2020-2021 College/Draft thread 1

[Fat]

Bj Boston my man bj Boston!!!!!!

Boston went from Brandon Ingram lite to kelly oubre

people forget Ingram was pretty unimpressive for a couple years

36.0 percent and 5-of-33 from three with 17 turnovers to 10 assists.

Type of unimpressive? Boston looks like he should stay another year

[cgf]

well yeah, but he's one of the main reasons why they have such good spacing and ball movement. it would be cool if we had that here

They're all one of the main reasons for that though

It's why I'm not as high on Suggs yet as some folks, though with him I'm less worried about him disappointing in the longrun...as I love his tools & attitude...and moreso skeptical about how "ready" he'll be in a less ideal setting.

I can see that skepticism with Suggs as playing on that team is all we've ever known of him at the college level and it certainly helps him look better by spacing the floor out for his drives and giving him many open looks

Kispert has been playing college ball for 4 years, the prior teams haven't been this dominant yet his career percentages are still through the roof at 40.7% from 3 on a large sample size of 516 attempts and now also backed up by him shooting 88% from the line which is usually a good indicator he's just a pure shooter and not a fluke on a limited sample size. Now this year he is shooting an insane 50.8% from 3 on 6.1 attempts a game.

Now some of that for sure is helped by the ball movement and spacing, but if you look at the distance on some of his highlights it's clear he is a deadeye shooter with unlimited range. A couple of these were nearly from the logo at center court. The rest of what he does might not be as effective at the higher level but I'm definitely buying the shot. Don't think he will be a superstar in the league but could definitely contribute to a winning team and provide help to a team desperate for shooters

Watch on YouTube

They haven't been dominant like this before, but they've been very well-coached & spaced throughout his tenure which has made it easier for him on offense and covered him up defensively.

Where Kentucky has made their players look worse for the past 5+ years, Gonzaga has consistently been making theirs look better as they have consistently been more than the sum of their parts...now just like with Bridges out of Villanova, that doesn't mean there aren't really good NBA talents there, but it is something to think about when trying to assess any of their players in isolation.

...I'm just not sure if he's a starter at the next level or only a 15-20 mpg gunner; like a rich man's Novak

Not saying a rich man's Novak wouldn't be nice to have right now, just that I think there are more interesting talents that will probably be available at our picks.

[NoDopeOnSundays]

I'm kinda thinking we should target kispert, it's clear the major weakness we have is still shooting, especially bigs. I think he's proven his ability in his department and a large sample size to back it up

I disagree, last night is an example of why I want another shot creator who can potentially hit threes. The Hawks were having success hiding Young on Bullock, when we had the lineup with Rivers out there they had no place to hide him and their defense fell apart. Whoever we draft needs to be able to create, you want multiple ball handlers so that teams that love to switch cannot hide their worst defender on a shooter.

[HEZI]

I'm kinda thinking we should target kispert, it's clear the major weakness we have is still shooting, especially bigs. I think he's proven his ability in his department and a large sample size to back it up

I disagree, last night is an example of why I want another shot creator who can potentially hit threes. The Hawks were having success hiding Young on Bullock, when we had the lineup with Rivers out there they had no place to hide him and their defense fell apart. Whoever we draft needs to be able to create, you want multiple ball handlers so that teams that love to switch cannot hide their worst defender on a shooter.

Kispert is not just a stand still shooter. He moves, he cuts and he can even put the ball on the floor at times. He's not somebody you just plant in the corner, he's really good playing off the ball and defenders have to chase him around all game. If you got players that can find him on the cut or on the curl then he can be really effective.

[robillionaire]

I'm really thinking 20-30 range with the Kispert idea, seeing as how one or more of our 2 picks will probably be there. I'm not even entertaining the idea of picking at the top of the draft anymore

[DowNY]

I'm really thinking 20-30 range with the Kispert idea, seeing as how one or more of our 2 picks will probably be there. I'm not even entertaining the idea of picking at the top of the draft anymore

Can’t blame you. Depending on how we look by the deadline, we might be buyers & might only have 1 1st rd pick anyway.
I think we still might trade up with additional draft capital regardless though. If not, BJ Boston might be in the way

[2010]

Y'all tripping doubting Kispert. He is not some dynamic off the dribble shot creator but he is a shot creator by default due to the spacing he provides. He makes others better just by being on the court. Which is why Suggs has a way easier time doing what he wants to do as opposed to Cunningham. Additionally, Kispert is a good passer, off ball screen runner, and backdoor cutter as well.

Every pick does not have to be a swing for the fences. Go up there slugging with 2-strikes and you often get K'd. Sometimes you gotta shorten up your stroke, go with the pitch, and hit it the other way for a double. Kispert would be a very nice pick for us.

If we continue to be good and the Mavs make the playoffs as well, we may end up with two picks nearly back-to-back in the mid-to-late teens. If that were the case, I'd be ecstatic to walk away with Kispert and one of the following who falls (Ziaire, Moody, Boston, or Clarke).

Then if you stand pat and make your 2nd round picks you go from a crop of guys like Ayo Dosunmu, David Johnson, Scottie Lewis, Landers Nolley II, Jeremiah Robinson-Earl, Sandro Mamukelashvili, etc.

We are sitting pretty no matter how our season goes. Loads of options. Even if our pick or the Mavs pick doesn't land in the lottery, it really doesn't matter. Just make sure you hit on your picks and keep building the culture.

[robillionaire]

Y'all tripping doubting Kispert. He is not some dynamic off the dribble shot creator but he is a shot creator by default due to the spacing he provides. He makes others better just by being on the court. Which is why Suggs has a way easier time doing what he wants to do as opposed to Cunningham. Additionally, Kispert is a good passer, off ball screen runner, and backdoor cutter as well.

Every pick does not have to be a swing for the fences. Go up there slugging with 2-strikes and you often get K'd. Sometimes you gotta shorten up your stroke, go with the pitch, and hit it the other way for a double. Kispert would be a very nice pick for us.

If we continue to be good and the Mavs make the playoffs as well, we may end up with two picks nearly back-to-back in the mid-to-late teens. If that were the case, I'd be ecstatic to walk away with Kispert and one of the following who falls (Ziaire, Moody, Boston, or Clarke).

Then if you stand pat and make your 2nd round picks you go from a crop of guys like Ayo Dosunmu, David Johnson, Scottie Lewis, Landers Nolley II, Jeremiah Robinson-Earl, Sandro Mamukelashvili, etc.

We are sitting pretty no matter how our season goes. Loads of options. Even if our pick or the Mavs pick doesn't land in the lottery, it really doesn't matter. Just make sure you hit on your picks and keep building the culture.

feeling the same way about it. good post. trust the scouts

[stuporman]

That Ayo kid from Illinois looks pretty nice for a 6-5 PG and might be there later in the 1st round to snag with whichever of the two the Knicks have is the lesser.

He's probably being overlooked because he's a Junior but that kid has all the skills you want, handle, shooting, passing, defense, BBIQ, vision, crafty and very long.

Maybe he lasts to the early 2nd round and the Knicks can snag him there but I wouldn't be surprised if he has a strong tourney and is a riser.

Ayo's one I'm not sure what to make of yet. Just can't tell if he'll be able to cut it as an on ball guy in the NBA or if his shooting has come far enough for him to thrive off-ball if he proves not to be quick/crafty enough to be a lead guard.

If he answers both of those concerns he'll be a very interesting prospect. if not he starts to look like a longer Elfrid Payton...I'm exaggerating, of course, but I am worried that he could have similar problems at the next level...

If you are comparing him to Elf I have to wonder why because they aren't really that comparable. Every season he's improved his FG%, FT% and TS% so not really sure where this issue about his shooting is based. Maybe there was a little as a freshman but he's improved dramatically since then.


He's even shooting 42% 3pts on 3.6apg this season and does so both catch & shoot and off the dribble also getting to the line almost 6apg. Plus, I'm talking about taking him with a late first rounder or possibly an early 2nd so this isn't a lottery pick and a little bit of risk is inherent in the prospect.

[cgf]

That Ayo kid from Illinois looks pretty nice for a 6-5 PG and might be there later in the 1st round to snag with whichever of the two the Knicks have is the lesser.

He's probably being overlooked because he's a Junior but that kid has all the skills you want, handle, shooting, passing, defense, BBIQ, vision, crafty and very long.

Maybe he lasts to the early 2nd round and the Knicks can snag him there but I wouldn't be surprised if he has a strong tourney and is a riser.

Ayo's one I'm not sure what to make of yet. Just can't tell if he'll be able to cut it as an on ball guy in the NBA or if his shooting has come far enough for him to thrive off-ball if he proves not to be quick/crafty enough to be a lead guard.

If he answers both of those concerns he'll be a very interesting prospect. if not he starts to look like a longer Elfrid Payton...I'm exaggerating, of course, but I am worried that he could have similar problems at the next level...

If you are comparing him to Elf I have to wonder why because they aren't really that comparable. Every season he's improved his FG%, FT% and TS% so not really sure where this issue about his shooting is based. Maybe a little as a freshman but he's improved dramatically since then.


He's even shooting 42% from 3 on 3.6apg this season both catch & shoot and off the dribble also getting to the line almost 6apg. Plus, I'm talking about taking him with a late first rounder or possibly an early 2nd so this isn't a lottery pick and a little bit of risk is inherent in the prospect.

Ayo's continued improvement is what makes him interesting, but the worry with him is about how he'll contribute if he proves not to be crafty or quick enough to run an NBA offense.

A problem that we are seeing (in the extreme) with Elf.

[stuporman]

Ayo's one I'm not sure what to make of yet. Just can't tell if he'll be able to cut it as an on ball guy in the NBA or if his shooting has come far enough for him to thrive off-ball if he proves not to be quick/crafty enough to be a lead guard.

If he answers both of those concerns he'll be a very interesting prospect. if not he starts to look like a longer Elfrid Payton...I'm exaggerating, of course, but I am worried that he could have similar problems at the next level...

If you are comparing him to Elf I have to wonder why because they aren't really that comparable. Every season he's improved his FG%, FT% and TS% so not really sure where this issue about his shooting is based. Maybe a little as a freshman but he's improved dramatically since then.


He's even shooting 42% from 3 on 3.6apg this season both catch & shoot and off the dribble also getting to the line almost 6apg. Plus, I'm talking about taking him with a late first rounder or possibly an early 2nd so this isn't a lottery pick and a little bit of risk is inherent in the prospect.

Ayo's continued improvement is what makes him interesting, but the worry with him is about how he'll contribute if he proves not to be crafty or quick enough to run an NBA offense.

A problem that we are seeing (in the extreme) with Elf.

He doesn't need to run an NBA offense.... he's 6-5 and the Knicks now have IQ along with Randle and RJ that can also facilitate. He'd be someone who can play the 2 while being an above average passer and shooter at that spot yet also has the handle and craftiness to do some play making.

[Fat]

If you are comparing him to Elf I have to wonder why because they aren't really that comparable. Every season he's improved his FG%, FT% and TS% so not really sure where this issue about his shooting is based. Maybe a little as a freshman but he's improved dramatically since then.


He's even shooting 42% from 3 on 3.6apg this season both catch & shoot and off the dribble also getting to the line almost 6apg. Plus, I'm talking about taking him with a late first rounder or possibly an early 2nd so this isn't a lottery pick and a little bit of risk is inherent in the prospect.

Ayo's continued improvement is what makes him interesting, but the worry with him is about how he'll contribute if he proves not to be crafty or quick enough to run an NBA offense.

A problem that we are seeing (in the extreme) with Elf.

He doesn't need to run an NBA offense.... he's 6-5 and the Knicks now have IQ along with Randle and RJ that can also facilitate. He'd be someone who can play the 2 while being an above average passer and shooter at that spot yet also has the handle and craftiness to do some play making.

randle part of the future now?

[stuporman]

Ayo's continued improvement is what makes him interesting, but the worry with him is about how he'll contribute if he proves not to be crafty or quick enough to run an NBA offense.

A problem that we are seeing (in the extreme) with Elf.

He doesn't need to run an NBA offense.... he's 6-5 and the Knicks now have IQ along with Randle and RJ that can also facilitate. He'd be someone who can play the 2 while being an above average passer and shooter at that spot yet also has the handle and craftiness to do some play making.

randle part of the future now?

Well, if this is the way he's going to play all season I suspect they will pick up his option because he's playing way above his contract value so far under Thibs. This means there would be at least one season of overlap if this is the scenario that would play out but who knows if Randle is going to stick around after that.

[WargamesX]

I'm really thinking 20-30 range with the Kispert idea, seeing as how one or more of our 2 picks will probably be there. I'm not even entertaining the idea of picking at the top of the draft anymore

You sound like a quitter.

If the league can gift us just a star talent I think the Knicks could win a championship in time. I don’t know if it’s our pick, the Mavs pick, or something else but you got to keep hope alive.

Regular season is one thing, playoffs are another. Also we are literally in the toughest division in the league. Not a bad team in the division if the Raptors wake up. Also if they are bad they sure woke up and beat us...... Ya’ll need to have a little more patience.

[RHODEY]

Ayo's continued improvement is what makes him interesting, but the worry with him is about how he'll contribute if he proves not to be crafty or quick enough to run an NBA offense.

A problem that we are seeing (in the extreme) with Elf.

He doesn't need to run an NBA offense.... he's 6-5 and the Knicks now have IQ along with Randle and RJ that can also facilitate. He'd be someone who can play the 2 while being an above average passer and shooter at that spot yet also has the handle and craftiness to do some play making.

randle part of the future now?

Playing the way he is now...why not?

[WargamesX]

He doesn't need to run an NBA offense.... he's 6-5 and the Knicks now have IQ along with Randle and RJ that can also facilitate. He'd be someone who can play the 2 while being an above average passer and shooter at that spot yet also has the handle and craftiness to do some play making.

randle part of the future now?

Playing the way he is now...why not?

It’s been 7 games. Let’s get to 30 games

[RHODEY]

randle part of the future now?

Playing the way he is now...why not?

It’s been 7 games. Let’s get to 30 games

That goes without saying...but basically if his play is real and sustainable then ...why not?

Barring some amazing trade were we'd get even more value , he''d probably be more valuable to us. Dude is doling out assists like candy.

[newyorker4ever]

Can someone explain to me why some sites list Springer as a PG/SG & Johnson as just a SG? Keon shows way more PG potential than Springer.

He's gonna be the CF for the New York Mets soon....fingers crossed.

[newyorker4ever]

From trading Morris we got Quickley and probably a pick in the early 30s from Detroit in the upcoming draft. That’s a nice haul. Might even wind up being better than what we get from KP with the 2021 and 2023 mavs picks. DSJ already amounted to nothing

Neither Morris or KP have played in a game this year with knee injuries

KP is still a star that the star needed Knicks traded away and they absolutely have to make something out of that trade and those two picks is all we have left to even make it close to being a good trade. As of right now i sure do wish we had KP playing on this Knicks team, even with his injury history cause when he's healthy he's a beast.

[stuporman]

randle part of the future now?

Playing the way he is now...why not?

It’s been 7 games. Let’s get to 30 games

The premise of the comment used as a basis for this exchange is 'if he plays this way the rest of the season' which you conveniently ignored but alas I'm here to remind you of the point.