren't going your way. I never said AK was an amateur. I said what he tells the media doesn't inform my decision on a prospect. The fact AK said he likes the player, and was his guy, is to be expected not only because they drafted him, but because part of his job is to sell the prospect to the fans. He can't say, "damn we really wanted Wiseman but they wanted LaVine and I only was willing to put in WCJ."
We have seen NBA executives come and go. Most on this board felt the executive in charge of the Bulls with 20 years experience didn't know what he was doing. And that's before getting into the fact the NBA pulls these analysts for work. Stepien's own Cole Zwicker works for an NBA team now. John Hollinger of the Athletic was a former Grizzlies executive. Guys like Schmitz could work for any nba team tomorrow if they wanted.
I like to read up on the prospects, check out videos and make my own decisions. I would guess most posters on here do. I have done this for years now and have my own sense of things. I'm sorry that upsets you or doesn't count in your book. But for some reason you prefer to just let the draft happen and trust the Bulls made the perfect move. That's fine, but that is not a good reason to criticize my approach.
samwana wrote:You can do all that and its perfectly fine, it's just annoying that you keep coming up with the same arguments all over again. People are telling you it is fine that you have your opinion, and you just don't want to stop arguing. Just bookmark this page and if PW busts you can dig it up and tell everyone that you were right.cjbulls wrote:Leslie Forman wrote:some guys on internet podcasts who have literally never worked in the NBA in any capacity = "professionals"
Arturas Karnisovas, A MAN LITERALLY GETTING PAID A LARGE SALARY BY AN NBA FRANCHISE = some amateur
yeah ok bud
You love to misrepresent things when they aren't going your way. I never said AK was an amateur. I said what he tells the media doesn't inform my decision on a prospect. The fact AK said he likes the player, and was his guy, is to be expected not only because they drafted him, but because part of his job is to sell the prospect to the fans. He can't say, "damn we really wanted Wiseman but they wanted LaVine and I only was willing to put in WCJ."
We have seen NBA executives come and go. Most on this board felt the executive in charge of the Bulls with 20 years experience didn't know what he was doing. And that's before getting into the fact the NBA pulls these analysts for work. Stepien's own Cole Zwicker works for an NBA team now. John Hollinger of the Athletic was a former Grizzlies executive. Guys like Schmitz could work for any nba team tomorrow if they wanted.
I like to read up on the prospects, check out videos and make my own decisions. I would guess most posters on here do. I have done this for years now and have my own sense of things. I'm sorry that upsets you or doesn't count in your book. But for some reason you prefer to just let the draft happen and trust the Bulls made the perfect move. That's fine, but that is not a good reason to criticize my approach.
I wasn't very excited about the pick at first, but I will give AK the benefit of the doubt. I have been saying all along that I don't care about mocks and that I like taking the player you want regardless of what other people think I should do. AK just did that and I respect that a lot. Does it mean he got it right? We will know in a few years. And I hope you are still here to say I told you so.
Chill man, season will start soon enough, so we can talk real game action again.
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