Moderators: LyricalRico, nate33, montestewart
NatP4 wrote:I’m not sure you trade a 27 year old superstar that has been nothing but loyal to the franchise, and for the most part, always played hard and played the right way and was a great leader on and off the court.
nate33 wrote:payitforward wrote:1. They failed to take a R1 pick for Davis Bertans last year. Now, if I'm Tommy, that is such an enormous win for my work... I can't imagine turning it down. I got a guy for nothing. A few months later I traded him for a R1 pick! For that reason, I am inclined to conclude that the decision was Ted's.
2. We concentrated on bandaid-level veteran FAs this off-season.
IOW, as with the Wall trade, I give Ted responsibility for these decisions, & I feel significant trepidation that he'll force Tommy to trade 1 or more of the young guys (not Deni or Rui...) for veteran "help."
I hope you are right & I am wrong!
1. Refraining from trading a veteran for future assets isn't the same thing as trading future assets for veterans. Yes, I agree that Sheppard missed an opportunity to build a better future by declining to trade Bertans, but that's not an indication that he is prioritizing now over the future. It is merely an indication that he cares about now to some degree. He isn't oriented solely on the future.
2. I thought the band-aid stop gap veteran additions were actually further indication of his future orientation. He wanted to make sure there was cap room available to retain our own young free agents and or be ready to acquire a bigger star down the line. The Ernie Grunfeld move would be to pay Tristian Thompson or Serge Ibaka $15M a year for 4 years and then watch Troy Brown and Isaac Bonga walk in free agency because we wouldn't pay the luxtax to retain them.
Frichuela wrote:After watching Tyler Herro’s poise and performance last night, I’m even keener on a Beal trade with Miami. Herro has the potential to be as good as Beal. He’s got 3 1/2 years left on a great rookie deal (was picked 13th).
Make the trade, get Achiuwa, a far in the future 1st round pick and run!
Obviously, get rid of Brooks too for a good coach who can install decent X and Os and develop a young core of Herro/Avdija/Rui/Achiuwa together with Bryant/Matthews/Troy/Bonga. We would probably have to keep Westbrook and Bertans until they can be traded for some positive value.
NatP4 wrote:I’m not sure you trade a 27 year old superstar that has been nothing but loyal to the franchise, and for the most part, always played hard and played the right way and was a great leader on and off the court.
SUPERBALLMAN wrote:Frichuela wrote:After watching Tyler Herro’s poise and performance last night, I’m even keener on a Beal trade with Miami. Herro has the potential to be as good as Beal. He’s got 3 1/2 years left on a great rookie deal (was picked 13th).
Make the trade, get Achiuwa, a far in the future 1st round pick and run!
Obviously, get rid of Brooks too for a good coach who can install decent X and Os and develop a young core of Herro/Avdija/Rui/Achiuwa together with Bryant/Matthews/Troy/Bonga. We would probably have to keep Westbrook and Bertans until they can be traded for some positive value.
I'm with you on this. I was impressed with both Herro & Achiuwa, I like their games and how they play.
Riley loves the star factor, acquiring established big time players (Butler, LeBron, Bosh, Shaq, Alonzo, Juwan Howard, etc), and has reportedly coveted Beal the past couple years.
I would do it...build on Avdija, Hachimura, Achiuwa, Herro, Mathews, Troy Brown Jr, Bonga, Bryant. Add a top 3 pick to this mix (Cunningham or Suggs?).
Deal Westbrook for cap friendly contracts (I'm thinking Clippers?).
Replace Brooks
penbeast0 wrote:never mind
tontoz wrote:Beal can be a UFA next summer. We all know why he structured his contract like that instead of taking a long term deal.
Ruzious wrote:payitforward wrote:nate33 wrote:I kinda feel like he'll be in Otto Porter "no mans' land" as a free agent. He is a very good player, but there will be a lot of teams bidding on him and he will end up signing a very lucrative deal. Ultimately, it may be a situation where a good player is being paid All-Star money and winds up being somewhat of a negative asset.
Centers are tricky. You either want an elite one like Jokic or Davis on a max deal, or you want a bargain basement guy who is rock solid on the court but underrated enough to be signed cheaply (guys like Holmes, Baynes, Ibaka, etc.). The troublesome ones are guys like Myles Turner, DeAndre Jordan, and Stephen Adams who are pretty good, but not worth their contract. Jarrett Allen may soon be one of them.
An interesting & very relevant take, nate.
Of course, you'd be happy to have "an elite one" and/or "a bargain basement guy... underrated enough to be signed cheaply" at every position -- preferably one of each! -- but your point still stands on its particulars for the C position.
One problem is that it is extremely difficult to get anyone to recognize guys in that second class (good, underrated, cheap). Christian Wood might be the textbook example. Ivica Zubac, Tony Bradley, Poeltl, Noel, & even Thomas Bryant (available free!) are others. Which is, obviously, why they're cheap!
Tony Bradley's probably available for peanuts - he was traded twice for peanuts in the offseason, and he hasn't played at all this season - behind Embiid and Howard.
Ruzious wrote:We'd need some picks in addition to Herro and Achiuwa. Is Miami's first available 1st in 2025? If so, make it 2 of their 2025, 2027, and 2029 1sts - unprotected. They're a very good organization, so they should have confidence that those picks will be low.
Looks like we'd probably have to take on the contracts of Iguodola and Leonard - who are both signed through next season. Might make sense to buy them out and let them go back to Miami.
If there's a problem - because the 2023 pick has some protection on it, Miami can take off the protection - and perhaps get a 2nd round pick in exchange for doing that.
dckingsfan wrote:Do we do Bledsoe + Redick for Beal + 2 first round picks? There might be other pieces around this to help the Pels in the near-term.
nate33 wrote:dckingsfan wrote:Do we do Bledsoe + Redick for Beal + 2 first round picks? There might be other pieces around this to help the Pels in the near-term.
No. That's horrible. Bledsoe is 31 and Redick is 36. Those 2 first round picks won't even be in the lottery and probably won't be in the top 20.
dckingsfan wrote:nate33 wrote:dckingsfan wrote:Do we do Bledsoe + Redick for Beal + 2 first round picks? There might be other pieces around this to help the Pels in the near-term.
No. That's horrible. Bledsoe is 31 and Redick is 36. Those 2 first round picks won't even be in the lottery and probably won't be in the top 20.
They have multiple first round picks coming from multiple places. I would think we would pick the years and get the best first in each of those years. Redick is an expiring and Bledsoe isn't fully guaranteed ($3.9 million guaranteed) for 2022-23. Guess is we could get some 2nd rounders as well.
NatP4 wrote:What about a deal with OKC? Something centered around Dort, Diallo, Bazley +multiple 1sts&filler?
We could get 1st rounders in 2021, 2022, and 2023.
