Randle vs. Porzingis

[gorz]

Porzingis has the higher ceiling but randle is the better player.

[UcanUwill]

No. An empty stats player is a player who doesn’t make his team better. He led the Knicks to our best start since 2013 with the hardest schedule in the league. It’s not his fault the Knicks have bums around him.

He led them to a 5-7 record. It's not like they could've been so much worse without him.

And if he's some all star-calibre player why do you think the Knicks out of all teams were able to land him in the first place?
Remember teams weren't really lining up for him. Are all the GMs just unable to evaluate talent?

But if that doesn't convince you I'm glad the Knicks finally landed a star player and I don't wanna take away your pleasure of talking yourself into Julius freaking Randle.

Dude, check Knicks roster, look up Barrets percentages, its a miracle that team is close to .500

[Richard4444]

What people don't seem to realize is that Randle is essentially, even stat-wise, the exact same mediocre player he's always been.

He just has more points because he's playing a ridiculous 38 minutes a game because Thibs likes to run guys into the ground.

What exactly has changed? His 3pt % has already been plummeting.

His playmaking (almost 7 assists a game) and defense are very good this season.

He also improved his FG numbers to 50/34/78 from 46/28/74.

[RoxSteady]

What people don't seem to realize is that Randle is essentially, even stat-wise, the exact same mediocre player he's always been.

He just has more points because he's playing a ridiculous 38 minutes a game because Thibs likes to run guys into the ground.

What exactly has changed? His 3pt % has already been plummeting.

It's only 12 games but passing and defensive efficiency are up significantly:
https://www.basketball-reference.com/players/r/randlju01.html

[urgal]

What people don't seem to realize is that Randle is essentially, even stat-wise, the exact same mediocre player he's always been.

He just has more points because he's playing a ridiculous 38 minutes a game because Thibs likes to run guys into the ground.

What exactly has changed? His 3pt % has already been plummeting.

It's only 12 games but passing and defensive efficiency are up significantly:
https://www.basketball-reference.com/players/r/randlju01.html

Exactly my point. It has only been 12 games. Maybe we shouldn't treat him like an All-Star just yeat when we have 6 years of sample size to work with showing the oppoosite, mainly that he's a mediocre player.

[ChaosHamster]

What people don't seem to realize is that Randle is essentially, even stat-wise, the exact same mediocre player he's always been.

He just has more points because he's playing a ridiculous 38 minutes a game because Thibs likes to run guys into the ground.

What exactly has changed? His 3pt % has already been plummeting.

Hes making better decisions and his passing has improved.

Still think passing is a little overrated. Hes playing a ton of minutes and his AST/TO isn't that great, but hes definitely looks better than last year.

[RoxSteady]

What people don't seem to realize is that Randle is essentially, even stat-wise, the exact same mediocre player he's always been.

He just has more points because he's playing a ridiculous 38 minutes a game because Thibs likes to run guys into the ground.

What exactly has changed? His 3pt % has already been plummeting.

It's only 12 games but passing and defensive efficiency are up significantly:
https://www.basketball-reference.com/players/r/randlju01.html

Exactly my point. It has only been 12 games. Maybe we shouldn't treat him like an All-Star just yeat when we have 6 years of sample size to work with showing the oppoosite, mainly that he's a mediocre player.

Pretty sure your point was that he's been the same over the first 12 games as he has his whole career but OK. I agree with you the sample size is small. Also different is that he seems to be in the best shape of his career.

[NY 567]

I don't understand comparing Randles small sample size to KPs career play. If we're using recent sample sizes, then KPs most recent play, his bubble play and the month before Covid shut the league down, KP was an absolute monster on both sides of the floor and clearly better than Randle is now. He averaged 25/10 in Feb, 23/11 in March, and over 30 in the bubble. I like how Julius is playing and I am cautiously optimistic that he's turned the corner, but a 7'3 two way player who can spread the floor at the 5 is always going to have more value than a guy like Randle, who is an incredibly high usage 3rd tier star.

[Richard4444]

[gfycat][/gfycat]

I'd rather have Randle. KP is better defensively, Randle better offensively, by similar margins. But KP appears to have plateaued while Randle has found yet another level to his offensive game. Randle is also much more durable.

We could have both. But if Randle is a Knick for beyond the foreseeable future, I’d pick him because of a variable of reasons: will be a more team friendly contract, no health concerns, a willing passer.


It’s hard to say KP made him teammates better.

There’s no denying that KP has elite rim protection and shooting abilities. It’s tough, but I wouldn’t want the Knicks committed to KP contractually & watch him sit on the bench for 50% of every season.

We couldnt have both. We only had cap space to sign Randle because we attached THj and Courtney Lee's contracts with KP's. If we kept them all, we wouldn't have had cap space and we would be sitting on a max contract for KP with not much opportunity to create more.

Randle's progression has been unbelievable thus far. Yeah he's been our lead facilitator and his assist and shooting numbers are easy to spot as major improvements from this year to last, and those numbers have gone up while his usg% has actually decreased.

But whats really been overlooked is the fact that he's actually been a pretty solid defender. He's not an All-Defense level guy like KP should be, and he probably never will be, nor will he be a shot blocker, but we're a better defensive team when he's on the floor. He's good at staying in front of his man, contesting shots, keeping his hands active, and pushing the ball after he gets the defensive rebound. It's why I think that he's more or less here to stay...

As far as who I'd rather have? If both players are healthy, then KP is the obvious choice. He's such a presence defensively, and he can spread the floor (although he's a little overrated there). I don't think either player is a good enough number 1 option, and KP has such a perfect skill-set for a 2nd or 3rd option that I think you have to pick him. BUT he's never healthy, and it's not like fluke injuries, it's ligaments and structural stuff, so theres plenty of reason to believe he's never gonna be a guy that can play 75+ games without needing to rest B2B's, or being on a minutes limit. Randle is pretty much the opposite. He plays through injuries, wants all the minutes he can get, and is reliable. Add in the contract (KP makes 32 million aav, Randle 20.5 aav) and the decision starts to get easier.

All things considered, I say I'd rather have Randle on his smaller deal with better durability, than KP with his max contract and consistently questionable status. It's a great question though!

I think we had around 20/25M on cap space counting KP cap Hold. We could have KP and Randle. But we were also crazy for a decent PG at the time.

We increase cap space to around 70M after get rid of KP cap hold (20M), Lee (12M) and THJ (18M).

[Texas Chuck]

I love this Knicks/Mavs rivalry thing. So much pettiness and saltiness from both sides itt. Closest to this is when Knicks fans blamed their entire franchise on Tyson Chandler who of course is a sacred cow for Mavs fans.

I'm glad Randle is playing well. Dallas kid doing well. Oh wait I mean he absolutely sucks and KP is MVP or something....

[iLLmatic860]

Honestly Knicks shooting has been so awful. We will welcome KP back with open arms.

Our starting line up consists of 4 non shooters

Elfrid Payton
Rj
Randle
And Mitch

I hate this starting line up so much.

But if tank commander Elf and Randle lead us to top 3 pick. Im all for it

Randle is our best player But Randle has no impact on winning. Empty stats at its finest

Kp wouldnt really be much better as a 1st option either but ill much rather have him IF HEALTHY. Unfortunately I dont think you would ever be able to keep KP healthy for a season and playoff time. So this argument is stupid because the only right answer is KP if healthy

[zeebneeb]

KP changes the game defensively. In today's league having him around the basket is a game changer.

Honestly, Randle has a ton to prove before I view him as anything more then someone putting up stats on a bad team.

With Porky is going to be about health, and health alone. If he stays healthy, he's the player with more impact.

[bluemj32]

KP is the better talent but his injuries have slowed his progression down. You can't improve of you aren't playing.

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[jbk1234]

Here's the problem with Randle, he's a poor defender so you have to play him alongside a good rim protector, and if that player's name isn't Miles Turner, it really junks up the paint.

So everyone 1-3 on the roster has to shoot well or you become an easy team to defend.

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[matt6715]

KP is the better talent but his injuries have slowed his progression down. You can't improve of you aren't playing.

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KP post-All Star break last year: 26/11/3 with 2.4 bpg
KP in the bubble: 30 and 10

[Shock Defeat]

Porzingis is the most overrated player in the NBA. Always hurt, getting paid like a franchise player. He is a below average 2nd option.

[LAKESHOW]

One dude got the better all around skills. But the other dude never gets hurt.

[imDatknicksTape]

i respect randle more. KP has the higher ceiling. But his ego got in the way.

Randle kept in shape during a pandemic and worked on his skills.

His contract is the most bargained in the entire NBA

so for me Randle > KP

[1999]

KP is easier to build around but Randle is better. KP is not a good passer out of double teams. He also has his issues scoring against stout opponents. Randles improved court awareness makes him the better player.


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[iLLmatic860]

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