The Official Cunningham vs Suggs Thread #Tank4Either

[BoyzNTheHood]

Am I the only one that doesn't love this draft in the 15-20 range?

You aren't alone, but I think once you get past the higher tier guys in the top 10-12 you can find a lot of rock solid prospects who may not be superstars but will be quality NBA players like FVV or KLow

If we're saying the top guys are Cunningham, Mobley, Suggs, Green, Kuminga, Barnes, Keon Johnson, Springer, Greg Brown, Ziaire Williams, Jalen Johnson, Nix, Bouknight, Moody, Wagner, which is 15 guys; who are your next 5? Or who do you swap out if you disagree with my choice of the best 15?

Personally, I think you could go in any direction with the next 5. You could go with more solid NBA ready guys like Keyontae Johnson, Jared Butler, Corey Kispert, Ayo Dosunmu, Davion Mitchell, etc OR you could choose prospects with higher upside like BJ Boston, Terrence Shannon, Josh Christopher, Kai Jones, Cameron Thomas, etc.

So while it definitely drops off, I think we can still come out of this draft feeling pretty good about ourselves no matter which direction we choose to go in.

[Psubs]

Looks like pick 20-25 it is.

[720]

Looks like pick 20-25 it is.

We can draft a project player that’ll sit on our bench for 2-3 years and hopefully become good enough to maybe be a starter.

[Psubs]

Looks like pick 20-25 it is.

We can draft a project player that’ll sit on our bench for 2-3 years and hopefully become good enough to maybe be a starter.

Filip Petrusev would be a Junior and proven on the collegiate and pro level (leading the Adriatic league in scoring). At 6'11, able to play C.

Read on Twitter

[JShuttlesworth]

Am I the only one that doesn't love this draft in the 15-20 range?

You aren't alone, but I think once you get past the higher tier guys in the top 10-12 you can find a lot of rock solid prospects who may not be superstars but will be quality NBA players like FVV or KLow

If we're saying the top guys are Cunningham, Mobley, Suggs, Green, Kuminga, Barnes, Keon Johnson, Springer, Greg Brown, Ziaire Williams, Jalen Johnson, Nix, Bouknight, Moody, Wagner, which is 15 guys; who are your next 5? Or who do you swap out if you disagree with my choice of the best 15?

Personally, I think you could go in any direction with the next 5. You could go with more solid NBA ready guys like Keyontae Johnson, Jared Butler, Corey Kispert, Ayo Dosunmu, Davion Mitchell, etc OR you could choose prospects with higher upside like BJ Boston, Terrence Shannon, Josh Christopher, Kai Jones, Cameron Thomas, etc.

So while it definitely drops off, I think we can still come out of this draft feeling pretty good about ourselves no matter which direction we choose to go in.

Well first, getting a player comparable to Lowry or FVV would be a great outcome, but I think that's probably improbable. Lowry is a 6 time All-Star after all.

I think a handful of these guys should be on the board.

- Jaden Springer
- Keon Johnson
- Greg Brown
- Ziaire Williams
- Cameron Thomas
- Corey Kispert
- Josh Christopher

There's no one player on that list that stands out to me. I don't know how I feel about the Tennessee guards just yet, I'm not big on Johnson because he struggles to shoot it. At the very least, the thing I like is that those wings (SGs) listed have a lot more size than we currently have.

Is Keyontae Johnson healthy? I believe he was shutdown for the season following his collapse. I'm not really big on Boston, he looks like a long work in progress.

If we draft another point guard, and we re-sign Lowry, I will seriously be scratching my head.

The one thing I will say, is that player development matters. I am confident in our team's ability to properly develop whoever it is that we draft.

[Nebuchadnezzar]

Can the title of this thread be changed to something related to the 2021 draft? The thread title is no longer relevant.

[Nebuchadnezzar]

Can the title of this thread be changed to something related to the 2021 draft? The thread title is no longer relevant.

[Young_Buc]

Can the title of this thread be changed to something related to the 2021 draft? The thread title is no longer relevant.

he's right

[Psubs]

Well first, getting a player comparable to Lowry or FVV would be a great outcome, but I think that's probably improbable. Lowry is a 6 time All-Star after all.

I think a handful of these guys should be on the board.

- Jaden Springer
- Keon Johnson
- Greg Brown
- Ziaire Williams
- Cameron Thomas
- Corey Kispert
- Josh Christopher

There's no one player on that list that stands out to me. I don't know how I feel about the Tennessee guards just yet, I'm not big on Johnson because he struggles to shoot it. At the very least, the thing I like is that those wings (SGs) listed have a lot more size than we currently have.

Is Keyontae Johnson healthy? I believe he was shutdown for the season following his collapse. I'm not really big on Boston, he looks like a long work in progress.

If we draft another point guard, and we re-sign Lowry, I will seriously be scratching my head.

The one thing I will say, is that player development matters. I am confident in our team's ability to properly develop whoever it is that we draft.

I think Greg Brown drops because he's so raw with his 2 assists and 32 turnovers! Jaden McDaniels fell to #28.

I'm all for Filip Petrusev with a pick in the 20's. Kai Jones is like a raw Petrusev that needs 3 years to catch up but is only 1 year younger.

[Syd-TK3]

Just draft Boston and hope college was a outlier and we can get him right

[BoyzNTheHood]

Am I the only one that doesn't love this draft in the 15-20 range?

You aren't alone, but I think once you get past the higher tier guys in the top 10-12 you can find a lot of rock solid prospects who may not be superstars but will be quality NBA players like FVV or KLow

If we're saying the top guys are Cunningham, Mobley, Suggs, Green, Kuminga, Barnes, Keon Johnson, Springer, Greg Brown, Ziaire Williams, Jalen Johnson, Nix, Bouknight, Moody, Wagner, which is 15 guys; who are your next 5? Or who do you swap out if you disagree with my choice of the best 15?

Personally, I think you could go in any direction with the next 5. You could go with more solid NBA ready guys like Keyontae Johnson, Jared Butler, Corey Kispert, Ayo Dosunmu, Davion Mitchell, etc OR you could choose prospects with higher upside like BJ Boston, Terrence Shannon, Josh Christopher, Kai Jones, Cameron Thomas, etc.

So while it definitely drops off, I think we can still come out of this draft feeling pretty good about ourselves no matter which direction we choose to go in.

Well first, getting a player comparable to Lowry or FVV would be a great outcome, but I think that's probably improbable. Lowry is a 6 time All-Star after all.

I think a handful of these guys should be on the board.

- Jaden Springer
- Keon Johnson
- Greg Brown
- Ziaire Williams
- Cameron Thomas
- Corey Kispert
- Josh Christopher

There's no one player on that list that stands out to me. I don't know how I feel about the Tennessee guards just yet, I'm not big on Johnson because he struggles to shoot it. At the very least, the thing I like is that those wings (SGs) listed have a lot more size than we currently have.

Is Keyontae Johnson healthy? I believe he was shutdown for the season following his collapse. I'm not really big on Boston, he looks like a long work in progress.

If we draft another point guard, and we re-sign Lowry, I will seriously be scratching my head.

The one thing I will say, is that player development matters. I am confident in our team's ability to properly develop whoever it is that we draft.

It's not improbable when you have great scouting. Lowry was picked 24th overall, and Fred as we all know was undrafted.

The thing about picking between 15-25 is that no one usually stands out otherwise they'd be ranked much higher. But if you look deeper into their games, past the flash you might be able to find a gem. On that list I think any of them are a great selection if we're picking later on in the draft. All of those players can be developed into productivity.

Keyontae is solid as a rock, and if he isn't healthy right now he probably won't declare this year. If he is healthy you're getting a beefy, tough wing prospect. I'm thinking Joey Graham with slightly less muscle and a helluva lot more brain.

And I'll admit, drafting another point guard and re-signing Kyle wouldn't be my ideal scenario but if that point guard is the obvious choice at our spot then I'm fine with it.

[BoyzNTheHood]

Well first, getting a player comparable to Lowry or FVV would be a great outcome, but I think that's probably improbable. Lowry is a 6 time All-Star after all.

I think a handful of these guys should be on the board.

- Jaden Springer
- Keon Johnson
- Greg Brown
- Ziaire Williams
- Cameron Thomas
- Corey Kispert
- Josh Christopher

There's no one player on that list that stands out to me. I don't know how I feel about the Tennessee guards just yet, I'm not big on Johnson because he struggles to shoot it. At the very least, the thing I like is that those wings (SGs) listed have a lot more size than we currently have.

Is Keyontae Johnson healthy? I believe he was shutdown for the season following his collapse. I'm not really big on Boston, he looks like a long work in progress.

If we draft another point guard, and we re-sign Lowry, I will seriously be scratching my head.

The one thing I will say, is that player development matters. I am confident in our team's ability to properly develop whoever it is that we draft.

I think Greg Brown drops because he's so raw with his 2 assists and 32 turnovers! Jaden McDaniels fell to #28.

I'm all for Filip Petrusev with a pick in the 20's. Kai Jones is like a raw Petrusev that needs 3 years to catch up but is only 1 year younger.

That number is troubling, but his potential is mouth watering

[JShuttlesworth]

Even Ziaire Williams, who has a nice soft looking jumper when he gets it off clean, struggles .367 FG% and a low 12.7 PER. It makes me think we won't be interested.

One thing I notice about Masai / Bobby picks, they tend to have a per above 20, regardless of where we draft them. The trend really seems noticeable after 2014, which was a bad draft for us.

Raptors Draft Picks by PER

2014 - Bruno Caboclo (NA), Deandre Daniels (20.0)
2015 - Delon Wright (29.2)
2016 - Jakob Pöltl (31.1), Pascal Siakam (31.6)
2017 - OG Anunoby (23.8)
2019 - Dewan Hernandez (22.1)
2020 - Malachi Flynn (27.7), Jalen Harris (26.4)

Mind you, all of our picks played more than one NCAA season, and not all were above 20 PER in their rookie NCAA season.

[BoyzNTheHood]

Even Ziaire Williams, who has a nice soft looking jumper when he gets it off clean, struggles .367 FG% and a low 12.7 PER. It makes me think we won't be interested.

One thing I notice about Masai / Bobby picks, they tend to have a per above 20, regardless of where we draft them. The trend really seems noticeable after 2014, which was a bad draft for us.

Raptors Draft Picks by PER

2014 - Bruno Caboclo (NA), Deandre Daniels (20.0)
2015 - Delon Wright (29.2)
2016 - Jakob Pöltl (31.1), Pascal Siakam (31.6)
2017 - OG Anunoby (23.8)
2019 - Dewan Hernandez (22.1)
2020 - Malachi Flynn (27.7), Jalen Harris (26.4)

Mind you, all of our picks played more than one NCAA season, and not all were above 20 PER in their rookie NCAA season.

If that's a real trend, and efficiency is something our management looks for maybe the Champagnie brothers could be real targets at our range. I think PSubs mentioned them earlier, and there's no reason that they shouldn't be ranked as 1st rounders yet unless they plan on returning to school.

[HeadtopChunes]

Kai Jones I like as a Christian Wood type project big

Greg Brown not feeling it, the game feel is a real problem

[Psubs]

Just draft Boston and hope college was a outlier and we can get him right

He could turn out like Kelly Oubre but then can just someone for the MLE to do the job.

I want a big.

[Psubs]

Even Ziaire Williams, who has a nice soft looking jumper when he gets it off clean, struggles .367 FG% and a low 12.7 PER. It makes me think we won't be interested.

One thing I notice about Masai / Bobby picks, they tend to have a per above 20, regardless of where we draft them. The trend really seems noticeable after 2014, which was a bad draft for us.

Raptors Draft Picks by PER

2014 - Bruno Caboclo (NA), Deandre Daniels (20.0)
2015 - Delon Wright (29.2)
2016 - Jakob Pöltl (31.1), Pascal Siakam (31.6)
2017 - OG Anunoby (23.8)
2019 - Dewan Hernandez (22.1)
2020 - Malachi Flynn (27.7), Jalen Harris (26.4)

Mind you, all of our picks played more than one NCAA season, and not all were above 20 PER in their rookie NCAA season.

If that's a real trend, and efficiency is something our management looks for maybe the Champagnie brothers could be real targets at our range. I think PSubs mentioned them earlier, and there's no reason that they shouldn't be ranked as 1st rounders yet unless they plan on returning to school.

They made the decision to play at different schools and they are both leading their good schools. Crazy that they are both really beasting in their 2nd years.

Justin gets A LOT of rebounds thus he PER is over 30, while Julian is at 24.

Pertrusev had a PER of 25 as a freshman and 30 as a sophomore. His 3pt shooting has increased in range and %!!! I think it has to do with him getting stronger. I'm cool with giving Watson and Watanabe more playing time going forward so the Champagnie twins are not really needed. PF/C is still a glaring weakness.

I think getting high PER players has them hitting more often. Memphis did well with Bane and Tillman. I think that's what the Raptors are going to continue doing (Bruno was an early misstep).

[Psubs]

I'm creating the Wat Test!!!

If looking at prospects that play SG, SF or PF, the question to ask is, do they look like they'll actually be better than Watson or Watanabe?

[Brinbe]

this is the guy you wanna tank for?

[PhilBlackson]

Well first, getting a player comparable to Lowry or FVV would be a great outcome, but I think that's probably improbable. Lowry is a 6 time All-Star after all.

I think a handful of these guys should be on the board.

- Jaden Springer
- Keon Johnson
- Greg Brown
- Ziaire Williams
- Cameron Thomas
- Corey Kispert
- Josh Christopher

Of that list Josh Christopher stands out the most to me and I'd actually be incredibly happy if we somehow ended up with him at our likely 18th-21st pick. He looks like a walking bucket and this team absolutely NEEDS someone who can do so...

Following that it would be Williams because all the skill is there but maybe our developmental team can push more out of him. I don't mind Brown because he has a raw "OG-esque" type of vibe to him and we've obviously turned him into one of the better high level 3+D players but he def wouldn't be top of my list.

Personally will be one of Barnes (mainly) or Johnson somehow drop into laps but I've said it a few times but guys like Bouknight or Duke scream "Raptor types of pick lately. Guys with at least a couple years under their belt and supposedly more "NBA ready". Won't be thrilled with that outcome because I think their ceiling is yet another high end roleplayer and I just believe guys like Christopher, Williams (ofc Barnes or Johnson) have more all star level potential....the one guy who I do at this point seeing dropping is Boston but personally I'd rather roll the dice on him than a supposed NBA ready player that almost certainly projects as a high level rotation player, we already have plenty of those and have to find a way to raise the team's ceiling as 1st rd to 2md rd at best fodder.