Assembling Core 2.0

[TheSuzerain]

Imagine getting 85 million for averaging 8 points in the NBA. I’ll need to do more homework on this guy because that seems insane.

I think the easiest way to think of it is as follows:

Would you eat bad Andrew Wiggins contract if it landed us another top 5 pick? If so, that's basically the same exchange as I'm proposing for THT. $85 million for a top 5 pick talent.

No I’m not swapping LaVine for Wiggins to get a top 5 pick.

I think we could ask for 3 1sts (all pretty good ones) if we give them Lavine for Wiggins.

Basically 1.5 1sts for taking the awful Wiggins contract. And 1.5 1sts for giving them Lavine.

[gobullschi]

[
I'll leave the off-the-court evaluation to the Bulls. But from a basketball perspective, I do think TD is a hidden gem.

THT has a Draymond type build which lends itself to defensive versatility. I do agree he's more of a 3/4, but you can get away with playing him at the 2 it seems in some match-ups.

Most intriguing to me with THT is his on-ball ability where he attacks to create. It's genuinely difficult to keep him away from the cup. When teams put small guys on him, THT has been able to slash with ease. He's also showed some solid playmaking/passing with his touches, so it's easy to project him playing within a team concept. Simply put, he is a 20-year old multi-talented forward who doesn't have any glaring weaknesses.

We would have to make an aggressive offer to nab him. Somewhere in region of 4 years, $85 million.

Imagine getting 85 million for averaging 8 points in the NBA. I’ll need to do more homework on this guy because that seems insane.

I think the easiest way to think of it is as follows:

Would you eat bad Andrew Wiggins contract if it landed us another top 5 pick? If so, that's basically the same exchange as I'm proposing for THT. $85 million for a top 5 pick talent.

Is it fair to put THT at the same tier as a top 5 pick? Let’s compare him to the top 4 in the 2020 ‘weak draft class’.

THT: 8.1 PPG 2.6 RPG 1.8 APG
Edwards: 13.6 PPG 2.9 RPG 2 APG
Wiseman: 10.9 PPG 6.1 RPG 1.5 BPG
Ball: 13.1 PPG 6.3 RPG 5.9 APG
Williams: 10.3 PPG 3.5 RPG 1 APG

What are you using to justify ranking?

[TheSuzerain]

Imagine getting 85 million for averaging 8 points in the NBA. I’ll need to do more homework on this guy because that seems insane.

I think the easiest way to think of it is as follows:

Would you eat bad Andrew Wiggins contract if it landed us another top 5 pick? If so, that's basically the same exchange as I'm proposing for THT. $85 million for a top 5 pick talent.

Is it fair to put THT at the same tier as a top 5 pick? Let’s compare him to the top 4 in the 2020 ‘weak draft class’.

THT: 8.1 PPG 2.6 RPG 1.8 APG
Edwards: 13.6 PPG 2.9 RPG 2 APG
Wiseman: 10.9 PPG 6.1 RPG 1.5 BPG
Ball: 13.1 PPG 6.3 RPG 5.9 APG
Williams: 10.3 PPG 3.5 RPG 1 APG

What are you using to justify ranking?

THT is on an actual good team (the best team in the league in fact). When he's on the floor, he's probably been better than any of the top 4 picks other than Lamelo. He just doesn't get on the floor as much because he's on the Lakers.

[netduri2]

LaVine is tremendous in recent games but I don't think his tough shots continue to fall and those shot attempts can kill not only the opponents' defense but also his own teammates' offensive flow.

He has improved but is still a below-average defender. He lost his man in crunch time several times this season though he showed some nice defensive moments.

When he's on the floor our offensive rating is 112.6 and when he's off the floor it's 111.6 so the difference is very little.

On the other end when he's on the floor our defensive rating is 120.4 which is really terrible. When he's off the floor it dramatically drops to 107.1

offensive rating : on 112.6 off 111.6
defensive rating : on 120.4 off 107.1

OFC It's not all on Zach being a bad defender but it is certain at least he's a part of the problem. And it is notable that offensive rating difference between on-off is quite small despite of his great offensive performance.

I know we've played only 11 games of the season so let's see what's going to happen this season. But I'm still reluctant to give him 190mil / 5 year type big contract when his contract is expired.

[netduri2]

I think the easiest way to think of it is as follows:

Would you eat bad Andrew Wiggins contract if it landed us another top 5 pick? If so, that's basically the same exchange as I'm proposing for THT. $85 million for a top 5 pick talent.

No I’m not swapping LaVine for Wiggins to get a top 5 pick.

I think we could ask for 3 1sts (all pretty good ones) if we give them Lavine for Wiggins.

Basically 1.5 1sts for taking the awful Wiggins contract. And 1.5 1sts for giving them Lavine.

I'll take the deal to trade LaVine for Wiggins(bad player salary dump) + 21 MIN FRP(top3 protected) + 23 GSW FRP(lottery protected) since this year's draft has many top talented prospects.

Also MIN is really bad team despite of having Towns come back. They hire their coach whose last name is Saunders even before they hire new FO. Even their new FO seems to have no plan. They don't have any reliable powerforward and yet they traded James Johnson + pick for Rubio which is hilarious because they already had many guards on their roster.

[gobullschi]

I think the easiest way to think of it is as follows:

Would you eat bad Andrew Wiggins contract if it landed us another top 5 pick? If so, that's basically the same exchange as I'm proposing for THT. $85 million for a top 5 pick talent.

Is it fair to put THT at the same tier as a top 5 pick? Let’s compare him to the top 4 in the 2020 ‘weak draft class’.

THT: 8.1 PPG 2.6 RPG 1.8 APG
Edwards: 13.6 PPG 2.9 RPG 2 APG
Wiseman: 10.9 PPG 6.1 RPG 1.5 BPG
Ball: 13.1 PPG 6.3 RPG 5.9 APG
Williams: 10.3 PPG 3.5 RPG 1 APG

What are you using to justify ranking?

THT is on an actual good team (the best team in the league in fact). When he's on the floor, he's probably been better than any of the top 4 picks other than Lamelo. He just doesn't get on the floor as much because he's on the Lakers.

He is listed as a SG/SF, which isn’t what I remembered when he played the Bulls. So he’s either competing against KCP and Wesley Matthews for minutes or Morris and Harrell.

[JohnnyTapwater]

THT would be such a sneaky steal in the offseason.

[WindyCityBorn]

LaVine is tremendous in recent games but I don't think his tough shots continue to fall and those shot attempts can kill not only the opponents' defense but also his own teammates' offensive flow.

He has improved but is still a below-average defender. He lost his man in crunch time several times this season though he showed some nice defensive moments.

When he's on the floor our offensive rating is 112.6 and when he's off the floor it's 111.6 so the difference is very little.

On the other end when he's on the floor our defensive rating is 120.4 which is really terrible. When he's off the floor it dramatically drops to 107.1

offensive rating : on 112.6 off 111.6
defensive rating : on 120.4 off 107.1

OFC It's not all on Zach being a bad defender but it is certain at least he's a part of the problem. And it is notable that offensive rating difference between on-off is quite small despite of his great offensive performance.

I know we've played only 11 games of the season so let's see what's going to happen this season. But I'm still reluctant to give him 190mil / 5 year type big contract when his contract is expired.

There is zero reason think his shots will stop falling and he is not a bad defender any more. Try again.

[netduri2]

LaVine is tremendous in recent games but I don't think his tough shots continue to fall and those shot attempts can kill not only the opponents' defense but also his own teammates' offensive flow.

He has improved but is still a below-average defender. He lost his man in crunch time several times this season though he showed some nice defensive moments.

When he's on the floor our offensive rating is 112.6 and when he's off the floor it's 111.6 so the difference is very little.

On the other end when he's on the floor our defensive rating is 120.4 which is really terrible. When he's off the floor it dramatically drops to 107.1

offensive rating : on 112.6 off 111.6
defensive rating : on 120.4 off 107.1

OFC It's not all on Zach being a bad defender but it is certain at least he's a part of the problem. And it is notable that offensive rating difference between on-off is quite small despite of his great offensive performance.

I know we've played only 11 games of the season so let's see what's going to happen this season. But I'm still reluctant to give him 190mil / 5 year type big contract when his contract is expired.

There is zero reason think his shots will stop falling and he is not a bad defender any more. Try again.

Keep defending him after you see his on-off impact number.

He’s still a below-average defender at best due to his horrendous off-ball defense. He still tends to lost his man regularly this season. He cannot navigate through screens when he is guarding on perimeter.

And the most important part is that our offense when he is off the floor is not that bad. Actually the difference between when he is on the court and off the court is very little. It’s only 1 point per 100 possessions which means despite of his hot hands he is not helping his teammates play better that much.

[WindyCityBorn]

LaVine is tremendous in recent games but I don't think his tough shots continue to fall and those shot attempts can kill not only the opponents' defense but also his own teammates' offensive flow.

He has improved but is still a below-average defender. He lost his man in crunch time several times this season though he showed some nice defensive moments.

When he's on the floor our offensive rating is 112.6 and when he's off the floor it's 111.6 so the difference is very little.

On the other end when he's on the floor our defensive rating is 120.4 which is really terrible. When he's off the floor it dramatically drops to 107.1

offensive rating : on 112.6 off 111.6
defensive rating : on 120.4 off 107.1

OFC It's not all on Zach being a bad defender but it is certain at least he's a part of the problem. And it is notable that offensive rating difference between on-off is quite small despite of his great offensive performance.

I know we've played only 11 games of the season so let's see what's going to happen this season. But I'm still reluctant to give him 190mil / 5 year type big contract when his contract is expired.

There is zero reason think his shots will stop falling and he is not a bad defender any more. Try again.

Keep defending him after you see his on-off impact number.

He’s still a below-average defender at best due to his horrendous off-ball defense. He still tends to lost his man regularly this season. He cannot navigate through screens when he is guarding on perimeter.

And the most important part is that our offense when he is off the floor is not that bad. Actually the difference between when he is on the court and off the court is very little. It’s only 1 point per 100 possessions which means despite of his hot hands he is not helping his teammates play better that much.

Blah blah he is playing like star.

[netduri2]

There is zero reason think his shots will stop falling and he is not a bad defender any more. Try again.

Keep defending him after you see his on-off impact number.

He’s still a below-average defender at best due to his horrendous off-ball defense. He still tends to lost his man regularly this season. He cannot navigate through screens when he is guarding on perimeter.

And the most important part is that our offense when he is off the floor is not that bad. Actually the difference between when he is on the court and off the court is very little. It’s only 1 point per 100 possessions which means despite of his hot hands he is not helping his teammates play better that much.

Blah blah he is playing like star.

You have really impressive attitude having endless affection towards LaVine!!

Without any evidence that support your argument you keep saying nonsense to other people who criticize your beloved player.

Keep going on you LaVine fanboys. Keep talking nonsense and keep And'1s to these useless posts.

The funny part is whose username is "evidence" is keep And'1s your post without any evidence LMFAO.

[StunnerKO]

[TheSuzerain]

Already mentioned THT and Terence Davis in this thread. I think both have done well so far.

Going to throw out a 3rd name: Jarred Vanderbilt. Potentially an elite defender/rebounder who can pass/handle enough to get by at the 4/5.

He is an RFA, but the TWolves have a ton of salary committed to 2022 already. Could very easily sign him to a deal that would require the TWolves to pay significant Lux Tax which I doubt they'll be willing to do.

[TheSuzerain]

Watch on YouTube

More flashes from THT. He's a legitimate threat off the dribble already. Too big for guards and too quick for bigs.

[Chi town]

What is the max Lakers can pay THT? What is his max on open market? Is a RFA?

I love his fit with this Bulls team and I think he could play SF with his length and strength. I think he could be our playmaker in the starting lineup. Could also see where he is the SG next to Lavine the de facto PG and Coby as the 3rd guard scorer off the bench.

[Chi town]

Hilarious to think about the three Iowa State kids that all could have really helped us...
THT
Haliburton
Monte Morris

We could have easily selected all 3 of them too.

[Chi town]

From a Lakers blog... Lakers can't sign him for more than MLE after he rejects the 1.7M qualifying offer right?

After being traded to the LA Lakers on draft night, Talen Horton-Tucker signed a fully guaranteed two-year deal with the team worth $2.416 million, which was the best deal the team could offer given the fact they were over the salary cap and out of exceptions. And therein lies the problem on why LA can’t extend Horton-Tucker’s contract at the moment, not that they likely would anyway.

But for those Lakers fans wanting that to happen, the reason that it can’t is that two-year contracts can’t be extended. The team can’t do anything until next summer, at which point they can extend him a qualifying offer worth $1.782 million to make him a restricted free agent. If the Lakers choose not to extend a qualifying offer, Talen Horton-Tucker would then become an unrestricted free agent.

[Chi town]

From GB

The problem for most teams, though, is that under what is known as the “Gilbert Arenas rule,” the Lakers will be in position to give Horton-Tucker a bigger deal, starting around $10.5 million. Opposing teams, though, will be limited by the mid-level exception which, if it comes in at about what it was this year, will be a bit more than $9 million. Advantage, Lakers.

But there is a quirk in the rules that allows for a third-year balloon payment worth as much as the maximum salary, with a raise in the fourth year. So a team could potentially pay Horton-Tucker $9 million in the first year, $10 million in the second year, then jump to more than $30 million in the third year and about $32 million in the fourth year.


Would AK pay 4/83M? You'd have to think Lebron would force Lakers to match.

What could Bulls do after that with the rest of their money?

Bring home the Chicago kid... THT!

[TheSuzerain]

From GB

The problem for most teams, though, is that under what is known as the “Gilbert Arenas rule,” the Lakers will be in position to give Horton-Tucker a bigger deal, starting around $10.5 million. Opposing teams, though, will be limited by the mid-level exception which, if it comes in at about what it was this year, will be a bit more than $9 million. Advantage, Lakers.

But there is a quirk in the rules that allows for a third-year balloon payment worth as much as the maximum salary, with a raise in the fourth year. So a team could potentially pay Horton-Tucker $9 million in the first year, $10 million in the second year, then jump to more than $30 million in the third year and about $32 million in the fourth year.


Would AK pay 4/83M? You'd have to think Lebron would force Lakers to match.

What could Bulls do after that with the rest of their money?

Bring home the Chicago kid... THT!

If the Lakers match, it would be extremely costly to them.

Even if THT is only making $10 million the first two years, that could easily be $20 million per year or more after Luxury tax is accounted for. And then in years 3/4, they'd have to pay him $30 million+ per year before even accounting for lux tax.

Hey maybe they will match, but we should absolutely offer it to THT. He's a starting caliber 20 year old that projects as plus on both ends.

[chefo]

THT appears as strong as an ox and looks like he has no neck to speak of--so, body-wise, he may be closer to a 6'5-6'6 guy than 6'4, big enough to play SF and may be even large wing, kind of like Jae Crowder.

I'd like to have another guy apart from Zach that can go North-south--that's because when the D plays as tight on our shooters as the Knicks did, it'd be a layup line if you have guys that can drive efficiently to the hoop. Right now Coby can't, Lauri can only on close-outs and same for Pat Williams. Our C's (apart from when Thad plays next to Lauri) are abysmal at that. You need to be able to drive if a team makes it an emphasis that they won't let you shoot.