Welcome Paul Reed

Sixer4life74 · Post #21 » by **Sixer4life74** » Sat Nov 21, 2020 3:55 pm

Everywhere you read he is high on everybody’s potential listing

LloydFree · Post #22 » by **LloydFree** » Sat Nov 21, 2020 9:17 pm

Probably old news to those who follow this stuff, but I just saw it... John Hollinger had #58 pick, Paul Reed, ranked ahead of #4 pick, PF Patrick Williams and #20 pick, PF Precious Achiuwa. Reed was #12 on his big board.

Kobblehead · Post #23 » by **Kobblehead** » Sat Nov 21, 2020 9:45 pm

LloydFree wrote:Probably old news to those who follow this stuff, but I just saw it... John Hollinger had #58 pick, Paul Reed, ranked ahead of #4 pick, PF Patrick Williams and #20 pick, PF Precious Achiuwa. Reed was #12 on his big board.

It's an interesting comparison. Often times upside/potential gets so married to age and it becomes distracting to look at things objectively.

When you really ask yourself what you want from a frontcourt player, you probably think:

- rebounding the ball (Precious and Paul)
- not being switch liability, defensively (all three)
- being able to hit free throws to stay on the floor late in games (Patrick and Paul)

Precious can't hit free throws. Patrick can't rebound. Paul is the only one of the three that ticks all of those vital frontcourt utilities.

I can see the argument, despite the discrepancy in age. As an aside, and also as a college veteran praise, I thought Xavier Tillman should have been a first round pick as well. He's another big that can do all those three things with the added ability of being a phenomenal passer for a big.

Onyeka Okongwu, Paul Reed and Xavier Tillman are the only bigs in this draft I would even want.

LloydFree · Post #24 » by **LloydFree** » Sat Nov 21, 2020 9:57 pm

Kobblehead wrote:
LloydFree wrote:Probably old news to those who follow this stuff, but I just saw it... John Hollinger had #58 pick, Paul Reed, ranked ahead of #4 pick, PF Patrick Williams and #20 pick, PF Precious Achiuwa. Reed was #12 on his big board.

It's an interesting comparison. Often times upside/potential gets so married to age and it becomes distracting to look at things objectively.

When you really ask yourself what you want from a frontcourt player, you probably think:

- rebounding the ball (Precious and Paul)
- not being switch liability, defensively (all three)
- being able to hit free throws to stay on the floor late in games (Patrick and Paul)

Precious can't hit free throws. Patrick can't rebound. Paul is the only one of the three that ticks all of those vital frontcourt utilities.

I can see the argument, despite the discrepancy in age. As an aside, and also as a college veteran praise, I thought Xavier Tillman should have been a first round pick as well. He's another big that can do all those three things with the added ability of being a phenomenal passer for a big.

Onyeka Okongwu, Paul Reed and Xavier Tillman are the only bigs in this draft I would even want.

I love Xavier Tillman. The teams that took big men in the 20's, up until his pick are going to be kicking themselves next year.

I know the Sun's are taking a lot of heat for picking Jalen Smith so high, but I think he can play a little bit and has a high floor. I could easily see that guy having a similar impact to Myles Turner offensively, if he reaches his ceiling.

LloydFree · Post #25 » by **LloydFree** » Sat Nov 21, 2020 10:15 pm

Kobblehead wrote:
LloydFree wrote:Probably old news to those who follow this stuff, but I just saw it... John Hollinger had #58 pick, Paul Reed, ranked ahead of #4 pick, PF Patrick Williams and #20 pick, PF Precious Achiuwa. Reed was #12 on his big board.

It's an interesting comparison. Often times upside/potential gets so married to age and it becomes distracting to look at things objectively.

When you really ask yourself what you want from a frontcourt player, you probably think:

- rebounding the ball (Precious and Paul)
- not being switch liability, defensively (all three)
- being able to hit free throws to stay on the floor late in games (Patrick and Paul)

Precious can't hit free throws. Patrick can't rebound. Paul is the only one of the three that ticks all of those vital frontcourt utilities.

I can see the argument, despite the discrepancy in age...

Patrick Williams is extremely young, but Achiuwa isn't. Paul Reed, a Junior, is only 3 months older than Freshman, Precious Achiuwa.

Kobblehead · Post #26 » by **Kobblehead** » Sat Nov 21, 2020 10:18 pm

I can't say that I'm a fan of Smith.

Freshman year, he couldn't hit free throws or rebound. Sophomore year, he could do both. Should we be impressed by him adding elements to his game or should we worry that he'll revert back to being deficient in those areas?

Also, I don't like him defensively. I think he's very exploitable on switches and with his weak power base in his lower body, I'm not even sure if he'll be a good post defender.

Kobblehead · Post #27 » by **Kobblehead** » Sat Nov 21, 2020 10:19 pm

Oh, I didn't know Precious was so old.

LloydFree · Post #28 » by **LloydFree** » Sat Nov 21, 2020 10:27 pm

Kobblehead wrote:I can't say that I'm a fan of Smith.

Freshman year, he couldn't hit free throws or rebound. Sophomore year, he could do both. Should we be impressed by him adding elements to his game or should we worry that he'll revert back to being deficient in those areas?

Also, I don't like him defensively. I think he's very exploitable on switches and with his weak power base in his lower body, I'm not even sure if he'll be a good post defender.

I'm not convinced that he'll be a good defender, but I had the same issues with Myles Turner, when he came out. Didn't think he moved well enough laterally and thought he was slow. He turned out ok, so I won't shut the door on Smith. As far as the shooting, is concerned, Smith's stroke is fluid and quick. I think his shooting is real. If Paul Reed had Jalen Smith's shooting form, he'd have gone in the top 20.

Kobblehead · Post #29 » by **Kobblehead** » Sat Nov 21, 2020 10:36 pm

There are traits to like with Smith (shotblocking, demonstrated rebounding improvement, demonstrated shooting improvement). And he seems to have excellent intangibles. Bright, good kid. Passionate and actually cares (walk off crying after loss).

I hate the value of taking a big in the lotto who probably can't play defense, though. Especially when you look at the players still on the board. Devin Vassell and Tyrese Haliburton went right after the Smith pick. Two guys that play on both ends of the floor that I have no doubt can be starters on a championship-caliber team. Seems like such a missed opportunity for Phoenix.

LloydFree · Post #30 » by **LloydFree** » Sun Nov 22, 2020 6:26 pm

Big men drafted in the 1st round that Paul Reed is significantly better than:

#16: Isaiah Stewart - Pistons
#22: Zeke Nnaji - Nuggets
#27: Udoka Azibuike - Jazz

Big men taken in the 1st, who I think he's better than but it's close:

#20: Precious Achiuwa - Heat
#28: Jaden McDaniels - Timberwolves

TTP · Post #31 » by **TTP** » Sun Nov 22, 2020 7:04 pm

LloydFree wrote:Probably old news to those who follow this stuff, but I just saw it... John Hollinger had #58 pick, Paul Reed, ranked ahead of #4 pick, PF Patrick Williams and #20 pick, PF Precious Achiuwa. Reed was #12 on his big board.

There's probably a lot of correlation between the guys Hollinger likes and the guys Morey likes.

Kobblehead · Post #32 » by **Kobblehead** » Sun Nov 22, 2020 7:44 pm

LloydFree wrote:Big men drafted in the 1st round that Paul Reed is significantly better than:

#16: Isaiah Stewart - Pistons
#22: Zeke Nnaji - Nuggets
#27: Udoka Azibuike - Jazz

Big men taken in the 1st, who I think he's better than but it's close:

#20: Precious Achiuwa - Heat
#28: Jaden McDaniels - Timberwolves

I think McDaniels has the creating skills to essentially play a wing role.

The Azibuike thing is the biggest head scratcher. Other than being 270 pounds and dominant on the glass, he offers nothing. No offensive ability, no defensive ability, low IQ and a character red flag. Terrible player.

Steward, Nnaji and Achiuwa have ability to drive offense so they'll likely be significantly more "productive" players than Reed (even though Reed will be more valuable).

LloydFree · Post #33 » by **LloydFree** » Sun Nov 22, 2020 8:19 pm

Kobblehead wrote:
LloydFree wrote:Big men drafted in the 1st round that Paul Reed is significantly better than:

#16: Isaiah Stewart - Pistons
#22: Zeke Nnaji - Nuggets
#27: Udoka Azibuike - Jazz

Big men taken in the 1st, who I think he's better than but it's close:

#20: Precious Achiuwa - Heat
#28: Jaden McDaniels - Timberwolves

I think McDaniels has the creating skills to essentially play a wing role.

The Azibuike thing is the biggest head scratcher. Other than being 270 pounds and dominant on the glass, he offers nothing. No offensive ability, no defensive ability, low IQ and a character red flag. Terrible player.

Steward, Nnaji and Achiuwa have ability to drive offense so they'll likely be significantly more "productive" players than Reed (even though Reed will be more valuable).

I'm just giving McDaniels the benefit of the doubt based on him being such a highly thought of HS player, but based on what I saw of him in college, he may never get off an NBA bench. He's worse and more raw than Skal Labissere was at the same stage.

I don't know what anybody sees in Stewart. He was the worst pick of the draft, IMO. I don't see how he could drive an offense.

Kobblehead · Post #34 » by **Kobblehead** » Sun Nov 22, 2020 8:41 pm

I mean drive offense in an undesirable scoring PF way ala Julius Randle.

Stewart's point production, free throw rate, and free throw percentage suggests he'll probably be able to score 12-16 ppg in his career.

All while being a defensive zero and insufficient rebounder, though.

Some teams just want guys to deposit buckets.

Negrodamus · Post #35 » by **Negrodamus** » Mon Nov 23, 2020 1:07 am

Read on Twitter

In the current offseason where teams are giving up on young talent, this is what I'm hoping Reed can become.

Raptors continue to be a top 5 run organization.

Arsenal · Post #36 » by **Arsenal** » Mon Nov 23, 2020 1:36 am

Right now I'm assuming Reed gets a 2-Way. However we've got one open roster spot and lack of depth at PF, so I wouldn't be surprised if Reed gets it.

Post #37 » by **Sixerscan** » Mon Nov 23, 2020 1:49 am

Arsenal wrote:Right now I'm assuming Reed gets a 2-Way. However we've got one open roster spot and lack of depth at PF, so I wouldn't be surprised if Reed gets it.

With the way 2 ways work this year (they can be active for 50 games) it's basically the same as having them on the end of the actual roster.

Arsenal · Post #38 » by **Arsenal** » Mon Nov 23, 2020 1:50 am

Sixerscan wrote:
Arsenal wrote:Right now I'm assuming Reed gets a 2-Way. However we've got one open roster spot and lack of depth at PF, so I wouldn't be surprised if Reed gets it.

With the way 2 ways work this year (they can be active for 50 games) it's basically the same as having them on the end of the actual roster.

If that's the case then yeah prob a 2-Way. I expect Morey would have no prob going into the season with only 14 then. Really think they want to give the kids a chance first before burning assets for more veterans.

Kobblehead · Post #39 » by **Kobblehead** » Tue Nov 24, 2020 1:02 am

He'll probably get slapped with a two-way contract just based on where we took him. I would not be surprised if they tear that up and convert him to a full contract as soon as it's possible to do so. As soon as he gets in camp, he's going to wow the staff/players.

Arsenal · Post #40 » by **Arsenal** » Tue Nov 24, 2020 1:13 am

Kobblehead wrote:He'll probably get slapped with a two-way contract just based on where we took him. I would not be surprised if they tear that up and convert him to a full contract as soon as it's possible to do so. As soon as he gets in camp, he's going to wow the staff/players.

And if he does wow them, locking him on a 4 year Hinkie special this year means they don't have to dip into the MLE or BAE to do it next year. They can then save those in full for veteran adds.