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Walter A Nesbeth III...I'm calling you out.

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34Celtic
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Walter A Nesbeth III...I'm calling you out. 

Post#1 » by 34Celtic » Thu Aug 16, 2007 5:18 pm

I thought this guy was an idiot when I read it and the Yankees are making me look right.

PS. I really hope this isn't NYKGM's real name

No one could have thought as that baseball gently settled into the outfield while Jay Bell crossed the plate on that unexpected night in Arizona some six years ago that the end of an era was not only near, it was already here. Since then the Yankees have made it to the playoffs every year, even reaching the World Series in 2003, but for all intents and purposes, the era of Bronx dominance had died at the bat of Luis Gonzales.

Fast forward to 2007, the bright future and high expectations that were case upon this talent laden Yankees team was absolutely vision through pinstripe colored glasses. Through 50+ games, the Yankees of 2007 have shown themselves to be an aged, overpaid, under motivated collection of ballplayers that bear more allegiance to the dollar sign on their checks than the N-Y on their jerseys.

Yes, Jeter, Posada, Pettite and Rivera, the old guard still represent what you want in a ballplayer, but even players of their respective mettle cannot lift the once proud organization out of the malaise that seems to have infected the team as easily as the flu passes through a preschool classroom. Watching the Yankees now is tantamount to watching seniors play botchy ball. Not much to look at.

What to do? Well as the expression goes, fish stinks at the head. In this case, albeit two classy fish, Brian Cashman and Joe Torre have to go. The time has come for a change to be made. Even the great leaders of our military past reached a point in their illustrious careers where the fire of their voices and the steel of their resolve could no longer move men to great things. I think that this is the case with the Yankees of today.

OK, firing is the easy part, what do you do afterwards? The plan to return the Yankees to glory has to first begin with choosing a new brain trust. That has to start with making Gene Michael, a universally acknowledged talent guru, either the General Manager or something real close to it. When the Yankees passed on Vladimir Guerrero for Gary Sheffield and Carlos Beltran for Johnny Damon, they missed two opportunities to facilitate getting younger while actually improving their talent. That cannot continue. No New York probably will not be willing to watch a team rebuild, but no one said that they have to.

This leads me to the manager.

One of Joe Torre
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Post#2 » by nykgeneralmanager » Thu Aug 16, 2007 6:55 pm

:lol: Don't worry that isn't me. Even though I don't like Torre and I don't want Mattingly to be his replacement either, I'm one of seemingly few people who really like what Cashman has done here.
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Post#3 » by Brooklyn Born » Wed Sep 12, 2007 7:14 am

34Celtic, I can appreciate your passion. You must be a brave soul to have a tag name bearing a Boston team yet be willing to call someone you don't know an idiot in defense of the Yankees.

In any event, for the record, I am a die-hard Yankees fan who unlike some out there didn't jump on the bandwagon in the 90's or off of it in the late 80's. That said, the article was pointed toward a need for the Yankees to get younger in order to return to glory, not just an attack on Torre and Cashman. I have a sincere doubt that youth will be served as long as Torre remains and the fact that the Joba rules were instituted points toward that. How many teams have to protect their your from their manager by putting those types of rules in place. One need look only as far as Sturtze, Villone, Mendoza, and now Vizcaino for the results and motivation. In his success, Torre has moved away from what made him successful.

Any true Yankees fan would submit that along with the acquisition of O'Neill, Key and Martinez and others the championship run would not have been possible without the infusion of youth. The inclusion of Rivera, Jeter, Pettite, Mendoza and Posada was just as important as the veteran aquisitions. During those times, Torre was willing to let young players grow and contribute. In the present time, the call-ups of Chamberlain, Hughes, Kennedy along with the earlier inclusion of Cano and Cabrera speak to the impact of included youth.

I would never bet against the Yankees because the fan in me would never allow that, but I am a big picture person and I want multiple championships, not just another run at the playoffs that is ended by the Anaheim Angels.

If that makes me an idiot as you saw fit to call me, I stand accused.

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Post#4 » by 34Celtic » Wed Sep 12, 2007 12:24 pm

I'll respond when I get more time.
HCYanks wrote:Thanks for reminding me Clay Buchholz is a couple of blocks away from me, Fox. Now I have to go hide my laptop.
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Post#5 » by 34Celtic » Thu Sep 13, 2007 12:24 am

Does it make sense that once the injury bug went away this team took off?

Does it make sense that since Steinbrenner has let Cashman take the full reigns of this team that this team ALREADY has gotten younger and arguably better?

I'm glad you want Carlos Beltran, ask Mets fans how they feel about that.
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Post#6 » by JurassicJake » Thu Sep 13, 2007 12:53 am

nykgeneralmanager wrote::lol: Don't worry that isn't me. Even though I don't like Torre and I don't want Mattingly to be his replacement either, I'm one of seemingly few people who really like what Cashman has done here.


I agree with you 100% except, that I like Torre. Although I think he needs to go.
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Post#7 » by Brooklyn Born » Thu Sep 13, 2007 3:50 am

You make a good point. The injuries held the team back from performing at their best with a full complement of players, but again, I am talking about beyond this year. Injuries are a part of sports, some years you escape the big ones and other years you are snake-bitten. That is where having depth and youth come into play. I'll be the first one to say that Cashman did a good job by sticking to his guns and stockpiling young talent in the minors, but if one believes that Torre's time has come, how do you separate him from Cashman. He works with the cards that Cashman deals him. In the long run, I think that youth will be served and they will make it back to the top, but only time will tell.
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Post#8 » by Abraham Lincoln » Thu Sep 13, 2007 4:31 am

Who writes these stupid articles? These are all opinion and no facts.
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Post#9 » by mets87 » Thu Sep 13, 2007 4:53 am

34Celtic wrote:
I'm glad you want Carlos Beltran, ask Mets fans how they feel about that.

he's great.
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Post#10 » by 34Celtic » Thu Sep 13, 2007 4:04 pm

mets87 wrote:-= original quote snipped =-


he's great.


34Celtic wrote:-= original quote snipped =-



The Yankees, you can have Melky, abreu, Tyler Clippard and Matt Desalvo


mets87 wrote:celtic he isn't "clutch" so you'd hate him...and why are you trading away 2 of your decent pitching prospects for someone that's even worse at handling new york pressure than a-rod?
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Post#11 » by mets87 » Sun Sep 16, 2007 6:09 am

you see that "clutch" remark? that's mocking you. i know public schools are in the **** these days and kids are worse and worse at being able to see the meaning in words, but come on. and since you are all obsessed with how a-rod is with the media, yeah, i don't think you'd want someone like beltran. he isn't a media favorite at all. but since i don't give a crap about what someone does once he's off the field, i love him.
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Post#12 » by 34Celtic » Sun Sep 16, 2007 10:28 pm

Mancrush much? Anyways, sorry I should have checked the stats for C&L situations.
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Post#13 » by mets87 » Sun Sep 16, 2007 11:14 pm

you still don't get what i meant by the clutch remark. try again. sigh.
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Post#14 » by 34Celtic » Mon Sep 17, 2007 12:34 am

Personally, I don't care what you have to say. This thread was started in support of Torre and Cashman.
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Post#15 » by sully00 » Mon Sep 17, 2007 6:43 pm

The biggest problem with this franchise is the fact that people can never separate Cashman's acts from those of Steinbrenner. This idea that Cashman or Torre should be facing a referendum this season is ridiculous. Torre may not have a reload in him and maybe he is done but Cashman is just getting to start untying the knot.

Do people really think that Brian Cashman wanted Kevin Brown, Randy Johnson, or Gary Sheffield?

I have grown to appreciate George over time (hated him when I was younger) he has made a lot possible, but his demands and meddling have hurt a lot as well, now as much as in the 80's. Cashman doesn't get a pass on every bad move and credit for every good move, Pavano comes to mind, but he has to be judged on almost a clean slate starting last year and see what happens from there.
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Post#16 » by cmaff051 » Mon Sep 17, 2007 8:50 pm

Brian Cashman acquired Kevin Brown. It was pretty much addition by subtraction. Jeff Weaver was never going to succeed here. Kevin Brown just came off a dominant year in the NL. Kevin Brown just got old in a hurry when he came to New York. It was a good risk that just didn't work out.

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