Official Speculation Thread '20-'21 VI: "I like this team"

[basketballRob]

A player like Killian Hayes wouldn't play for a couple years if Clifford was the coach. Detroit is going to keep playing him and he'll keep getting better.

Bamba should be playing 15-20 mpg.

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[KillMonger]

yeah, i think i seen something on twitter saying that bamba has to win his spot back from birch.....i was like.....wha....huh? if bamba is back and ready to play birch would be in a 3 piece suit tomorrow if it was up to me....shouldn't have to win anything from birch, he isn't really doing anything

[pepe1991]

A player like Killian Hayes wouldn't play for a couple years if Clifford was the coach. Detroit is going to keep playing him and he'll keep getting better.

Bamba should be playing 15-20 mpg.

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He keeps playing Cole who is as bad.
Bamba is third year player, grace period of getting PT because of draft stock is over. Sink or swim.

[thelead]

A player like Killian Hayes wouldn't play for a couple years if Clifford was the coach. Detroit is going to keep playing him and he'll keep getting better.

Bamba should be playing 15-20 mpg.

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He keeps playing Cole who is as bad.
Bamba is third year player, grace period of getting PT because of draft stock is over. Sink or swim.

He has no other option but to play Cole. Killian would be benched for Rose if Cliff was the coach. 100%.

[pepe1991]

A player like Killian Hayes wouldn't play for a couple years if Clifford was the coach. Detroit is going to keep playing him and he'll keep getting better.

Bamba should be playing 15-20 mpg.

Sent from my SM-G950U using RealGM mobile app

He keeps playing Cole who is as bad.
Bamba is third year player, grace period of getting PT because of draft stock is over. Sink or swim.

He has no other option but to play Cole. Killian would be benched for Rose if Cliff was the coach. 100%.

Witch kind a tells you that front office set us to fail, with rookie PG being backup.

Killian should be bench player tho, he is 19 and raw as hell.

Also i don't get fascination with "starting" . Averaging 22 mpg, off bench or as starter is basically same.

[KillMonger]

Anybody read this article? https://www.cbssports.com/nba/news/the-orlando-magic-are-defying-all-logic-and-reason-with-their-shot-selection/



i like this blurb

The actual solution to this would be better personnel, but until the Magic can find it, a commitment to taking a reasonable amount of 3-pointers even with the knowledge that they wouldn't make many of them would at least force defenders to take the threat seriously. Yet even when the Magic try to take 3-pointers, they instinctively find ways to avoid doing so. Two different Orlando players stepped on the line unnecessarily while trying to take 3's in the same game against the Wizards.

and this one

But accountability has to factor into the equation at some point. There is a line between being behind the times and ignoring them altogether, and the Orlando Magic haven't just crossed it, they're drawing a new line somewhere in the neighborhood of intentional defiance.

now i know if we had better shooters it might be different but i've been saying it for a while now clifford has this team playing like it's the 90's i've literally said those words verbatim in the past year or so....i wish we ran a motion offense or just something modern

[thelead]

He keeps playing Cole who is as bad.
Bamba is third year player, grace period of getting PT because of draft stock is over. Sink or swim.

He has no other option but to play Cole. Killian would be benched for Rose if Cliff was the coach. 100%.

Witch kind a tells you that front office set us to fail, with rookie PG being backup.

Killian should be bench player tho, he is 19 and raw as hell.

Also i don't get fascination with "starting" . Averaging 22 mpg, off bench or as starter is basically same.

Yeah but playing time is important. Clifford would bury Killian if he could. I can only imagine how Clifford would have handled Trae the first half of his rookie season.

Starting is important when playing for a terrible team though. Especially for point guards. Nothing sets a young pg up for failure like playing them with g league players while getting crushed by the opponent.

[MartinsIzAfraud]

Anybody read this article? https://www.cbssports.com/nba/news/the-orlando-magic-are-defying-all-logic-and-reason-with-their-shot-selection/



i like this blurb

The actual solution to this would be better personnel, but until the Magic can find it, a commitment to taking a reasonable amount of 3-pointers even with the knowledge that they wouldn't make many of them would at least force defenders to take the threat seriously. Yet even when the Magic try to take 3-pointers, they instinctively find ways to avoid doing so. Two different Orlando players stepped on the line unnecessarily while trying to take 3's in the same game against the Wizards.

and this one

But accountability has to factor into the equation at some point. There is a line between being behind the times and ignoring them altogether, and the Orlando Magic haven't just crossed it, they're drawing a new line somewhere in the neighborhood of intentional defiance.

now i know if we had better shooters it might be different but i've been saying it for a while now clifford has this team playing like it's the 90's i've literally said those words verbatim in the past year or so....i wish we ran a motion offense or just something modern

yet the FO & Ownership group are thrilled being 8th 9th seed and saying but VUC is an allstar and we're making progress

[VFX]

Anybody read this article? https://www.cbssports.com/nba/news/the-orlando-magic-are-defying-all-logic-and-reason-with-their-shot-selection/



i like this blurb

The actual solution to this would be better personnel, but until the Magic can find it, a commitment to taking a reasonable amount of 3-pointers even with the knowledge that they wouldn't make many of them would at least force defenders to take the threat seriously. Yet even when the Magic try to take 3-pointers, they instinctively find ways to avoid doing so. Two different Orlando players stepped on the line unnecessarily while trying to take 3's in the same game against the Wizards.

and this one

But accountability has to factor into the equation at some point. There is a line between being behind the times and ignoring them altogether, and the Orlando Magic haven't just crossed it, they're drawing a new line somewhere in the neighborhood of intentional defiance.

now i know if we had better shooters it might be different but i've been saying it for a while now clifford has this team playing like it's the 90's i've literally said those words verbatim in the past year or so....i wish we ran a motion offense or just something modern

Posters here have been saying this for years.

This is specifically why most rational people are critical of this FO and their inability to construct a coherent roster in 2021. It’s also why a lot of us weren’t happy with the Clifford hire.

[dsg2021]

Anybody read this article? https://www.cbssports.com/nba/news/the-orlando-magic-are-defying-all-logic-and-reason-with-their-shot-selection/



i like this blurb

The actual solution to this would be better personnel, but until the Magic can find it, a commitment to taking a reasonable amount of 3-pointers even with the knowledge that they wouldn't make many of them would at least force defenders to take the threat seriously. Yet even when the Magic try to take 3-pointers, they instinctively find ways to avoid doing so. Two different Orlando players stepped on the line unnecessarily while trying to take 3's in the same game against the Wizards.

and this one

But accountability has to factor into the equation at some point. There is a line between being behind the times and ignoring them altogether, and the Orlando Magic haven't just crossed it, they're drawing a new line somewhere in the neighborhood of intentional defiance.

now i know if we had better shooters it might be different but i've been saying it for a while now clifford has this team playing like it's the 90's i've literally said those words verbatim in the past year or so....i wish we ran a motion offense or just something modern

I don’t think it’s an archaic offense, not when the offensive team numbers are doing well, and the record is still good. It’s actually been a really big breath of fresh air to not have an offense that doesn’t pass around at the top of the key for 20 of 24 seconds, looking for a terrible 3 point shot. And it’s our players sticking to their strengths and hot spots, where they can gain confidence. The biggest issue is the man Bacon himself. This dude has the length and skillset to do it all, and he’s only a few % points away from blowing up a little. But he needs some of the offense, and when he ends those possessions at his current %’s..

I love his soft touch, but I’ve never seen a player more in need of missed shot analysis than Bacon. It seems most of them are coming up a tiny bit too short.

[basketballRob]

A player like Killian Hayes wouldn't play for a couple years if Clifford was the coach. Detroit is going to keep playing him and he'll keep getting better.

Bamba should be playing 15-20 mpg.

Sent from my SM-G950U using RealGM mobile app

He keeps playing Cole who is as bad.
Bamba is third year player, grace period of getting PT because of draft stock is over. Sink or swim.

He outplayed Birch last season.

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[basketballRob]

He keeps playing Cole who is as bad.
Bamba is third year player, grace period of getting PT because of draft stock is over. Sink or swim.

He has no other option but to play Cole. Killian would be benched for Rose if Cliff was the coach. 100%.

Witch kind a tells you that front office set us to fail, with rookie PG being backup.

Killian should be bench player tho, he is 19 and raw as hell.

Also i don't get fascination with "starting" . Averaging 22 mpg, off bench or as starter is basically same.

They'd get better by playing. I remember Garland being one of the worst Pg's in the league last season and now he's a top contender for MIP.

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[basketballRob]

He has no other option but to play Cole. Killian would be benched for Rose if Cliff was the coach. 100%.

Witch kind a tells you that front office set us to fail, with rookie PG being backup.

Killian should be bench player tho, he is 19 and raw as hell.

Also i don't get fascination with "starting" . Averaging 22 mpg, off bench or as starter is basically same.

Yeah but playing time is important. Clifford would bury Killian if he could. I can only imagine how Clifford would have handled Trae the first half of his rookie season.

Starting is important when playing for a terrible team though. Especially for point guards. Nothing sets a young pg up for failure like playing them with g league players while getting crushed by the opponent.

Clifford says the first couple years are the most important to make them earn playing time. I think Clifford mind screws them. They are petrified to make a mistake, they get yanked for every little mistake. Sure Fultz has played, but would he have been better with a coach that ran plays for him? Last year it was so obvious Fultz should've handled the ball down the stretch of games, instead they'd do the opposite.

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[pepe1991]

Anybody read this article? https://www.cbssports.com/nba/news/the-orlando-magic-are-defying-all-logic-and-reason-with-their-shot-selection/



i like this blurb

The actual solution to this would be better personnel, but until the Magic can find it, a commitment to taking a reasonable amount of 3-pointers even with the knowledge that they wouldn't make many of them would at least force defenders to take the threat seriously. Yet even when the Magic try to take 3-pointers, they instinctively find ways to avoid doing so. Two different Orlando players stepped on the line unnecessarily while trying to take 3's in the same game against the Wizards.

and this one

But accountability has to factor into the equation at some point. There is a line between being behind the times and ignoring them altogether, and the Orlando Magic haven't just crossed it, they're drawing a new line somewhere in the neighborhood of intentional defiance.

now i know if we had better shooters it might be different but i've been saying it for a while now clifford has this team playing like it's the 90's i've literally said those words verbatim in the past year or so....i wish we ran a motion offense or just something modern

Posters here have been saying this for years.

This is specifically why most rational people are critical of this FO and their inability to construct a coherent roster in 2021. It’s also why a lot of us weren’t happy with the Clifford hire.

I think some of us repeated things like that 5000000 times. You can't have modern basketball team with 2 funcional shooters in it. You simply can't.

[VFX]

Anybody read this article? https://www.cbssports.com/nba/news/the-orlando-magic-are-defying-all-logic-and-reason-with-their-shot-selection/



i like this blurb

The actual solution to this would be better personnel, but until the Magic can find it, a commitment to taking a reasonable amount of 3-pointers even with the knowledge that they wouldn't make many of them would at least force defenders to take the threat seriously. Yet even when the Magic try to take 3-pointers, they instinctively find ways to avoid doing so. Two different Orlando players stepped on the line unnecessarily while trying to take 3's in the same game against the Wizards.

and this one

But accountability has to factor into the equation at some point. There is a line between being behind the times and ignoring them altogether, and the Orlando Magic haven't just crossed it, they're drawing a new line somewhere in the neighborhood of intentional defiance.

now i know if we had better shooters it might be different but i've been saying it for a while now clifford has this team playing like it's the 90's i've literally said those words verbatim in the past year or so....i wish we ran a motion offense or just something modern

I don’t think it’s an archaic offense, not when the offensive team numbers are doing well, and the record is still good. It’s actually been a really big breath of fresh air to not have an offense that doesn’t pass around at the top of the key for 20 of 24 seconds, looking for a terrible 3 point shot. And it’s our players sticking to their strengths and hot spots, where they can gain confidence. The biggest issue is the man Bacon himself. This dude has the length and skillset to do it all, and he’s only a few % points away from blowing up a little. But he needs some of the offense, and when he ends those possessions at his current %’s..

I love his soft touch, but I’ve never seen a player more in need of missed shot analysis than Bacon. It seems most of them are coming up a tiny bit too short.

It’s archaic in the aspect that they’ve chosen to perpetuate an offense, through a Center, that hasn’t really stretched the floor until late last season. That isn’t a slight to Vuc.

The FO knew full well Orlando has been fluctuating in the bottom rankings offensively, even before the FO or Clifford was hired. Instead of searching for answers, they’ve now done this through multiple contracts and resigning the same core. Clifford merely perpetuated the offense with what he had.

Sure, the players “played to their strengths”. Why wouldn’t they? It’s less about the players, and their capabilities, and more about building a roster that makes sense.

[pepe1991]

Witch kind a tells you that front office set us to fail, with rookie PG being backup.

Killian should be bench player tho, he is 19 and raw as hell.

Also i don't get fascination with "starting" . Averaging 22 mpg, off bench or as starter is basically same.

Yeah but playing time is important. Clifford would bury Killian if he could. I can only imagine how Clifford would have handled Trae the first half of his rookie season.

Starting is important when playing for a terrible team though. Especially for point guards. Nothing sets a young pg up for failure like playing them with g league players while getting crushed by the opponent.

Clifford says the first couple years are the most important to make them earn playing time. I think Clifford mind screws them. They are petrified to make a mistake, they get yanked for every little mistake. Sure Fultz has played, but would he have been better with a coach that ran plays for him? Last year it was so obvious Fultz should've handled the ball down the stretch of games, instead they'd do the opposite.

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You had nice writeup about the coach. But his name is not Steve Clifford but Tom Thibodeau.
Fultz lead all Magic players in usage rate, Cole is second in usage off bench.

So everything you said is simply false, but whatever.

[basketballRob]

Yeah but playing time is important. Clifford would bury Killian if he could. I can only imagine how Clifford would have handled Trae the first half of his rookie season.

Starting is important when playing for a terrible team though. Especially for point guards. Nothing sets a young pg up for failure like playing them with g league players while getting crushed by the opponent.

Clifford says the first couple years are the most important to make them earn playing time. I think Clifford mind screws them. They are petrified to make a mistake, they get yanked for every little mistake. Sure Fultz has played, but would he have been better with a coach that ran plays for him? Last year it was so obvious Fultz should've handled the ball down the stretch of games, instead they'd do the opposite.

Sent from my SM-G950U using RealGM mobile app

You had nice writeup about the coach. But his name is not Steve Clifford but Tom Thibodeau.
Fultz lead all Magic players in usage rate, Cole is second in usage off bench.

So everything you said is simply false, but whatever.

Thru 6 games, he'll probably find a way to bench Cole soon.

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[pepe1991]

Clifford says the first couple years are the most important to make them earn playing time. I think Clifford mind screws them. They are petrified to make a mistake, they get yanked for every little mistake. Sure Fultz has played, but would he have been better with a coach that ran plays for him? Last year it was so obvious Fultz should've handled the ball down the stretch of games, instead they'd do the opposite.

Sent from my SM-G950U using RealGM mobile app

You had nice writeup about the coach. But his name is not Steve Clifford but Tom Thibodeau.
Fultz lead all Magic players in usage rate, Cole is second in usage off bench.

So everything you said is simply false, but whatever.

Thru 6 games, he'll probably find a way to bench Cole soon.

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He is already on bench

[pepe1991]

Irrelevant topic, but did you guys notice how in-face dunks completely dissapeared from basketball?

I guess nobody plays hard enough defense to even challenge dunk at rim.

[MagicFan101]

He has no other option but to play Cole. Killian would be benched for Rose if Cliff was the coach. 100%.

Witch kind a tells you that front office set us to fail, with rookie PG being backup.

Killian should be bench player tho, he is 19 and raw as hell.

Also i don't get fascination with "starting" . Averaging 22 mpg, off bench or as starter is basically same.

They'd get better by playing. I remember Garland being one of the worst Pg's in the league last season and now he's a top contender for MIP.

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You build chemistry quicker by playing with the first team unit you hope to have a future with.

You also improve by playing against better competition in having the majority of your minutes stacked against opposing starters.

Not all minutes are created equal.


Obviously a lot of great development can be done for a player in practice / weight training / nutrition and such. Backup minutes can also mix in rotations with / against starters. So not all is lost. Bamba is being wasted. Cole is seeing a lot of valuable playing time in mixed roles.