2020-2021 College/Draft thread 1

[DaGawd]

You don't need to be fast at 6'8", I don't think he's slow, he just seems to play at his own speed. Also, young wings like this are almost always trying to get to the rim, the potential in them is that they can handle the ball which is a rare skill for guys this size, and pass which is even more rare. If he proves to be a solid shooter it opens up his entire game. You can just do a lot of funky things that teams have trouble matching up with if you have multiple wings, if we have RJ & Cade obviously we want to develop both into solid catch and shoot guys so that when one has the ball the other is a threat.

I like Suggs a lot, and if Cade is off the board he's the guy I want. With that said It should be a rule by now that you don't draft PG sized players over big wings if skillsets are close, Fultz went over Tatum, Young went over Luka, Morant went over RJ Big wings almost always win in the end.

just to note luka went 3rd and young 5th so he didn't really go over luka in fact the hawks got another lottery pick for moving back to take young 5th and morant won ROTY and looks better than RJ, also we would be very happy to have young or morant.

Luka was traded for Young, already had it amended, and no amount of lottery picks can make up for trading away a generational wing. They basically traded a LeBron/KD talent for a Damian Lillard & Robert Covington deal, that's a loss no matter how you cut it.

RJ will be better than Morant in the long run, it isn't about who is better right now, but who will be better in 3 years time. I like Suggs because he's got great size for a PG, and would already be among the strongest PGs in the league as a 19 year old. I don't like wiry or small PGs like Morant & Young, ultimately those guys get exposed in playoff series. The NBA is heading in a direction where teams with elite wing playmakers are just doing away with PG sized players, the Mavs are copying the Lakers now, they are going to run Richardson 6'6" and Hardaway 6'6" in their backcourt.

How do you say RJ will be better than Morant with such conviction? Ja is special

[robillionaire]

just to note luka went 3rd and young 5th so he didn't really go over luka in fact the hawks got another lottery pick for moving back to take young 5th and morant won ROTY and looks better than RJ, also we would be very happy to have young or morant.

Luka was traded for Young, already had it amended, and no amount of lottery picks can make up for trading away a generational wing. They basically traded a LeBron/KD talent for a Damian Lillard & Robert Covington deal, that's a loss no matter how you cut it.

RJ will be better than Morant in the long run, it isn't about who is better right now, but who will be better in 3 years time. I like Suggs because he's got great size for a PG, and would already be among the strongest PGs in the league as a 19 year old. I don't like wiry or small PGs like Morant & Young, ultimately those guys get exposed in playoff series. The NBA is heading in a direction where teams with elite wing playmakers are just doing away with PG sized players, the Mavs are copying the Lakers now, they are going to run Richardson 6'6" and Hardaway 6'6" in their backcourt.

How do you say RJ will be better than Morant with such conviction? Ja is special

and one was rookie of the year and the other didn't even make the top 10 all rookie team. I hope RJ is eventually better but the grizzlies certainly have zero regrets as of now. And I'm sure we wouldn't either if we were the ones set at PG for a generation

[NoDopeOnSundays]

just to note luka went 3rd and young 5th so he didn't really go over luka in fact the hawks got another lottery pick for moving back to take young 5th and morant won ROTY and looks better than RJ, also we would be very happy to have young or morant.

Luka was traded for Young, already had it amended, and no amount of lottery picks can make up for trading away a generational wing. They basically traded a LeBron/KD talent for a Damian Lillard & Robert Covington deal, that's a loss no matter how you cut it.

RJ will be better than Morant in the long run, it isn't about who is better right now, but who will be better in 3 years time. I like Suggs because he's got great size for a PG, and would already be among the strongest PGs in the league as a 19 year old. I don't like wiry or small PGs like Morant & Young, ultimately those guys get exposed in playoff series. The NBA is heading in a direction where teams with elite wing playmakers are just doing away with PG sized players, the Mavs are copying the Lakers now, they are going to run Richardson 6'6" and Hardaway 6'6" in their backcourt.

How do you say RJ will be better than Morant with such conviction? Ja is special

Morant is good, but he had a much better situation than RJ, especially in terms of fit. How do you think RJ's season would have looked if we had Jaren Jackson at the 4 instead of Randle, Jaren takes 7 threes a game and hits 39% of them, just to put it in perspective after Jaren got hurt in the bubble Morant shot 39% from the field and 26% from three and teams were going under every screen begging him to shoot it. I think RJ will be better because I value his size as a potential + defender, and Morant has almost as many questions about his shot as RJ, he's just on the ball a lot more with better spacing.

[DaGawd]

Luka was traded for Young, already had it amended, and no amount of lottery picks can make up for trading away a generational wing. They basically traded a LeBron/KD talent for a Damian Lillard & Robert Covington deal, that's a loss no matter how you cut it.

RJ will be better than Morant in the long run, it isn't about who is better right now, but who will be better in 3 years time. I like Suggs because he's got great size for a PG, and would already be among the strongest PGs in the league as a 19 year old. I don't like wiry or small PGs like Morant & Young, ultimately those guys get exposed in playoff series. The NBA is heading in a direction where teams with elite wing playmakers are just doing away with PG sized players, the Mavs are copying the Lakers now, they are going to run Richardson 6'6" and Hardaway 6'6" in their backcourt.

How do you say RJ will be better than Morant with such conviction? Ja is special

Morant is good, but he had a much better situation than RJ, especially in terms of fit. How do you think RJ's season would have looked if we had Jaren Jackson at the 4 instead of Randle, Jaren takes 7 threes a game and hits 39% of them, just to put it in perspective after Jaren got hurt in the bubble Morant shot 39% from the field and 26% from three and teams were going under every screen begging him to shoot it. I think RJ will be better because I value his size as a potential + defender, and Morant has almost as many questions about his shot as RJ, he's just on the ball a lot more with better spacing.

Too many what if’s in here for me to say RJ will be better than Morant for sure.. Morant was rated higher than RJ on most draft boards and proved to be better in their respective rookie seasons. Both could end up being great players but the fact is right now Morant kind of proved he can be a franchise cornerstone.. the jury is still out on RJ

[NoDopeOnSundays]

Luka was traded for Young, already had it amended, and no amount of lottery picks can make up for trading away a generational wing. They basically traded a LeBron/KD talent for a Damian Lillard & Robert Covington deal, that's a loss no matter how you cut it.

RJ will be better than Morant in the long run, it isn't about who is better right now, but who will be better in 3 years time. I like Suggs because he's got great size for a PG, and would already be among the strongest PGs in the league as a 19 year old. I don't like wiry or small PGs like Morant & Young, ultimately those guys get exposed in playoff series. The NBA is heading in a direction where teams with elite wing playmakers are just doing away with PG sized players, the Mavs are copying the Lakers now, they are going to run Richardson 6'6" and Hardaway 6'6" in their backcourt.

How do you say RJ will be better than Morant with such conviction? Ja is special

and one was rookie of the year and the other didn't even make the top 10 all rookie team. I hope RJ is eventually better but the grizzlies certainly have zero regrets as of now. And I'm sure we wouldn't either if we were the ones set at PG for a generation

I don't know why that award means anything, Malcolm Brogdon and MCW have one over Joel Embiid and Giannis, it doesn't really matter in terms of long term projections.

I think Zion and RJ will be the best players from that draft, JA is good, but he's no more special than any of the other 10-15 other good PGs in the league, where as there's a shortage of good young wing players.

[NoDopeOnSundays]

How do you say RJ will be better than Morant with such conviction? Ja is special

Morant is good, but he had a much better situation than RJ, especially in terms of fit. How do you think RJ's season would have looked if we had Jaren Jackson at the 4 instead of Randle, Jaren takes 7 threes a game and hits 39% of them, just to put it in perspective after Jaren got hurt in the bubble Morant shot 39% from the field and 26% from three and teams were going under every screen begging him to shoot it. I think RJ will be better because I value his size as a potential + defender, and Morant has almost as many questions about his shot as RJ, he's just on the ball a lot more with better spacing.

Too many what if’s in here for me to say RJ will be better than Morant for sure.. Morant was rated higher than RJ on most draft boards and proved to be better in their respective rookie seasons. Both could end up being great players but the fact is right now Morant kind of proved he can be a franchise cornerstone.. the jury is still out on RJ

What are these what ifs? Morant had better teammates around him that fit his skillset, he shot worse than RJ once that player was removed from the equation.

I don't see how Morant is any more special than Fox, Murray, SGA or Young, the PG position is loaded and I get that we don't have one which leads to us wanting one, but we have a young wing that had rookie numbers comparable to all-star wings when they were rookies. There's positional scarcity that you're just overlooking while citing things that just don't matter, why should we care about past rankings when we're talking about how players will develop?

[DaGawd]

Morant is good, but he had a much better situation than RJ, especially in terms of fit. How do you think RJ's season would have looked if we had Jaren Jackson at the 4 instead of Randle, Jaren takes 7 threes a game and hits 39% of them, just to put it in perspective after Jaren got hurt in the bubble Morant shot 39% from the field and 26% from three and teams were going under every screen begging him to shoot it. I think RJ will be better because I value his size as a potential + defender, and Morant has almost as many questions about his shot as RJ, he's just on the ball a lot more with better spacing.

Too many what if’s in here for me to say RJ will be better than Morant for sure.. Morant was rated higher than RJ on most draft boards and proved to be better in their respective rookie seasons. Both could end up being great players but the fact is right now Morant kind of proved he can be a franchise cornerstone.. the jury is still out on RJ

What are these what ifs? Morant had better teammates around him that fit his skillset, he shot worse than RJ once that player was removed from the equation.

I don't see how Morant is any more special than Fox, Murray, SGA or Young, the PG position is loaded and I get that we don't have one which leads to us wanting one, but we have a young wing that had rookie numbers comparable to all-star wings. There's positional scarcity that you're just overlooking while citing things that just don't matter, why should we care about past rankings when we're talking about how players will develop?

This argument somewhat reminds me of the Derrick Rose vs Evan Turner battle. Evan Turner like RJ was a jack of all trades, master of none. Turner never ended up being better than Rose at any point in their careers

[Chanel Bomber]

I’m also confident RJ will be better than Morant. Ja got off to a better start but that’s not always indicative of how these careers will pan out. It’s a marathon, not a sprint.

If RJ becomes a respectable shooter, I think he’ll be the more impactful all-around player, the better leader and the more durable player of the two. Let’s not forget also that RJ is almost a year younger than Ja.

[robillionaire]

Morant is good, but he had a much better situation than RJ, especially in terms of fit. How do you think RJ's season would have looked if we had Jaren Jackson at the 4 instead of Randle, Jaren takes 7 threes a game and hits 39% of them, just to put it in perspective after Jaren got hurt in the bubble Morant shot 39% from the field and 26% from three and teams were going under every screen begging him to shoot it. I think RJ will be better because I value his size as a potential + defender, and Morant has almost as many questions about his shot as RJ, he's just on the ball a lot more with better spacing.

Too many what if’s in here for me to say RJ will be better than Morant for sure.. Morant was rated higher than RJ on most draft boards and proved to be better in their respective rookie seasons. Both could end up being great players but the fact is right now Morant kind of proved he can be a franchise cornerstone.. the jury is still out on RJ

What are these what ifs? Morant had better teammates around him that fit his skillset, he shot worse than RJ once that player was removed from the equation.

I don't see how Morant is any more special than Fox, Murray, SGA or Young, the PG position is loaded and I get that we don't have one which leads to us wanting one, but we have a young wing that had rookie numbers comparable to all-star wings. There's positional scarcity that you're just overlooking while citing things that just don't matter, why should we care about past rankings when we're talking about how players will develop?

morant might not be any more special than those guys, I would also point out that with fox and sga, you could point to wings taken over them who didn't pan out as good as them well (josh jackson, kevin knox/mikal bridges) so I think that also throws a wrench into the idea that it's always going to be better to take the wing

[NoDopeOnSundays]

Too many what if’s in here for me to say RJ will be better than Morant for sure.. Morant was rated higher than RJ on most draft boards and proved to be better in their respective rookie seasons. Both could end up being great players but the fact is right now Morant kind of proved he can be a franchise cornerstone.. the jury is still out on RJ

What are these what ifs? Morant had better teammates around him that fit his skillset, he shot worse than RJ once that player was removed from the equation.

I don't see how Morant is any more special than Fox, Murray, SGA or Young, the PG position is loaded and I get that we don't have one which leads to us wanting one, but we have a young wing that had rookie numbers comparable to all-star wings. There's positional scarcity that you're just overlooking while citing things that just don't matter, why should we care about past rankings when we're talking about how players will develop?

This argument somewhat reminds me of the Derrick Rose vs Evan Turner battle. Evan Turner like RJ was a jack of all trades, master of none. Turner never ended up being better than Rose at any point in their careers

Evan Turner averaged 7ppg as a 22 year old rookie, this is in no way like RJ and Morant


RJ's numbers as a rookie are perfectly in line with what other all-star wings did as rookies.

[jvsimonetti0514]

2 games into the season and I’m drafting Suggs over Cade. There’s a lot of similarities I see with RJ and Cade basically that they use strength to power their ways to the rim. He’s def a better shooter but unless he gets a lot more crafty off the dribble, I worry how well he’ll get to the rim. He doesn’t look like he’s just playing at his pace either, he just looks slow. Compare that to how Suggs just flies down the court with a bunch of sick step backs and eurosteps.

You don't need to be fast at 6'8", I don't think he's slow, he just seems to play at his own speed. Also, young wings like this are almost always trying to get to the rim, the potential in them is that they can handle the ball which is a rare skill for guys this size, and pass which is even more rare. If he proves to be a solid shooter it opens up his entire game. You can just do a lot of funky things that teams have trouble matching up with if you have multiple wings, if we have RJ & Cade obviously we want to develop both into solid catch and shoot guys so that when one has the ball the other is a threat.

I like Suggs a lot, and if Cade is off the board he's the guy I want. With that said It should be a rule by now that you don't draft PG sized players over big wings if skillsets are close, Fultz went over Tatum, Young traded for Luka, Morant went over RJ Big wings almost always win in the end.

I disagree that athleticism difference is how you have a been Simmons vs someone like Lebron, Or Paul George vs like Evan Turner. Just cuz Luka can pull off the average athlete that can get to the rim all the time doesn't mean Cade will be able too. I don't even really mean this as a slight to him cuz he's been good but I'd like to see more crafty off the dribble stuff from him. I like how his coach has gotten creative and put him into the post too. He's definitely got some solid skills, I just worry about having two guys that need to bully ball their way to the rim. It's still super early in the process and a lot can and will change before next june, I just like Suggs better ATM.

[NoDopeOnSundays]

Too many what if’s in here for me to say RJ will be better than Morant for sure.. Morant was rated higher than RJ on most draft boards and proved to be better in their respective rookie seasons. Both could end up being great players but the fact is right now Morant kind of proved he can be a franchise cornerstone.. the jury is still out on RJ

What are these what ifs? Morant had better teammates around him that fit his skillset, he shot worse than RJ once that player was removed from the equation.

I don't see how Morant is any more special than Fox, Murray, SGA or Young, the PG position is loaded and I get that we don't have one which leads to us wanting one, but we have a young wing that had rookie numbers comparable to all-star wings. There's positional scarcity that you're just overlooking while citing things that just don't matter, why should we care about past rankings when we're talking about how players will develop?

morant might not be any more special than those guys, I would also point out that with fox and sga, you could point to wings taken over them who didn't pan out as good as them well (josh jackson, kevin knox/mikal bridges) so I think that also throws a wrench into the idea that it's always going to be better to take the wing

Tatum over Fox.

Luka over SGA.


Seems like the Wing over guard thing still holds up.

[Chanel Bomber]

Too many what if’s in here for me to say RJ will be better than Morant for sure.. Morant was rated higher than RJ on most draft boards and proved to be better in their respective rookie seasons. Both could end up being great players but the fact is right now Morant kind of proved he can be a franchise cornerstone.. the jury is still out on RJ

What are these what ifs? Morant had better teammates around him that fit his skillset, he shot worse than RJ once that player was removed from the equation.

I don't see how Morant is any more special than Fox, Murray, SGA or Young, the PG position is loaded and I get that we don't have one which leads to us wanting one, but we have a young wing that had rookie numbers comparable to all-star wings. There's positional scarcity that you're just overlooking while citing things that just don't matter, why should we care about past rankings when we're talking about how players will develop?

This argument somewhat reminds me of the Derrick Rose vs Evan Turner battle. Evan Turner like RJ was a jack of all trades, master of none. Turner never ended up being better than Rose at any point in their careers

Evan Turner was compared to John Wall, not Derrick Rose. All these players are different anyway. Same archetypes, true, but intangibles will have a huge influence on how their careers will unfold. Not saying you’re wrong, but just saying that this one-year sample size is not enough to draw any conclusions, especially when you consider that RJ is younger than Ja.

[DaGawd]

What are these what ifs? Morant had better teammates around him that fit his skillset, he shot worse than RJ once that player was removed from the equation.

I don't see how Morant is any more special than Fox, Murray, SGA or Young, the PG position is loaded and I get that we don't have one which leads to us wanting one, but we have a young wing that had rookie numbers comparable to all-star wings. There's positional scarcity that you're just overlooking while citing things that just don't matter, why should we care about past rankings when we're talking about how players will develop?

This argument somewhat reminds me of the Derrick Rose vs Evan Turner battle. Evan Turner like RJ was a jack of all trades, master of none. Turner never ended up being better than Rose at any point in their careers

Evan Turner was compared to John Wall, not Derrick Rose. All these players are different anyway. Same archetypes, true, but intangibles will have a huge influence on how their careers will unfold. Not saying you’re wrong, but just saying that this one-year sample size is not enough to draw any conclusions, especially when you consider that RJ is younger than Ja.

I meant the Chicago battle between rose and Turner both coming from rival schools there and facing off but I digress and hear your point. We’ll just have to see with RJ. I’m not totally sold but wouldn’t be shocked if he becomes a franchise talent do to how hard he seems to work

[Chanel Bomber]

This argument somewhat reminds me of the Derrick Rose vs Evan Turner battle. Evan Turner like RJ was a jack of all trades, master of none. Turner never ended up being better than Rose at any point in their careers

Evan Turner was compared to John Wall, not Derrick Rose. All these players are different anyway. Same archetypes, true, but intangibles will have a huge influence on how their careers will unfold. Not saying you’re wrong, but just saying that this one-year sample size is not enough to draw any conclusions, especially when you consider that RJ is younger than Ja.

I meant the Chicago battle between rose and Turner both coming from rival schools there and facing off but I digress and hear your point. We’ll just have to see with RJ. I’m not totally sold but wouldn’t be shocked if he becomes a franchise talent do to how hard he seems to work

Got you.

[NoDopeOnSundays]

2 games into the season and I’m drafting Suggs over Cade. There’s a lot of similarities I see with RJ and Cade basically that they use strength to power their ways to the rim. He’s def a better shooter but unless he gets a lot more crafty off the dribble, I worry how well he’ll get to the rim. He doesn’t look like he’s just playing at his pace either, he just looks slow. Compare that to how Suggs just flies down the court with a bunch of sick step backs and eurosteps.

You don't need to be fast at 6'8", I don't think he's slow, he just seems to play at his own speed. Also, young wings like this are almost always trying to get to the rim, the potential in them is that they can handle the ball which is a rare skill for guys this size, and pass which is even more rare. If he proves to be a solid shooter it opens up his entire game. You can just do a lot of funky things that teams have trouble matching up with if you have multiple wings, if we have RJ & Cade obviously we want to develop both into solid catch and shoot guys so that when one has the ball the other is a threat.

I like Suggs a lot, and if Cade is off the board he's the guy I want. With that said It should be a rule by now that you don't draft PG sized players over big wings if skillsets are close, Fultz went over Tatum, Young traded for Luka, Morant went over RJ Big wings almost always win in the end.

I disagree that athleticism difference is how you have a been Simmons vs someone like Lebron, Or Paul George vs like Evan Turner. Just cuz Luka can pull off the average athlete that can get to the rim all the time doesn't mean Cade will be able too. I don't even really mean this as a slight to him cuz he's been good but I'd like to see more crafty off the dribble stuff from him. I like how his coach has gotten creative and put him into the post too. He's definitely got some solid skills, I just worry about having two guys that need to bully ball their way to the rim. It's still super early in the process and a lot can and will change before next june, I just like Suggs better ATM.

Athleticism isn't what's separating Simmons and LeBron, it's a jumper, if Simmons were a willing & semi decent 3 point shooter he'd be a top 3 player in the league now. What will make or break Cade is the jumper, if he can make the shot he'll be an elite player because a 6'8" guy handling the ball is still very difficult to defend. He doesn't need to be fast, he needs to be a solid & willing shooter to open up his game to force people to play up on him. Someone like Jimmy Butler isn't ever called an elite athlete, he's just strong and quick enough to get to where he wants to go and he doesn't even take a high volume of threes. There's only 6 guys in the league over 6'7" that averaged 6apg or more, if Cade can be that kind of playmaker he'd be elite.

I'd love to have Cade & RJ, do exactly what the Celtics did with Brown & Tatum and stress their development in catch & shoot situations. I like Suggs a lot, but Cade is the number 1 pick because of what it would allow us to do in terms of team build, especially if Obi can score.

[HEZI]

Jalen Johnson looks really good

Gotta say, Duke has done an excellent job getting these top recruits to their program over the last few years.

Back to Johnson though, his versatility is very intriguing. How big are his hands? The way he can palm the ball and control it with one hand is very impressive. That kid is a consistent jumper away from being a legit stud.

[Chanel Bomber]

2 games into the season and I’m drafting Suggs over Cade. There’s a lot of similarities I see with RJ and Cade basically that they use strength to power their ways to the rim. He’s def a better shooter but unless he gets a lot more crafty off the dribble, I worry how well he’ll get to the rim. He doesn’t look like he’s just playing at his pace either, he just looks slow. Compare that to how Suggs just flies down the court with a bunch of sick step backs and eurosteps.

You don't need to be fast at 6'8", I don't think he's slow, he just seems to play at his own speed. Also, young wings like this are almost always trying to get to the rim, the potential in them is that they can handle the ball which is a rare skill for guys this size, and pass which is even more rare. If he proves to be a solid shooter it opens up his entire game. You can just do a lot of funky things that teams have trouble matching up with if you have multiple wings, if we have RJ & Cade obviously we want to develop both into solid catch and shoot guys so that when one has the ball the other is a threat.

I like Suggs a lot, and if Cade is off the board he's the guy I want. With that said It should be a rule by now that you don't draft PG sized players over big wings if skillsets are close, Fultz went over Tatum, Young traded for Luka, Morant went over RJ Big wings almost always win in the end.

I disagree that athleticism difference is how you have a been Simmons vs someone like Lebron, Or Paul George vs like Evan Turner. Just cuz Luka can pull off the average athlete that can get to the rim all the time doesn't mean Cade will be able too. I don't even really mean this as a slight to him cuz he's been good but I'd like to see more crafty off the dribble stuff from him. I like how his coach has gotten creative and put him into the post too. He's definitely got some solid skills, I just worry about having two guys that need to bully ball their way to the rim. It's still super early in the process and a lot can and will change before next june, I just like Suggs better ATM.

Suggs does seem more dynamic and easier to integrate into our current core. He’d bring another dimension to the team with his speed. It’ll be interesting to see what their FG% from different spots will look like at the end of the year.

[NoDopeOnSundays]

Jalen Johnson looks really good

Gotta say, Duke has done an excellent job getting these top recruits to their program over the last few years.

Back to Johnson though, his versatility is very intriguing. How big are his hands? The way he can palm the ball and control it with one hand is very impressive. That kid is a consistent jumper away from being a legit stud.

I think he'd be in the mix if he can guard in space, if he looks more like an SF than a PF then he could be a pick. I think he's in the tier 1 of the guys so far with Cade & Suggs, that could change once the G-league guys get going, but so far the best players look to be the playmakers.

[jvsimonetti0514]

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