Bucks acquire Jrue Holiday - Trade done - Bucks 2022 to CLE unprotected

[soxperry]

This isnt the end all be all but maybe there is a reason Jrue is making 27 and Bled is making , what, 16?

Seems like the market has jrue being significantly better. I know sometimes a guy gets a bigger contract than he should but is there any universe where Bled would have gotten 27 from any team?

New Orleans valued bled as being a pile of drsft picks and george hill worse than Jrue. Yeah i understand bid wars. Still..

I cant believe we are having this discussion.

[Warriors Analyst]

Stop acting like Bledsoe is the same player in the playoffs

He literally is the same player. I've heard people say that about so many players over the years and the players generally always revert to their level of regular season performance. Bledsoe has played 679 games in his career and you're judging him based on 24 of them. I don't believe Bledsoe is incapable of performing in the playoffs just like I don't believe Giannis is either.

Bledsoe hovers around league average in the regular season and has averaged 49% TS in the last three playoffs and his efficiency only gets worse deeper in the playoffs. He's an awful playoff performer. There's no disputing that. I don't know why you'd want to wait around for Bledsoe to prove you right when the Bucks are in the middle of Giannis' prime.

[LUKE23]

Again:

Bledsoe 48 career playoffs games, Holiday 30 career playoff games.

Bledsoe Playoff TS: .516 (.558 for career regular season)
Holiday Playoff TS: .545 (.529 for career regular season)

Bledsoe Playoff FT per 36: 2.7 makes @ .712 (3.9 makes @ .793 career regular season)
Holiday Playoff FT per 36: 2.5 makes @ .806 (2.2 makes @ .777 career regular season)

Bledsoe Playoff 3's per 36: 1.1 makes @ .254 (1.4 makes @ .336 career regular season)
Holiday Playoff 3's per 36: 1.6 makes @ .387 (1.4 makes @ .354 career regular season)

[FlagsFlyForever]

Lowry has had plenty of really good playoff games and solid to very good playoff performances that would indicate he’s at least got that level in him.

It's easy to say that now with the benefit of hindsight bias, but five years ago you said this:

Every single year Derozan and Lowry prove that the players they are in the regular season means absolutely nothing in the playoffs, they're mental midgets who have games tailor made to thrive in the softer regular season and fold in the playoffs.

You were saying the same thing about Lowry then as you are about Bledsoe now.

[GHOSTofSIKMA]

bledsoes was getting progressively worse each time he goes to the playoffs. i dont think theres any example that quite correlates with what ive seen there that any championship contender didnt try to replace after 31 games and 3 year audition.

i do think if he gets a chance again it will be with a lesser role and he can turn it around. i really really like eric bledsoe.... it was a sad realization for me that there was just no way not even a 1% chance id want to go back to playoffs with him as our pg. there was a hesitation that had developed before he shot where you could tell he just didnt think it was going to go in when that ball went up

[ABucksFan]

Lowry has had plenty of really good playoff games and solid to very good playoff performances that would indicate he’s at least got that level in him.

It's easy to say that now with the benefit of hindsight bias, but five years ago you said this:

Every single year Derozan and Lowry prove that the players they are in the regular season means absolutely nothing in the playoffs, they're mental midgets who have games tailor made to thrive in the softer regular season and fold in the playoffs.

You were saying the same thing about Lowry then as you are about Bledsoe now.

[Lippo]

Missing the Aqua Dagger already.....

[Prez]

Lowry has had plenty of really good playoff games and solid to very good playoff performances that would indicate he’s at least got that level in him.

It's easy to say that now with the benefit of hindsight bias, but five years ago you said this:

Every single year Derozan and Lowry prove that the players they are in the regular season means absolutely nothing in the playoffs, they're mental midgets who have games tailor made to thrive in the softer regular season and fold in the playoffs.

You were saying the same thing about Lowry then as you are about Bledsoe now.

I have to hand it to you, that's an impressive commitment to this argument to dig for a post of mine from 5 years ago I was clearly wrong on Lowry then, but if you wanted the organization to roll with Bledsoe after 3 straight playoff flameouts going into Giannis' contract year (prior to the extension), then we're just too far apart on this.

[DingleJerry]

Big difference between Lowry and Bled though is that Lowry was a good shooter. He just needed to right his head which came with experience in the playoffs. Bledsoe isn't a good shooter to begin with, so even if he does get over his nerves he still isn't that great of a playoff player due to not being a good shooter. Lowry's normal game is made for the playoffs, he just had to actually bring it.

[jute2003]

I think if Bledsoe gets in a good situation for his skillset, he is going to break through and have some good playoff series. I hope he does. He was a good dude here and played his ass off.

The Bucks were in a position where it made more sense to try something else but he was definitely my favorite non-Giannis player to watch.

[rilamann]

I said it last season in my prediction for the Bucks and I will say it again, I would never take a team that plays Eric Bledsoe 30+ minutes a night seriously as far as winning a championship. Good dude off the court, but glad as hell he's gone. Every season if he remained on the Bucks would have been a wasted season for Giannis.

Last season even when the Bucks were at their absolute peak, the whole time I was thinking in the back of my head We ain't winning **** when it matters as long as Bledsoe is on the roster. Yeah, he would look like a legit all-star on a random night in January against a 25 win team, but he wanted no part of the big stage.

We beat Boston in 2018 and we beat Toronto in 2019 if Bledsoe just simply doesn't play. And anyone who disputes that, I would question if you actually watched those series.

To not only get rid of Bledsoe, but to get rid of him in return for Holiday was huge.

[ShootingtheJ]

Bledsoe couldn't even be trusted in regular season crunch time. He only played 28 minutes a game because Hill was the better option all too often. Why are we still talking about him?

[MVP2110]

Yep. Jrue & Bledsoe are similar but also quite different. But what I think the main goal is is to be able to get Good Bledsoe production in the playoffs instead of Bad Bledsoe production

[JayMKE]

I hope Jrue can succeed where Bledsoe failed, we’re paying a premium for clutchness.

[DrWood]

I said it last season in my prediction for the Bucks and I will say it again, I would never take a team that plays Eric Bledsoe 30+ minutes a night seriously as far as winning a championship. .

I guess it's a good thing he only played 27 minutes a game for us last year.

[DrWood]

The biggest advantage Jrue has over Bledsoe is he can defend taller players. We'll see how much we take advantage of that.
Everything else is just wishful thinking.

[LUKE23]

The biggest advantage Jrue has over Bledsoe is he can defend taller players. We'll see how much we take advantage of that.
Everything else is just wishful thinking.

Holiday isn't a great shooter, but he's a better shooter than Bled, especially on catch and shoot and corner 3's. The gap in their playoff three point percentage is absolute huge as well.

[tedbrogen]

Do people feel Jrue is better in a full switch situation than Bledsoe?

It seemed to me a lot of Bledsoe's value on defense was being able to fight over screens so they could keep using the drop zone. He seemed to get exposed at times when they went full switch because he would get posted up inside and it lead to easy scores or him fouling in the post. To me he doesn't seem to be a great post defender on anyone taller than him.

Jrue has a few inches on Bledsoe and seems to not get destroyed in the post on switches.

Wondering what everyone else thinks.

He guarded Butler multiple times in the post and did a great job from what I saw. He might literally be the strongest guy at his height in NBA history and he has like a 6'8" wingspan. The Bucks should have switched more. The real issue with not playing the defense that would have been best for them was Brook, not Bledsoe. I know they had great regular season defense, but when you advance in the playoffs and face teams who can put 4 or 5 shooters on the floor, the defense was exploited like clockwork.

Jrue is better at switching though, and if that's what it takes to grow out of the damn dinosaur drop defense and dinosaur plodder Brook, I'm all for it.

They did go full switch against the Magic for small stretches when Vuc was destroying them on open threes. I seem to remember that while the Magic guards could get pull up jumpers off against Brook, that wasn't the biggest issue when they were switching, it was that Vuc was taking Bledsoe and Wes into the post and took them to school. I remember similar issues against the Heat with Bam taking the guards into the low post on switches. Not saying a team with better guards/wings wouldn't go at Brook more, but it definitely didn't help that Bledsoe was also best suited for a defense that didn't switch. Similarly, Wes was also not best suited for a switching defense because he was good at guarding one specific type of player.

Jrue, Craig, DDV, Pat, Wilson, Midds, and Giannis are all very switchable defensively. Brook and DJA are not. Portis should be able to but has a pretty bad rep defensively. And Forbes can't guard anybody so if teams want to waste time trying to get him into different matchups, they are just burning shot clock.

[coolhandluke121]

They did go full switch against the Magic for small stretches when Vuc was destroying them on open threes. I seem to remember that while the Magic guards could get pull up jumpers off against Brook, that wasn't the biggest issue when they were switching, it was that Vuc was taking Bledsoe and Wes into the post and took them to school. I remember similar issues against the Heat with Bam taking the guards into the low post on switches. Not saying a team with better guards/wings wouldn't go at Brook more, but it definitely didn't help that Bledsoe was also best suited for a defense that didn't switch. Similarly, Wes was also not best suited for a switching defense because he was good at guarding one specific type of player.

Jrue, Craig, DDV, Pat, Wilson, Midds, and Giannis are all very switchable defensively. Brook and DJA are not. Portis should be able to but has a pretty bad rep defensively. And Forbes can't guard anybody so if teams want to waste time trying to get him into different matchups, they are just burning shot clock.

I honestly don't remember those stretches but if having a PG who can guard Vucevic is a prerequisite for a switching defense, then hardly any team in the league should even be considering it. I remember a whole lot of Vucevic eating the Slowpez brothers for lunch though. Honestly they were so slow that they couldn't even guard him in the post, let alone out on the perimeter, where it was a shooting drill for him. I remember trying Marvin on Vucevic a lot, but he was only marginally better, if at all.

Portis is an awful defender but he's another guy who you just play in the drop defense like Brook to mitigate the damage. Just park it in the paint and be big and tall. So we're stuck with the drop defense again unless DJW emerges. Just pray the Bucks shoot their 3's a little better and their opponents struggle a little more in the playoffs I guess.

[LuessiT]

They did go full switch against the Magic for small stretches when Vuc was destroying them on open threes. I seem to remember that while the Magic guards could get pull up jumpers off against Brook, that wasn't the biggest issue when they were switching, it was that Vuc was taking Bledsoe and Wes into the post and took them to school. I remember similar issues against the Heat with Bam taking the guards into the low post on switches. Not saying a team with better guards/wings wouldn't go at Brook more, but it definitely didn't help that Bledsoe was also best suited for a defense that didn't switch. Similarly, Wes was also not best suited for a switching defense because he was good at guarding one specific type of player.

Jrue, Craig, DDV, Pat, Wilson, Midds, and Giannis are all very switchable defensively. Brook and DJA are not. Portis should be able to but has a pretty bad rep defensively. And Forbes can't guard anybody so if teams want to waste time trying to get him into different matchups, they are just burning shot clock.

I honestly don't remember those stretches but if having a PG who can guard Vucevic is a prerequisite for a switching defense, then hardly any team in the league should even be considering it. I remember a whole lot of Vucevic eating the Slowpez brothers for lunch though. Honestly they were so slow that they couldn't even guard him in the post, let alone out on the perimeter, where it was a shooting drill for him. I remember trying Marvin on Vucevic a lot, but he was only marginally better, if at all.

Portis is an awful defender but he's another guy who you just play in the drop defense like Brook to mitigate the damage. Just park it in the paint and be big and tall. So we're stuck with the drop defense again unless DJW emerges. Just pray the Bucks shoot their 3's a little better and their opponents struggle a little more in the playoffs I guess.

I mean there's a misconception about switching. Yes, if you switch a lot the opposing team will eventually be able to get the matchups they want but they need to run the necessary action. You'll be deep into the shot clock and won't have to defend many different moves and counters. So yes, your 1 may have to guard some 5's in the post but the shot clock will be at 7 and the double team is coming if they're even capable of feeding the post.
Also not every team is capable of running the play action to force the matchups they want. E.g. very few teams can run 4/5 PnRs.