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Official 2020-21 Season Thread #1: To Beard or not To Beard?

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Re: Official 2020-21 Season Thread #1: To Beard or not To Beard? 

Post#361 » by DCasey91 » Fri Feb 5, 2021 11:02 pm

Stribor wrote:
DCasey91 wrote:
Stribor wrote:Don't touch what is not broken. We are still young team, and I think if we do not win this season, Maxey and Shake could make surprising jump the next one, and the other guys will already enter a serious senior years. We are constructed well atm.



I’d agree there provided the ongoing year in/ year out deep problem is solved. I don’t think either of the two are capable enough of being a 2nd option on a championship winning team at all. I like them both but I’m realistic with the two. I see more 6th man potential.

Korkmaz I’m not high on

Thybulle should be safe (but it’s his awareness that’s a let down. I.e 35% from 3, lower foul rate and there’s a full time bench spot for any team in the league for a decade. That’s on him though).

Joe is too raw (better shooter out of the lot).

Milton ceiling is coming up (don’t see all star potential but that’s fine. He was a steal at his pick).

Maxey has a suspect jumpshot I believe.

The irony is that there’s a playoffs starter in my eyes from day one by the name of Mikal Bridges without needing any of our young players/Green.
He has the required skillset to be Covington at minumum. There’s our SF for the next half decade lol.
Made no sense to me to trade the pick then get a less superior player (Thybulle) and get a vet Green as well. It’s like doubling down after the fact.

I agree with Mikal sentiment, but I am much more high on Maxey. I could actually see him possibly becoming u surprise a la D. Mitchell (although clearly a very different player). He is atheltic enough, not elite, but enough. On the other hand his handles and coordination seem elite. If he learns the tricks and develops further his shoot, he could become something surprising. I would not like to give up on guy that seem to have a lot of potential.



The thing though the context and environment matter a ton though. Handing the keys over to a young player can turn out great or bad. But that was never going to happen with Maxey. Completely understandable too with a established playoff team.

Thing that I found though with star caliber players , I wouldn’t call it selfish but they flash the “I’m the best player on the floor mentality or you can see best player on the floor” very early on. Whether the results come in the next few years is a different equation. Hence why Ben’s progression can be extremely frustrating (he flashed top ten player in the comp potential from like his 5th game onwards in his rookie year lol).
He’s a great kid, great tools, astounding work ethic.
But I don’t “see it” yet. If his jumpshot is fine in the coming years then I’ll reassess.

Sexton is a great example for Maxey’s comp. It needed to be the tethered at times but he had the I’m better than you and I’ll prove it approach right from the jump. Had a horrible rookie year from an advanced stat perspective. But the Cavs have their franchise player right now.

Don’t worry I’m high on Maxey like everybody else is here :)
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Re: Official 2020-21 Season Thread #1: To Beard or not To Beard? 

Post#362 » by DCasey91 » Sat Feb 6, 2021 1:22 am

Lowry is cooking the nets on the outside. Still at his age would be a very valuable player to us.
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Re: Official 2020-21 Season Thread #1: To Beard or not To Beard? 

Post#363 » by Negrodamus » Sat Feb 6, 2021 1:41 am

HardenToSixers wrote:
Negrodamus wrote:
elchengue20 wrote:Bledsoe sucks, and can't shoot.

Those players are lateral moves, won't change much.

Fournier could be interesting, but he's been hurt lately. Patty Mills maybe, still isn't much better than Seth.


Lateral moves from Seth Curry? 2-time all defensive team, is currently shooting 40% from 3 on 5 attempts a game on a dreadful team, has a career .337 FTr, can actually play PG. When Curry isn't hitting shots, he is honestly worthless. His perceived value is his ability to hit wide open 3 pointers. That's obviously not happening right now and will be even harder in the playoffs when the good teams tighten up their defense.

Scott, Ferguson, Bradley, and arguably Furkan are nearly unplayable in the playoffs.

Comparable players on contenders right now: Dennis Schroder on the Lakers (Rondo last year), Patrick Beverley on the Clippers, Mike Conley on the Jazz, Marcus Smart on the Celtics.... These are the guys that show up in the playoffs and play high effort defense while showing veteran intangibles to stay in/win games.

We currently don't have anyone like that. The only guy who approaches that is Dwight Howard and, with all due respect, he ain't it.

Additionally, we're not getting Beal, there's no one disgruntled enough to pull off a huge trade. Waiting on a third star is basically acknowledging that this season isn't a realistic contending season. I know that sounds crazy in the context of the top team in the East, but we have seen time and time again that if Ben or Embiid are out or having an off night, we are completely inept at creating offense.

It's definitely counterintuitive to my usual priorities, but I'd do Seth, Scott, Ferguson, and either a heavily protected future first or two seconds for Bledsoe. Salaries match up well and we're not giving up really anything of consequence.
Don't disagree with most of what you said, but when you bring up Rondo but say Dwight ain't it, I feel like you're a bit biased by watching the same guys on our team all the time. Like did you watch that much of Rondo before the playoffs? He just had a one-off strong playoff run and has been a pretty shaky player for many years now.


I mean, kinda nitpicking one part of the post but... I'm not saying Rondo is consistently a good player, but he provides veteran intangibles that present themselves when the games matter, ie the playoffs. At the moment, we do not have a guy like that.

Meanwhile, Dwight didn't do anything in the playoffs other than foul, and he continues that trend into this current regular season. I don't think we he will provide the veteran leadership needed when down in a playoff game/series to change momentum.

All of this said, Bledsoe could come here and not be good. I acknowledge that. I just think he's less exploitable in the playoffs and has more in his toolbox than Seth Curry and I'm not sure there's going to be many other options for the remainder of this season.
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Re: Official 2020-21 Season Thread #1: To Beard or not To Beard? 

Post#364 » by VDT » Sat Feb 6, 2021 2:02 am

Negrodamus wrote:
HardenToSixers wrote:
Negrodamus wrote:
Lateral moves from Seth Curry? 2-time all defensive team, is currently shooting 40% from 3 on 5 attempts a game on a dreadful team, has a career .337 FTr, can actually play PG. When Curry isn't hitting shots, he is honestly worthless. His perceived value is his ability to hit wide open 3 pointers. That's obviously not happening right now and will be even harder in the playoffs when the good teams tighten up their defense.

Scott, Ferguson, Bradley, and arguably Furkan are nearly unplayable in the playoffs.

Comparable players on contenders right now: Dennis Schroder on the Lakers (Rondo last year), Patrick Beverley on the Clippers, Mike Conley on the Jazz, Marcus Smart on the Celtics.... These are the guys that show up in the playoffs and play high effort defense while showing veteran intangibles to stay in/win games.

We currently don't have anyone like that. The only guy who approaches that is Dwight Howard and, with all due respect, he ain't it.

Additionally, we're not getting Beal, there's no one disgruntled enough to pull off a huge trade. Waiting on a third star is basically acknowledging that this season isn't a realistic contending season. I know that sounds crazy in the context of the top team in the East, but we have seen time and time again that if Ben or Embiid are out or having an off night, we are completely inept at creating offense.

It's definitely counterintuitive to my usual priorities, but I'd do Seth, Scott, Ferguson, and either a heavily protected future first or two seconds for Bledsoe. Salaries match up well and we're not giving up really anything of consequence.
Don't disagree with most of what you said, but when you bring up Rondo but say Dwight ain't it, I feel like you're a bit biased by watching the same guys on our team all the time. Like did you watch that much of Rondo before the playoffs? He just had a one-off strong playoff run and has been a pretty shaky player for many years now.


I mean, kinda nitpicking one part of the post but... I'm not saying Rondo is consistently a good player, but he provides veteran intangibles that present themselves when the games matter, ie the playoffs. At the moment, we do not have a guy like that.

Meanwhile, Dwight didn't do anything in the playoffs other than foul, and he continues that trend into this current regular season. I don't think we he will provide the veteran leadership needed when down in a playoff game/series to change momentum.

All of this said, Bledsoe could come here and not be good. I acknowledge that. I just think he's less exploitable in the playoffs and has more in his toolbox than Seth Curry and I'm not sure there's going to be many other options for the remainder of this season.



Bledsoe is a career 34% three point shooter, i dont think his shooting this year is sustainable. Without being a reliable threat from 3 i am not sure he has a place in the starting lineup. He has also been abysmal in the playoffs for the Bucks, averaging 12-13 ppg at below 50% TS. And that was during what is usually a player's peak years (28-30).

Having someone to play hard nosed defense in the playoffs may be good but Bledsoe gets around 18 mil for the next three years (last year not entirely guaranteed) and i dont think it makes sense for the current roster next to Simmons and Embiid. Maybe if his shooting this year was for real but i doubt it is.
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Re: Official 2020-21 Season Thread #1: To Beard or not To Beard? 

Post#365 » by Arsenal » Sat Feb 6, 2021 4:07 am

Durant pulled from game tonight and not traveling to Philly. Need to beat Nets tomorrow as they’re also on a B2B.
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Re: Official 2020-21 Season Thread #1: To Beard or not To Beard? 

Post#366 » by 76ciology » Sat Feb 6, 2021 5:03 am

DCasey91 wrote:Lowry is cooking the nets on the outside. Still at his age would be a very valuable player to us.


And you think Raps would just hand him out to us?

If Raps would just ask for expiring for him, then sure.
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Re: Official 2020-21 Season Thread #1: To Beard or not To Beard? 

Post#367 » by 76ciology » Sat Feb 6, 2021 5:16 am

I think the right move now is to hunt for guys who can help now that wouldnt cost much. I might even try to absorb bad contracts and get picks in return (Hield? Barnes?).

Then try to win with this group.

Do well in the draft.

Accumulate a set of assets. Then pounce when there’s another opportunity.
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Re: Official 2020-21 Season Thread #1: To Beard or not To Beard? 

Post#368 » by stormi » Sat Feb 6, 2021 5:45 am

DCasey91 wrote:Lowry is cooking the nets on the outside. Still at his age would be a very valuable player to us.


Read on Twitter


I see the idea gaining steam. He's really the only playmaking guard on the potential market right now that has the ability to move the needle for us. If they keeping winning their way back into the playoff race maybe Masai would be less inclined to deal him, but Masai also seems like a forward thinker that would make any move he sees putting the franchise in a better long term position. 2 firsts + Shake/Maxey for a 35 year old is a no in every single world though. That's a CJ McCollum package.
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Re: Official 2020-21 Season Thread #1: To Beard or not To Beard? 

Post#369 » by DCasey91 » Sat Feb 6, 2021 6:35 am

76ciology wrote:
DCasey91 wrote:Lowry is cooking the nets on the outside. Still at his age would be a very valuable player to us.


And you think Raps would just hand him out to us?

If Raps would just ask for expiring for him, then sure.



If the right deal is offered sure. Make no mistake he’d be our 2nd best player from day dot even at his age.

Shake + 1st rnd Pick and filler salaries for the backroom commitment to resign (2 years) I’ll gladly take that.

CP3 has a ungodly big contract, but guess what him + Embiid is money.

In comparsion to Harris’s contract it needs to be moved down the line. It’s just too much.

Role players:
Bjelica
Ilyasova
George Hill
Satoranksy
Mills

Some solid options there.

If there’s no star on the outside avaliable that’s the route id take personally. Won’t upset the teams chemistry/balance.

(I’m still hoping some way we get oladipo lol).
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Re: Official 2020-21 Season Thread #1: To Beard or not To Beard? 

Post#370 » by 76ciology » Sat Feb 6, 2021 8:15 am

Nahh..
im not trading shake, maxey, picks and any assets that would prevent me to be in the mix for the next disgruntled superstar.
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Re: Official 2020-21 Season Thread #1: To Beard or not To Beard? 

Post#371 » by 51X3RF4N » Sat Feb 6, 2021 2:00 pm

Yeah I think Morey is playing it smart right now.

1) The 2 stars on this team were BOTH relieved we didn't do the Harden deal. And they BOTH have endorsed Tobias, as well as finding continuity with this squad. They both think Seth is a perfect complementary piece. They both have talked up Maxey and Thybulle and Shake. If you trade any of those pieces, you better be getting back a difference maker so that ultimately Embiid and Simmons are happy with it.

2) There really isn't a market right now for a superstar that isn't a severe overpay.

3) Give the bench guys a chance to find their role and step into it. Maxey, Milton, Thybulle and Korkmaz are all kind of on the bubble of uncertainty. Can any of the 4 find a consistent role in the rotation? Shake is the only one that seems fringe playoff ready. But they've all dealt with limited minutes, injuries, etc. So give them some more time to put it together and let's see what we have versus what we need.

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Re: Official 2020-21 Season Thread #1: To Beard or not To Beard? 

Post#372 » by GutUNC » Sat Feb 6, 2021 3:31 pm

stormi wrote:
DCasey91 wrote:Lowry is cooking the nets on the outside. Still at his age would be a very valuable player to us.


Read on Twitter


I see the idea gaining steam. He's really the only playmaking guard on the potential market right now that has the ability to move the needle for us. If they keeping winning their way back into the playoff race maybe Masai would be less inclined to deal him, but Masai also seems like a forward thinker that would make any move he sees putting the franchise in a better long term position. 2 firsts + Shake/Maxey for a 35 year old is a no in every single world though. That's a CJ McCollum package.


I'm all for the Lowy idea but giving up all that for the right to lock in a soon to be 35 year old for 2 additional years ahead of time.....yikes. Trade for him as a rental if the price is right and then go into the offseason making a decision on him as your player who you've seen mesh with Jo and Ben.
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Re: Official 2020-21 Season Thread #1: To Beard or not To Beard? 

Post#373 » by Negrodamus » Sat Feb 6, 2021 3:50 pm

I'm curious what the Ben/Lowry relationship is like after these two events:

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Re: Official 2020-21 Season Thread #1: To Beard or not To Beard? 

Post#374 » by GutUNC » Sat Feb 6, 2021 4:47 pm

Negrodamus wrote:I'm curious what the Ben/Lowry relationship is like after these two events:



Lowry pulls the fake tough guy/flopper act with so many people, I doubt he even remembers.
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Re: Official 2020-21 Season Thread #1: To Beard or not To Beard? 

Post#375 » by youngcrev » Sat Feb 6, 2021 4:50 pm

I'd happily do Maxey/1st/expirings for Lowry if something like that was on the table, so I guess I'd have to still consider another pick. Much rather include Maxey than Shake even though he might have more upside since Shake is clearly able to help this team a lot more right now.

If you could do that AND manage to get JJ in a buyout AND find some type of stretch big for the bench... They might even be the favorites.
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Re: Official 2020-21 Season Thread #1: To Beard or not To Beard? 

Post#376 » by Stanford » Sat Feb 6, 2021 5:10 pm

Good lord, people
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Re: Official 2020-21 Season Thread #1: To Beard or not To Beard? 

Post#377 » by 76ciology » Sat Feb 6, 2021 5:44 pm

Stanford wrote:Good lord, people


:lol:
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Re: Official 2020-21 Season Thread #1: To Beard or not To Beard? 

Post#378 » by sixers hoops » Sat Feb 6, 2021 8:24 pm

stormi wrote:
DCasey91 wrote:Lowry is cooking the nets on the outside. Still at his age would be a very valuable player to us.


Read on Twitter


I see the idea gaining steam. He's really the only playmaking guard on the potential market right now that has the ability to move the needle for us. If they keeping winning their way back into the playoff race maybe Masai would be less inclined to deal him, but Masai also seems like a forward thinker that would make any move he sees putting the franchise in a better long term position. 2 firsts + Shake/Maxey for a 35 year old is a no in every single world though. That's a CJ McCollum package.


Yeah. That is insane. I’m glad he’s not our GM.
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Re: Official 2020-21 Season Thread #1: To Beard or not To Beard? 

Post#379 » by DCasey91 » Sat Feb 6, 2021 8:51 pm

Hey guys being emotionally attached to players who currently don’t move the needle/picks that are in the hypothetical air leads to teams not doing anything of note.

When Davis was available the Lakers cashed in their chips and got a chip out of it.

Embiid has a window, thus in direct part the teams has a window. Once Embiid’s window is gone that’s it the “Process” starts again.

Hinkie is 100% right if there is a star/superstar available you better push your chips in or live to regret the decision not to.

Leonard, Harden missed because of hypothetical ceilings/potential. Not what is reality. Paul too.
They are ATG for positions respectively.

Instead we went an even worse route “playing it safe” signing & resigning Harris + Horford, how’d did that go?

If there’s a big problem solve it as quick as possible or else the problem gets worse over time.

You telling me Milton + Picks is better than 2 years of Lowry? Cmon guys. All star/All NBA player > than that package not close.

Same with Ben + co for Leonard/Harden/Beal.
Talent is talent.

Don’t end up in a Barkley/Iverson situation all over again. Either way Morey for sure won’t let happen.
I’m guessing after this playoffs for better or worse some changes will be made. It’s about time too.


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Re: Official 2020-21 Season Thread #1: To Beard or not To Beard? 

Post#380 » by Zumramania » Sat Feb 6, 2021 9:30 pm

I believe Morey said it a few times and it sounds like a major commonplace - but we often forget to put ourselves in the perspective of the other team involved in a potential trade. Some posters here are underestimating the value of Lowry and overestimating the (current) value of some of our rotational players.

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