Lets talk Zach Lavine

[Butler4thewin]

i like lavine but i think we end up a better team trading him for a top 2 pick maybe number 1 and draft cade then trading lauri and otto plus anything except pwill for another shot at a top 5 pick before the deadline

[DroseReturnChi]

This is tough since it’s like a catch 22. Lavine has definitely evolved as a player but I would still see what is out there near the trade deadline and see where we are at a team. If it’s too good of a deal with a combination of picks or possibly young players and some team gets antsy that that will put their team over the top near the deadline, I may trade him. It comes down to one thing, the max contract he will likely getting, is he worth it? If he is and you think he’s worth it, it’s going to limit your financial flexibility in the future. If giving the max contract, do you want to build around Lavine as your number one option? He seems more of a second or third option. If he decides to take less than a max and team friendly deal, I would pounce all over it but that is unlikely as some team will be giving the max in the open market.

What’s team friendly deal? He is playing like a $30 million player now. Could be even better by the time his contract is up. In today’s NBA 2nd and 3rd options on great teams get max contracts. Zach looks like a really good 2nd option.

25 million per year, maybe 30 million. The key word in your post is great teams. Bulls aren’t a great team at this stage. Not sure if the Bulls even offered an extension this past offseason but that would have been a great deal for the Bulls had Lavine accepted although that would be unlikely from his perspective.

so a 30mil dollar player is worth if he gets maxed 5/190? he needs to take friendly discount or out.

[WindyCityBorn]

i like lavine but i think we end up a better team trading him for a top 2 pick maybe number 1 and draft cade then trading lauri and otto plus anything except pwill for another shot at a top 5 pick before the deadline

This isn’t NBA 2K and Cade isn’t Luka.

[WindyCityBorn]

What’s team friendly deal? He is playing like a $30 million player now. Could be even better by the time his contract is up. In today’s NBA 2nd and 3rd options on great teams get max contracts. Zach looks like a really good 2nd option.

25 million per year, maybe 30 million. The key word in your post is great teams. Bulls aren’t a great team at this stage. Not sure if the Bulls even offered an extension this past offseason but that would have been a great deal for the Bulls had Lavine accepted although that would be unlikely from his perspective.

so a 30mil dollar player is worth if he gets maxed 5/190? he needs to take friendly discount or out.

Based on what? Also how much should Lauri get? If LaVine is worth $30 million then what is Lauri’s team friendly deal? Definitely significantly less than what ever LaVine will get. Like less than $20 million. That is the more pressing issue right now tbh as he could walk for nothing this off-season. We have another year on LaVine to figure things out.

[Butler4thewin]

i like lavine but i think we end up a better team trading him for a top 2 pick maybe number 1 and draft cade then trading lauri and otto plus anything except pwill for another shot at a top 5 pick before the deadline

This isn’t NBA 2K and Cade isn’t Luka.

did i say cade is luka ? 2k ? bro i dont play video games but you seem to know a Lot about them bringing them up like that


so what is it ? if a poster posts something in needs to be in your perceived realm of possibility or we shouldnt post? good luck with that

[WindyCityBorn]

i like lavine but i think we end up a better team trading him for a top 2 pick maybe number 1 and draft cade then trading lauri and otto plus anything except pwill for another shot at a top 5 pick before the deadline

This isn’t NBA 2K and Cade isn’t Luka.

did i say cade is luka ? 2k ? bro i dont play video games but you seem to knos Lot about them bringing them up like that

They way you suggested those moves will definitely be the right call isn’t rooted in reality so it seemed like build a team 2K video game GM moves to me. My bad.

[erasmusmrr]

Wiseman was benched last night. He plus the Minny and GS firsts have been mentioned.

[Chicago-Bull-E]

i like lavine but i think we end up a better team trading him for a top 2 pick maybe number 1 and draft cade then trading lauri and otto plus anything except pwill for another shot at a top 5 pick before the deadline

No one would trade the 1st pick in this draft for Lavine, who would only have one year left on his deal at that point.

His trade value would drop significantly after the season. Teams would be trading for a rental at that point.

The time to trade him would be before the deadline, if at all.

[Kukoc-Lauri]

Lavine for Oubre Jr plus Minesotta pick 21 and Warriors pick 21. Lavine for M.Robinson,K.Knox,F.Nikitlina, Knicks own first round pick 21, Mavs first round picks 21&23.Lavine and Young for A.Edwards, J.Culver Ricky Rubio and future first from Miny. Lavine and Porter for Ben Simmons, Danny Green and Mattisse Thybulle.

[erasmusmrr]

I want the 2 GS and Minny picks

[TheStig]

Why is GS gutting their future for Lavine?

[Kukoc-Lauri]

Why is GS gutting their future for Lavine?

Their future with Steph being 32, Klay 31, Green 31 is now. Their window without trades is closed. When Wiseman hits his prime 2028 they all gonna be in retirement.

[TheSuzerain]

Why is GS gutting their future for Lavine?

GS has no future post Curry/Klay/Dray


Curry
Lavine
Wiggins or Oubre (eventually Klay next year)
Dray
Wiseman

That team has some juice for the remainder of Curry's prime.

[gardenofsound]

People on the T&T board are thinking that LaVine's value is that MIN pick and expirings (Oubre and filler).

I think that's asinine.

That MIN pick is getting HORRIBLY overvalued for what it really is.

The only reasons to trade LaVine are if you get a sock-knocker deal, or if he (or his agent) tell Bulls' brass that he intends to test the market and/or is leaning towards not re-signing in Chicago. Then you trade him and get what value you can.

Otherwise, let him play his prime out here and see if you can't acquire or develop the pieces to fit around him.

I am more and more convinced that he is the real deal. Get him some players that complement his game.

[Leslie Forman]

The only reasons to trade LaVine are if you get a sock-knocker deal, or if he (or his agent) tell Bulls' brass that he intends to test the market

I don't think people quite realize that Zach absolutely IS going to become a free agent, because he HAS to, in order to get a fat new deal instead of just an "extension" based on his current contract, which limits him. He has absolutely no incentive whatsoever to sign a deal while he's on his current contract.

And this is why his trade value is really not what people think it is here.

[erasmusmrr]

3 options. He walks. He is resigned for 5/190. He is traded. Better not let him walk away from a 25 win team and get nothing in return.

[DroseReturnChi]

I am more and more convinced that he is the real deal. Get him some players that complement his game.

Lavine is a terrible defender and playmaker. the player your describing are supermax players kawhi, and pg 13 that can complement his game. its not like these guys you can pick off the streets esp with Lavine getting 5/190.

[TheSuzerain]

The only reasons to trade LaVine are if you get a sock-knocker deal, or if he (or his agent) tell Bulls' brass that he intends to test the market

I don't think people quite realize that Zach absolutely IS going to become a free agent, because he HAS to, in order to get a fat new deal instead of just an "extension" based on his current contract, which limits him. He has absolutely no incentive whatsoever to sign a deal while he's on his current contract.

And this is why his trade value is really not what people think it is here.

I think his trade value is high if a team views him as a starter for a playoff run this year and next. And that's a reasonable proposition.

[kodo]

i like lavine but i think we end up a better team trading him for a top 2 pick maybe number 1 and draft cade then trading lauri and otto plus anything except pwill for another shot at a top 5 pick before the deadline

This isn’t NBA 2K and Cade isn’t Luka.

Nobody trades unprotected top 1/2 picks like that anymore either.
Anthony Davis' return package included a top 8 protected pick...Anthony Davis.
The most unprotected pick I remember off hand was Minny's to GS, still top 3 protected. So we're still looking at best a #4, like Patrick Williams.

If the Bulls want a top 2 pick, and who doesn't, it will have to be our own.

[OldSchoolNoBull]

I voted a month ago to trade him, and made this post explaining that vote.

But I think I've changed my mind in the month since then.

First, Zach's play the first month of this season has done a lot to make me think he's a piece worth keeping.

Second, I've had a change in my thinking about his FA. I had been skeptical that he would stay here, I thought he'd want to go to a better team. But in looking at the projected 2022 payrolls, I realize that there just aren't many teams that will both have the cap space and be significantly better than us right away.

There's Miami, who was gearing up for a Giannis run that won't happen now. They could be in position to offer Zach max to play with Jimmy and Bam, but that max slot goes away if they pay Duncan Robinson/Kendrick Nunn. I don't see them kicking those guys to the curb for Zach, particularly when they have Herro, who could be a Zach-like player.

Memphis is interesting - they would have to let a number of guys walk, but they could offer Zach max to play with Morant, JJJ, and Brooks.

Dallas isn't really projected to have the money, but if they dumped the final years of Powell and Kleiber's contracts and let Josh Richardson walk, they could give Zach the max to play with Doncic and Porzingis, but you'd think they'd be looking to add defense/slashing/rebounding/rim protection rather than more volume scoring. Or, they could keep all those guys and just dump the injury-prone Porzingis. Doncic/LaVine/Richardson would be a great perimeter trio.

New Orleans, if they let everyone of worth outside of Zion/Ingram go, could offer LaVine max and essentially start new with a Zion/Ingram/LaVine trio.

But that's kind of it. There are some interesting FA options, but nothing looks overwhelming to me to the point where he'd turn down the extra money we could offer to take one of those opportunities.

So, his performance in the early part of the season plus the lack of home-run FA opportunities upon closer inspection have turned me on the issue of Zach. I'm still open to trading him if a can't-miss deal presents itself, but I'm ok keeping him as of now.

However, if the decision is to keep him, it only makes sense imo if we pivot to a mindset of making anything and everything outside of him available in trade to acquire a second star to put aside him. He's not a youngin anymore, he's going to be 26 in March, and we can't be thinking of putting a team around him in three years anymore. I realize that some of our pieces - Carter and Lauri - don't exactly have a ton of value right now, but we've got Coby, PWill, our future picks, and (if we're talking about this season) ample salary filler in Otto/Thad/Sato/Felicio. I'm not sure the kind of deal I'm thinking of would be possible, but it's the kind of deal the new regime should probably be looking for if their intent is to re-sign Zach.