Official Trade Thread -- Part XXXIX

[DCZards]

LaMelo is ranked #1 on the latest NBA.com "Rookie Ladder." Wiseman is ranked #2. If I can figure out a way to get Wiseman in a trade. I'm doing it.

Nothing against Ball, but there were reasons Charlotte was talked about as considering a trade up to snag Wiseman. And if given the chance, would swap their rooks right now. Despite playing only three games in college and being off a competitive court for about a year, Wiseman has stepped into a serious operation in Golden State and provided instant value.

The glimpses of greatness are getting more frequent, whether he’s facing, backing toward the basket or protecting the rim at a pace of 1.5 blocks nightly. There are league execs who will tell you already that, while Ball might wind up as this year’s Rookie of the Year, the guy they’d rather have five years from now is Wiseman.

https://www.nba.com/news/kia-rookie-ladder-jan-13-2021-edition

[NatP4]

Don’t know who this guy is, but he claims that Robinson, Herro, Achiuwa+Picks would be too much from Miami’s perspective. Also reports that Miami’s interest level in Beal is “high”

Read on Twitter

[pcbothwel]

Don’t know who this guy is, but he claims that Robinson, Herro, Achiuwa+Picks would be too much from Miami’s perspective. Also reports that Miami’s interest level in Beal is “high”

Read on Twitter

I really dont care about how Miami and GSW feel about the Price tag. They are capped out with aging superstars making an offer on the best player & fit possibly available. Give up the loot or play on the fringes.
GSW is on the fast track to missing the playoffs and Miami is looking at a first round exit as a 7th seed.

[SA37]

I don't see why Golden St. would have any interest in trading one of the only bigs they have (who happens to be the #2 pick) to add another guard to their team which is stacked with wing players -- and on top of it give Washington a bunch of picks for the pleasure.

You're asking why Golden St would want to trade for the league's leading scorer (on tremendous efficiency) in his prime when they have Oubre/Wiggins/Bazemore fleshing out their wing rotation atm? As mentioned previously, Beal gives them Klay insurance, supports the greatest player in their franchise's history for his remaining tenure, and gives them the ability to ease Klay back into the rotation even if he returns to something approximating his former self. Klay might be shifted to the three next season anyway given the impact the ACL and achilles injuries might have on his quickness. All for the price of a big that's likely a few years away from being a valuable contributor to a winning basketball team and a pick that might not convey this season and even if it does, could end up sixth or seventh in this years draft. The additional draft capital was intended to counterbalance this trade so as not to put the entirety of the risk on Washington's side of the ledger.

It's an atrocious deal for Golden St.

Golden St doesn't have issues putting the ball in the basket, but they do need size, rebounding, and interior defense. Beal provides none of that and getting rid of Wiseman only exacerbates that problem.

That Minnesota pick Golden St owns could end up giving Golden St two lottery picks -- the Minnesota pick potentially between 4-10 -- since the Warriors have a decent chance of missing the playoffs themselves. Two lottery picks would likely open up tons of trades for Golden St to bolster their frontcourt. Even if the Minnesota pick doesn't convey this year, it has a good chance of being a lottery pick next year and would be a huge asset if Minnesota did not look like a playoff team.

[pcbothwel]

I don't see why Golden St. would have any interest in trading one of the only bigs they have (who happens to be the #2 pick) to add another guard to their team which is stacked with wing players -- and on top of it give Washington a bunch of picks for the pleasure.

You're asking why Golden St would want to trade for the league's leading scorer (on tremendous efficiency) in his prime when they have Oubre/Wiggins/Bazemore fleshing out their wing rotation atm? As mentioned previously, Beal gives them Klay insurance, supports the greatest player in their franchise's history for his remaining tenure, and gives them the ability to ease Klay back into the rotation even if he returns to something approximating his former self. Klay might be shifted to the three next season anyway given the impact the ACL and achilles injuries might have on his quickness. All for the price of a big that's likely a few years away from being a valuable contributor to a winning basketball team and a pick that might not convey this season and even if it does, could end up sixth or seventh in this years draft. The additional draft capital was intended to counterbalance this trade so as not to put the entirety of the risk on Washington's side of the ledger.

It's an atrocious deal for Golden St.

Golden St doesn't have issues putting the ball in the basket, but they do need size, rebounding, and interior defense. Beal provides none of that and getting rid of Wiseman only exacerbates that problem.

That Minnesota pick Golden St owns could end up giving Golden St two lottery picks -- the Minnesota pick potentially between 4-10 -- since the Warriors have a decent chance of missing the playoffs themselves. Two lottery picks would likely open up tons of trades for Golden St to bolster their frontcourt. Even if the Minnesota pick doesn't convey this year, it has a good chance of being a lottery pick next year and would be a huge asset if Minnesota did not look like a playoff team.

Could not disagree more about your assessment. Curry will be 33/34 next year and Klay will be 31/32. Keep in mind, Klay couldnt really create for him self at 28 and healthy, so Im curious to see his skill set at 31 with a torn ACL and achilles. They need Klay to be a pure 3 & D at this point on the wing and need another guard to alleviate Curry's usage.

Your other problem is if they wait until this summer then they have wasted another year of Curry's fleeting Prime while having TERRIBLE contracts in Draymond and Wiggins as the only filler to move in a trade with Oubre now a FA.
What star player from a rebuilding team could they possibly get thats a better fit for a cheaper price?

[long suffrin' boulez fan]

I love Brad. But I’d do Brad for Herro, Robinson, Achiuwa and picks all day.

[Topofthekey]

Don’t know who this guy is, but he claims that Robinson, Herro, Achiuwa+Picks would be too much from Miami’s perspective. Also reports that Miami’s interest level in Beal is “high”

Read on Twitter

I really dont care about how Miami and GSW feel about the Price tag. They are capped out with aging superstars making an offer on the best player & fit possibly available. Give up the loot or play on the fringes.
GSW is on the fast track to missing the playoffs and Miami is looking at a first round exit as a 7th seed.

I would hold out for Adebayo

If they aren't ready to do that, then just don't trade Beal

Beal hasn't given any indication that he isn't happy, so there's currently no pressure to trade him

Wizards aren't in the type of desperate situation where they are looking to recoup as much value as they can for an unhappy Beal

The team already has Hachimura and Avdija at PF and SF, and it doesn't look like Westbrook is going anywhere soon

No point trading Beal for a downgrade at SG

So the most logical target in a trade for Beal is to improve the C position

Adebayo fits the bill

[JAR69]

Don’t know who this guy is, but he claims that Robinson, Herro, Achiuwa+Picks would be too much from Miami’s perspective. Also reports that Miami’s interest level in Beal is “high”

Read on Twitter

A good GM would play Miami and Philly off each other now (maybe GS too) to drive up the price.

[SUPERBALLMAN]

I don't see why Golden St. would have any interest in trading one of the only bigs they have (who happens to be the #2 pick) to add another guard to their team which is stacked with wing players -- and on top of it give Washington a bunch of picks for the pleasure.

You're asking why Golden St would want to trade for the league's leading scorer (on tremendous efficiency) in his prime when they have Oubre/Wiggins/Bazemore fleshing out their wing rotation atm? As mentioned previously, Beal gives them Klay insurance, supports the greatest player in their franchise's history for his remaining tenure, and gives them the ability to ease Klay back into the rotation even if he returns to something approximating his former self. Klay might be shifted to the three next season anyway given the impact the ACL and achilles injuries might have on his quickness. All for the price of a big that's likely a few years away from being a valuable contributor to a winning basketball team and a pick that might not convey this season and even if it does, could end up sixth or seventh in this years draft. The additional draft capital was intended to counterbalance this trade so as not to put the entirety of the risk on Washington's side of the ledger.

It's an atrocious deal for Golden St.

Golden St doesn't have issues putting the ball in the basket, but they do need size, rebounding, and interior defense. Beal provides none of that and getting rid of Wiseman only exacerbates that problem.

That Minnesota pick Golden St owns could end up giving Golden St two lottery picks -- the Minnesota pick potentially between 4-10 -- since the Warriors have a decent chance of missing the playoffs themselves. Two lottery picks would likely open up tons of trades for Golden St to bolster their frontcourt. Even if the Minnesota pick doesn't convey this year, it has a good chance of being a lottery pick next year and would be a huge asset if Minnesota did not look like a playoff team.

Well give them Lopez. And we'll take that horrible Wiggins contract.

But we want Wiseman + the two 1st round picks (theirs & Twolves).

https://basketball.realgm.com/tradechecker/saved_trade/7381952

[TGW]

If the warriors gave us that package, that’s the best deal on the table. And as much I dislike Wiggins, he at least plays good defense. Saw a stat somewhere that he’s one of the best defenders in the league.

[NatP4]

Keep wiggins far away

[Dat2U]

You're asking why Golden St would want to trade for the league's leading scorer (on tremendous efficiency) in his prime when they have Oubre/Wiggins/Bazemore fleshing out their wing rotation atm? As mentioned previously, Beal gives them Klay insurance, supports the greatest player in their franchise's history for his remaining tenure, and gives them the ability to ease Klay back into the rotation even if he returns to something approximating his former self. Klay might be shifted to the three next season anyway given the impact the ACL and achilles injuries might have on his quickness. All for the price of a big that's likely a few years away from being a valuable contributor to a winning basketball team and a pick that might not convey this season and even if it does, could end up sixth or seventh in this years draft. The additional draft capital was intended to counterbalance this trade so as not to put the entirety of the risk on Washington's side of the ledger.

It's an atrocious deal for Golden St.

Golden St doesn't have issues putting the ball in the basket, but they do need size, rebounding, and interior defense. Beal provides none of that and getting rid of Wiseman only exacerbates that problem.

That Minnesota pick Golden St owns could end up giving Golden St two lottery picks -- the Minnesota pick potentially between 4-10 -- since the Warriors have a decent chance of missing the playoffs themselves. Two lottery picks would likely open up tons of trades for Golden St to bolster their frontcourt. Even if the Minnesota pick doesn't convey this year, it has a good chance of being a lottery pick next year and would be a huge asset if Minnesota did not look like a playoff team.

Well give them Lopez. And we'll take that horrible Wiggins contract.

But we want Wiseman + the two 1st round picks (theirs & Twolves).

https://basketball.realgm.com/tradechecker/saved_trade/7381952

Two picks & Wiseman seems really light. Teams are getting 3-4 picks, picks swaps and prospects for their franchise guys that are forcing their way out.

[nate33]

It's an atrocious deal for Golden St.

Golden St doesn't have issues putting the ball in the basket, but they do need size, rebounding, and interior defense. Beal provides none of that and getting rid of Wiseman only exacerbates that problem.

That Minnesota pick Golden St owns could end up giving Golden St two lottery picks -- the Minnesota pick potentially between 4-10 -- since the Warriors have a decent chance of missing the playoffs themselves. Two lottery picks would likely open up tons of trades for Golden St to bolster their frontcourt. Even if the Minnesota pick doesn't convey this year, it has a good chance of being a lottery pick next year and would be a huge asset if Minnesota did not look like a playoff team.

Well give them Lopez. And we'll take that horrible Wiggins contract.

But we want Wiseman + the two 1st round picks (theirs & Twolves).

https://basketball.realgm.com/tradechecker/saved_trade/7381952

Two picks & Wiseman seems really light. Teams are getting 3-4 picks, picks swaps and prospects for their franchise guys that are forcing their way out.

You can't just gloss over the fact that one of those picks is a high lotto pick from Minnesota. And Wiseman was the #2 pick in the draft.

Two high lotto picks is better than 4 or 5 picks in the 20's.

[SA37]

You're asking why Golden St would want to trade for the league's leading scorer (on tremendous efficiency) in his prime when they have Oubre/Wiggins/Bazemore fleshing out their wing rotation atm? As mentioned previously, Beal gives them Klay insurance, supports the greatest player in their franchise's history for his remaining tenure, and gives them the ability to ease Klay back into the rotation even if he returns to something approximating his former self. Klay might be shifted to the three next season anyway given the impact the ACL and achilles injuries might have on his quickness. All for the price of a big that's likely a few years away from being a valuable contributor to a winning basketball team and a pick that might not convey this season and even if it does, could end up sixth or seventh in this years draft. The additional draft capital was intended to counterbalance this trade so as not to put the entirety of the risk on Washington's side of the ledger.

It's an atrocious deal for Golden St.

Golden St doesn't have issues putting the ball in the basket, but they do need size, rebounding, and interior defense. Beal provides none of that and getting rid of Wiseman only exacerbates that problem.

That Minnesota pick Golden St owns could end up giving Golden St two lottery picks -- the Minnesota pick potentially between 4-10 -- since the Warriors have a decent chance of missing the playoffs themselves. Two lottery picks would likely open up tons of trades for Golden St to bolster their frontcourt. Even if the Minnesota pick doesn't convey this year, it has a good chance of being a lottery pick next year and would be a huge asset if Minnesota did not look like a playoff team.

Could not disagree more about your assessment. Curry will be 33/34 next year and Klay will be 31/32. Keep in mind, Klay couldnt really create for him self at 28 and healthy, so Im curious to see his skill set at 31 with a torn ACL and achilles. They need Klay to be a pure 3 & D at this point on the wing and need another guard to alleviate Curry's usage.

Your other problem is if they wait until this summer then they have wasted another year of Curry's fleeting Prime while having TERRIBLE contracts in Draymond and Wiggins as the only filler to move in a trade with Oubre now a FA.
What star player from a rebuilding team could they possibly get thats a better fit for a cheaper price?

So you don't think Golden St needs size, rebounding, and interior defense when their frontline is Draymond Green (6'6), Paschall (6'6), Kevin Looney (6'8), and Wiseman (7')? (Golden St was 24th in rebounding last year; they are 18th at the moment, but it is a small sample size.)

If we're measuring in terms of championship contention, this year ended for them as soon as Thompson went down injured. My guess is Thompson is also likely going to miss part of next season as well and we'll have to see where he stands when he comes back. As for him not being able to create...so what? That's not his game and he has been a premier 2 guard in the NBA playing his way. Also, the Warriors traded away the guard you say they need for Wiggins and the pick you're after.

Even if Golden St still has every intention of trying to put together a championship team around Curry, Thompson, and Green, their front office should be very aware that this may be the end of the road and they need to be thinking about what comes next. Dumping every single asset (Wiseman, the Minny pick, and whatever other picks) that would help them prepare for life after Curry and Thompson into a trade for Bradley Beal is about as desperate and as irresponsible of a decision as they could make (especially given they'll already lose their 1st rd pick in 2024 or 2025 to Memphis) given the makeup of their roster.

[SA37]

Well give them Lopez. And we'll take that horrible Wiggins contract.

But we want Wiseman + the two 1st round picks (theirs & Twolves).

https://basketball.realgm.com/tradechecker/saved_trade/7381952

I mean, I understand why you like this deal, but it is just an abominable deal for Golden St.

[DCsOwn]

Well give them Lopez. And we'll take that horrible Wiggins contract.

But we want Wiseman + the two 1st round picks (theirs & Twolves).

https://basketball.realgm.com/tradechecker/saved_trade/7381952

I mean, I understand why you like this deal, but it is just an abominable deal for Golden St.

Brother, you might want to kick back for a minute. Literally your first response on this particular subject was saying that G State doesn’t have any issue scoring when their adjusted offensive rating this season is in OKC territory (a team most people thought going into this season was deliberately tanking), and that’s with Curry going supernova Steph multiple times already. They have literally no other quality offensive players on the team other than Steph atm. Wiggins has been a dreadful offensive player from an efficiency perspective his entire career practically, Draymond has conspicuously regressed in that dept from his halcyon days as a defense first fourth option offensively, Oubre is having an atrocious offensive season, and Wiseman’s a rookie that’s scored 10 points or fewer in two thirds of his games. By the end of the season (barring a move) Golden State will finish with a bottom half of the league offense and this with Curry straining to get them across the finish line.

Certainly Golden State can stay the course and plan for a future beyond Curry/Thompson as they careen towards irrelevance. That’s certainly an option. Probably a tougher pill to swallow given that they have that palatial arena that they need to pack to the gills at exorbitant seating prices (shoutout the overheated real estate market in San Fran), AND the fact that I’m sure their stars (Curry and Draymond in particular) likely still view themselves as capable of competing for championships and probably wouldn’t be happy to be relegated to novelty act status for the rest of their careers while that aforementioned future is assiduously safeguarded. But sure, that’s their prerogative. There’s precisely one needle moving transaction out there atm though, and to position themselves to be competitive in a world where Beal’s on the market, they’ll need to be willing to part with valuable commodities, simple as that.

[DCsOwn]

Comment from the general board:

Peregrine01 wrote:
That Curry is facing a box and 1 or triangle and 2 every night shows just how little respect defenses have for the rest of the team.

Comment from a poster in this thread:

“Golden State doesn’t have an issue putting the ball in the basket.”

[SA37]

I mean, I understand why you like this deal, but it is just an abominable deal for Golden St.

Brother, you might want to kick back for a minute. Literally your first response on this particular subject was saying that G State doesn’t have any issue scoring when their adjusted offensive rating this season is in OKC territory (a team most people thought going into this season was deliberately tanking), and that’s with Curry going supernova Steph multiple times already. They have literally no other quality offensive players on the team other than Steph atm. Wiggins has been a dreadful offensive player from an efficiency perspective his entire career practically, Draymond has conspicuously regressed in that dept from his halcyon days as a defense first fourth option offensively, Oubre is having an atrocious offensive season, and Wiseman’s a rookie that’s scored 10 points or fewer in two thirds of his games. By the end of the season (barring a move) Golden State will finish with a bottom half of the league offense and this with Curry straining to get them across the finish line.

Certainly Golden State can stay the course and plan for a future beyond Curry/Thompson as they careen towards irrelevance. That’s certainly an option. Probably a tougher pill to swallow given that they have that palatial arena that they need to pack to the gills at exorbitant seating prices (shoutout the overheated real estate market in San Fran), AND the fact that I’m sure their stars (Curry and Draymond in particular) likely still view themselves as capable of competing for championships and probably wouldn’t be happy to be relegated to novelty act status for the rest of their careers while that aforementioned future is assiduously safeguarded. But sure, that’s their prerogative. There’s precisely one needle moving transaction out there atm though, and to position themselves to be competitive in a world where Beal’s on the market, they’ll need to be willing to part with valuable commodities, simple as that.

Judging the current Warriors, who have only played a handful of games together at full health (excluding Klay, who is out for the year), and drawing definitive conclusions is, at the very least, premature.

Even if your analysis is correct and all the guys you named are ineffecient and potentially shadows of their former selves, then this means a complete roster overhaul is necessary; presumably those same players would have low trade value and wouldn't bring in the type of talent Golden St would need to return to a championship contender. If Golden State can't contend, then the answer might be to trade Curry. These arguments all support not trading the picks.

Essentially you are presenting contradicting arguments. On one hand, Golden St is this motley crew of has beens, never weres, and inefficient underachievers who are spoiling Curry's final prime years; at the same time, you paint a rosy a picture where Bradley Beal will steer the Warriors away from "careening towards irrelevance," revive the fans' spirits and have them packing into the arena, and the motley crew will finally rediscover their true talents -- all for the modest price of Wiseman and those burdensome potential lotto picks.

You can't have it both ways.

[prime1time]

What’s the argument for Wiseman over Porter Jr? Porter Jr jd actually a good player. There is no evidence Wiseman will be anything more than an average player. Porter Kr is averaging 56% from the field and 40% plus from 3. For me it’s a no brained assuming we have to trade Brad.

[SUPERBALLMAN]

Well give them Lopez. And we'll take that horrible Wiggins contract.

But we want Wiseman + the two 1st round picks (theirs & Twolves).

https://basketball.realgm.com/tradechecker/saved_trade/7381952

I mean, I understand why you like this deal, but it is just an abominable deal for Golden St.

Well I do think based this is a fair market deal, at least as a foundation. There could be tweaks to it or a sweetener to get it done.

Maybe the Wizards include Troy Brown Jr & 2021 2nd rounder (which will be high in the round) in their package.

https://basketball.realgm.com/tradechecker/saved_trade/7381956