Official Trade Thread -- Part XXXIX

[payitforward]

...I do like the package Miami can put together because I'm really high on Tyler Herro.... I see a future all-star....

Do you think he'll be as good as Keldon Johnson? Herro isn't playing at all well this season.

Do you think he'll be as good as Garrison Mathews?

(Ok, that's not a fair comparison. Yes, Mathews is playing a 1000 times better than Herro, but it's only on 65 minutes so far!)

[NatP4]

What about first, a Hachimura+Bertans for Collins+Snell swap?

Atlanta gets a shooter for a playoff run, and a young PF that they don’t have to pay for a couple years instead of paying Collins.

We get a really good young player that can play the 4&5 and Snell’s expiring deal, get out of that Bertans contract.

Then we pivot and move Beal for the Miami deal of Herro, Achiuwa, Robinson, and a 2025 1st&2027 1st.

Next move would be to move Westbrook for expirings.

[gambitx777]

Big ol 5 team block buster here.

Boston :
George hill and davis burtains

Magic :
ish Smith

Pelicans :
bradley beal, jerome robinson

Thunder:
Westbrook, mobamba, 2021 second from boston via okc and 2022 second from boston via hornets

Wizards :
Ariza, redick, darious miller, ball, justin jackson, robert williams 3 , hayes, alexander walker, pritchard,2021 first from pels via LA, 2021 second from pels via wizards, 2021 second boston, 2022 first pels, 2022 second boston, 2023 first pels via LA, 2024 first pels, 2025 first pels via bucks.

Boston, it's an arms race in the east right now. Burtains gives them another weapon off the bench and hill gives them another piece of vet insurance for kemba. Williams 3 and PP are pretty expendable. Spending 4 seconds isn't much when they arnt giving up a first.

Magic need a stop gap PG and ish fits that role, bamba needs a change of location bad and they have a pretty bad log jam up front any way.

Pels obviously they wanna form a big 3 type situation and set up for a run in a rapidly declining west.

Thunder, they are aproching a tank situation. Picks may not be important to them. But they are lacking center options going forward. bamba out of the rotation is young option for them to look at going forward with horfords days numbered. Why take westbrook? Well what good is cap room in okc the next 2 seasons. ? It isn't they are rebuilding and high level free agents aren't gonna just flock there and it would do their young team good to bring in the home town heart for a farewell tour and let him teach the kids how it's done. They also get a young center and two seconds to take westbrook which is a pretty good deal for them considering their situation.

Wizards, well they blow it up all in one. They trade beal and burtains and get 5 firsts and 3 seconds for them not only that but they get 4 good young pieces and ball who isn't awful but might come cheap on his next deal due to underperforming. You cut ariza, reddick, miller, and probably justin jackson I assume unless you wanna cut gil and take a flyer on him I'd cut him. Then if you don't keep jackson you can bring up and promote matthews by cutting gill or lopz and bring in Jordan bell on a 2 way if you keep jackson you can still bring up matthews and cuz gill and lopez. You clear 20 mill in cap room too? What good is that you ask, well you can use that at the dead line to absorbed a contract for a bigger deal for an asset. Yes those picks are probably late but! Who cares, they are assets and if you do a good enough job in evaluating taller or trades they could net you something worth while all while dumping westbrook at a minimum coast.

The trade can't be done till 2/20/21 due to burtians but the money works. And I think it gets us value and opesn up lines for us to trade guys like bryant, mo, or brown down the line or at the dead line or next summer.

Ok rip me apart I'm ready!

Sent from my SM-G965U1 using RealGM mobile app

This is a thermonuclear blow it up trade idea. I don’t have enough cognitive ability ATM to begin to wrap my mind around this.

Gambitx777, this is making my stretch my paradigm of thought... I’ll try...

On the surface of it I’d say the Magic get screwed on Ish for Bamba.

Beal would likely see New Orleans with a very young team and a crusty coach as a lateral move at best. He wants a winning situation.

Boston would love Bertans giving what they lost giving up Hayward and also having a real steady veteran PG to rotate with Smart and Walker. They love this.

OKC ? I dunno but Westbrook’s still got love there.

For Washington, as are 99% of most trade proposals I’m going to assume we reap more than we sow.

Thanks for the thoughts my main idea with orlando is for some reason bamba is a healthy scratch they arnt playing him and he's not in the rotation. Get him somewhere else and get a useful pg to fill in for fultz maybe toss them a second.

As for the pels that team isn't that young once this trade happens and you fill it with vets and who cares. Beal has one more full year on his deal does he not. That's zion and a young stud in ingram. That's a legit big 3 with some good vet starters in bledsoe and adams and you still have decent bench players in willy H and hart and melli. They can definitely play big on the buy out market too. It's a Toronto rapters gamble with kawi all over again.

Sent from my SM-G965U1 using RealGM mobile app

[nate33]

What about first, a Hachimura+Bertans for Collins+Snell swap?

Atlanta gets a shooter for a playoff run, and a young PF that they don’t have to pay for a couple years instead of paying Collins.

We get a really good young player that can play the 4&5 and Snell’s expiring deal, get out of that Bertans contract.

Then we pivot and move Beal for the Miami deal of Herro, Achiuwa, Robinson, and a 2025 1st&2027 1st.

Next move would be to move Westbrook for expirings.

Atlanta already has Gallinari. I don't see them valuing Bertans that much.

[Ruzious]

https://poll.fm/10722381/results?msg=voted

Interesting to see what NBA fans think. I voted in the minority - that he'll stay long-term, but I was just being a homer.

[nate33]

https://poll.fm/10722381/results?msg=voted

Interesting to see what NBA fans think. I voted in the minority - that he'll stay long-term, but I was just being a homer.

I think it's #2 or #4.

I don't think he will be traded this year, and I don't think he'll walk in free agency.

Either he agrees to opt in on his player option this summer, or we will look to trade him in the summer or by the Trade Deadline next year.

[payitforward]

To me, there are two basic issues; they are somewhat in conflict, but we have to hope they are not altogether contradictory.

The first is that this team needs a total rebuild -- or, more accurately, it needs to continue on the path of total rebuild which it's been on since Ernie was fired. Any move off that path, every waver, is just a way to let mediocrity in & breathe a sigh of relief -- a way of welcoming mediocrity.

The second such basic issue is that everyone one of us wants to keep Bradley Beal -- the FO, every fan... everyone! & why wouldn't we all want to keep him? & so... we should.

IMO, just keep Brad & also stay on the rebuild path. Live with the conflict.

[Ruzious]

To me, there are two basic issues; they are somewhat in conflict, but we have to hope they are not altogether contradictory.

The first is that this team needs a total rebuild -- or, more accurately, it needs to continue on the path of total rebuild which it's been on since Ernie was fired. Any move off that path, every waver, is just a way to let mediocrity in & breathe a sigh of relief -- a way of welcoming mediocrity.

The second such basic issue is that everyone one of us wants to keep Bradley Beal -- the FO, every fan... everyone! & why wouldn't we all want to keep him? & so... we should.

IMO, just keep Brad & also stay on the rebuild path. Live with the conflict.

But why would Brad choose to live with it? Striving for mediocrity might not be as appealing as it sounds.

[popper]

To me, there are two basic issues; they are somewhat in conflict, but we have to hope they are not altogether contradictory.

The first is that this team needs a total rebuild -- or, more accurately, it needs to continue on the path of total rebuild which it's been on since Ernie was fired. Any move off that path, every waver, is just a way to let mediocrity in & breathe a sigh of relief -- a way of welcoming mediocrity.

The second such basic issue is that everyone one of us wants to keep Bradley Beal -- the FO, every fan... everyone! & why wouldn't we all want to keep him? & so... we should.

IMO, just keep Brad & also stay on the rebuild path. Live with the conflict.

I don't want to keep Beal on the team. I was the first, or one of the first at least, to advocate trading Wall before he signed the ridiculous super max contract and before he was injured. Caught a lot of flak for that position. We should trade Beal ASAP because:

-- He's wasting his prime here
-- our coach is awful
-- the team has no discernable strategic plan to win a championship
-- he's inhibiting the growth of our younger players by playing one-on-one basketball and trying to score 40 points a game
-- he's healthy now and very well could be the opposite soon (just like Wall)

Get the most we can for him now, develop a plan to win a championship in the next four years, hire a real coach, and hold everyone accountable. My two cents.

[Dat2U]

To me, there are two basic issues; they are somewhat in conflict, but we have to hope they are not altogether contradictory.

The first is that this team needs a total rebuild -- or, more accurately, it needs to continue on the path of total rebuild which it's been on since Ernie was fired. Any move off that path, every waver, is just a way to let mediocrity in & breathe a sigh of relief -- a way of welcoming mediocrity.

The second such basic issue is that everyone one of us wants to keep Bradley Beal -- the FO, every fan... everyone! & why wouldn't we all want to keep him? & so... we should.

IMO, just keep Brad & also stay on the rebuild path. Live with the conflict.

I don't want to keep Beal on the team. I was the first, or one of the first at least, to advocate trading Wall before he signed the ridiculous super max contract and before he was injured. Caught a lot of flak for that position. We should trade Beal ASAP because:

-- He's wasting his prime here
-- our coach is awful
-- the team has no discernable strategic plan to win a championship
-- he's inhibiting the growth of our younger players by playing one-on-one basketball and trying to score 40 points a game
-- he's healthy now and very well could be the opposite soon (just like Wall)

Get the most we can for him now, develop a plan to win a championship in the next four years, hire a real coach, and hold everyone accountable. My two cents.

The first 3 i get, the last 2 you could have left off. There is no reason for Beal to stop shooting when he's as efficient as he's been. He's kept us in alot of these games. You could say Westbrook's shot jacking inhibits growth because he's supposed to be the PG but goes 6 for 21 every night and his decision making is generally erratic. As for health, you could say that about any player in the league, there's nothing about Beal rn that makes a higher risk than anyone else.

[Dat2U]

To me, there are two basic issues; they are somewhat in conflict, but we have to hope they are not altogether contradictory.

The first is that this team needs a total rebuild -- or, more accurately, it needs to continue on the path of total rebuild which it's been on since Ernie was fired. Any move off that path, every waver, is just a way to let mediocrity in & breathe a sigh of relief -- a way of welcoming mediocrity.

The second such basic issue is that everyone one of us wants to keep Bradley Beal -- the FO, every fan... everyone! & why wouldn't we all want to keep him? & so... we should.

IMO, just keep Brad & also stay on the rebuild path. Live with the conflict.

Beal has been absolutely amazing. Mathews continues to flash promise. That's the good.

As for the rest.... Your 2nd best player was playing injured and terrible. Your 3rd best player wasn't progressing as hoped and then tore his acl. Your 4th best player came in fat and looked like he hadn't picked up a basketball on months. Your 5th best player had goopy eye that kept him sidelined for 3 weeks. Were relying too much on journeymen like Ish, Neto & Lopez. Brooks has continued to coach like he's firing him would be doing him a solid.

Avdija has looked like he's trying to fit in. Troy looks like he can't fit in. Jerome Robinson & Anthony Gill look like they don't belong. Bonga ended up in Brooks' doghouse. Wagner still can't stop fouling.

Its a mess of all messes. Talent wise I don’t think were as bad as the results say but even if Westbrook gets right, losing Bryant seems alot to overcome. Lottery balls are likely without some sort of trade.

[Dat2U]

I enjoy watching Beal but my desire to keep him is nearly zero. The team sucks, and I want to field a good team. So I have zero issues whatsoever in trading Brad for a great package.

I do agree with many that Wiseman is looking less and less like the ideal centerpiece of a trade and indeed would require significant assets to even make it worth it for a straight up deal for Brad with expiring's, much less taking on the Wiggins contract.

DeAndre Hunter has nearly 50/40/90 splits and is 17/6 on only 11 shots a game in his second year. Okongwu, Hawks 2021 first, Hunter, and Snell (to make the trade work) is something I'd agree to today and I think it benefits both teams. I would not want to play that Hawks team with Beal in the playoffs if healthy.

I would like DeAndre Hunter on the Wizards. Next too Beal not for him.

IMO. Okongwu, Reddish, Huerter are all 2nd tier prospects. I dont think Hunter and two of them are enough much less one.

[Ruzious]

I enjoy watching Beal but my desire to keep him is nearly zero. The team sucks, and I want to field a good team. So I have zero issues whatsoever in trading Brad for a great package.

I do agree with many that Wiseman is looking less and less like the ideal centerpiece of a trade and indeed would require significant assets to even make it worth it for a straight up deal for Brad with expiring's, much less taking on the Wiggins contract.

DeAndre Hunter has nearly 50/40/90 splits and is 17/6 on only 11 shots a game in his second year. Okongwu, Hawks 2021 first, Hunter, and Snell (to make the trade work) is something I'd agree to today and I think it benefits both teams. I would not want to play that Hawks team with Beal in the playoffs if healthy.

I would like DeAndre Hunter on the Wizards. Next too Beal not for him.

IMO. Okongwu, Reddish, Huerter are all 2nd tier prospects. I dont think Hunter and two of them are enough much less one.

I'm an Okongwu guy - I have been from day 1, and I don't see a reason to change now. I think he helps the team do a 180 on defense - which they really need to do - they're still near the bottom of the NBA in defense - with Beal. That needs to change. Huerter's no star, but he can fill the role that Robinson does with Miami - and all winning teams love to have a player like that. If we're giving the offer of Hunter, Okongwu and Huerter plus filler for Beal, I take it (sure, get a 2023 pick, as well to at least offset the pick we gave up in the Wall trade) and don't wait for Beal to turn 28 and bitter.

Also, I want more ping pong balls for this year's draft - not less. We're NOT playing for the playoffs now that Bryant's out and our record being awful. That's a given, I hope.

[payitforward]

To me, there are two basic issues; they are somewhat in conflict, but we have to hope they are not altogether contradictory.

The first is that this team needs a total rebuild -- or, more accurately, it needs to continue on the path of total rebuild which it's been on since Ernie was fired. Any move off that path, every waver, is just a way to let mediocrity in & breathe a sigh of relief -- a way of welcoming mediocrity.

The second such basic issue is that everyone one of us wants to keep Bradley Beal -- the FO, every fan... everyone! & why wouldn't we all want to keep him? & so... we should.

IMO, just keep Brad & also stay on the rebuild path. Live with the conflict.

But why would Brad choose to live with it? Striving for mediocrity might not be as appealing as it sounds.

Don't strive for mediocrity, & don't trade Beal. Instead, try to build a contending team via youth, & hope you can do it quick enough that Brad wants to stay. Now... we won't get there before he can opt out if he wants, but we can achieve enough that the future looks bright.

At least we can try to do that. Of course our off season (other than drafting Deni) made this strategy more difficult. We didn't mine R2, we didn't find an undrafted gem, & we brought in 1-year-contract veterans.

Suppose that, instead of signing Gill, we'd made a move to get Xavier Tillman.
Suppose that, instead of signing Robin Rose, we'd signed Nathan Knight undrafted.

Those two moves alone -- I'm not even insisting we ink Nate Hinton! -- change the way the future looks for the Wizards. &, the better the future looks the easier it is to get Brad to believe in that future.

Again, that's what I mean by "stay on the rebuild path" & "keep Brad."

[nate33]

It's important to understand that when Beal makes his decision whether or not to leave, he'll be looking forward, not in the rear view mirror. It doesn't matter how successful the Wizards are in the 2020-21 season, and not necessarily even the 2021-22 season. What matters is Beal's belief that the Wizards will be good in the 2022-23 season and beyond.

A few growing pains this year as we develop our young talent and perhaps even tank for a 2021 draft pick will be forgotten if the team is successful next year.

[payitforward]

To me, there are two basic issues; they are somewhat in conflict, but we have to hope they are not altogether contradictory.

The first is that this team needs a total rebuild -- or, more accurately, it needs to continue on the path of total rebuild which it's been on since Ernie was fired. Any move off that path, every waver, is just a way to let mediocrity in & breathe a sigh of relief -- a way of welcoming mediocrity.

The second such basic issue is that everyone one of us wants to keep Bradley Beal -- the FO, every fan... everyone! & why wouldn't we all want to keep him? & so... we should.

IMO, just keep Brad & also stay on the rebuild path. Live with the conflict.

Beal has been absolutely amazing. Mathews continues to flash promise. That's the good.

As for the rest.... Your 2nd best player was playing injured and terrible. Your 3rd best player wasn't progressing as hoped and then tore his acl. Your 4th best player came in fat and looked like he hadn't picked up a basketball on months. Your 5th best player had goopy eye that kept him sidelined for 3 weeks. Were relying too much on journeymen like Ish, Neto & Lopez. Brooks has continued to coach like he's firing him would be doing him a solid.

Avdija has looked like he's trying to fit in. Troy looks like he can't fit in. Jerome Robinson & Anthony Gill look like they don't belong. Bonga ended up in Brooks' doghouse. Wagner still can't stop fouling.

Its a mess of all messes. Talent wise I don’t think were as bad as the results say but even if Westbrook gets right, losing Bryant seems a lot to overcome. Lottery balls are likely without some sort of trade.

Welcome to the Garrison Mathews fan club, Dat -- I guess you no longer think a chair can dunk on him!

I don't agree that Bryant "wasn't progressing as hoped;" it's fairer just to say that he's a terrific player in some important ways but looks like he's not going to be a plus defender.

I think Troy Brown is being coached into incompetence. He was too good last year to be bad this year. Play him. Ditto Bonga.

[payitforward]

It's important to understand that when Beal makes his decision whether or not to leave, he'll be looking forward, not in the rear view mirror. It doesn't matter how successful the Wizards are in the 2020-21 season, and not necessarily even the 2021-22 season. What matters is Beal's belief that the Wizards will be good in the 2022-23 season and beyond.

A few growing pains this year as we develop our young talent and perhaps even tank for a 2021 draft pick will be forgotten if the team is successful next year.

Even if we're *not* successful next year -- as you say -- but we look like we've made even more smart moves oriented towards future success. That might be enough. After all, a smart guy like Brad isn't going think our future prospects are significantly improved b/c we've got Robin Lopez or Anthony Gill.

[pcbothwel]

It's important to understand that when Beal makes his decision whether or not to leave, he'll be looking forward, not in the rear view mirror. It doesn't matter how successful the Wizards are in the 2020-21 season, and not necessarily even the 2021-22 season. What matters is Beal's belief that the Wizards will be good in the 2022-23 season and beyond.

A few growing pains this year as we develop our young talent and perhaps even tank for a 2021 draft pick will be forgotten if the team is successful next year.

Even if we're *not* successful next year -- as you say -- but we look like we've made even more smart moves oriented towards future success. That might be enough. After all, a smart guy like Brad isn't going think our future prospects are significantly improved b/c we've got Robin Lopez or Anthony Gill.

Hmmm. Ok. Master Plan.
Trade Beal for rebuilding package of picks and filler and allow Beal to compete on title contender for 2 playoff runs.
Let Westbrook rebuild value, with aim to move him in the summer or before next deadline to contender for expirings.
Rebuild around young guys and top 6 pick in 2021 draft.
Go after Beal in Summer of 2022 with the Full Max.

How am I doing? Lol

[The Consiglieri]

https://poll.fm/10722381/results?msg=voted

Interesting to see what NBA fans think. I voted in the minority - that he'll stay long-term, but I was just being a homer.

Not a surprise to me. All guys in Beals situation, w/only rare exceptions, leave, either via trade or Free Agency. I’ve been flummoxed for the past two or so years by the plethora of posters who simply believe his public statements on the issue (statements I think most would take w/a grain of salt if uttered by other teams players).

I do understand that by being locals your more privy to certain inside things that people like me way out West would not necessarily be clued into, but generally I think fan bases tend to be naive about their own players while more circumspect or cynical w/others from other teams which can help explain why canvases can still be blind sided by potential trades like this even in this day and age.

[Silvie Lysandra]

a different approach to the Bradley Beal discussion: why not see if we can trade for a disgruntled star on the relative cheap? I'm not a big fan of KAT, but he's a star center who's only 25, who's pretty likely to bolt a terrible Minnesota team (sound familiar?)

The deal would go as follows:

Wizards trade:
Unprotected 2021 FRP
2022 SRP
Rui Hachimura
Jerome Robinson
Moritz Wagner
Thomas Bryant (assuming he passes a physical)

T'Wolves trade:
Karl-Anthony Towns (S&T)

Why for the Timberwolves? This is an excellent rebuilding package for someone who is likely to leave for nothing. They build around Rui, get back a high lottery pick, and fill out the roster with talent that is still fairly young.

Why for the Wizards?

This gets a second star to pair with Beal for the next 5 years and instantly makes the team relevant again. Even if the Westbrook contract is too much of an albatross to move, unless he's completely physically washed up, Beal + Towns gets the team back to the playoffs. We still retain Avidja and Bonga for future development/starters on the wings.

C: Towns/MLE FA
PF: Bertrans/Avidja
SF: Avidja/Bonga
SG: Beal/Matthews
PG: Westbrook/Smith

Once Westbrook is off the books, the Wizards are suddenly in a position to trade for that 3rd star.

With that said, I'm 80% sure Minny says no, or at least demands Avidja.