Fool Me Twice: The Gordon Hayward Thread

[_tijo_]

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[Hornet Mania]

I think one way to look at this is what would you be willing to trade for Hayward if he wasn't a free agent? Would you trade Monk for him? Would you trade Rozier for him? Would you trade a first for him?

That is the way we could be looking at if we are able to dump Batum contract to another team by giving an asset away. Because if we can trade Batum and an asset to another team we will still have the original 20 million of cap space we came into the summer with.

If you big brain it a little bit.. it might be worth it to trade Batum Salary and Monk/our first, open up 20 million in cap and then use that cap to fill the spot with a player a team might be willing to dump and possibly get an asset back along with it. ex: Aaron Gordon, Valanciunas, Olynyk...

You won't fool us that easily Danny Ainge

If a deal happens it needs to be Boston sending us the sugar, not the other way around. That $30m TPE can help the swing a trade solidly into contention, our cap space only lets us overpay for guys who we wonder are even worth the price. I'd 100% rather stretch Batum than send Boston a 1st or Monk.

[vorbis]

Woj narrating the past 3 days in Hornets land. I mean, everybody knows this is exactly what's happening. maybe there's actually a development on the horizon, though, if Woj is starting to talk about it like this. "last chance to pony up for an expiring contract, teams"

[JMAC3]

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Whatever the final details, Gordon Hayward is headed to Charlotte on a four-year, $120M contract. <a href="https://t.co/o9DqjEZeYj">https://t.co/o9DqjEZeYj</a></p>&mdash; Adrian Wojnarowski (@wojespn) <a href="

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?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">November 25, 2020</a></blockquote> <script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

[Liver_Pooty]

I'm assuming we would be the ones to get compensated for that huge tpe?

[DY_nasty]

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so we didn't even have a plan?

just throw hayward the bag and figure it out later

edit: probably trying to leverage some picks out of the batum expiring with someone but nobody will do it without making us hold a long term deal due to how stacked the draft is. this is a joke of a FO

[LofJ]

Why are we so focused on creating cap space with just Batum? We could also move Rozier or Zeller to create the space we need, and they might actually have some value so you would think it would be easier to move them.

[Chapelchilla]

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so we didn't even have a plan?

just throw hayward the bag and figure it out later

edit: probably trying to leverage some picks out of the batum expiring with someone but nobody will do it without making us hold a long term deal due to how stacked the draft is. this is a joke of a FO

It seems a lot more likely that it's Boston trying to work the sign and trade at this point then us. BTW, the headline thread on the Celtics board has been to fire Ainge most of the week due to his letting Hayward getaway for nothing. They are trying to salvage the screw up on their part. I wouldn't be so quick to throw your (?) teams FO under the bus when you don't know the facts yet.

[JMAC3]

Obviously wouldn't be my first choice, but I would consider trading a lottery protected pick to OKC to take on Batum. Why?

It would open up 20 million cap space right now even after Hayward signing.
It would open up 9 million in cap space next summer.
and 9 million in cap space summer after next.

40 Million is a lot of cheddar to have available for 1 pick outside lottery.

Assuming it is lottery protected, it is not all that difficult to pick up a first in the 20-25 range.

I think this is a do the deal now type thing, and try best to restock the asset later situation.

Could be a deal where we then sign Whiteside to a 1/15 deal and then at deadline look to flip him for a late first to replace the pick we lost. When all is said and done that is better to me then having the dead cap.

[BlackOutBuzz]

Getting Hayward for Batum should be enough compensation for Charlotte, seems the play here is for Ainge to find a home for Batum by giving up picks a necessary. Not an easy task, but perhaps worth it if they can create a huge TPE.

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[Liver_Pooty]

Boston did kind of help us out a little bit in the Kemba sign and trade with Rozier so we didn't lose him for absolutely nothing. Can definitely see us maybe repaying that favor a little and letting Ainge save a little face here.

[vorbis]

wondering if the Hornets are basically trying to flip whatever pick they get from Boston to facilitate the TPE to a 3rd team to take on Batum's expiring.

[LofJ]

wondering if the Hornets are basically trying to flip whatever pick they get from Boston to facilitate the TPE to a 3rd team to take on Batum's expiring.

That team is likely OKC. They have a $27 million TPE, they just needed time to complete all the trades they made.

[DY_nasty]

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so we didn't even have a plan?

just throw hayward the bag and figure it out later

edit: probably trying to leverage some picks out of the batum expiring with someone but nobody will do it without making us hold a long term deal due to how stacked the draft is. this is a joke of a FO

It seems a lot more likely that it's Boston trying to work the sign and trade at this point then us. BTW, the headline thread on the Celtics board has been to fire Ainge most of the week due to his letting Hayward getaway for nothing. They are trying to salvage the screw up on their part. I wouldn't be so quick to throw your (?) teams FO under the bus when you don't know the facts yet.

Boston isn't the team that's holding everyone and themselves hostage by threatening to stretch Batum to screw everyone if they don't get their way.

Hell, they can't even finish filling out their roster until this is done

[Chapelchilla]

so we didn't even have a plan?

just throw hayward the bag and figure it out later

edit: probably trying to leverage some picks out of the batum expiring with someone but nobody will do it without making us hold a long term deal due to how stacked the draft is. this is a joke of a FO

It seems a lot more likely that it's Boston trying to work the sign and trade at this point then us. BTW, the headline thread on the Celtics board has been to fire Ainge most of the week due to his letting Hayward getaway for nothing. They are trying to salvage the screw up on their part. I wouldn't be so quick to throw your (?) teams FO under the bus when you don't know the facts yet.

Boston isn't the team that's holding everyone and themselves hostage by threatening to stretch Batum to screw everyone if they don't get their way.

Hell, they can't even finish filling out their roster until this is done

The facts are not yet known so why pretend you know them?

[DY_nasty]

It seems a lot more likely that it's Boston trying to work the sign and trade at this point then us. BTW, the headline thread on the Celtics board has been to fire Ainge most of the week due to his letting Hayward getaway for nothing. They are trying to salvage the screw up on their part. I wouldn't be so quick to throw your (?) teams FO under the bus when you don't know the facts yet.

Boston isn't the team that's holding everyone and themselves hostage by threatening to stretch Batum to screw everyone if they don't get their way.

Hell, they can't even finish filling out their roster until this is done

The facts are not yet known so why pretend you know them?

because the situation has played out the way that it is has

why even point the waive/stretch gun at our head if we have options? or a better plan in place?

its only getting harder now, later into FA because most teams have locked their money into place too

[JMAC3]

I really think that we have 3 or 4 options that we are weighing and it is hard to identify who has leverage in the situation and who should be getting the best end of the deal.

Boston wants the TPE, but doesn't have another way to add players.

Charlotte doesn't want to stretch Batum, but they could

OKC doesn't want Batum, but they also would like to get something of value out of that Adams TPE...

[Braggins]

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so we didn't even have a plan?

just throw hayward the bag and figure it out later

edit: probably trying to leverage some picks out of the batum expiring with someone but nobody will do it without making us hold a long term deal due to how stacked the draft is. this is a joke of a FO

And if the plan is to keep Rozier and trade Batum they aren't going to have much cap space next offseason to do anything except resign Graham. Oh, and we'll probably lose Monk and/or Miles for cap reasons even if they break out and they want to keep them. This is literally perfect deja vu of the last failed rebuild.

[Braggins]

Obviously wouldn't be my first choice, but I would consider trading a lottery protected pick to OKC to take on Batum. Why?

It would open up 20 million cap space right now even after Hayward signing.
It would open up 9 million in cap space next summer.
and 9 million in cap space summer after next.

40 Million is a lot of cheddar to have available for 1 pick outside lottery.

Assuming it is lottery protected, it is not all that difficult to pick up a first in the 20-25 range.

I think this is a do the deal now type thing, and try best to restock the asset later situation.

Could be a deal where we then sign Whiteside to a 1/15 deal and then at deadline look to flip him for a late first to replace the pick we lost. When all is said and done that is better to me then having the dead cap.

Every worthwhile player has already been signed. The extra cap this offseason from moving Batum is useless and any extra cap space it would create next offseason we'd be getting anyways because his deal is expiring (assuming there is another way to avoid stretching him). Giving up a 1st to move Batum's contract would be just as bad as stretching him.

[DY_nasty]

News but not news

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so we didn't even have a plan?

just throw hayward the bag and figure it out later

edit: probably trying to leverage some picks out of the batum expiring with someone but nobody will do it without making us hold a long term deal due to how stacked the draft is. this is a joke of a FO

And if the plan is to keep Rozier and trade Batum they aren't going to have much cap space next offseason to do anything except resign Graham. Oh, and we'll probably lose Monk and/or Miles for cap reasons even if they break out and they want to keep them. This is literally perfect deja vu of the last failed rebuild.

You see it.

This is setting us up to dig out of a hole again... we're looking for solutions to problems we're going out of our way to create.