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Trade Thread #8: All Gordon things come to an End

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Re: Trade Thread #8: All Gordon things come to an End 

Post#1841 » by Celts17Pride » Mon Nov 23, 2020 4:43 am

SuperDeluxe wrote:Hollinger's summary of the Celtics' situation, including what a S&T with Charlotte would entail:

Boston, post-Hayward, represents the other side of the Bird rights trap. Its roster is a bit like a deflated balloon right now. The Celtics used their MLE on a big man, just like they would have anyway, and another small exception on a guard, and as a result are more or less the exact same team they would have been … except without Hayward. They can’t replace him as an over-the-cap team. It’s possible for Boston to pull off a late, dramatic save by generating a massive $30 million (or so) trade exception in a sign-and-trade with Charlotte, but even that will prove costly. The Celtics need to pony up an asset to include in the trade with Charlotte and then, almost certainly, another asset to bring a player into the exception. At a minimum, replacing Hayward in their salary structure will cost them two draft picks.


Source (The Athletic via Hoopshype): https://hoopshype.com/rumor/1414077/

That’s why he probably willing to take a player from Charlotte (Rozier) and immediately move the player for a better fit player and draft considerations and just take a $12 million TPE.

Ainge is probably calling every GM in the league trying to find a home for Rozier.

Just my guess
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Re: Trade Thread #8: All Gordon things come to an End 

Post#1842 » by BostonCouchGM » Mon Nov 23, 2020 4:43 am

SuperDeluxe wrote:Hollinger's summary of the Celtics' situation, including what a S&T with Charlotte would entail:

Boston, post-Hayward, represents the other side of the Bird rights trap. Its roster is a bit like a deflated balloon right now. The Celtics used their MLE on a big man, just like they would have anyway, and another small exception on a guard, and as a result are more or less the exact same team they would have been … except without Hayward. They can’t replace him as an over-the-cap team. It’s possible for Boston to pull off a late, dramatic save by generating a massive $30 million (or so) trade exception in a sign-and-trade with Charlotte, but even that will prove costly. The Celtics need to pony up an asset to include in the trade with Charlotte and then, almost certainly, another asset to bring a player into the exception. At a minimum, replacing Hayward in their salary structure will cost them two draft picks.


Source (The Athletic via Hoopshype): https://hoopshype.com/rumor/1414077/


This is why when you have an opportunity to draft great prospects that fall to you you don't take stashes or trade the picks away for future 2nd rounders.
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Re: Trade Thread #8: All Gordon things come to an End 

Post#1843 » by SMTBSI » Mon Nov 23, 2020 4:46 am

Shak_Celts wrote:
SuperDeluxe wrote:
Shak_Celts wrote:Here me out AGAIN... DA gets the TPE just to use some to get Myles Turner! I don't know what we'd give to Pacers but DA could cobble something! How about a 1st in 2035? I won't be alive so I don't care. Get it done Danno! :lol:

You are not planning on being around when we hang banner 29?


Picture it, Futurama, 19... Nixon.

Spoiler:
Slid in a Golden Girls reference!! :lol:

Shak moments before game 7 Finals 2035:

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Re: Trade Thread #8: All Gordon things come to an End 

Post#1844 » by Shak_Celts » Mon Nov 23, 2020 4:50 am

SMTBSI wrote:
Shak_Celts wrote:
SuperDeluxe wrote:You are not planning on being around when we hang banner 29?


Picture it, Futurama, 19... Nixon.

Spoiler:
Slid in a Golden Girls reference!! :lol:

Shak moments before game 7 Finals 2035:



Nooooo he's dumb as a box of rocks! I'd hope I could be the alien. Well, my plans never work out so... :(

:lol:
NAME ON THE FRONT OF THE JERSEY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!(!)
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Re: Trade Thread #8: All Gordon things come to an End 

Post#1845 » by Patsfan1081 » Mon Nov 23, 2020 4:51 am

SuperDeluxe wrote:Hollinger's summary of the Celtics' situation, including what a S&T with Charlotte would entail:

Boston, post-Hayward, represents the other side of the Bird rights trap. Its roster is a bit like a deflated balloon right now. The Celtics used their MLE on a big man, just like they would have anyway, and another small exception on a guard, and as a result are more or less the exact same team they would have been … except without Hayward. They can’t replace him as an over-the-cap team. It’s possible for Boston to pull off a late, dramatic save by generating a massive $30 million (or so) trade exception in a sign-and-trade with Charlotte, but even that will prove costly. The Celtics need to pony up an asset to include in the trade with Charlotte and then, almost certainly, another asset to bring a player into the exception. At a minimum, replacing Hayward in their salary structure will cost them two draft picks.


Source (The Athletic via Hoopshype): https://hoopshype.com/rumor/1414077/


Their MLE wouldn’t have been enough to get Thompson, this team would be looking at Noel/Boucher type talent. Not sure why this gets left out. I don’t really see why they would have to pony up an asset either if it meant CHA needing to stretch Batum or not.
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Re: Trade Thread #8: All Gordon things come to an End 

Post#1846 » by robdog_5 » Mon Nov 23, 2020 4:51 am

Ainge and Zarren (supposed Cap genius) have bungled some stuff man. First time I've legitimately felt like Ainge screwed up. He wasn't 100% in control because Hayward had the option but the fact he got strung along as much as he did and let a bunch of better options go by is frustrating

As far as this season I think we see a mins breakdown like this.

Big spot-Theis 20 Thompson 20 Williams 8
Wing Big-Tatum 25 Brown 5 Theis 5 GWilliams 13
Wing 3-Brown 22 Tatum 8 Naismith 18
2- Smart 24 Brown 5 Langford 15 Kemba 4
PG- kemba 26 Smart 6 Teague 16

Basically a 11 man rotation
Tatum 33
Brown 32
Kemba/Smart 30
Theis 25
Thompson 20
Naismith 18
Teague 16
Langford 15
Grant 13
RWilliams 8

Still worried about wing spot. If any injuries or Langford/Naismith aren't ready paper thin there .
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Re: Trade Thread #8: All Gordon things come to an End 

Post#1847 » by Writebloc » Mon Nov 23, 2020 4:56 am

SMTBSI wrote:
ConstableGeneva wrote:Please don't put Semi ahead of our lottery picks in the rotation. Langford, get well already!!

Complete tangent, but I got to be honest, I have a hard time thinking of Langford and Nesmith - #14s in general - as "lottery picks". I know they technically are, but it feels like it's in the same way that Roy Hibbert was technically an all-star.

Not saying this to knock them. #14 just feels solidly mid-pack.


Well, at least this year, you should factor in the weirdness of this draft and the fact that no one wanted picks at the top of this draft and all the value really came in picks 11 through 14, and I truly mean that. I dove full into this draft and it was one of the oddest on record.

1, 2, and 3 are all headscratchers. By that I mean their pedigree and measurements put them there, but by no means are they locks to be superstars.

Anthony Edwards has every measurable that you want and all the athleticism, but if you read one interview you start shaking your head, and he went number one. Minnesota was looking to trade out right up until the pick was made.

James Wiseman, again the package is there for him, and anyone can see the makings of a stud, but he played three whole games in college. He's not a no brainer at two, but he should be okay at Golden State, there are a wide array of outcomes for him.

LaMelo, another tough player to forecast. He has a legitimate skill with his handle and ability to pass the ball. He can't shoot, he can't play defense. He's got the height and length, but has a long way to go before his body is NBA ready. Every place he's played has been catered to him. He's never had to play in a system.

The crazy thing is they all deserved to be drafted where the were slotted, but I'd be shocked if any of them won rookie of the year.

Then at four Patrick Williams is another baffling pick. He was picked based on measurables and hints of possibility.

By no means am I saying that Nesmith is a home run, but to get a 6'6 wing with a 6'11 wingspan that already knows his role and has an NBA ready skill in the most difficult skill to find in the NBA is a gift. If there was any year where the 14th pick in the draft was worth a pick in the lottery this was the year. In fact for all the pomp and circumstance of last year's draft with Zion and Ja on a whole the talent was better in this draft than 2019.

There's been some encouraging signs with Romeo even though he hasn't been on the court much, but the pedigree, the measurements, and the willingness to work is there. Still I consider him to be more of a project than Nesmith is. I think Nesmith will show something because his game is polished and he knows his role.

Anyone of of Vassel, Halliburton, Lewis, or Nesmith were the sweet spot in this draft - the Celtics were fortunate to have that selection.
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Re: Trade Thread #8: All Gordon things come to an End 

Post#1848 » by Triple7 » Mon Nov 23, 2020 5:00 am

djFan71 wrote:
ConstableGeneva wrote:Please don't put Semi ahead of our lottery picks in the rotation. Langford, get well already!!

Sorry, too easy.


This!
I do hope Stevens plays nesmith a lot. He should be better than duncan robinson one day. Consistent minutes is the key, and not playing in garbage time.
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Re: Trade Thread #8: All Gordon things come to an End 

Post#1849 » by Parliament10 » Mon Nov 23, 2020 5:06 am

Lakers have gotten a lot better.
Would like to see Celtics make some more moves.
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Nothing is given."

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Re: Trade Thread #8: All Gordon things come to an End 

Post#1850 » by Parliament10 » Mon Nov 23, 2020 5:17 am

The G League is in jeopardy of being played this year.
Our Two-Way players may just have to stay with the Big Team(s).

Tacko would be fine, as he's a bit of an icon.
But, any other Two-Way players are in limbo.
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Nothing is given."

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Re: Trade Thread #8: All Gordon things come to an End 

Post#1851 » by themoneyteam2 » Mon Nov 23, 2020 5:43 am

Read on Twitter
?s=20
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Re: Trade Thread #8: All Gordon things come to an End 

Post#1852 » by ConstableGeneva » Mon Nov 23, 2020 5:58 am

This Hayward S&T is dedicated to MagicBagley... It's entitled "As one Gordon closes, another one opens."

Spoiler:
Image

Give Rockets all the picks.
░N░0░0░D░S░ ░I░N░ ░B░I░O░
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Re: Trade Thread #8: All Gordon things come to an End 

Post#1853 » by ThirtyFour » Mon Nov 23, 2020 5:59 am

themoneyteam2 wrote:
Read on Twitter
?s=20


“There’s a sense of pride, there’s an edge you have to have to play here. I can only imagine the love, the reception, if you hung one of those banners up. It would be incredible — it’s going to be incredible. I know it.” —Jayson Tatum
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Re: Trade Thread #8: All Gordon things come to an End 

Post#1854 » by soxfan2003 » Mon Nov 23, 2020 6:12 am

NuckyPowell wrote:
themoneyteam2 wrote:
Read on Twitter
?s=20

I have never heard Tatum speak about being a Celtic that way before. Great to hear.


Give me 195 million and even this Laker hater will say wonderful things about the LA Lakers. In all seriousness, in the NBA grand scheme of things, Tatum earned his money by playing really well these first 3 seasons.
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Re: Trade Thread #8: All Gordon things come to an End 

Post#1855 » by 76ciology » Mon Nov 23, 2020 6:12 am

I come in peace.

I think the right move for your team is to package Kemba and Jaylen for an upgrade. Maybe Paul George or Bradley Beal?

Shift from having 4 mid to low tier stars into 2 top tier stars

You then can easily build Tatum and a top tier star with role players that Ainge is good at.
There’s never been a time in history when we look back and say that the people who were censoring free speech were the good guys.
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Re: Trade Thread #8: All Gordon things come to an End 

Post#1856 » by themoneyteam2 » Mon Nov 23, 2020 6:17 am

76ciology wrote:I come in peace.

I think the right move for your team is to package Kemba and Jaylen for an upgrade. Maybe Paul George or Bradley Beal?

Shift from having 4 mid to low tier stars into 2 top tier stars

You then can easily build Tatum and a top tier star with role players that Ainge is good at.


Kemba and Jaylen Brown for PG-13%?

No thanks.
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Re: Trade Thread #8: All Gordon things come to an End 

Post#1857 » by 76ciology » Mon Nov 23, 2020 6:20 am

themoneyteam2 wrote:
76ciology wrote:I come in peace.

I think the right move for your team is to package Kemba and Jaylen for an upgrade. Maybe Paul George or Bradley Beal?

Shift from having 4 mid to low tier stars into 2 top tier stars

You then can easily build Tatum and a top tier star with role players that Ainge is good at.


Kemba and Jaylen Brown for PG-13%?

No thanks.


Maybe Beal? Maybe even try it for Harden.
There’s never been a time in history when we look back and say that the people who were censoring free speech were the good guys.
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Re: Trade Thread #8: All Gordon things come to an End 

Post#1858 » by ajones9219 » Mon Nov 23, 2020 6:48 am

76ciology wrote:I come in peace.

I think the right move for your team is to package Kemba and Jaylen for an upgrade. Maybe Paul George or Bradley Beal?

Shift from having 4 mid to low tier stars into 2 top tier stars

You then can easily build Tatum and a top tier star with role players that Ainge is good at.


I'm not sure there's really that much of an argument that PG13 is better than brown at this point
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Re: Trade Thread #8: All Gordon things come to an End 

Post#1859 » by Justin33 » Mon Nov 23, 2020 6:52 am

76ciology wrote:I come in peace.

I think the right move for your team is to package Kemba and Jaylen for an upgrade. Maybe Paul George or Bradley Beal?

Shift from having 4 mid to low tier stars into 2 top tier stars

You then can easily build Tatum and a top tier star with role players that Ainge is good at.


I fart in your general direction
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Re: Trade Thread #8: All Gordon things come to an End 

Post#1860 » by SMTBSI » Mon Nov 23, 2020 7:46 am

76ciology wrote:
themoneyteam2 wrote:
76ciology wrote:I come in peace.

I think the right move for your team is to package Kemba and Jaylen for an upgrade. Maybe Paul George or Bradley Beal?

Shift from having 4 mid to low tier stars into 2 top tier stars

You then can easily build Tatum and a top tier star with role players that Ainge is good at.


Kemba and Jaylen Brown for PG-13%?

No thanks.


Maybe Beal? Maybe even try it for Harden.

What you got to keep in mind is that, though we love our team and our city, and as much as the Celtics are a premier franchise in terms of history, viewership, and franchise market value, we are not, of late, a location that true top-tier superstars are clamoring to force their way to.

One of the advantages of developing your own talent is that you can engender some loyalty, if you treat them right. It's one of several reasons why we haven't been in a rush to trade Tatum off for every flavor-of-the-month all-star that's come on the market, and is giving every indication that they are a serious flight risk to go to wherever they really want to be.

You guys should get it - you just got a first-hand taste of this with Jimmy. Same thing with the Raps. Yes, it paid off for them, but it was a much saner risk for them since they were staring down a rebuild coming soon one way or the other.

I'm very much the kind of fan who believes there's no such thing as untouchables - there are absolutely futures where anyone and everyone on our team gets traded, Tatum included. But, the deal's got to be right. In my opinion, staying the course with Brown and Tatum sets a high enough floor on us that, worst come to worst, you can hang around and hope Tatum really blooms, then maneuver for max cap space and try to lure some Super Friends once Tatum's fully established.

There are a whole bunch of paths that are not super palatable but are nonetheless viable, including selling off vets and taking a one-year dip back into the lotto to grab a few assets while Tatum and Brown are both still under wraps for a while. What we can't do is accidentally blow it all up completely, and lose both our young talent, and fail to retain the pieces we traded them for. That way lies 20 more years of doldrums.

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