Grade the Hayes pick!

[440BB]

I suspect a realistic grade for the Hayes pick will take a full year from now to estimate. Assuming he recovers well and has this summer to get back on track, we should know much more by the middle of next season.

First things first, here's hoping he can recover well, whether through rehab or surgery. For me, all bets are off until that happens.

[Jackattaq]

Still can’t wrap my head around a “Pro” athlete at only 19 years old tearing a hip on a non-contact play. Someone who has a job of taking care of their body and making sure it’s in tip top shape and they tear a muscle running down a play from behind with no contact? I have very little faith from what he has shown on the court so far, can’t shoot or finish or make simple passes that he will ever amount to anything but another wasted top ten pick.

His defense was decent, but other than that he offered me little in terms of expectations. 7th overall picks aren’t supposed to look clueless on the court. He struggled every time he was pressed. Couldn’t even bring the ball up court against pressure. Couldn’t deliver easy post entry passes. Nearly every time he got in the lane, he couldn’t finish, he missed 80% of his floaters near the paint. He just didn’t look NBA caliber. For all the touting of “this kid played in a PRO league in Europe” (where have we heard that before?). He didn’t look college level most of the time I watched. Guards have a certain skill set, dribbling being one of them, passing being another and he did not have it.

WASTED PICK.

[Manocad]

Still can’t wrap my head around a “Pro” athlete at only 19 years old tearing a hip on a non-contact play. Someone who has a job of taking care of their body and making sure it’s in tip top shape and they tear a muscle running down a play from behind with no contact? I have very little faith from what he has shown on the court so far, can’t shoot or finish or make simple passes that he will ever amount to anything but another wasted top ten pick.

His defense was decent, but other than that he offered me little in terms of expectations. 7th overall picks aren’t supposed to look clueless on the court. He struggled every time he was pressed. Couldn’t even bring the ball up court against pressure. Couldn’t deliver easy post entry passes. Nearly every time he got in the lane, he couldn’t finish, he missed 80% of his floaters near the paint. He just didn’t look NBA caliber. For all the touting of “this kid played in a PRO league in Europe” (where have we heard that before?). He didn’t look college level most of the time I watched. Guards have a certain skill set, dribbling being one of them, passing being another and he did not have it.

WASTED PICK.

If suffering an injury early in their rookie season is a measure of whether or not the pick was wasted, Blake Griffin, Joel Embiid, Zion Williamson and Ben Simmons would like to weigh in.

[Jackattaq]

Still can’t wrap my head around a “Pro” athlete at only 19 years old tearing a hip on a non-contact play. Someone who has a job of taking care of their body and making sure it’s in tip top shape and they tear a muscle running down a play from behind with no contact? I have very little faith from what he has shown on the court so far, can’t shoot or finish or make simple passes that he will ever amount to anything but another wasted top ten pick.

His defense was decent, but other than that he offered me little in terms of expectations. 7th overall picks aren’t supposed to look clueless on the court. He struggled every time he was pressed. Couldn’t even bring the ball up court against pressure. Couldn’t deliver easy post entry passes. Nearly every time he got in the lane, he couldn’t finish, he missed 80% of his floaters near the paint. He just didn’t look NBA caliber. For all the touting of “this kid played in a PRO league in Europe” (where have we heard that before?). He didn’t look college level most of the time I watched. Guards have a certain skill set, dribbling being one of them, passing being another and he did not have it.

WASTED PICK.

If suffering an injury early in their rookie season is a measure of whether or not the pick was wasted, Blake Griffin, Joel Embiid, Zion Williamson and Ben Simmons would like to weigh in.

All of those guys showed some amount of talent in their first 8 games, not a total inability to play at the professional level. The guy can’t dribble with his right hand !!!! Really ???? He flubbed several easy passes (point guards are supposed to be able to dribble and pass using either hand). He missed a lot of 10-12 foot shots in the paint, he looked pretty damn slow out there. He didn’t know what to do when he got double teamed. He turned it over, couldn’t go right. He doesn’t look at all like a top 10 pick in any draft.

[Manocad]

Still can’t wrap my head around a “Pro” athlete at only 19 years old tearing a hip on a non-contact play. Someone who has a job of taking care of their body and making sure it’s in tip top shape and they tear a muscle running down a play from behind with no contact? I have very little faith from what he has shown on the court so far, can’t shoot or finish or make simple passes that he will ever amount to anything but another wasted top ten pick.

His defense was decent, but other than that he offered me little in terms of expectations. 7th overall picks aren’t supposed to look clueless on the court. He struggled every time he was pressed. Couldn’t even bring the ball up court against pressure. Couldn’t deliver easy post entry passes. Nearly every time he got in the lane, he couldn’t finish, he missed 80% of his floaters near the paint. He just didn’t look NBA caliber. For all the touting of “this kid played in a PRO league in Europe” (where have we heard that before?). He didn’t look college level most of the time I watched. Guards have a certain skill set, dribbling being one of them, passing being another and he did not have it.

WASTED PICK.

If suffering an injury early in their rookie season is a measure of whether or not the pick was wasted, Blake Griffin, Joel Embiid, Zion Williamson and Ben Simmons would like to weigh in.

All of those guys showed some amount of talent in their first 8 games, not a total inability to play at the professional level. The guy can’t dribble with his right hand !!!! Really ???? He flubbed several easy passes (point guards are supposed to be able to dribble and pass using either hand). He missed a lot of 10-12 foot shots in the paint, he looked pretty damn slow out there. He didn’t know what to do when he got double teamed. He turned it over, couldn’t go right. He doesn’t look at all like a top 10 pick in any draft.

I saw film on him and he looked fine using his right hand. Regardless, my point still remains--using the fact that he got injured as a reason for calling it a wasted pick is ridiculous.

[MotownMadness]

Maybe he will look better without deferring to Blake as the main facilitator. He looks nothing like the highlights I watched of him but more like a scared player, sorta like Fultz when he came into the league.

[ComboGuardCity]

I still believe he can be decent. He was literally thrust in to the NBA with no off-season and told to play point while differing.

[edmunder_prc]

I have no idea what Hayes talents are because he couldnt dribble the ball with any type of press defense.

The normal PG just flies past that or dribbles around it. Hayes will be among the slowest PGs out there and he cant dribble. So step one for him is to learn basic ball handling skills.

Also, for someone like Anthony Edwards who has all the physical talents in the world, or a Josh Jackson type player who can basically do anything he wants when his mind/hands/feet/temper are all aligned. Its another thing entirely when the guy is slow as molasses, cant dribble, cant pass... and people are still high on him.

He had about 10 good plays in the 10 games he played. He had about 30 plays that lead to easy points for the other team or unforced TOs.

Who were some bad non-bigs that Pistons drafted? Knight, Stuckey, Stanley Johnson. Those guys all looked better than Hayes starting off. Thats the hill Hayes has to climb. And a potentially serious injury.

[zeebneeb]

Maybe he will look better without deferring to Blake as the main facilitator. He looks nothing like the highlights I watched of him but more like a scared player, sorta like Fultz when he came into the league.

There is a million different ways he could look. We as Piston fans only saw 7 games, and have no Idea what kind of a player he is going to turn out to be. I agree that he looked scared, like a deer in the headlights kind of way, and I also agree that he looked absolutely nothing like the player we all saw in his highlights.

I firmly believe that he has the talent(hell we all watched it)to be an excellent player in the NBA. It's also true that he has to work on his right hand as he is severely deficient in that regard. What is also true is that anyone who thinks they know how Hayes will turn out is full of crap.(not talking about you Motown, your level-headed)Saying that it was a wasted pick is, without sugar coating it, stupid. Could he turn out to be a trainwreck? Absolutely. He could also turn out to be a top PG during his prime.

Point here is that if some Piston fans wanted to say Hayes is going to turn out to be a bust, wouldn't it be smart to at least give the kid one damn season before trying to run him out of town? I have a tendency to give Piston players more slack then most. Guilty as charged. I would rather do that then be the guy who gives up on a player after only 7 damn games.

It just strikes me as sensible.

[DetroitSho]

People talking about Hayes not being strong with his right like we didn't watch Brandon Jennings outright refuse to use his right hand and still be somewhat successful.

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[Pharaoh]

I find it comical that Hayes has been completely written off by so many on here.

Before the Draft he was the consensus pick by this board.

Before the Draft he was universally ranked in the top 10 prospects.

7 games is all it took for some to throw him under the bus!

I'd normally rate this board as one of the most impressive collections of basketball minds going around but after the last few months I'm blown away by some people and their takes.

Gonna be a long few years methinks

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[MotownMadness]

I find it comical that Hayes has been completely written off by so many on here.

Before the Draft he was the consensus pick by this board.

Before the Draft he was universally ranked in the top 10 prospects.

7 games is all it took for some to throw him under the bus!

I'd normally rate this board as one of the most impressive collections of basketball minds going around but after the last few months I'm blown away by some people and their takes.

Gonna be a long few years methinks

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This fanbase is gonna be a nightmare through a rebuild. Like holy ****, even if he bust (we cant say that yet) you have to be prepared for it cause it might happen a few times before we get that star type franchise guy in the top 10. (Although this draft is a good opportunity to get one)

You're just projecting these 18 year olds on what they can become as their not as developed as some of the later (junior or senior) picks.

[DetroitSho]

I find it comical that Hayes has been completely written off by so many on here.

Before the Draft he was the consensus pick by this board.

Before the Draft he was universally ranked in the top 10 prospects.

7 games is all it took for some to throw him under the bus!

I'd normally rate this board as one of the most impressive collections of basketball minds going around but after the last few months I'm blown away by some people and their takes.

Gonna be a long few years methinks

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You really would rate this board that high? That's where your mistake is. This board is a cesspool most days with some of the stupid takes that get tossed out.

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[Manocad]

I find it comical that Hayes has been completely written off by so many on here.

Before the Draft he was the consensus pick by this board.

Before the Draft he was universally ranked in the top 10 prospects.

7 games is all it took for some to throw him under the bus!

I'd normally rate this board as one of the most impressive collections of basketball minds going around but after the last few months I'm blown away by some people and their takes.

Gonna be a long few years methinks

Sent from my SM-G781B using RealGM mobile app

You really would rate this board that high? That's where your mistake is. This board is a cesspool most days with some of the stupid takes that get tossed out.

Sent from my SM-N975U using RealGM mobile app

Yeah, the Monday morning quarterbacking around here gets brushed aside by those who do it as "The GM should know better; that's his job." I don't recall any draft analysts being critical of the Hayes pick (the worst I saw was C+, and most were A, A-, B+) yet we've got a whole slew of Nostradamuses here who just KNOW it's a wasted pick.

[DetroitSho]

I find it comical that Hayes has been completely written off by so many on here.

Before the Draft he was the consensus pick by this board.

Before the Draft he was universally ranked in the top 10 prospects.

7 games is all it took for some to throw him under the bus!

I'd normally rate this board as one of the most impressive collections of basketball minds going around but after the last few months I'm blown away by some people and their takes.

Gonna be a long few years methinks

Sent from my SM-G781B using RealGM mobile app

You really would rate this board that high? That's where your mistake is. This board is a cesspool most days with some of the stupid takes that get tossed out.

Sent from my SM-N975U using RealGM mobile app

Yeah, the Monday morning quarterbacking around here gets brushed aside by those who do it as "The GM should know better; that's his job." I don't recall any draft analysts being critical of the Hayes pick (the worst I saw was C+, and most were A, A-, B+) yet we've got a whole slew of Nostradamuses here who just KNOW it's a wasted pick.

This

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[edmunder_prc]

Here are some clips of all Hayes plays in a few games. Shooting ~20% with high TOs.

Watch on YouTube

Watch on YouTube

Watch on YouTube

Watch on YouTube

[DBC10]

I still want to see Hayes unleashed without having to defer to BG like he had to do. Otherwise, trying to decipher what he is or isn't is fairly meaningless right now

That's not to say there aren't worrying signs from him even with the 10 or so games but at the very least, he has a good looking shooting stroke (not really falling tho), has solid passing vision, and isn't a liability on defense. That's enough to build off of.

[Pharaoh]

It was 7 games. Se7en!

I still want to see Hayes unleashed without having to defer to BG like he had to do. Otherwise, trying to decipher what he is or isn't is fairly meaningless right now

That's not to say there aren't worrying signs from him even with the 10 or so games but at the very least, he has a good looking shooting stroke (not really falling tho), has solid passing vision, and isn't a liability on defense. That's enough to build off of.

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[DetroitSho]

Most times when a player is hated it's really more-or-less because of that player's fans blowing their game outta proportion when they're not that good, as to provide balance.

NONE of that is happening here. Even those who support the pick AT BEST is saying hey, it's only been 7 games. So since there's no need to provide balance, why do people continue to feel this incessant need to trash the kid? Like wtf is wrong with people?

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[GBanga3]

Watch on YouTube

Yo! Kid is 18 years of age, was thrust into the starting lineup of an NBA team with little to no pre-season.

Personally I think the injury (front office possibly do also) is a blessing in disguise. Its just giving him extra time to acclimate to NBA life and learn everything that embodies being a PG in the NBA.

I'm actually thinking about keeping a list of everyone that has labeled him a bust already. I'm going to call it "You owe me a beer from being stupid list"