Back Alley brawl: Zion vs McGregor who wins?

[Zenzibar]

Doens't matter. Martial Arts was designed exactly to equal a seemingly disadvantage.
Observe.

Watch on YouTube

When you're talking 100lbs plus advantage, most of that goes out the door.

Like, for comparison. With weight differential, for most people that's like fighting a grade schooler as an adult male.

I don't care how well trained a you are as a 12 year old, the odds aren't on your side. Anything you do doesn't generate enough force to matter, you can't even turn to grappling. It has to be relatively close in terms of weight, for the training to matter.

haha no true. A choke hold will stop the blood from flowing no matter what. We're not a 12 year old, we talking a world class fighter who trains with men 70-100 pounds heavier regularly.

[SMTBSI]

The differential is over 115 lbs.

So, for context if we assume the average grown male is 200lbs -115lbs = 85lbs.

Take the world's most elite 85lb pre-teen, who could have been training since birth. So, if the argument for McGregor holds true the kid should win. Right?

That's a really silly analogy. Relative difference is way more important here than absolute difference. Taking your point to it's logical conclusion, a 999,900lb kaiju would have no chance against a 1,000,000lb kaiju.

Plus, full grown, athletic males, even those on the lighter side, have power that is not in the same category as an 85lb preteen. Body, bone, muscular development is complete, whereas it's not in the pre-teen. To say nothing of experience and decision making.

So the pre-teen suffers more here both in terms of relative body weight, and body composition, and other factors, in a way that is not captured by your attempt to generalize the comparison. It's just not an useful analogy at all.


Just look at all the people Bob Sapp lost to over the years, who were 100lbs - or more - lighter than him. And he actually approximately knows how to play his sport.

[The_Teflon_Don]

With 6 months of training, Zion would destroy McGregor due to sheer size and power.

Hell - Look at Brock Lesnar. He had no background in mixed martial arts prior to 2007, yet after only 18 months he became UFC champion by effectively bum rushing every opponent with crazy speed and power.

You honestly think you couldn't train Zion in a 6 month period to adapt a Brock Lesnar style of fighting and use a +100lb advantage to destory McGregor.

Forget 6 months. If Zion had 6 years of training, he would still get slept by McGregor within the first round.

[Steelo Green]

With 6 months of training, Zion would destroy McGregor due to sheer size and power.

Hell - Look at Brock Lesnar. He had no background in mixed martial arts prior to 2007, yet after only 18 months he became UFC champion by effectively bum rushing every opponent with crazy speed and power.

You honestly think you couldn't train Zion in a 6 month period to adapt a Brock Lesnar style of fighting and use a +100lb advantage to destory McGregor.

Forget 6 months. If Zion had 6 years of training, he would still get slept by McGregor within the first round.

Finally some sense.

Fighters are just like ballers, they have talent.

That’s why CM Punk looks like an amateur even with so much training.

People don’t realize that when the UFC started they had no weight classes and the small Royce Gracie would finish heavyweights and take them down.

As an MMA fan this is an insult to the sport.

It’s the equivalent of 6 months for Mahomes to train, could he beat Dame.

[Pachinko_]

As an MMA fan this is an insult to the sport.

Now you know what it sounds like to every non-American when people say Lebron would be awesome at soccer LOL

[clippertown]

It is not possible for a guy to win a fair fight giving up 100 pounds of muscle. None.

Just imagine you, the average guy fighting the biggest guy you ever met in your life. Zion has hundreds of ways to win the fight and McGregor has just a few options. Also, in an alley fight, there are no rules so Zion could easily get out of any ground and pound situation by attacking eyes or groin. Zion could literally pick up McGregor and throw him through a wall.

Just imagine the scene in Friday where Zibo is chasing Katt Williams and replace them with Zion and McGregor.

My guess is that you have never been in a fight before. Zion only has one chance at winning and that's landing a wild haymaker that he never expected to land.

McGregor could beat Zion anyway he pleased. Whether it's standing up or on the ground. Zion won't have the technique to take McGregor down and he doesn't have the skills to outstrike Connor. McGregor can finish Zion whichever way he decides.

Zions chances of beating McGregor in a street fight slim to none and slim just left town. The fact that this even a debate shows the lack of knowledge and experience people on these forums have when it comes to fighting.

Zion or any NBA players would get slept by McGregor or any half decent fighter.

Actually, I have dedicated around 10 years of my life to the study of a specific style of Chinese Kung Fu called Tong Lung so I really do know what I am talking about. I am not saying 100 pounds between a guy that is 250lb vs 350lb. I am talking about a guy that is 170lb vs an in-shape 275lb monster. Every fighter has a punchers chance, but Zion would literally destroy McGregor if he had 6 hours of fight training and strategy prep. It’s just an impossible task. Even Bruce Lee at his peak would not stand a chance against Zion in a serious street fight. It’s too much of a weight and strength difference, not to mention height (leverage) and reach.

I will also say specific to your comments. 1. What makes you think Zion can only throw haymakers? 2. Standing would be destructive for McGregor. He lacks reach and power while Zion has excess in both. 3. What in OP’s instructions indicates a ring and a ref. Alleys and real fights are very constrictive. You simply cannot run and weave unless you are in a ring. 4. On the ground, Zion would just lift McGregor off him via strength, like a bench press. Let’s see McGregor bench Zion. Plus, for those that are not well versed in MMA, on the ground fighting is a terrible technique without rules. You expose your eyes, groin, hair, mouth etc. You also expose your back to secondary attackers. Real fights almost never end in ground and pound - that requires rules and a referee.

In a ring, with gloves, McGregor has a much better chance - say 10% instead of 2% on the street. There is a reason they have weight classes in boxing and MMA. If McGregor wanted to beat Zion he would need to become better versed in strikes to the neck, eyes or temples but we are assuming he fights his type of fight, in which case he loses pretty badly barring a miracle.

[Blazer1776]

It’s very easy to see who has, and who hasn’t ever been in a fight.

There is a reason why one of the last people you want to pick a fight with is a wrestler, let alone a trained MMA fighter.

It’s pretty amazing how advantageous knowing how to fight is, comparative to being strong and/or longer/bigger.

[dshearn]

I think there's about a zero percent chance that McGregor wins a back alley fight with a pro athlete literally twice as heavy as him. They have weight classes in UFC for a reason.

I would normally agree with you on this.


but


its not 100% because of Submissions


Its almost impossible to defend against a rear naked choke and when someone can apply pressure to your sinus. Its human nature to go with the pressure, and that will untuck your chin. All combat sports outlaw that kind of stuff, but in a back ally....well.....anything can happen.

Most big guys tend to fight fair, its in the nature.... They are big.

Then there is trained fighters against non-trained fighters. I have seen several UFC guys in trouble with Golden Glove boxers during training and those guys actually train to punch people daily.

This reminds me of Michael Carbajal's bar room fight (this happened in his prime). Carbajal is 5-5 and fought at 105 pounds. He notoriously knocked out a 200 pound guy in a bar brawl after the dude threw a punch at him. It was a reminder of what happens when a big unskilled guy misses that haymaker against an actual fighter.

But like you..... that's a hell of a miss match in size

forget weight for a second, its damn hard to deal with some one that damn tall and long. You cant even get good energy on a punch to the head at that angle. Plus you give up reach to boot. When it eventually gets to the ground, you have to get that dudes back quick. Just the geometry would have Zion throwing elbows with the reach of your fist, and he could reach out for stabilization beyond your ability to control his hands. Once you add the strength of a 270+ plus world class athlete, the second he actually grabbed one of your arms....you no longer have two arms....your not getting that arm back. Hell you might as well be fighting a grizzly bear at that point...at least its not calculating. If Zion had 2 hours of judo training and just learned the first rule of submissions fighting (control at least one of the other persons hands) that fight would be over.

[dshearn]

It’s very easy to see who has, and who hasn’t ever been in a fight.

There is a reason why one of the last people you want to pick a fight with is a wrestler, let alone a trained MMA fighter.

It’s pretty amazing how advantageous knowing how to fight is, comparative to being strong and/or longer/bigger.

As someone who did Judo for 12 years, plus a few years of BJJ and has rolled with several UFC guys....skill absolutely has its place. I can also say with certainty even UFC guys start hunting the neck when they are dealing with the average guy who looks like an NFL offensive lineman, let alone someone like Zion.

I have no idea if Zion has any fight training. Hell he very well might, BJJ is very, VERY popular. I would bet he could be VERY difficult to deal with after several HOURS of training.

How would you break his guard? You cant posture up on him because of his reach. He has the strength and reach to control your head and neck from FLAT on his back. Going to try and get a Kimora? Can you even get to his arms from guard? If you can are you brave enough to give him a clean shot at your head? What if you get it locked in...and your not strong enough to rotate his shoulder? You think your going to stop a 300 pound super athlete from sweeping you when he can push off with his other elbow or arm and likely bridge with both his legs now? How about an arm bar? You sure you got the angle? Those arms are damn long How far out have you had to go to pivot his elbow? Plus he probably CURLS McGregor's body weight for fun. He likely can just push you out of position with his free arm. I don't think many UFC guys take that gamble against guys twice their size.

I have seen UFC guys rolling with your AVERAGE super large local guy, not take those risks let alone in a real fight. They always go for the neck. There is a point where skill gives way to what is actually possible when your mismatched. That point is somewhere BEFORE an average size man deals with someone Zion sized.

[Jkam31]

With 6 months of training, Zion would destroy McGregor due to sheer size and power.

Hell - Look at Brock Lesnar. He had no background in mixed martial arts prior to 2007, yet after only 18 months he became UFC champion by effectively bum rushing every opponent with crazy speed and power.

You honestly think you couldn't train Zion in a 6 month period to adapt a Brock Lesnar style of fighting and use a +100lb advantage to destory McGregor.

Don’t come back in this thread man

Every time I see this thread bumped I’m like no way I’ll see something dumber than last time and here we are

[Jkam31]

Lol how stupid you can be to think weight/size is the only things that matters in a fight.

McGregor is a freaking fight machine. He fights for a living and it's one of the best. Zion at best must have fighted a couple of times in his life.Of course he will murder Zion in the 1st round.

I guarantee you Zion and 90% of nba players haven’t been in a fight. Most of them were worshipped since middle school nobody would try to pick a fight with them

[Jkam31]

As an MMA fan this is an insult to the sport.

Now you know what it sounds like to every non-American when people say Lebron would be awesome at soccer LOL

Lebron would be goat TE/WR
CP3 would be a decent QB

Just to name a few of these takes

[Saint Lazarus]

What are you talking about dude?

Are you talking about a situation that Zion sucker punches Connor in a crowd? Sure dude, he wins that "fight". But only if his one shot actually knocks him out.

As for the "spacing" thing well sometime you actually want less space specially in grappling. If they're in a clinch situation, that probably favors the trained fighter more.

Someone has to punch first, right? And it usually happens unexpectedly in street fights... That doesn't mean it's a 'sucker' punch... Sucker punching to me would be like if Conor was taking a shot of his Proper Twelve whiskey with his back turned and doesn't see Zion coming from behind with a hit to his head...

What about if the two are yapping at each other and then Zion throws a punch first, or just decides to charge at him? Does that put him in a 'sucker' category?

Clinch situation lol. You've lived through one too many UFC fights vicariously my friend... If Zion decides to charge Conor before Conor can react (which would be the smartest way of approaching the fight from his perspective) there is no clinch... The two hit the ground and then the onus is on McGregor to outwrestle a 6'6'', 285 pound dude off him before he gets too many shots to the head which is bouncing off the concrete...

If someone can do that it's certainly going to be a professionally trained wrestler, but it definitely won't be as easy as some of the guys here make it sound just because Zion has zero training. He's still 6'6'' and has 120 pounds on Conor, and it's entirely possible Conor's back is up against some obstacle where he cant fully move about.

If Connor is on his feet all he would do is use his very good kicks to quickly take out Zion's bad knee.

Zions body may be 260 pounds but his neck, arms, knees, and feet are not 260 pounds. If any of them are exposed on the ground its lights out for any well trained BJJ guy. Zion is a amateur. The neck would be choked. The ankle or foot would be in a lock. The arm would be in an arm bar.

I think the whole thread is made for a "brawl" to throw in an unknown factor because people know in a ring it would be over.

So is there a chance in a backyard brawl? Sure nobody can say what would happen. Maybe somebody in a backyard will grab a shovel and hit the other over the head. There also is a chance that Zion is one of the worst fighters in the NBA.

Maybe Conor will slip on a banana peel Tom and Jerry style and step right into a upper cut

[HeartBreakKid]

The reason why Zion Williamson cannot just "brock lesnar" someone is because he's not a former NCAA division 1 wrestling champion.

Brock Lesnar had years of experience in a martial art before crossing over into the UFC. Don't think Zion's time at Duke gave him that.

The differential is over 115 lbs.

So, for context if we assume the average grown male is 200lbs -115lbs = 85lbs.

Take the world's most elite 85lb pre-teen, who could have been training since birth. So, if the argument for McGregor holds true the kid should win. Right?

Jeeeez, the education of where ever you're from must have been horrible. I mean....jeeeeez.

And to think people with this type of logical thinking are allowed to vote. I mean...my lord.


The bold part so ridiculous that it's not even worth dissecting, but the entire concept of this post literally shows that this person doesn't understand how weight classes work - yet his argument revolves around a weight argument. This is really a post for the ages.

It's kind of unreal that this guy has never thought about why weight classes at smaller weights have have less differences in LBS than higher weights, but he talks with so much confidence as if he took the time to think about his argument - which is clearly uninformed. This guy literally has no idea how weight classes work, talking out of your ass 101.

[Pg81]

It is not possible for a guy to win a fair fight giving up 100 pounds of muscle. None.

Just imagine you, the average guy fighting the biggest guy you ever met in your life. Zion has hundreds of ways to win the fight and McGregor has just a few options. Also, in an alley fight, there are no rules so Zion could easily get out of any ground and pound situation by attacking eyes or groin. Zion could literally pick up McGregor and throw him through a wall.

Just imagine the scene in Friday where Zibo is chasing Katt Williams and replace them with Zion and McGregor.

My guess is that you have never been in a fight before. Zion only has one chance at winning and that's landing a wild haymaker that he never expected to land.

McGregor could beat Zion anyway he pleased. Whether it's standing up or on the ground. Zion won't have the technique to take McGregor down and he doesn't have the skills to outstrike Connor. McGregor can finish Zion whichever way he decides.

Zions chances of beating McGregor in a street fight slim to none and slim just left town. The fact that this even a debate shows the lack of knowledge and experience people on these forums have when it comes to fighting.

Zion or any NBA players would get slept by McGregor or any half decent fighter.

Actually, I have dedicated around 10 years of my life to the study of a specific style of Chinese Kung Fu called Tong Lung so I really do know what I am talking about. I am not saying 100 pounds between a guy that is 250lb vs 350lb. I am talking about a guy that is 170lb vs an in-shape 275lb monster. Every fighter has a punchers chance, but Zion would literally destroy McGregor if he had 6 hours of fight training and strategy prep. It’s just an impossible task. Even Bruce Lee at his peak would not stand a chance against Zion in a serious street fight. It’s too much of a weight and strength difference, not to mention height (leverage) and reach.

I will also say specific to your comments. 1. What makes you think Zion can only throw haymakers? 2. Standing would be destructive for McGregor. He lacks reach and power while Zion has excess in both. 3. What in OP’s instructions indicates a ring and a ref. Alleys and real fights are very constrictive. You simply cannot run and weave unless you are in a ring. 4. On the ground, Zion would just lift McGregor off him via strength, like a bench press. Let’s see McGregor bench Zion. Plus, for those that are not well versed in MMA, on the ground fighting is a terrible technique without rules. You expose your eyes, groin, hair, mouth etc. You also expose your back to secondary attackers. Real fights almost never end in ground and pound - that requires rules and a referee.

In a ring, with gloves, McGregor has a much better chance - say 10% instead of 2% on the street. There is a reason they have weight classes in boxing and MMA. If McGregor wanted to beat Zion he would need to become better versed in strikes to the neck, eyes or temples but we are assuming he fights his type of fight, in which case he loses pretty badly barring a miracle.

This argument is so stupid that it is sigworthy.

[Lalouie]

mcgregor will stick out his chin and say "hit me, i want to taste my blood".
and after zion hits him, mcgregor will smile and punch zion in the face. zion's eyes will get watery and he will cry. and what do they say in the movies all the time ....."he broke my nose". as for zion's height, cm would displace zion's kneecap to the back of the joint

there is no dunking style points in fighting

[Doug_12]

It’s very easy to see who has, and who hasn’t ever been in a fight.

There is a reason why one of the last people you want to pick a fight with is a wrestler, let alone a trained MMA fighter.

It’s pretty amazing how advantageous knowing how to fight is, comparative to being strong and/or longer/bigger.

As someone who did Judo for 12 years, plus a few years of BJJ and has rolled with several UFC guys....skill absolutely has its place. I can also say with certainty even UFC guys start hunting the neck when they are dealing with the average guy who looks like an NFL offensive lineman, let alone someone like Zion.

I have no idea if Zion has any fight training. Hell he very well might, BJJ is very, VERY popular. I would bet he could be VERY difficult to deal with after several HOURS of training.

How would you break his guard? You cant posture up on him because of his reach. He has the strength and reach to control your head and neck from FLAT on his back. Going to try and get a Kimora? Can you even get to his arms from guard? If you can are you brave enough to give him a clean shot at your head? What if you get it locked in...and your not strong enough to rotate his shoulder? You think your going to stop a 300 pound super athlete from sweeping you when he can push off with his other elbow or arm and likely bridge with both his legs now? How about an arm bar? You sure you got the angle? Those arms are damn long How far out have you had to go to pivot his elbow? Plus he probably CURLS McGregor's body weight for fun. He likely can just push you out of position with his free arm. I don't think many UFC guys take that gamble against guys twice their size.

I have seen UFC guys rolling with your AVERAGE super large local guy, not take those risks let alone in a real fight. They always go for the neck. There is a point where skill gives way to what is actually possible when your mismatched. That point is somewhere BEFORE an average size man deals with someone Zion sized.

I'd assume that he has no to minimal background in martial arts.

If that is the case I'd argue that you don't need to build this strategy up. As he has no experience he will expose himself sooner or later by leaving his head open for a punch or by leaving his leg undefended and open for a sweep (then when he is on the ground laying on his back, his weight and height advantage is gone) etc... I'd bet that it would happen at the very first time he tries to land a punch.

And even though Zion is 285 lbs his head is most probably not more durable than an average person's...

[AussieCeltic]

My guess is that you have never been in a fight before. Zion only has one chance at winning and that's landing a wild haymaker that he never expected to land.

McGregor could beat Zion anyway he pleased. Whether it's standing up or on the ground. Zion won't have the technique to take McGregor down and he doesn't have the skills to outstrike Connor. McGregor can finish Zion whichever way he decides.

Zions chances of beating McGregor in a street fight slim to none and slim just left town. The fact that this even a debate shows the lack of knowledge and experience people on these forums have when it comes to fighting.

Zion or any NBA players would get slept by McGregor or any half decent fighter.

Actually, I have dedicated around 10 years of my life to the study of a specific style of Chinese Kung Fu called Tong Lung so I really do know what I am talking about. I am not saying 100 pounds between a guy that is 250lb vs 350lb. I am talking about a guy that is 170lb vs an in-shape 275lb monster. Every fighter has a punchers chance, but Zion would literally destroy McGregor if he had 6 hours of fight training and strategy prep. It’s just an impossible task. Even Bruce Lee at his peak would not stand a chance against Zion in a serious street fight. It’s too much of a weight and strength difference, not to mention height (leverage) and reach.

I will also say specific to your comments. 1. What makes you think Zion can only throw haymakers? 2. Standing would be destructive for McGregor. He lacks reach and power while Zion has excess in both. 3. What in OP’s instructions indicates a ring and a ref. Alleys and real fights are very constrictive. You simply cannot run and weave unless you are in a ring. 4. On the ground, Zion would just lift McGregor off him via strength, like a bench press. Let’s see McGregor bench Zion. Plus, for those that are not well versed in MMA, on the ground fighting is a terrible technique without rules. You expose your eyes, groin, hair, mouth etc. You also expose your back to secondary attackers. Real fights almost never end in ground and pound - that requires rules and a referee.

In a ring, with gloves, McGregor has a much better chance - say 10% instead of 2% on the street. There is a reason they have weight classes in boxing and MMA. If McGregor wanted to beat Zion he would need to become better versed in strikes to the neck, eyes or temples but we are assuming he fights his type of fight, in which case he loses pretty badly barring a miracle.

This argument is so stupid that it is sigworthy.

He has to be trolling. There is no way someone with 10 years of training would say things like that.

[clippertown]

Actually, I have dedicated around 10 years of my life to the study of a specific style of Chinese Kung Fu called Tong Lung so I really do know what I am talking about. I am not saying 100 pounds between a guy that is 250lb vs 350lb. I am talking about a guy that is 170lb vs an in-shape 275lb monster. Every fighter has a punchers chance, but Zion would literally destroy McGregor if he had 6 hours of fight training and strategy prep. It’s just an impossible task. Even Bruce Lee at his peak would not stand a chance against Zion in a serious street fight. It’s too much of a weight and strength difference, not to mention height (leverage) and reach.

I will also say specific to your comments. 1. What makes you think Zion can only throw haymakers? 2. Standing would be destructive for McGregor. He lacks reach and power while Zion has excess in both. 3. What in OP’s instructions indicates a ring and a ref. Alleys and real fights are very constrictive. You simply cannot run and weave unless you are in a ring. 4. On the ground, Zion would just lift McGregor off him via strength, like a bench press. Let’s see McGregor bench Zion. Plus, for those that are not well versed in MMA, on the ground fighting is a terrible technique without rules. You expose your eyes, groin, hair, mouth etc. You also expose your back to secondary attackers. Real fights almost never end in ground and pound - that requires rules and a referee.

In a ring, with gloves, McGregor has a much better chance - say 10% instead of 2% on the street. There is a reason they have weight classes in boxing and MMA. If McGregor wanted to beat Zion he would need to become better versed in strikes to the neck, eyes or temples but we are assuming he fights his type of fight, in which case he loses pretty badly barring a miracle.

This argument is so stupid that it is sigworthy.

He has to be trolling. There is no way someone with 10 years of training would say things like that.

Not going to get into it. The stupid underlined area simply meant that if Zion had no clue how to fight, he would need some basic training. Obviously, he knows something. Seriously, anybody who thinks McGregor would beat Zion is fully ready for Idiocracy.

Just imagine a prime McGregor vs a 50 year old Tyson. Or think of you against a 50 year old Barkley. This whole topic is silly. Too many people watching Kung Fu movies and thinking its reality.

[Pg81]

This argument is so stupid that it is sigworthy.

He has to be trolling. There is no way someone with 10 years of training would say things like that.

Not going to get into it. The stupid underlined area simply meant that if Zion had no clue how to fight, he would need some basic training. Obviously, he knows something. Seriously, anybody who thinks McGregor would beat Zion is fully ready for Idiocracy.

Just imagine a prime McGregor vs a 50 year old Tyson. Or think of you against a 50 year old Barkley. This whole topic is silly. Too many people watching Kung Fu movies and thinking its reality.