Woj - Westbrook for Wall and 1st Rounder

[DCZards]

As for the pick, this organization out of all cannot afford to burn assets, especially based on some fluffed up outrage that the organization somehow owns players' personal lives off the court. Not all of your fans are angels either. That was in part what makes Wall compelling, as a player and a person. He he often speaks the truth even when he shouldn't. He of all players tries to 'keep it real' even when a mic is stuck in front of his face and he gives a nuanced answer to a question, that then gets taken out of context and turned into "WALL AND BEAL DON'T LIKE EACH OTHER-- News at 11". If being tru tot himself means he still has some friends that might make Ted uncomfortable, man, oh well. Get over it fatboy. Pretty sure there are Wizards fans who make Ted uncomfortable. He walks around talking with fans at hockey games. Does he do so at WIzards games? I haven't seen it...

Yes, Ted walks around the concourse and interacts with fans at Zards games. I've seen it.

[DCZards]

Love you too bruh!

Read on Twitter

[wall_glizzy]

The trade was good - going into the season with John's situation (both injury-wise and trade-wise) up in the air was clearly going to be a distraction, and I'm comfortable trusting the front office's judgment on that. A first rounder protected like the one we sent out is much less than I thought we'd have to pay to dump the Wall contract, let alone receive any kind of impactful player in return.

The Westbrook hate in here is absurd (and has been over-exaggerated in the broader NBA world for a few years now). Whatever you think of his efficiency numbers, he's a productive player; more importantly, he's the sort of absolute hardass leader that this team hasn't had this millennium. His OKC teammates love him, OKC fans still love him, and even at the usage rates he was putting up with the post-KD Thunder he was getting the best out of his teammates. Beal, Bertans, and even Thomas Bryant are miles beyond anyone Russ has had around him, spacing-wise (I'm excluding Harden here, obviously, because of how much of a special case that Houston system is).

Anyway, I'm excited to see what happens. I think the team's going to play hard as hell, be an absolute menace in transition, and hopefully win more games than we lose. I really like the Westbrook/Beal/Bonga/Bertans/Bryant starting lineup that was mentioned up-thread, and the fact that we can stagger the backcourt rotation to have top-notch playmaking out there for 48 minutes a game. (I really hope we get to see Russ with an Avdija/Gill small-ball frontcourt out there while Brad sits). Frankly, I don't care that we're re-building less than 100% optimally - the Wall/Beal situation put us in an impossible position suspended between all-out tanking and trying to compete, and if we're determined to take the latter route then I think we've made about the most that we could of the cards we were dealt.

I'll also really miss John, as will (as should) the whole Wizards fanbase. There aren't a lot of players who stick it out with teams long enough for their presence to be a bona fide era, and especially not in markets like DC. Look at the connection he made with the city during his time here, though, and it's no mystery. My basketball mind is ready to see Brad and Russ give it a go, but my heart will really hurt seeing John in another uniform. I'm beyond proud to have been there for Game 6 in 2017 - that'll forever be my most treasured basketball memory, and the one I'll return to when I think about Wizards basketball in the 2010s.

[prime1time]

The trade was good - going into the season with John's situation (both injury-wise and trade-wise) up in the air was clearly going to be a distraction, and I'm comfortable trusting the front office's judgment on that. A first rounder protected like the one we sent out is much less than I thought we'd have to pay to dump the Wall contract, let alone receive any kind of impactful player in return.

The Westbrook hate in here is absurd (and has been over-exaggerated in the broader NBA world for a few years now). Whatever you think of his efficiency numbers, he's a productive player; more importantly, he's the sort of absolute hardass leader that this team hasn't had this millennium. His OKC teammates love him, OKC fans still love him, and even at the usage rates he was putting up with the post-KD Thunder he was getting the best out of his teammates. Beal, Bertans, and even Thomas Bryant are miles beyond anyone Russ has had around him, spacing-wise (I'm excluding Harden here, obviously, because of how much of a special case that Houston system is).

Anyway, I'm excited to see what happens. I think the team's going to play hard as hell, be an absolute menace in transition, and hopefully win more games than we lose. I really like the Westbrook/Beal/Bonga/Bertans/Bryant starting lineup that was mentioned up-thread, and the fact that we can stagger the backcourt rotation to have top-notch playmaking out there for 48 minutes a game. (I really hope we get to see Russ with an Avdija/Gill small-ball frontcourt out there while Brad sits). Frankly, I don't care that we're re-building less than 100% optimally - the Wall/Beal situation put us in an impossible position suspended between all-out tanking and trying to compete, and if we're determined to take the latter route then I think we've made about the most that we could of the cards we were dealt.

I'll also really miss John, as will (as should) the whole Wizards fanbase. There aren't a lot of players who stick it out with teams long enough for their presence to be a bona fide era, and especially not in markets like DC. Look at the connection he made with the city during his time here, though, and it's no mystery. My basketball mind is ready to see Brad and Russ give it a go, but my heart will really hurt seeing John in another uniform. I'm beyond proud to have been there for Game 6 in 2017 - that'll forever be my most treasured basketball memory, and the one I'll return to when I think about Wizards basketball in the 2010s.

I agree with a lot of what you wrote but Brooks has already said that Rui's starting. So I'm going to assume that Bertans will be coming off the bench.

[Ruzious]

Fwiw, SI.com had 5 analysts give their view of who won the trade and why. https://www.si.com/nba/2020/12/03/russell-westbrook-john-wall-rockets-wizards-trade#:~:text=The%20Rockets%20traded%20Russell%20Westbrook,rumors%20between%20the%20two%20superstars.

4 of them had the Wiz winning it, and the other said both teams won.

[wall_glizzy]

some stuff

I agree with a lot of what you wrote but Brooks has already said that Rui's starting. So I'm going to assume that Bertans will be coming off the bench.

Yeah, I saw that as well (and expect that's what'll happen, still) but we'll see how that changes with Westbrook in the fold. By all accounts, the Westbrook/Wall trade talk was pretty dead until Russ didn't show up at camp in Houston yesterday and forced Rafael Stone's hand, so I'm actually not sure if Brooks was considering that possibility at the time.

[dlts20]

I feel bad for Wall. Finally I think he's ready to finish his career truly giving it 100 percent his best. He finally gets to play with a stretch big that can space the floor for him and a crazy shooter like Bertans but he does not get the chance. Then you are traded to a tougher and PG heavy conference.. Finally get LeBron out of the east and Wall still has to go through him... Lol

Then I always wanted to see Wall play for MDA. I think that he would be crazy good but now Wall comes as soon as MDA and small ball leaves. He just never gets the perfect setup but I do think that Silas will be good and hopefully Boogie is healthy because that would be a spacer for him and someone Wall could feast with.

The best part about this deal for us is that Westbrook is healthy and ready. I already know that I was going to be annoyed by us load managing John and missing b2bs when there will probably be a lot of them this year. Also, idk if the NBA has already set the schedule but Westbrook would put us in way more prime time games than previously.

Also, I think that Westbrook is actually the most motivated he's ever been. I think that he got a bad rap for the playoffs. He may have been the best player in the league after they went small. Then covid shuts the season down when he's playing his best ever. Season resumes but he catches covid, pulls a hammy, and has to come back against the Lakers who are in playoff mode while Russ is rusty.. Lol

Like Wall, Westbrook has also never really gotten to play his game or play to his strength. He's always had Perkins or Adams clogging the lane. He will kill with Bryant. I also think that he will be excited to be playing in the east and living in a city like DC

[Ruzious]

The trade was good - going into the season with John's situation (both injury-wise and trade-wise) up in the air was clearly going to be a distraction, and I'm comfortable trusting the front office's judgment on that. A first rounder protected like the one we sent out is much less than I thought we'd have to pay to dump the Wall contract, let alone receive any kind of impactful player in return.

The Westbrook hate in here is absurd (and has been over-exaggerated in the broader NBA world for a few years now). Whatever you think of his efficiency numbers, he's a productive player; more importantly, he's the sort of absolute hardass leader that this team hasn't had this millennium. His OKC teammates love him, OKC fans still love him, and even at the usage rates he was putting up with the post-KD Thunder he was getting the best out of his teammates. Beal, Bertans, and even Thomas Bryant are miles beyond anyone Russ has had around him, spacing-wise (I'm excluding Harden here, obviously, because of how much of a special case that Houston system is).

Anyway, I'm excited to see what happens. I think the team's going to play hard as hell, be an absolute menace in transition, and hopefully win more games than we lose. I really like the Westbrook/Beal/Bonga/Bertans/Bryant starting lineup that was mentioned up-thread, and the fact that we can stagger the backcourt rotation to have top-notch playmaking out there for 48 minutes a game. (I really hope we get to see Russ with an Avdija/Gill small-ball frontcourt out there while Brad sits). Frankly, I don't care that we're re-building less than 100% optimally - the Wall/Beal situation put us in an impossible position suspended between all-out tanking and trying to compete, and if we're determined to take the latter route then I think we've made about the most that we could of the cards we were dealt.

I'll also really miss John, as will (as should) the whole Wizards fanbase. There aren't a lot of players who stick it out with teams long enough for their presence to be a bona fide era, and especially not in markets like DC. Look at the connection he made with the city during his time here, though, and it's no mystery. My basketball mind is ready to see Brad and Russ give it a go, but my heart will really hurt seeing John in another uniform. I'm beyond proud to have been there for Game 6 in 2017 - that'll forever be my most treasured basketball memory, and the one I'll return to when I think about Wizards basketball in the 2010s.

No doubt his inefficient scoring is a problem, but yeah - let's give him a chance to see if the spacing primarily from Bertans and Beal will lead to an improvement there. If he averages 30/10/10 a game, it'll be hard to be too upset. If we believe Aldridge, a change had to be made, and Aldridge knows more than all of us. So, I'm fine with moving on from moping about the trade and looking forward to seeing where we're headed.

[NatP4]

I’m curious to see how long Westbrook can be an effective player. DWade had his drop off in that age 34 season. Thoughts??

[ClutchDJ]

I highly doubt both Beal & Westbrook will be here after 2023.

[DCZards]

Also, I think that Westbrook is actually the most motivated he's ever been. I think that he got a bad rap for the playoffs. He may have been the best player in the league after they went small. Then covid shuts the season down when he's playing his best ever. Season resumes but he catches covid, pulls a hammy, and has to come back against the Lakers who are in playoff mode while Russ is rusty.. Lol

This. Those on here talking about how much Russ has declined must not have been watching the second half of last season when he was beasting.

[LyricalRico]

After sleeping on this trade and viewing it with a fresh set of eyes, I've come around on it a bit. This is a good basketball move, but it hurts like hell as a long-time fan of the team.

Yeah, I was undecided last night but now starting to get excited about this season. I really did want to see what a healthy Wall could do back in a Wiz uni, but that was primarily sentimental. From a basketball perspective, I don't see how this doesn't make the Wiz better in the short term.

Long term? Sure the future with Westbrook has question marks, but so did a future with Wall. We basically swapped our existing questions/risks for a different set of questions/risks and ultimately I'm cool with that. Go Wiz!

[payitforward]

PIF, how many teams actually "rebuild" from scratch and win a title or even make it to the playoffs...very few....

Where did I say "from scratch?"

OTOH, how many players on the 15-man Washington Wizards roster as the 2020-21 season begins were with us at the beginning of the 2018-19 season, 2 years ago? Exactly 3 -- Beal, Brown & Bryant. Make it 3 years ago, & it's only 1, Brad Beal.

I don't know, my friend, but... doesn't that qualify as "rebuilding from scratch?"

Very few win a title doing that, to be sure. Then again... there's only 1 champion per year! Very few win a title doing... anything!

If you become "respectable" and make the playoffs on the strength of two all-NBA players like Beal and Westbrook, the shooting of Bertans, and the development of 2-3 of your youngins, then you stand a good chance of trading for or signing that last piece or two in free agency. Then you get a lot closer to competing for what we all want--a championship....

Zards, how many teams do what you describe & then add "that last piece or two" & get "what we all want--a championship?"

I disagree that "winning sooner rather than later" conflicts with winning a title.

Ok ok... maybe it was an overstatement!

Apparently there are many roads that do not lead to a championship! Certainly, it would be hard to make a case that losing "sooner rather than later" is a road that leads to a title!

Perhaps we can agree on another: signing Raul Neto, Robin Lopez & Anthony Gill does not give the appearance of being a road that leads to a championship -- at least it doesn't look like a shortcut!

Peace! Go Wiz!

[payitforward]

... I thought it was pretty clear this trade was going to happen when Cousins signed with Houston. Wall and him have been talking about playing together forever so wherever he ended up, I assumed Wall would join (or stay)....

Hey! Clever!!!

Did anyone else pick up on that? I sure didn't.

???

It was the first thing I said when they did it. They were trolling and trying to induce John to push for the trade.

Sorry, doc -- dunno how, but I missed that.

Now that you mention it, Houston signing Cousins as an inducement to Wall was pretty clever too!

[DCZards]

If you become "respectable" and make the playoffs on the strength of two all-NBA players like Beal and Westbrook, the shooting of Bertans, and the development of 2-3 of your youngins, then you stand a good chance of trading for or signing that last piece or two in free agency. Then you get a lot closer to competing for what we all want--a championship....

Zards, how many teams do what you describe & then add "that last piece or two" & get "what we all want--a championship?"

Well, actually the last two championship teams have done it--Toronto with Kawhi and the Lakers with Davis.

And then there's Miami which went from 10th in the East in 2018-19 to the finals last season. That happens primarily because of the addition of Butler.

[payitforward]

Are people not aware of the history of Achilles injuries???

I read about them in the Iliad....

[NatP4]

Incoming PIF rant about Tyler Herro, Bam Adebayo, and Duncan Robinson

It’s true though, the NBA is wide open right now. The wizards could make more win now moves and acquire another big piece to compete for a championship.

I would rather see what we have in Hachimura, Brown, and Avdija first.

[doclinkin]

Are people not aware of the history of Achilles injuries???

I read about them in the Iliad....

Man, you're so old you heard it from Homer directly.

[Zonkerbl]

IS IT THE APOCALYPSE?!?!?!?!

[Dat2U]

As for the pick, this organization out of all cannot afford to burn assets, especially based on some fluffed up outrage that the organization somehow owns players' personal lives off the court. Not all of your fans are angels either. That was in part what makes Wall compelling, as a player and a person. He he often speaks the truth even when he shouldn't. He of all players tries to 'keep it real' even when a mic is stuck in front of his face and he gives a nuanced answer to a question, that then gets taken out of context and turned into "WALL AND BEAL DON'T LIKE EACH OTHER-- News at 11". If being tru tot himself means he still has some friends that might make Ted uncomfortable, man, oh well. Get over it fatboy. Pretty sure there are Wizards fans who make Ted uncomfortable. He walks around talking with fans at hockey games. Does he do so at WIzards games? I haven't seen it...

Yes, Ted walks around the concourse and interacts with fans at Zards games. I've seen it.

Yep everytime I sip some Fireball, I get flashbacks about my interaction with Ted.