Lauri Markkanen Discussion Thread

[ZOMG]

If Lavine continues to be a flamethrower at such a high frequency then yeah Lauri is less useful. But I really want to see how Lauri's integrated back in now that it's clicking for lavine and coby is playing more of an off ball role.

I disagree that Lauri's value is less than the off season. His injury risk is a valid concern but I think he's shown that last year with Boylen was a down year that he's past now

nah, he aint getting more excuses. enough is enough. he will either sign in offseason max 13M per year or he can look for another job accross NBA. we are past this "shown", "valid", "boylen" etc crap

The Bulls are not in the driver's seat anymore. They took their shot at the negotiation table and missed. Either they will pay Lauri a LOT more than their original lowball offer to keep him... or lose him for nothing. AK won't like either option, but overpaying a young, efficient player like Lauri is nothing in this league compared to just letting your asset walk out the door.

I don't believe in any Markkanen trade. I think the Bulls will pay him, and it'll be very close to $20 million per.

[ZOMG]

He's certainly less valuable when Zach is doing what he's doing. I'm still open to resigning Lauri but he needs to put together a great 2nd half and contribute to wins. Right now his value is less than it was this offseason, which is I guess sort of a win for Chicago.

That's a crazy take. Less??

He's been an efficient 19/6 guy this season. You think the League cares that he hurt his shoulder? People get injured literally EVERY DAY in the NBA and it doesn't do anything to their value - trade or otherwise. He's just 23 years old.

The fact remains that when it comes to his RFA status, Lauri's holding all the cards now, not the Bulls. Markkanen bet on himself - aided by the FO's misguided decision to play hardball with him - and won. Now AK is running a real risk of losing him for nothing, which would be a disaster.

I don't see teams frantically putting together packages of assets for a Lauri trade. They know very well what's up. Someone will give him that $20 million offer and the Bulls FO will have an extremely painful decision to make.

I don’t know why everything thinks AK are terrified of losing Lauri. Their behavior in the off-season indicates otherwise.

It's not about Lauri. It's about managing your assets.

[LateNight]

That's a crazy take. Less??

He's been an efficient 19/6 guy this season. You think the League cares that he hurt his shoulder? People get injured literally EVERY DAY in the NBA and it doesn't do anything to their value - trade or otherwise. He's just 23 years old.

The fact remains that when it comes to his RFA status, Lauri's holding all the cards now, not the Bulls. Markkanen bet on himself - aided by the FO's misguided decision to play hardball with him - and won. Now AK is running a real risk of losing him for nothing, which would be a disaster.

I don't see teams frantically putting together packages of assets for a Lauri trade. They know very well what's up. Someone will give him that $20 million offer and the Bulls FO will have an extremely painful decision to make.

I don’t know why everything thinks AK are terrified of losing Lauri. Their behavior in the off-season indicates otherwise.

It's not about Lauri. It's about managing your assets.

If the market is as strong as you say it is, then he absolutely still has trade value for us. If you want him, you have to either be the team he chooses or deal with us.

Not to mention - maybe Lauri wants to go play for a team who don’t have cap space. And that team also wants Lauri. Which means they have to deal. It is possible to have deals where everyone gets what they want

[MrSparkle]

We didn't shed a tear when Niko left for chips.

We didn't shed a tear for Bobby, even in hindsight (as Otto has been a shell of his Wizards' self).

If you compare their per-36 and advanced stats the first 4 years, you'll find 3 very similar players, despite their stylistic differences.

Unless Lauri becomes a top-15 offensive player in the NBA (which would be quite the feat), we won't be crying about his departure. Hey, Zach has become a top-15 offensive player and there's still a loud 'trade' crowd even as his intangibles have improved to a respectable level.

Even the Spurs aren't crying about losing Bertans. Maybe they felt salty for a season, but not after he got paid $80m.

Now if Lauri signs for a $40m C. Wood deal, then you just match it and don't worry about his potential. There is the smallest chance in hell that our great Finnish hope outplays Wood next season, IMHO.

Thing about Sabonis, Turner, Wood and other successful young bigs is they could switch between PF and C pretty seamlessly without positional lapse. Besides it being an ideal goal for him, I still see no evidence that Lauri can hang at center. He's bad in the post, guarding the post, on the glass, shot-blocking, and help defending. Donovan has actually moved him to 70% at C (compared to 20% in prior years), and OnCourt score is still -8.7.

This said, if he can sign below $14m annual, I match the RFA offer unless a better FA is available, because he is good for 15+ PPG. IMO he should come off the bench, behind Pat, if we can address starting SF next year. He is a career bum slayer. Virtually every game we've ever won with a dominant Lauri was against a scrub team with a scrub front-court. This is why we keep getting fooled by his 30 pt. outbursts. They come against Zeller, Bertans, 36yo Carmelo and Kanter, post-ACL Porzingis, or Love. And then you look at those guys, and they also actually get their 20-25 point season-high games.

So the Lauri charade is up. He's the long lost lab-child of Niko and Doug McDermott. Resign cheap for the bench, or let him walk if someone's gonna a $20m salary in hand.

[Red8911]

I like Lauri and still want him to stay but the way the bulls have been playing without him isn’t good for his case. Especially since PWill has shown to fill in just fine at that position. AK has a decision to make either trade him now or keep him and re sign him later. Again I would rather have him stay and hopefully will get better but if AK goes the other way we can’t blame him.

[ZOMG]

We didn't shed a tear when Niko left for nothing.

We didn't shed a tear for Bobby when he was sent out, even in hindsight as Otto has been a shell of his Wizards' self.

Niko left for nothing? Huh??

Bobby Portis could have faced criminal charges for what he did. You have got to be kidding comparing him to Lauri.

[Indomitable]

We didn't shed a tear when Niko left for nothing.

We didn't shed a tear for Bobby when he was sent out, even in hindsight as Otto has been a shell of his Wizards' self.

Niko left for nothing? Huh??

Bobby Portis could have faced criminal charges for what he did. You have got to be kidding comparing him to Lauri.

Yeah

[MrSparkle]

We didn't shed a tear when Niko left for nothing.

We didn't shed a tear for Bobby when he was sent out, even in hindsight as Otto has been a shell of his Wizards' self.

Niko left for nothing? Huh??

Bobby Portis could have faced criminal charges for what he did. You have got to be kidding comparing him to Lauri.

Well, clearly HoiGarPax weren't worried about, cause they kept him for a full year and half after the fact.

In fact I recall them still praising him and lamenting the trade when they announced it.

It was purely a basketball decision.

[TheFinishSniper]

The Bulls are not in the driver's seat anymore. They took their shot at the negotiation table and missed. Either they will pay Lauri a LOT more than their original lowball offer to keep him... or lose him for nothing. AK won't like either option, but overpaying a young, efficient player like Lauri is nothing in this league compared to just letting your asset walk out the door.

I don't believe in any Markkanen trade. I think the Bulls will pay him, and it'll be very close to $20 million per.

It doesnt matter. I mean if some team offers Lauri 20M per year you let him theoretically walk. I mean that's no brainer. You just dont do that deal. If anything you look to move him at draft night in package to move up along your pick to someone who wants his rights so they can offer him longest deal.

You dont let him walk away for nothing. But you plan to move from his completely. He shown nothing to get that deal and that security. If someone wants to gamble on him ok.

Only person you dont let walk this summer and keep him under all costs is Lavine.

[Pax for Prez]

The Bulls are not in the driver's seat anymore. They took their shot at the negotiation table and missed. Either they will pay Lauri a LOT more than their original lowball offer to keep him... or lose him for nothing. AK won't like either option, but overpaying a young, efficient player like Lauri is nothing in this league compared to just letting your asset walk out the door.

I don't believe in any Markkanen trade. I think the Bulls will pay him, and it'll be very close to $20 million per.

It doesnt matter. I mean if some team offers Lauri 20M per year you let him theoretically walk. I mean that's no brainer. You just dont do that deal. If anything you look to move him at draft night in package to move up along your pick to someone who wants his rights so they can offer him longest deal.

You dont let him walk away for nothing. But you plan to move from his completely. He shown nothing to get that deal and that security. If someone wants to gamble on him ok.

Only person you dont let walk this summer and keep him under all costs is Lavine.

Lauri can not be moved on draft night.

Either he has to be:
1. moved by the trade deadline
or
2.in a sign and trade in the off season.

But remember the team acquiring Lauri in the offseason may decide not to participate and try just to sign him outright.

[madvillian]

You're not "letting Lauri walk for nothing" you are making a calculated risk that you can replace him with a better long term option for less money.

I guarantee AK doesn't think like Garpax: they never understand opportunity cost and sunk cost and their relation to each other. If Lauri wants to ball out and stay healthy AK will reconsider the sunk cost and the opportunity cost and probably resign him. But if he does what he's done most of his 4 years in Chicago I'd imagine he lets him walk.

[WindyCityBorn]

Yes with our current construction. There is zero players who can provide the average defense/big man work that wcj provides. The drop off from him to gafford is gargantuan.

Lauri's strengths can be covered by committee if one of our role players (or coby) gets hot. Lauri can still be useful for the offense when it stagnates (like it did in the 2nd quarter last game). He is more of a backbone offensive player

He's certainly less valuable when Zach is doing what he's doing. I'm still open to resigning Lauri but he needs to put together a great 2nd half and contribute to wins. Right now his value is less than it was this offseason, which is I guess sort of a win for Chicago.

That's a crazy take. Less??

He's been an efficient 19/6 guy this season. You think the League cares that he hurt his shoulder? People get injured literally EVERY DAY in the NBA and it doesn't do anything to their value - trade or otherwise. He's just 23 years old.

The fact remains that when it comes to his RFA status, Lauri's holding all the cards now, not the Bulls. Markkanen bet on himself - aided by the FO's misguided decision to play hardball with him - and won. Now AK is running a real risk of losing him for nothing, which would be a disaster.

I don't see teams frantically putting together packages of assets for a Lauri trade. They know very well what's up. Someone will give him that $20 million offer and the Bulls FO will have an extremely painful decision to make.

He probably wanted $20 million per this past off-season so I don’t think much has changed for Bulls except they know his injury issues continued.

[HomoSapien]

Renamed this thread to a general Lauri Markkanen Discussion Thread. It was perpetually confusing to see a thread about how Lauri wanted out given it's old news.

[sco]

He's certainly less valuable when Zach is doing what he's doing. I'm still open to resigning Lauri but he needs to put together a great 2nd half and contribute to wins. Right now his value is less than it was this offseason, which is I guess sort of a win for Chicago.

That's a crazy take. Less??

He's been an efficient 19/6 guy this season. You think the League cares that he hurt his shoulder? People get injured literally EVERY DAY in the NBA and it doesn't do anything to their value - trade or otherwise. He's just 23 years old.

The fact remains that when it comes to his RFA status, Lauri's holding all the cards now, not the Bulls. Markkanen bet on himself - aided by the FO's misguided decision to play hardball with him - and won. Now AK is running a real risk of losing him for nothing, which would be a disaster.

I don't see teams frantically putting together packages of assets for a Lauri trade. They know very well what's up. Someone will give him that $20 million offer and the Bulls FO will have an extremely painful decision to make.

He probably wanted $20 million per this past off-season so I don’t think much has changed for Bulls except they know his injury issues continued.

I get why folks are Lauri fans. Especially, anyone from Finland. I would be a huge fan too. He came into the NBA with a lot of promise, and has showed meaningful stretches of being a top 5-10 PF. My issues are:

1) He's shown longer stretches of being a bottom 5-10 starting PF in the league.
2) He's only been available (due to injuries) to play in 70% of his games.

This season's strong play (which I will acknowledge - including NBA average level defense...which is big) has been overshadowed by 2 more injuries where he's missed numerous games. I'm not looking for another Otto situation. I'd rather have an MLE level talent play 90% of the games and use the extra money to bolster the team. I really hope they can get a useful asset back for him, but I would be happier seeing him elsewhere by the deadline.

[Dez]

That's a crazy take. Less??

He's been an efficient 19/6 guy this season. You think the League cares that he hurt his shoulder? People get injured literally EVERY DAY in the NBA and it doesn't do anything to their value - trade or otherwise. He's just 23 years old.

The fact remains that when it comes to his RFA status, Lauri's holding all the cards now, not the Bulls. Markkanen bet on himself - aided by the FO's misguided decision to play hardball with him - and won. Now AK is running a real risk of losing him for nothing, which would be a disaster.

I don't see teams frantically putting together packages of assets for a Lauri trade. They know very well what's up. Someone will give him that $20 million offer and the Bulls FO will have an extremely painful decision to make.

He probably wanted $20 million per this past off-season so I don’t think much has changed for Bulls except they know his injury issues continued.

I get why folks are Lauri fans. Especially, anyone from Finland. I would be a huge fan too. He came into the NBA with a lot of promise, and has showed meaningful stretches of being a top 5-10 PF. My issues are:

1) He's shown longer stretches of being a bottom 5-10 starting PF in the league.
2) He's only been available (due to injuries) to play in 70% of his games.

This season's strong play (which I will acknowledge - including NBA average level defense...which is big) has been overshadowed by 2 more injuries where he's missed numerous games. I'm not looking for another Otto situation. I'd rather have an MLE level talent play 90% of the games and use the extra money to bolster the team. I really hope they can get a useful asset back for him, but I would be happier seeing him elsewhere by the deadline.

No, it didn't.

[nekorajo]

We didn't shed a tear when Niko left for nothing.

We didn't shed a tear for Bobby when he was sent out, even in hindsight as Otto has been a shell of his Wizards' self.

Niko left for nothing? Huh??

Bobby Portis could have faced criminal charges for what he did. You have got to be kidding comparing him to Lauri.

Didn't Niko move aggressively towards Bobby during a verbal confrontation? Sounds like self defense.

[GrowingHorns]

That's a crazy take. Less??

He's been an efficient 19/6 guy this season. You think the League cares that he hurt his shoulder? People get injured literally EVERY DAY in the NBA and it doesn't do anything to their value - trade or otherwise. He's just 23 years old.

The fact remains that when it comes to his RFA status, Lauri's holding all the cards now, not the Bulls. Markkanen bet on himself - aided by the FO's misguided decision to play hardball with him - and won. Now AK is running a real risk of losing him for nothing, which would be a disaster.

I don't see teams frantically putting together packages of assets for a Lauri trade. They know very well what's up. Someone will give him that $20 million offer and the Bulls FO will have an extremely painful decision to make.

He probably wanted $20 million per this past off-season so I don’t think much has changed for Bulls except they know his injury issues continued.

I get why folks are Lauri fans. Especially, anyone from Finland. I would be a huge fan too. He came into the NBA with a lot of promise, and has showed meaningful stretches of being a top 5-10 PF. My issues are:

1) He's shown longer stretches of being a bottom 5-10 starting PF in the league.
2) He's only been available (due to injuries) to play in 70% of his games.

This season's strong play (which I will acknowledge - including NBA average level defense...which is big) has been overshadowed by 2 more injuries where he's missed numerous games. I'm not looking for another Otto situation. I'd rather have an MLE level talent play 90% of the games and use the extra money to bolster the team. I really hope they can get a useful asset back for him, but I would be happier seeing him elsewhere by the deadline.

One correction on the one i bolded: the first break was covid related quarantine, and would have missed just few games without it.But it worries me his shoulder seemed to got hurt for nothing, like is it just bad luck or is there some issues to be found more so it won't happen again... And do we know everything... Can't start guessing, but agreed here. I am one of those Finnish super fans, but I have come into place I will support any decision AK will make. It just will be giving me no2 team then to root aside for Bulls. If we trade him, I hope it's with some WCF team so I could have my no2 team there.

[coldfish]

If Lauri gets to free agency, some team is going to offer him 4/$80m or more. If the Bulls have absolutely no intention of paying him that much, they need to trade him at the deadline for whatever they can get.

Ideally, the team can combine assets and get a player of value but the more likely scenario is a well protected 1st round pick.

Here is the capsace situation:
https://www.spotrac.com/nba/cap/2021/

Here are the free agents:
https://hoopshype.com/lists/2021-nba-free-agent-rankings/

[WindyCityBorn]

If Lauri gets to free agency, some team is going to offer him 4/$80m or more. If the Bulls have absolutely no intention of paying him that much, they need to trade him at the deadline for whatever they can get.

Ideally, the team can combine assets and get a player of value but the more likely scenario is a well protected 1st round pick.

Here is the capsace situation:
https://www.spotrac.com/nba/cap/2021/

Here are the free agents:
https://hoopshype.com/lists/2021-nba-free-agent-rankings/

How much do you think they should be willing to pay?

[mack2354]

I'm not sure we'd get a good asset by trading him and I have a feeling the coach and front office wouldn't mind squeaking into the playoffs.

I'd try sliding PWill to the starting spot and have Lauri come off the bench. Our second unit has a lot of unselfish good passers in Sato, Arch, Valentine and Thad.

I'd draw up a lot of plays to get Lauri in position to score making him the focal point. All 4 of those guys are better passers than Coby, Zach, PWill, and WCJ so Lauri should thrive.

I think that's what's best for Lauri, the team, and our off season because then Lauri can't demand high end starter salary.

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