Official Speculation Thread '20-'21 VI: "I like this team"

[tiderulz]

The risk of not extending them is losing value. Isaac could be bid up by teams with excess cash next offseason. I wouldn't be surprised if he gets $25-30M next offseason, which then makes it a real question if the Magic match the offer. I think they would have to.
If Fultz can shoot the 3 ball at 33% on higher volume this year while also improving in other areas, like defense, he is going to get paid next offseason.

If we are able to lock Isaac in to something like $18M a year, while he is producing closer to $30M, then we are on to something. That is how you get a good team, by excess value/production over the salary cap. Same goes for Fultz. If we could get him at 13-15, and have him produce at something like $20M, it's a huge win, and $20M of production is probably like 15th best point guard territory.

Is it a risk? Of course. Every contract is a risk, you have to guess on development or decline (in older players). Almost every contract this offseason was a big risk. We have to spend our money on someone, it may as well be on players that have upside. I would feel a lot more comfortable giving JI $20M a year than Jerami Grant, or Fultz $13M than Rozier's $19M.

I would be very surprised, because he cannot stay healthy. Isaac hasnt shown enough to land a $25-30 mil/yr type of contract.

What has he had three injuries. A sprained ankle, a sprained/bruised knee, and the torn ACL. Basically the ACL is the only one of consequence at this point. Kristaps and Klay Thompson both got a max on blind ACL recoveries. These are probably a horrible examples to use for giving JI a new contract, but the point is teams are willing to bet on recovery. ACL is a common injury at this point, that usually result in full recoveries. Had he not gotten hurt he would probably been looking at close to the max, based on just last year, not any further development this year.

I am certainly not saying we should bid against ourselves, but next year we would be bidding against teams loaded up with cash. We saw what happened in FA this year when there was hardly any cash. JI at $18M would look like one of the best contracts this offseason comparatively.

he has played 136 of 258 games. thats barely above half. teams dont like giving big money to a player only available every other game

[j-ragg]

Read on Twitter

Read on Twitter

[yoyojw17]

We split against the Lakers last season too.

Sent from my SM-G950U using RealGM mobile app

And i get it too... for some people they have no problem overlooking internal growth. But at the same time... there are no guarantees just cuz they "look better on paper". I personally am excited about cole and chuma additions. If people want to already disregard their potential... then for most... "we haven't added anything". And there is still the growth of fultz and bamba. once again... people might simplify everything and boil it down to... they are gonna be the same as last year. For me... Fultz is going to take a load of the usage off of other players... and in doing so... things will change drastically for us. And bamba... coming in at 250 lb... I will reserve judgement and see what he does with that extra weight. So... many are humdrummed about this season.... especially without Isaac... I'm still excited bout what we have left to play... and I don't believe this season will be a loss at all. Might even have some people having to backtrack on their previous outlooks.

but only time will tell. Tomorrow starts a new season... Let's Go Magic!

And Atlanta doesn't stand chance for internal growth?
Trae Young ( 22)
Collins ( 23)
Deanre Hunter (22)
Huerter (22)
Reddish (21)
Fernando (22)
Okongwu (19)


We objectivlly got worst at PG spot and at SF spot. We flipped Iwundu (not world beater but somewhat decent deep bench guy) with Bacon, who isn't even deep bench guy.
That's pretty much it.
You expect to take Fultz load from who? Magic are bringing same starting 5 back.
Evan is in contract year, Gordon is year away from being expiring contract and pending trade is imminent. So they will stat-chace like crazy. Vuc will still be our go to guy.
You can be exited about whatever you want, you can get exited about way Clarke is tying his laces. But Magic win range for next season is 25-35. They won't tank so they won't drop lower due all play- in crap.
They also have no talent to win more.
I wouldn't even bet my money that healthy Wall and Beal won't surpass us in standings.

Don't get me wrong. I believe they will as well. I'm excited for what they have done and can't wait for this season to start.

You expect to take Fultz load from who? - Take it from who? EVAN.... and AG...Evan in particular and he will be even better in us doing so. I really doubt we're going to see a sub 21 percent usage rate from fultz this year.

Well.... yes.... i am going to be excited... cuz i'm a fan of the team. I can't spend my time trying to prove how and why and if ... things are happening and will they work. Same way that there is no proof that any acquisition or move by ANY team will work and make them better... even if it adds up on paper.

I don't think the hammond and weltman are incompetitent... so i will give their strategies a chance and see how it plays out and understand why they are doing what they are doing. And in doing so... i can see how it all works out for the best, even though it might not be my initial choice.

but... as i am allowed to be excited... i guess you're allowed to disagree. lol

[tiderulz]

Bamba.... man. I will refrain from my typical rant because there’s a chance this is still him shaking off the covid cobwebs.

I hope he doesn’t go down as one of the biggest-wastes-of-an-NBA-body of all time. He’s skinny but IMO has a bigger frame than someone like Isaac to put on muscle. 3rd year is usually the big year young guys put it together, not off to a great start.

yeah, i just cant see a great or even good future for him right now. as you say, maybe he shakes some things off, but to me you would at least want to see motivation and effort with him whenever he was on the court and i just dont see it.

[Nyce_1]

So let's just remove Aminu from all possible lineups, smh.

AG definitely starting at the 4, and Okeke/Clark will backup that position as a tandem. I think Clark is a good test for Okeke to battle for minutes.

Fultz/MCW/Cole
Fournier/Ross
Ennis/Bacon
Gordon/Clark/Okeke
Vucevic/Bamba (hopefully)/Birch

For all the tankers, if we have another injury-riddled season like the last, we'll FOR SURE be battling for high lotto odds.

[j-ragg]

Not to be too doom and gloom but I wouldn’t doubt if we don’t see Bamba all season. The way these guys baby any player ailment even if he’s ready to go post ASB I doubt they’d want him to be out there.

[Nyce_1]

Read on Twitter

Clifford keeps hinting at this idea that it's going to be tough for Anthony and Okeke to get on the floor and if that's the case, really just kill me now.

Why are you surprised? He said the same with Fultz leading up to camp and by game 7 (or something) he was starting. He's setting expectations low for us fans, but also making sure the players hear his words in the media. "You MFs better work to earn this PT."

If the kids understand our concepts and earn trust in camp, they'll get their share of PT.

[pepe1991]

Not to be too doom and gloom but I wouldn’t doubt if we don’t see Bamba all season. The way these guys baby any player ailment even if he’s ready to go post ASB I doubt they’d want him to be out there.

This is why you can't put all the cookies into tanking jar.
Isaac, Fultz, Bamba 3 top 6 picks, 1 is mediocre, other is solid but always hurt and third is bad and always hurt.

Bamba ... i won't even go there. There is nothing else to say from me at this stage.

[j-ragg]

Oh is today like pseudo media day? I guess that makes sense. Training camp is probably starting now, a week and change from preseason.

[Max Power]

If the Magic aren’t going to contend for a playoff spot, there’s no reason at all to not flood Okeke and Anthony with useful minutes. In my honest opinion, I think there’s going to be a fire sale at the deadline, with Gordon, Fournier, and even Ross and Vucevic being on the trade market. Unfortunately at its best this was a potential 45 win squad when healthy 18 months ago. But without a healthy JI and the fact that AG and Fournier have peaked, I think it’s time to bring in some new blood. I’d overhaul this roster and bounce WeHam this coming offseason. I do think Clifford is a fine coach, I think he’s turned in enough wins to stay coach here for the immediate future.

[PrimeThyme]

The unfortunate COVID side effects just feels like the nail in the coffin for Bamba (on this team at least). I have serious doubts that they will even pick up his option next offseason.

He's had some bad luck, but regardless, I can't consider him a core piece at this point. Even with a fully healthy career, I don't think I would have ever been able to. Now it's just another position on this team that we need to actively be looking for the player of the future.

Hopefully, we get some lottery luck this year and can think long and hard about taking one of the stud center prospects at the top.

[OrlChamps2030]

The unfortunate COVID side effects just feels like the nail in the coffin for Bamba (on this team at least). I have serious doubts that they will even pick up his option next offseason.

He's had some bad luck, but regardless, I can't consider him a core piece at this point. Even with a fully healthy career, I don't think I would have ever been able to. Now it's just another position on this team that we need to actively be looking for the player of the future.

Hopefully, we get some lottery luck this year and can think long and hard about taking one of the stud center prospects at the top.

Taking another center high in the draft hurts to even think about.. but yeah I do agree I think Bamba’s days are numbered in Orlando.

[Def Swami]

On Bamba, the Magic aren't being totally up front about what's going on with him. It has been 6 months since he had COVID. They actually tried to play him in the Bubble until they decided he was feeling the lasting affects of COVID. What makes them sure that it's the lasting affects of COVID and nothing else? I'm genuinely curious. There are long haulers, but 6 months is a long time.

Also, how bad is the Magic medical team? Aminu had surgery almost a YEAR ago. In what world is he not ready for training camp? The Magic paid this guy $30 million and they can't even get him on the court after rehabbing for a whole year. Makes you really dubious as to the job they're doing. Especially when you factor in everything Isaac has been through.

It makes sense why the Magic re-signed Clark if Aminu is out. Clifford needed someone to play over Okeke. Clifford isn't playing Anthony or Okeke. He's going to ride his vets to 30 wins and a play in tournament.

One thing about Clifford, he doesn't lie about his feelings on players. If he's optimistic about a player, he'll tell you. If he's pessimistic, you'll hear it in his words. The one encouraging thing from his presser is Fultz looks good. Fultz turning into a go-to option has always been the Magic's hail mary lottery ticket. Fultz getting better would be a huge win for this team in the grand scheme of things.

Read on Twitter

[zaymon]

Some interesting quotes from Clifford today.
-He thinks Fultz will be more than a solid starter this year
- He doesnt put ceiling on Cole and Chuma role this season.
- Aminu, Bamba not cleared for full contact
- Okeke cleared to play
- admits we lacked skill and shooting last year, additions of Anthony, Okeke and Bacon should help a lot
- saw Bacon as possible solid starter his rookie year, loves his tools

[jonbob17]

delete

[KillMonger]

Read on Twitter

Clifford keeps hinting at this idea that it's going to be tough for Anthony and Okeke to get on the floor and if that's the case, really just kill me now.

I would think that's the case for chuma maybe but to say that for anthony? he's at least the backup PG from day one unless clifford is really going to play MCW in front of him....i'm sorry i like MCW but continuity or not he should not be ahead of Cole in the depth chart.

[Nyce_1]

Oh is today like pseudo media day? I guess that makes sense. Training camp is probably starting now, a week and change from preseason.

It's media "week". Since no full camp until friday, teams are allowed to have players in groups of 4 for mini-camp-like workouts. The Magic will make a couple players available every day for media sessions.

[Nyce_1]

On Bamba, the Magic aren't being totally up front about what's going on with him. It has been 6 months since he had COVID. They actually tried to play him in the Bubble until they decided he was feeling the lasting affects of COVID. What makes them sure that it's the lasting affects of COVID and nothing else? I'm genuinely curious. There are long haulers, but 6 months is a long time.

Also, how bad is the Magic medical team? Aminu had surgery almost a YEAR ago. In what world is he not ready for training camp? The Magic paid this guy $30 million and they can't even get him on the court after rehabbing for a whole year. Makes you really dubious as to the job they're doing. Especially when you factor in everything Isaac has been through.

It makes sense why the Magic re-signed Clark if Aminu is out. Clifford needed someone to play over Okeke. Clifford isn't playing Anthony or Okeke. He's going to ride his vets to 30 wins and a play in tournament.

One thing about Clifford, he doesn't lie about his feelings on players. If he's optimistic about a player, he'll tell you. If he's pessimistic, you'll hear it in his words. The one encouraging thing from his presser is Fultz looks good. Fultz turning into a go-to option has always been the Magic's hail mary lottery ticket. Fultz getting better would be a huge win for this team in the grand scheme of things.

Read on Twitter

Re Mo & Covid: Long haulers suffer symptoms for a while. Some longer than 6 months. It's just unfortunate for Mo and hopefully he recovers 100%. I think because COVID is still such an unknown about it's lasting effects, the teams is navigating their best to also protect his future.

Cliff is open to playing the kids if they earn their time. If he felt comfortable playing a rookie Bacon in Char, and a making Kelle the starter after about 2 weeks into the season, i have no doubt he'll play the rookies if they prove they deserve the time.

[drsd]

The Hypothetical Trade

Magic Receive: James Harden, Danuel House Jr.

Rockets Receive: Evan Fournier, Aaron Gordon, Mo Bamba, 2021 First-Round Pick, 2023 First-Round Pick, 2025 First-Round Pick, 2027 First-Round Pick

I am so glad Magic fans do not have a voice the GM and PBO listen to!

Link

After a couple second-round playoff exits, the Magic would be unable to redevelop a roster until about 2030.
(( And I thought we were "guaranteed" a championship by 2030 ))

..

[Nyce_1]

Listening to Cliff's interview, you can tell the hope is there for our bench unit to include Cole/Bacon/Okeke. He said all of their strengths are what we lacked with the 2nd unit last season. It may not happen right away, but I will be happy to see these guys raising the floor of our team. Hopefully they show flashes and contribute to wins.