Game 26 : Cleveland Cavaliers (10-15) @ Denver Nuggets (12-11) - 9:00PM

[jbk1234]

And yeah, get Drummond out of here. And get Love back and healthy so someone will trade for him(clippers?).

No one is trading for Love until this summer, and that's only if he stays healthy and plays well. But the Cavs don't really have a replacement, and if Allen is a key piece, he is, then you need a stretch 4 alongside him. We're 30th, aka dead last, offensively without Love. I'm not sure we should be in any rush to trade him at this point.

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[JonFromVA]

Maybe they should go back to shooting all the floaters? It at least lets us take advantage of one of our few strengths (offensive rebounding).

The Cavs are veering towards unwatchable again, hopefully JBB has some better ideas than the "twin tower" approach.

Our floor spacing was bad enough before JBB decided to go with two 7 footers who can't shoot, and Okoro's shooting has just gotten worse this month.

We have some lineups that have worked without Nance, I'd suggest JBB try one of them as the starting unit:

Allen-Prince-Okoro-Sexton-Garland are +26 in just 36 minutes. Seems like a no-brainer to give that lineup a chance to start, other than the uncomfortable part where JBB has to inform Drummond that he's coming off the bench.

https://www.basketball-reference.com/teams/CLE/2021/lineups/

[Harper4Ferry?]

This team is definitely unwatchable at this point. Without Larry we don't play any sort of winning type basketball. Drummond just keeps taking horrible possessions. Sexton and Garland hate taking 3's, which as Gen Z players that's borderline unbelievable to me.
Windler should be shooting a lot more. TBH he should be splitting time with Okoro 50/50 at this point.

[jbk1234]

Maybe they should go back to shooting all the floaters? It at least lets us take advantage of one of our few strengths (offensive rebounding).

The Cavs are veering towards unwatchable again, hopefully JBB has some better ideas than the "twin tower" approach.

Our floor spacing was bad enough before JBB decided to go with two 7 footers who can't shoot, and Okoro's shooting has just gotten worse this month.

We have some lineups that have worked without Nance, I'd suggest JBB try one of them as the starting unit:

Allen-Prince-Okoro-Sexton-Garland are +26 in just 36 minutes. Seems like a no-brainer to give that lineup a chance to start, other than the uncomfortable part where JBB has to inform Drummond that he's coming off the bench.

https://www.basketball-reference.com/teams/CLE/2021/lineups/

See, to me, I think Prince should play with Drummond to open up the floor and because Drummond is going to steal rebounds from whoever plays PF with him anyway. Assuming Love's calf strain isn't actually Achilles tendinitis, it's probably time to speed up his recovery process. I think he'd play very well alongside Allen. Whether Drummond should start or not should probably depend upon the opponent. There are games where he's frustrating, there are also games where he's one of our best offensive threats. I'm not against giving Windler some run as a starter but he's going to get roasted against elite SFs.

Trigger warning Stillwater

Spoiler:

I think it's probably time to see how Sexton looks as a 6th man. Especially if we're going to start Windler

[JonFromVA]

Maybe they should go back to shooting all the floaters? It at least lets us take advantage of one of our few strengths (offensive rebounding).

The Cavs are veering towards unwatchable again, hopefully JBB has some better ideas than the "twin tower" approach.

Our floor spacing was bad enough before JBB decided to go with two 7 footers who can't shoot, and Okoro's shooting has just gotten worse this month.

We have some lineups that have worked without Nance, I'd suggest JBB try one of them as the starting unit:

Allen-Prince-Okoro-Sexton-Garland are +26 in just 36 minutes. Seems like a no-brainer to give that lineup a chance to start, other than the uncomfortable part where JBB has to inform Drummond that he's coming off the bench.

https://www.basketball-reference.com/teams/CLE/2021/lineups/

See, to me, I think Prince should play with Drummond to open up the floor and because Drummond is going to steal rebounds from whoever plays PF with him anyway. Assuming Love's calf strain isn't actually Achilles tendinitis, it's probably time to speed up his recovery process. I think he'd play very well alongside Allen. Whether Drummond should start or not should probably depend upon the opponent. There are games where he's frustrating, there are also games where he's one of our best offensive threats. I'm not against giving Windler some run as a starter but he's going to get roasted against elite SFs.

Trigger warning Stillwater

Spoiler:

I think it's probably time to see how Sexton looks as a 6th man. Especially if we're going to start Windler

While I'm fine with any experiment JBB cares to try *if* it's for the purpose of trying to find something that addresses the problems the team is having - my preference is to at least start with the lineups that emphasize our expected core. So, no Drummond.

As much as I'd like to see Windler add his shooting to the starting unit, I think he's still getting his feet wet and needs more time to adjust and build up some confidence in his shot. - alas sometimes there's a chicken & the egg problem holding a player back.

We do have one productive lineup with Drummond and Prince, but it features Cedi in for Garland, with Sexton and Okoro. So... yeah, if you want to go down that path, Garland may need to be the odd man out.

[jbk1234]

Maybe they should go back to shooting all the floaters? It at least lets us take advantage of one of our few strengths (offensive rebounding).

The Cavs are veering towards unwatchable again, hopefully JBB has some better ideas than the "twin tower" approach.

Our floor spacing was bad enough before JBB decided to go with two 7 footers who can't shoot, and Okoro's shooting has just gotten worse this month.

We have some lineups that have worked without Nance, I'd suggest JBB try one of them as the starting unit:

Allen-Prince-Okoro-Sexton-Garland are +26 in just 36 minutes. Seems like a no-brainer to give that lineup a chance to start, other than the uncomfortable part where JBB has to inform Drummond that he's coming off the bench.

https://www.basketball-reference.com/teams/CLE/2021/lineups/

See, to me, I think Prince should play with Drummond to open up the floor and because Drummond is going to steal rebounds from whoever plays PF with him anyway. Assuming Love's calf strain isn't actually Achilles tendinitis, it's probably time to speed up his recovery process. I think he'd play very well alongside Allen. Whether Drummond should start or not should probably depend upon the opponent. There are games where he's frustrating, there are also games where he's one of our best offensive threats. I'm not against giving Windler some run as a starter but he's going to get roasted against elite SFs.

Trigger warning Stillwater

Spoiler:

I think it's probably time to see how Sexton looks as a 6th man. Especially if we're going to start Windler

While I'm fine with any experiment JBB cares to try *if* it's for the purpose of trying to find something that addresses the problems the team is having - my preference is to at least start with the lineups that emphasize our expected core. So, no Drummond.

As much as I'd like to see Windler add his shooting to the starting unit, I think he's still getting his feet wet and needs more time to adjust and build up some confidence in his shot. - alas sometimes there's a chicken & the egg problem holding a player back.

We do have one productive lineup with Drummond and Prince, but it features Cedi in for Garland, with Sexton and Okoro. So... yeah, if you want to go down that path, Garland may need to be the odd man out.

I think you need to be really careful when projecting which lineups are productive based on small sample sizes when played against
very different opponents. But I have a difficult time getting too invested in who is out there starting or playing with who. We're a bad team without Love and Nance. Moving the deck chairs around while playing top 10 teams is only going to change so much. As far as I'm concerned, Allen and Garland are the only players on the roster who I'd identify as core pieces. Okoro could get there by working on his shot this off season. Nance is clearly a guy whose absence is felt on the court.

[JonFromVA]

See, to me, I think Prince should play with Drummond to open up the floor and because Drummond is going to steal rebounds from whoever plays PF with him anyway. Assuming Love's calf strain isn't actually Achilles tendinitis, it's probably time to speed up his recovery process. I think he'd play very well alongside Allen. Whether Drummond should start or not should probably depend upon the opponent. There are games where he's frustrating, there are also games where he's one of our best offensive threats. I'm not against giving Windler some run as a starter but he's going to get roasted against elite SFs.

Trigger warning Stillwater

Spoiler:

I think it's probably time to see how Sexton looks as a 6th man. Especially if we're going to start Windler

While I'm fine with any experiment JBB cares to try *if* it's for the purpose of trying to find something that addresses the problems the team is having - my preference is to at least start with the lineups that emphasize our expected core. So, no Drummond.

As much as I'd like to see Windler add his shooting to the starting unit, I think he's still getting his feet wet and needs more time to adjust and build up some confidence in his shot. - alas sometimes there's a chicken & the egg problem holding a player back.

We do have one productive lineup with Drummond and Prince, but it features Cedi in for Garland, with Sexton and Okoro. So... yeah, if you want to go down that path, Garland may need to be the odd man out.

I think you need to be really careful when projecting which lineups are productive based on small sample sizes when played against
very different opponents. But I have a difficult time getting too invested in who is out there starting or playing with who. We're a bad team without Love and Nance. Moving the deck chairs around while playing top 10 teams is only going to change so much. As far as I'm concerned, Allen and Garland are the only players on the roster who I'd identify as core pieces. Okoro could get there by working on his shot this off season. Nance is clearly a guy whose absence is felt on the court.

Well, if the Cavs would actually try some of the lineups that show promise, we'd have better data ... but realistically, JBB needs to be careful which toes he steps on. Trying to build a workable lineup around the players we consider core is about the safest thing he can try and as a bonus Allen and Prince are familiar with each other, Prince currently leads the team in 3pt%, and running P&R/lobs with Allen gives both Garland and Sexton something else to do.

The goal here is to develop young players in competitive games and build up our offensive/defensive systems. We need to achieve a certain base level for that to happen, not just run post-up's to Andre or hope someone goes off playing hero ball.

[jbk1234]

While I'm fine with any experiment JBB cares to try *if* it's for the purpose of trying to find something that addresses the problems the team is having - my preference is to at least start with the lineups that emphasize our expected core. So, no Drummond.

As much as I'd like to see Windler add his shooting to the starting unit, I think he's still getting his feet wet and needs more time to adjust and build up some confidence in his shot. - alas sometimes there's a chicken & the egg problem holding a player back.

We do have one productive lineup with Drummond and Prince, but it features Cedi in for Garland, with Sexton and Okoro. So... yeah, if you want to go down that path, Garland may need to be the odd man out.

I think you need to be really careful when projecting which lineups are productive based on small sample sizes when played against
very different opponents. But I have a difficult time getting too invested in who is out there starting or playing with who. We're a bad team without Love and Nance. Moving the deck chairs around while playing top 10 teams is only going to change so much. As far as I'm concerned, Allen and Garland are the only players on the roster who I'd identify as core pieces. Okoro could get there by working on his shot this off season. Nance is clearly a guy whose absence is felt on the court.

Well, if the Cavs would actually try some of the lineups that show promise, we'd have better data ... but realistically, JBB needs to be careful which toes he steps on. Trying to build a workable lineup around the players we consider core is about the safest thing he can try and as a bonus Allen and Prince are familiar with each other, Prince currently leads the team in 3pt%, and running P&R/lobs with Allen gives both Garland and Sexton something else to do.

The goal here is to develop young players in competitive games and build up our offensive/defensive systems. We need to achieve a certain base level for that to happen, not just run post-up's to Andre or hope someone goes off playing hero ball.

I agree with all of that. I'm skeptical that Drummond is the main problem on most nights, but again, I'm not convinced that starting or bringing him off the bench is going to move the needle as much as others. If the Cavs think Drummond off the bench works better, especially against certain teams, then that's what they should do. This season is lost. We're 10-16. If Love doesn't come and play real minutes during this West coast trip, we'll be ten games below .500 by the time he gets back on the court.

What is important for the Cavs to do, IMO, is to know what they want to do with Sexton long-term before any extension talks start. That decision will impact not just a few games, but the next several years.

[Stillwater]

Maybe they should go back to shooting all the floaters? It at least lets us take advantage of one of our few strengths (offensive rebounding).

The Cavs are veering towards unwatchable again, hopefully JBB has some better ideas than the "twin tower" approach.

Our floor spacing was bad enough before JBB decided to go with two 7 footers who can't shoot, and Okoro's shooting has just gotten worse this month.

We have some lineups that have worked without Nance, I'd suggest JBB try one of them as the starting unit:

Allen-Prince-Okoro-Sexton-Garland are +26 in just 36 minutes. Seems like a no-brainer to give that lineup a chance to start, other than the uncomfortable part where JBB has to inform Drummond that he's coming off the bench.

https://www.basketball-reference.com/teams/CLE/2021/lineups/

See, to me, I think Prince should play with Drummond to open up the floor and because Drummond is going to steal rebounds from whoever plays PF with him anyway. Assuming Love's calf strain isn't actually Achilles tendinitis, it's probably time to speed up his recovery process. I think he'd play very well alongside Allen. Whether Drummond should start or not should probably depend upon the opponent. There are games where he's frustrating, there are also games where he's one of our best offensive threats. I'm not against giving Windler some run as a starter but he's going to get roasted against elite SFs.

Trigger warning Stillwater

Spoiler:

I think it's probably time to see how Sexton looks as a 6th man. Especially if we're going to start Windler

Absolutely should be the sixth man if it means getting him the ball with a competent on or off ball player in the back court with him like Dotson instead of forcing him to play off of the meh offense running through little Darius who didnt even attempt a 3 point shot in the first half & The Front office down to the coaching staff has their proverbial heads in the sand if they are in fact telling those guards to feed the bigs pass up 3s and drive into the trees looking for kick backs to players who then pass up the shot and pass it back to a big again as the shot clock runs out smh.
The entire team looks like A. they are confused B. they are all fighting injuries or maybe something else sapping oxygenation is moving through the team even if it isnt covid and C. trying to play a style of basketball they dont believe will ne successful because only a tank commanding coach would employ it. I have no idea who got to JBB but he was doing great when he had this team playing defense that creates offense but I guess maybe that is just too much to expect with 2 small guards sharing the back court and a front office and apparently some fans cough cough that would rather the kid with the dazzling handles get the keys to the team even if he can't actually generate enough offense to make up for his defense against most people he faces. I will give DG some credit for trying to play defense and a lot of this team lately including Sexton has been taking plays off, but that does not change the fact the 2 together is a major liability.
Even if Sexton is better served coming off the bench right now on this roster as far as giving him the rock and letting him go get his 25 points esp if they are opting for Garland to drop dimes to bigs trying to beat the modern NBA by making a lot of 2 point shots in the paint to the oppositions open 3s , it only proves DG is overvalued by this front office.

[JonFromVA]

I think you need to be really careful when projecting which lineups are productive based on small sample sizes when played against
very different opponents. But I have a difficult time getting too invested in who is out there starting or playing with who. We're a bad team without Love and Nance. Moving the deck chairs around while playing top 10 teams is only going to change so much. As far as I'm concerned, Allen and Garland are the only players on the roster who I'd identify as core pieces. Okoro could get there by working on his shot this off season. Nance is clearly a guy whose absence is felt on the court.

Well, if the Cavs would actually try some of the lineups that show promise, we'd have better data ... but realistically, JBB needs to be careful which toes he steps on. Trying to build a workable lineup around the players we consider core is about the safest thing he can try and as a bonus Allen and Prince are familiar with each other, Prince currently leads the team in 3pt%, and running P&R/lobs with Allen gives both Garland and Sexton something else to do.

The goal here is to develop young players in competitive games and build up our offensive/defensive systems. We need to achieve a certain base level for that to happen, not just run post-up's to Andre or hope someone goes off playing hero ball.

I agree with all of that. I'm skeptical that Drummond is the main problem on most nights, but again, I'm not convinced that starting or bringing him off the bench is going to move the needle as much as others. If the Cavs think Drummond off the bench works better, especially against certain teams, then that's what they should do. This season is lost. We're 10-16. If Love doesn't come and play real minutes during this West coast trip, we'll be ten games below .500 by the time he gets back on the court.

What is important for the Cavs to do, IMO, is to know what they want to do with Sexton long-term before any extension talks start. That decision will impact not just a few games, but the next several years.

We do need to decide if we're going to offer Collin an extension this Summer and how well he plays with our core group should be a big part of that. Assuming Drummond is not part of that group, I'm just not that concerned that some nights he's going to win us a game because he feels in the mood to dominate his matchup. I'd rather the team was spacing the floor better and developing skills that will help us down the road.

Alas, we'll probably wait it out until Kevin returns. I suspect they feel an obligation to give the Drummond/Love front-court another chance at until the trade deadline in March. To me it seems like a waste of time UNLESS there's a chance they would keep both and risk Allen running out of patience with the team and forcing his way out the door this Summer.

[JonFromVA]

Maybe they should go back to shooting all the floaters? It at least lets us take advantage of one of our few strengths (offensive rebounding).

The Cavs are veering towards unwatchable again, hopefully JBB has some better ideas than the "twin tower" approach.

Our floor spacing was bad enough before JBB decided to go with two 7 footers who can't shoot, and Okoro's shooting has just gotten worse this month.

We have some lineups that have worked without Nance, I'd suggest JBB try one of them as the starting unit:

Allen-Prince-Okoro-Sexton-Garland are +26 in just 36 minutes. Seems like a no-brainer to give that lineup a chance to start, other than the uncomfortable part where JBB has to inform Drummond that he's coming off the bench.

https://www.basketball-reference.com/teams/CLE/2021/lineups/

See, to me, I think Prince should play with Drummond to open up the floor and because Drummond is going to steal rebounds from whoever plays PF with him anyway. Assuming Love's calf strain isn't actually Achilles tendinitis, it's probably time to speed up his recovery process. I think he'd play very well alongside Allen. Whether Drummond should start or not should probably depend upon the opponent. There are games where he's frustrating, there are also games where he's one of our best offensive threats. I'm not against giving Windler some run as a starter but he's going to get roasted against elite SFs.

Trigger warning Stillwater

Spoiler:

I think it's probably time to see how Sexton looks as a 6th man. Especially if we're going to start Windler

Absolutely should be the sixth man if it means getting him the ball with a competent on or off ball player in the back court with him like Dotson instead of forcing him to play off of the meh offense running through little Darius who didnt even attempt a 3 point shot in the first half & The Front office down to the coaching staff has their proverbial heads in the sand if they are in fact telling those guards to feed the bigs pass up 3s and drive into the trees looking for kick backs to players who then pass up the shot and pass it back to a big again as the shot clock runs out smh.
The entire team looks like A. they are confused B. they are all fighting injuries or maybe something else sapping oxygenation is moving through the team even if it isnt covid and C. trying to play a style of basketball they dont believe will ne successful because only a tank commanding coach would employ it. I have no idea who got to JBB but he was doing great when he had this team playing defense that creates offense but I guess maybe that is just too much to expect with 2 small guards sharing the back court and a front office and apparently some fans cough cough that would rather the kid with the dazzling handles get the keys to the team even if he can't actually generate enough offense to make up for his defense against most people he faces. I will give DG some credit for trying to play defense and a lot of this team lately including Sexton has been taking plays off, but that does not change the fact the 2 together is a major liability.
Even if Sexton is better served coming off the bench right now on this roster as far as giving him the rock and letting him go get his 25 points esp if they are opting for Garland to drop dimes to bigs trying to beat the modern NBA by making a lot of 2 point shots in the paint to the oppositions open 3s , it only proves DG is overvalued by this front office.

Speaking of oxygenation ... it's never easy getting a road win 5000ft up in Denver.

IMO, we'd have a better chance generating 3pt shots if the big man in the P&R was willing to pass the ball.

[Stillwater]

See, to me, I think Prince should play with Drummond to open up the floor and because Drummond is going to steal rebounds from whoever plays PF with him anyway. Assuming Love's calf strain isn't actually Achilles tendinitis, it's probably time to speed up his recovery process. I think he'd play very well alongside Allen. Whether Drummond should start or not should probably depend upon the opponent. There are games where he's frustrating, there are also games where he's one of our best offensive threats. I'm not against giving Windler some run as a starter but he's going to get roasted against elite SFs.

Trigger warning Stillwater

Spoiler:

I think it's probably time to see how Sexton looks as a 6th man. Especially if we're going to start Windler

Absolutely should be the sixth man if it means getting him the ball with a competent on or off ball player in the back court with him like Dotson instead of forcing him to play off of the meh offense running through little Darius who didnt even attempt a 3 point shot in the first half & The Front office down to the coaching staff has their proverbial heads in the sand if they are in fact telling those guards to feed the bigs pass up 3s and drive into the trees looking for kick backs to players who then pass up the shot and pass it back to a big again as the shot clock runs out smh.
The entire team looks like A. they are confused B. they are all fighting injuries or maybe something else sapping oxygenation is moving through the team even if it isnt covid and C. trying to play a style of basketball they dont believe will ne successful because only a tank commanding coach would employ it. I have no idea who got to JBB but he was doing great when he had this team playing defense that creates offense but I guess maybe that is just too much to expect with 2 small guards sharing the back court and a front office and apparently some fans cough cough that would rather the kid with the dazzling handles get the keys to the team even if he can't actually generate enough offense to make up for his defense against most people he faces. I will give DG some credit for trying to play defense and a lot of this team lately including Sexton has been taking plays off, but that does not change the fact the 2 together is a major liability.
Even if Sexton is better served coming off the bench right now on this roster as far as giving him the rock and letting him go get his 25 points esp if they are opting for Garland to drop dimes to bigs trying to beat the modern NBA by making a lot of 2 point shots in the paint to the oppositions open 3s , it only proves DG is overvalued by this front office.

Speaking of oxygenation ... it's never easy getting a road win 5000ft up in Denver.

IMO, we'd have a better chance generating 3pt shots if the big man in the P&R was willing to pass the ball.

tell that to JBB for insisting they pass up the 3 when he does pass it back

[jbk1234]

Well, if the Cavs would actually try some of the lineups that show promise, we'd have better data ... but realistically, JBB needs to be careful which toes he steps on. Trying to build a workable lineup around the players we consider core is about the safest thing he can try and as a bonus Allen and Prince are familiar with each other, Prince currently leads the team in 3pt%, and running P&R/lobs with Allen gives both Garland and Sexton something else to do.

The goal here is to develop young players in competitive games and build up our offensive/defensive systems. We need to achieve a certain base level for that to happen, not just run post-up's to Andre or hope someone goes off playing hero ball.

I agree with all of that. I'm skeptical that Drummond is the main problem on most nights, but again, I'm not convinced that starting or bringing him off the bench is going to move the needle as much as others. If the Cavs think Drummond off the bench works better, especially against certain teams, then that's what they should do. This season is lost. We're 10-16. If Love doesn't come and play real minutes during this West coast trip, we'll be ten games below .500 by the time he gets back on the court.

What is important for the Cavs to do, IMO, is to know what they want to do with Sexton long-term before any extension talks start. That decision will impact not just a few games, but the next several years.

We do need to decide if we're going to offer Collin an extension this Summer and how well he plays with our core group should be a big part of that. Assuming Drummond is not part of that group, I'm just not that concerned that some nights he's going to win us a game because he feels in the mood to dominate his matchup. I'd rather the team was spacing the floor better and developing skills that will help us down the road.

Alas, we'll probably wait it out until Kevin returns. I suspect they feel an obligation to give the Drummond/Love front-court another chance at until the trade deadline in March. To me it seems like a waste of time UNLESS there's a chance they would keep both and risk Allen running out of patience with the team and forcing his way out the door this Summer.

I feel like the Cavs made a decision on Drummond when they traded for Allen. I'm just not sure how Allen on the floor instead of Drummond really impacts spacing in a meaningful way.

What I'm watching is opposing teams regularly pack the paint and daring the Cavs to beat them by shooting. In order to do that players need to shoot when they're open. The ball needs to move and the passing needs to be timely and accurate. There's too many times when guys are passing up good looks. There are also too many times when guys are open and the passes come late or are off target and the shooter has to recover.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-J327A using RealGM mobile app

[JonFromVA]

I agree with all of that. I'm skeptical that Drummond is the main problem on most nights, but again, I'm not convinced that starting or bringing him off the bench is going to move the needle as much as others. If the Cavs think Drummond off the bench works better, especially against certain teams, then that's what they should do. This season is lost. We're 10-16. If Love doesn't come and play real minutes during this West coast trip, we'll be ten games below .500 by the time he gets back on the court.

What is important for the Cavs to do, IMO, is to know what they want to do with Sexton long-term before any extension talks start. That decision will impact not just a few games, but the next several years.

We do need to decide if we're going to offer Collin an extension this Summer and how well he plays with our core group should be a big part of that. Assuming Drummond is not part of that group, I'm just not that concerned that some nights he's going to win us a game because he feels in the mood to dominate his matchup. I'd rather the team was spacing the floor better and developing skills that will help us down the road.

Alas, we'll probably wait it out until Kevin returns. I suspect they feel an obligation to give the Drummond/Love front-court another chance at until the trade deadline in March. To me it seems like a waste of time UNLESS there's a chance they would keep both and risk Allen running out of patience with the team and forcing his way out the door this Summer.

I feel like the Cavs made a decision on Drummond when they traded for Allen. I'm just not sure how Allen on the floor instead of Drummond really impacts spacing in a meaningful way.

What I'm watching is opposing teams regularly pack the paint and daring the Cavs to beat them by shooting. In order to do that players need to shoot when they're open. The ball needs to move and the passing needs to be timely and accurate. There's too many times when guys are passing up good looks. There are also too many times when guys are open and the passes come late or are off target and the shooter has to recover.

I'm hardly saying there's just one problem on the team ... but I do expect playing Allen will improve the floor spacing. Having a center that's willing to run the P&R properly and set screens for teammates tends to do that. Alas, the lack of practice time is a problem and a challenge for the coaching staff. Playing the expected core as many minutes together is just the first step in addressing that.

Maybe I mistook the play, but there was one play our ball handler was calling for a screen from Drummond who waived him off and pointed to a teammate. The guard passed the ball to the teammate, and the teammate made an entry pass to Drummond for a post-up. Something to watch, anyway, but a big man refusing to set a screen for a guard is something I'd never seen before. Tristan Thompson by comparison was like a dog when the dinner bell is rung.

[jbk1234]

We do need to decide if we're going to offer Collin an extension this Summer and how well he plays with our core group should be a big part of that. Assuming Drummond is not part of that group, I'm just not that concerned that some nights he's going to win us a game because he feels in the mood to dominate his matchup. I'd rather the team was spacing the floor better and developing skills that will help us down the road.

Alas, we'll probably wait it out until Kevin returns. I suspect they feel an obligation to give the Drummond/Love front-court another chance at until the trade deadline in March. To me it seems like a waste of time UNLESS there's a chance they would keep both and risk Allen running out of patience with the team and forcing his way out the door this Summer.

I feel like the Cavs made a decision on Drummond when they traded for Allen. I'm just not sure how Allen on the floor instead of Drummond really impacts spacing in a meaningful way.

What I'm watching is opposing teams regularly pack the paint and daring the Cavs to beat them by shooting. In order to do that players need to shoot when they're open. The ball needs to move and the passing needs to be timely and accurate. There's too many times when guys are passing up good looks. There are also too many times when guys are open and the passes come late or are off target and the shooter has to recover.

I'm hardly saying there's just one problem on the team ... but I do expect playing Allen will improve the floor spacing. Having a center that's willing to run the P&R properly and set screens for teammates tends to do that. Alas, the lack of practice time is a problem and a challenge for the coaching staff. Playing the expected core as many minutes together is just the first step in addressing that.

Maybe I mistook the play, but there was one play our ball handler was calling for a screen from Drummond who waived him off and pointed to a teammate. The guard passed the ball to the teammate, and the teammate made an entry pass to Drummond for a post-up. Something to watch, anyway, but a big man refusing to set a screen for a guard is something I'd never seen before. Tristan Thompson by comparison was like a dog when the dinner bell is rung.

It's going to be a mixed bag. Drummond commands double teams in the post and almost always on the boards. Plus, if you want our guards shooting from the outside more, bringing that second defender out isn't always helpful.

[JonFromVA]

I feel like the Cavs made a decision on Drummond when they traded for Allen. I'm just not sure how Allen on the floor instead of Drummond really impacts spacing in a meaningful way.

What I'm watching is opposing teams regularly pack the paint and daring the Cavs to beat them by shooting. In order to do that players need to shoot when they're open. The ball needs to move and the passing needs to be timely and accurate. There's too many times when guys are passing up good looks. There are also too many times when guys are open and the passes come late or are off target and the shooter has to recover.

I'm hardly saying there's just one problem on the team ... but I do expect playing Allen will improve the floor spacing. Having a center that's willing to run the P&R properly and set screens for teammates tends to do that. Alas, the lack of practice time is a problem and a challenge for the coaching staff. Playing the expected core as many minutes together is just the first step in addressing that.

Maybe I mistook the play, but there was one play our ball handler was calling for a screen from Drummond who waived him off and pointed to a teammate. The guard passed the ball to the teammate, and the teammate made an entry pass to Drummond for a post-up. Something to watch, anyway, but a big man refusing to set a screen for a guard is something I'd never seen before. Tristan Thompson by comparison was like a dog when the dinner bell is rung.

It's going to be a mixed bag. Drummond commands double teams in the post and almost always on the boards. Plus, if you want our guards shooting from the outside more, bringing that second defender out isn't always helpful.

Bringing that second defender out of the paint (if they actually would step out) creates more space in the paint, plus there are a lot more ways a big man can facilitate an offense through screening than just running a 2-man P&R.

[jbk1234]

I'm hardly saying there's just one problem on the team ... but I do expect playing Allen will improve the floor spacing. Having a center that's willing to run the P&R properly and set screens for teammates tends to do that. Alas, the lack of practice time is a problem and a challenge for the coaching staff. Playing the expected core as many minutes together is just the first step in addressing that.

Maybe I mistook the play, but there was one play our ball handler was calling for a screen from Drummond who waived him off and pointed to a teammate. The guard passed the ball to the teammate, and the teammate made an entry pass to Drummond for a post-up. Something to watch, anyway, but a big man refusing to set a screen for a guard is something I'd never seen before. Tristan Thompson by comparison was like a dog when the dinner bell is rung.

It's going to be a mixed bag. Drummond commands double teams in the post and almost always on the boards. Plus, if you want our guards shooting from the outside more, bringing that second defender out isn't always helpful.

Bringing that second defender out of the paint (if they actually would step out) creates more space in the paint, plus there are a lot more ways a big man can facilitate an offense through screening than just running a 2-man P&R.

We're facing a lot of zone and even when opposing teams play man they're packing the paint and playing way off the would-be shooters.

[JonFromVA]

It's going to be a mixed bag. Drummond commands double teams in the post and almost always on the boards. Plus, if you want our guards shooting from the outside more, bringing that second defender out isn't always helpful.

Bringing that second defender out of the paint (if they actually would step out) creates more space in the paint, plus there are a lot more ways a big man can facilitate an offense through screening than just running a 2-man P&R.

We're facing a lot of zone and even when opposing teams play man they're packing the paint and playing way off the would-be shooters.

If we can't shoot over the zone, I'd still feel better about attacking the middle of the zone with Allen who will pass the ball.

Anyway, I suspect we're in a holding pattern to see how things look with Kevin and Andre. It's always possible the rest of the world is a lot farther down the line in terms of breaking up the team than Altman is. Seems to happen a lot.

[SaiCLE]

It's time for some to admit that Drummond is a major issue & needs to be bought out ASAP. I knew he wasn't going to give effort tonight after Sexton refused to pass him the ball in the post while 2 defenders were crowding the paint. He immediately starting sulking and just gave up. That is terrible because this a team full of young guys & that type of stuff rubs on others. JB Bickerstaff is way over his head as a head coach. He has these guys playing 1990 like offense where he prefers two center line ups which makes it harder for Sexton/Garland to operate offensively. The Cavs prefer Drummond iso post attempts over moving the ball for open 3's.

Bickerstaff doesn't like playing with 2 centers. Unless you count Prince, we have no healthy power forwards. This isn't complicated. Wade is a G League guy.

If Drummond isn't giving effort or playing well, he can go to the bench. Allen and Garland are the only two guys giving any type of consistent play right now. If we buy out everyone who has a bad game or games, they'll be no one left on the roster. We're playing good teams and we're not a good team. We're not even a mediocre team without Love or Nance.

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Any coach that is willing start both Allen & Drummond together is a bad coach. You start Prince for spacing reasons regardless. Drummond is just a bad player. Maybe i'm just overly negative due to the losing but I can not wait until Drummond & Bicker staff is both gone

[JonFromVA]

It's time for some to admit that Drummond is a major issue & needs to be bought out ASAP. I knew he wasn't going to give effort tonight after Sexton refused to pass him the ball in the post while 2 defenders were crowding the paint. He immediately starting sulking and just gave up. That is terrible because this a team full of young guys & that type of stuff rubs on others. JB Bickerstaff is way over his head as a head coach. He has these guys playing 1990 like offense where he prefers two center line ups which makes it harder for Sexton/Garland to operate offensively. The Cavs prefer Drummond iso post attempts over moving the ball for open 3's.

Bickerstaff doesn't like playing with 2 centers. Unless you count Prince, we have no healthy power forwards. This isn't complicated. Wade is a G League guy.

If Drummond isn't giving effort or playing well, he can go to the bench. Allen and Garland are the only two guys giving any type of consistent play right now. If we buy out everyone who has a bad game or games, they'll be no one left on the roster. We're playing good teams and we're not a good team. We're not even a mediocre team without Love or Nance.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-J327A using RealGM mobile app

Any coach that is willing start both Allen & Drummond together is a bad coach. You start Prince for spacing reasons regardless. Drummond is just a bad player. Maybe i'm just overly negative due to the losing but I can not wait until Drummond & Bicker staff is both gone

I don't mind a coach who experiments, just as long as he's able to identify when it's not working and move on to the next.

That being said, JBB's experiments should be trying to provide proper floor spacing ... I think that's more important than any short term advantage he might find by clogging the paint and trying to win the rebound battle.