Official trade thread/buy-out market 20-21 edition

[stan francisco]

Ibaka to the Clips still bothers me.

[zimpy27]

Would be good to get Lonzo back over Schroeder.

[lazybatman]

The sacrifice in depth to bring Beal, feels just too much. Besides I think he's got some under the table business going on with the Wizards.. Why else would any max guy sign extentions there.

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[Hoopz Afrik]

Would be good to get Lonzo back over Schroeder.

Why would you want that? Legit question.

[zimpy27]

Would be good to get Lonzo back over Schroeder.

Why would you want that? Legit question.

Because Lonzo is more impactful and has less ego. Probably gets paid less.

LeBron, THT, KCP, Davis, C
Lonzo, Caruso, Kuzma, Morris, Harrell

[Hoopz Afrik]

Would be good to get Lonzo back over Schroeder.

Why would you want that? Legit question.

Because Lonzo is more impactful and has less ego. Probably gets paid less.

LeBron, THT, KCP, Davis, C
Lonzo, Caruso, Kuzma, Morris, Harrell

The ego thing is arguable and Lonzo will likely make less than Schroder but the impact thing? I don't see that at all. Not even close IMO. Better defense at the point of attack, much more consistent effort, more effective getting to the basket and to the line. I'm not sure how you came to that conclusion but to each his/her own.

Plus, they've already been that road and I doubt they'd want to revisit that one.

[lazybatman]

Why would you want that? Legit question.

Because Lonzo is more impactful and has less ego. Probably gets paid less.

LeBron, THT, KCP, Davis, C
Lonzo, Caruso, Kuzma, Morris, Harrell

The ego thing is arguable and Lonzo will likely make less than Schroder but the impact thing? I don't see that at all. Not even close IMO. Better defense at the point of attack, much more consistent effort, more effective getting to the basket and to the line. I'm not sure how you came to that conclusion but to each his/her own.

Plus, they've already been that road and I doubt they'd want to revisit that one.

Yeah.. Lonzo is not in the same tier right now mate. Schroeder's defense is outstanding, which alone puts him a tier above, and then add the iso offense he reliably can create whenever he wants.

I do wish we switched up Schroeder and Caruso's minutes for better balance, but not trading him straight up for Lonzo, as much as I love his game.

[zimpy27]

Because Lonzo is more impactful and has less ego. Probably gets paid less.

LeBron, THT, KCP, Davis, C
Lonzo, Caruso, Kuzma, Morris, Harrell

The ego thing is arguable and Lonzo will likely make less than Schroder but the impact thing? I don't see that at all. Not even close IMO. Better defense at the point of attack, much more consistent effort, more effective getting to the basket and to the line. I'm not sure how you came to that conclusion but to each his/her own.

Plus, they've already been that road and I doubt they'd want to revisit that one.

Yeah.. Lonzo is not in the same tier right now mate. Schroeder's defense is outstanding, which alone puts him a tier above, and then add the iso offense he reliably can create whenever he wants.

I do wish we switched up Schroeder and Caruso's minutes for better balance, but not trading him straight up for Lonzo, as much as I love his game.

I will wait to see if Schroeder can get his offense up but Lonzo is the superior defender, Schroeder is more of a pest

[lazybatman]

The ego thing is arguable and Lonzo will likely make less than Schroder but the impact thing? I don't see that at all. Not even close IMO. Better defense at the point of attack, much more consistent effort, more effective getting to the basket and to the line. I'm not sure how you came to that conclusion but to each his/her own.

Plus, they've already been that road and I doubt they'd want to revisit that one.

Yeah.. Lonzo is not in the same tier right now mate. Schroeder's defense is outstanding, which alone puts him a tier above, and then add the iso offense he reliably can create whenever he wants.

I do wish we switched up Schroeder and Caruso's minutes for better balance, but not trading him straight up for Lonzo, as much as I love his game.

I will wait to see if Schroeder can get his offense up but Lonzo is the superior defender, Schroeder is more of a pest

Lonzo has better size and potential IMO, but what Schroeder has been doing so far since the trade is pretty special.

Here's a stat I picked up on twitter -

Schröder’s defense this season:

Stephen Curry: 0-9 FG, 1 TO
John Wall: 0-5 FG, 7 TO’s
Luka Doncic: 0-4 FG, 1 TO
DeMar DeRozan: 1-5 FG
D’Angelo Russell: 1-3 FG, 5 TO’s
Trae Young: 1-4 FG, 2 TO’s
Jamal Murray: 1-3 FG, 3 TO’s
James Harden: 1-3 FG, 1 TO’s

Don't remember the codes to post the tweet, or I would.

Talent and ability are only half the battle. Fitness and conviction the other. Schroeder's effort and tenacity have been amazing so far.

I am kinda dissappointed in his playmaking ability and execution, which is where Lonzo excels. If Schroeder wasn't here, I would have been overjoyed to have Lonzo replacing Rondo. But, I suggested we explore the Ben Simmons + Seth Curry for Schroeder + Trez in an earlier post here. So that's where I think Schroeder ranks.

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[stan francisco]

Lonzo is a brainiac defender. Reads the game like few ever have. Great help defender. He has size and quickness enough for switches 1-3. Like Simmons, he makes any offense 4 on 5 by not having a jump shot. I think Rob will pass on both Ball and Simmons in trades because of that incompleteness.

[stan francisco]

Yeah.. Lonzo is not in the same tier right now mate. Schroeder's defense is outstanding, which alone puts him a tier above, and then add the iso offense he reliably can create whenever he wants.

I do wish we switched up Schroeder and Caruso's minutes for better balance, but not trading him straight up for Lonzo, as much as I love his game.

I will wait to see if Schroeder can get his offense up but Lonzo is the superior defender, Schroeder is more of a pest

Lonzo has better size and potential IMO, but what Schroeder has been doing so far since the trade is pretty special.

Here's a stat I picked up on twitter -

Schröder’s defense this season:

Stephen Curry: 0-9 FG, 1 TO
John Wall: 0-5 FG, 7 TO’s
Luka Doncic: 0-4 FG, 1 TO
DeMar DeRozan: 1-5 FG
D’Angelo Russell: 1-3 FG, 5 TO’s
Trae Young: 1-4 FG, 2 TO’s
Jamal Murray: 1-3 FG, 3 TO’s
James Harden: 1-3 FG, 1 TO’s

Don't remember the codes to post the tweet, or I would.

Talent and ability are only half the battle. Fitness and conviction the other. Schroeder's effort and tenacity have been amazing so far.

I am kinda dissappointed in his playmaking ability and execution, which is where Lonzo excels. If Schroeder wasn't here, I would have been overjoyed to have Lonzo replacing Rondo. But, I suggested we explore the Ben Simmons + Seth Curry for Schroeder + Trez in an earlier post here. So that's where I think Schroeder ranks.

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That’s an impressive list but I want to see a bigger sample size before starting bandwagoning. He’s like an annoying fly on defense, makes a lot of noise and is frenetically energetic. I love his conviction and focus. I think he can improve his help defense and get a better grasp of how to direct the defense vocally. Let’s not mistake activity for achievement.

On offense, he needs to do the opposite. Calm down. Unless on the break or in a one on one situation, chill t f out, Dennis! Survey calmly, dissect, use your noggin more and wear out your knees less. He’s bouncing the ball and running hard too much. This is not some junk roster. AD and LBJ and AC and KCP and so on are all perfectly capable of handling the rock. It seems his ego can’t manage to ‘delegate’ to them. At least not enough per my judgment. AD needs touches.

But I like quiet passing and assassinating-by-committee string music type team ball. Schröder would still have some winning over work to do before I’d sign him long term.

[Showtime:Part2]

The ego thing is arguable and Lonzo will likely make less than Schroder but the impact thing? I don't see that at all. Not even close IMO. Better defense at the point of attack, much more consistent effort, more effective getting to the basket and to the line. I'm not sure how you came to that conclusion but to each his/her own.

Plus, they've already been that road and I doubt they'd want to revisit that one.

Yeah.. Lonzo is not in the same tier right now mate. Schroeder's defense is outstanding, which alone puts him a tier above, and then add the iso offense he reliably can create whenever he wants.

I do wish we switched up Schroeder and Caruso's minutes for better balance, but not trading him straight up for Lonzo, as much as I love his game.

I will wait to see if Schroeder can get his offense up but Lonzo is the superior defender, Schroeder is more of a pest

Agree w this whole heartedly. Lonzo is highly effective off the ball and is a better catch and shoot guy from 3 than Dennis. With the emergence of tht as a playmaker, we don’t need Dennis and his inefficient black hole ways on offense. And last but not least, as you mentioned zo is a significantly better defender and can switch on to bigger guards like pg and kawhi and harden as he has huge size on Dennis.

[bb22]

Yeah.. Lonzo is not in the same tier right now mate. Schroeder's defense is outstanding, which alone puts him a tier above, and then add the iso offense he reliably can create whenever he wants.

I do wish we switched up Schroeder and Caruso's minutes for better balance, but not trading him straight up for Lonzo, as much as I love his game.

I will wait to see if Schroeder can get his offense up but Lonzo is the superior defender, Schroeder is more of a pest

Agree w this whole heartedly. Lonzo is highly effective off the ball and is a better catch and shoot guy from 3 than Dennis. With the emergence of tht as a playmaker, we don’t need Dennis and his inefficient black hole ways on offense. And last but not least, as you mentioned zo is a significantly better defender and can switch on to bigger guards like pg and kawhi and harden as he has huge size on Dennis.

This is amusing, but Lonzo is never coming back here.
I haven’t been following him much since he left, but I would be willing to bet that his numbers and impact would significantly fall if he was put in Dennis’ role. Lakers already have a guy that can do what Lonzo does, including shooting the open 3 at a higher rate, in Caruso.
Lakers need Dennis for his aggressiveness on offense and penetrating ability. I think he should be playing more with the second unit, but nevertheless he fits with this team perfectly.
I keep hoping Lakers package Kuz for something, but he’s been a great role player lately so I don’t see that happening.

[lazybatman]

This is amusing, but Lonzo is never coming back here.
I haven’t been following him much since he left, but I would be willing to bet that his numbers and impact would significantly fall if he was put in Dennis’ role. Lakers already have a guy that can do what Lonzo does, including shooting the open 3 at a higher rate, in Caruso.
Lakers need Dennis for his aggressiveness on offense and penetrating ability. I think he should be playing more with the second unit, but nevertheless he fits with this team perfectly.
I keep hoping Lakers package Kuz for something, but he’s been a great role player lately so I don’t see that happening.

I dont fully agree. They're both extremely high IQ basketballers, but very different strengths.

Caruso's probably a fringe All NBA level defender, but he doesn't have the playmaking ability of Lonzo. Caruso doesn't have the skill & vision of Lonzo, but he's already identified how he can impact winning. I don't think Caruso is that far away from his peak now, and he's pretty damn good.

Lonzo is still finding himself, and could be a a few years away from growing into his peak. Lonzo could turn out to be a way better player in the end, but at this moment I wouldn't trade them.

The more I think about it, the more I find myself buying into the Schroeder for Lonzo deal somebody suggested here. Lonzo could theoretically replace Dennis' scoring by facilitating a smoother offensive scheme, some P&R action than drive / throw the ball to AD in the middle.

I don't remember seeing Lonzo running P&R sets either though.. not sure if he's developed that, but hopeful.

Still think it's worth calling Morey for the Simmons+Curry deal, before this though. Nothing to lose there.

[lazybatman]

Read on Twitter

Ben Simmons Ridiculous graphic from GB.

And AD has not been all that shabby considering the flak we been giving him lately.

[bb22]

This is amusing, but Lonzo is never coming back here.
I haven’t been following him much since he left, but I would be willing to bet that his numbers and impact would significantly fall if he was put in Dennis’ role. Lakers already have a guy that can do what Lonzo does, including shooting the open 3 at a higher rate, in Caruso.
Lakers need Dennis for his aggressiveness on offense and penetrating ability. I think he should be playing more with the second unit, but nevertheless he fits with this team perfectly.
I keep hoping Lakers package Kuz for something, but he’s been a great role player lately so I don’t see that happening.

I dont fully agree. They're both extremely high IQ basketballers, but very different strengths.

Caruso's probably a fringe All NBA level defender, but he doesn't have the playmaking ability of Lonzo. Caruso doesn't have the skill & vision of Lonzo, but he's already identified how he can impact winning. I don't think Caruso is that far away from his peak now, and he's pretty damn good.

Lonzo is still finding himself, and could be a a few years away from growing into his peak. Lonzo could turn out to be a way better player in the end, but at this moment I wouldn't trade them.

The more I think about it, the more I find myself buying into the Schroeder for Lonzo deal somebody suggested here. Lonzo could theoretically replace Dennis' scoring by facilitating a smoother offensive scheme, some P&R action than drive / throw the ball to AD in the middle.

I don't remember seeing Lonzo running P&R sets either though.. not sure if he's developed that, but hopeful.

Still think it's worth calling Morey for the Simmons+Curry deal, before this though. Nothing to lose there.

I get way your saying, Lonzo is definiely an asset and someone I’d like to have around once Bron is gone. But I still think Schroeder is a better overall shooter and scorer (much better at getting to the rim), which is what this current team needs.
Also, Lonzo would be hard to play late in some close games because of his poor FT shooting, which would be unacceptable next to lebron.
Again, I haven’t watched much of him this year. But we’ve all seen players “thrive” after leaving LA.

[tamaraw08]

This is amusing, but Lonzo is never coming back here.
I haven’t been following him much since he left, but I would be willing to bet that his numbers and impact would significantly fall if he was put in Dennis’ role. Lakers already have a guy that can do what Lonzo does, including shooting the open 3 at a higher rate, in Caruso.
Lakers need Dennis for his aggressiveness on offense and penetrating ability. I think he should be playing more with the second unit, but nevertheless he fits with this team perfectly.
I keep hoping Lakers package Kuz for something, but he’s been a great role player lately so I don’t see that happening.

I dont fully agree. They're both extremely high IQ basketballers, but very different strengths.

Caruso's probably a fringe All NBA level defender, but he doesn't have the playmaking ability of Lonzo. Caruso doesn't have the skill & vision of Lonzo, but he's already identified how he can impact winning. I don't think Caruso is that far away from his peak now, and he's pretty damn good.

Lonzo is still finding himself, and could be a a few years away from growing into his peak. Lonzo could turn out to be a way better player in the end, but at this moment I wouldn't trade them.

The more I think about it, the more I find myself buying into the Schroeder for Lonzo deal somebody suggested here. Lonzo could theoretically replace Dennis' scoring by facilitating a smoother offensive scheme, some P&R action than drive / throw the ball to AD in the middle.

I don't remember seeing Lonzo running P&R sets either though.. not sure if he's developed that, but hopeful.

Still think it's worth calling Morey for the Simmons+Curry deal, before this though. Nothing to lose there.

I get way your saying, Lonzo is definiely an asset and someone I’d like to have around once Bron is gone. But I still think Schroeder is a better overall shooter and scorer (much better at getting to the rim), which is what this current team needs.
Also, Lonzo would be hard to play late in some close games because of his poor FT shooting, which would be unacceptable next to lebron.
Again, I haven’t watched much of him this year. But we’ve all seen players “thrive” after leaving LA.

I am not sure how many of us here had a chance to watch him play many time lately, I try to but let's examine the numbers.
His 3pt shooting is actually up to 36.7% and has increased his Pts/game at 13.4 pts which is good, right?
Well, his rebounds AND ASSISTS are at his career all time low at 4.3 and 4.6 respectively.
Also, the guy barely attacks the basket only taking 17.4 % of his attempts from 0-3 feet WHILE TAKING 60% from beyond 3pt line and his FTs/game has been his career low of .8 attempts/game.
per basketballref, the league ave 3pt Attempt rate is 39.4%, he is at 60% while his FT att rate is .07
If you are a fan of his, you can say, well, he can spot up for this team well, then... ahhh, Caruso, KCP, Kuzma have been shooting above 39% from there so....
His defensive stats are at an all time low with a DRTG of 112(106 first year) and DBPM of .3 (+1.6 rookie year)
Personally, I wouldn't mind his presence here but NOT at the expense of giving up Schroder who is a dynamic scorer, who has FT rate of 30.7, currenty, he is struggling with his shooting and still finding his way through the offense esp with Lebron dominating the ball but at some point, Lebron will slow down 2+ years from now, and I can't see Ball stepping up when this happens.

[Kilroy]

I went ahead and merged this with the stickied trade thread... I figured we needed this stickied but we already had the trade thread so that just seemed like the logical solution.
-Kilroy

[lazybatman]

I went ahead and merged this with the stickied trade thread... I figured we needed this stickied but we already had the trade thread so that just seemed like the logical solution.
-Kilroy

Good call. Thanks mate.

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[Slava]

I'd love to get Capela out of Atlanta as the long term rim running center next to AD.